Need Advice with my "troubled" middle schooler...

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

I know more about child psychologists, therapists, and long term care facilities than anyone without a degree should.

 

The disassociations he is having are the biggest concern, and my initial thought is that he needs medication for them sooner rather than later.

 

My initial advice is this: Do not be afraid of any plan of action. As an adoptive parent of kids with issues, I know a dozen other adoptive parents of kids with issues. Half of them deal with reality. Half of them think **** is going to get better or that hospitalization is not really needed or whatever. Those parents are failing their kids.

 

Having said that, get a children's psychiatrist (not psychologist yet). Do not get medication from your pediatrician. They don't know this stuff, and they can't monitor. It's going to take some time to figure out what the right medication/medications are and the correct doses. But medications can help. I would think some kind of anti-psychotic like Risperidone and maybe something for impulse control, like, Clonidine.

 

Try to find a therapist associated with that psychiatrist. Therapists and psychiastrists have to work hand in hand. We made the mistake for a year of separate offices.

 

Do NOT be afraid of hospitalization. My oldest has been to a psych hospital 5 times. It's almost like taking your car for a tune-up at this point. These hospitals are awful and depressing, but they can work for everyone. It's typically less than a week stay. You know they are safe. You get a break from worrying. And they will be able to closely monitor medications to make sure they are doing what they are supposed to.

 

Do NOT listen to anyone else here. I'm sorry, but unless you've been through this, you don't know what the hell you are talking about.

 

 

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

9 minutes ago, bcl05 said:

I'm a physician, but not a psychiatrist. I am the parent of an angry/angsty 13-year old...

 

For your son, I would strongly recommend an urgent psychiatric evaluation.  Suicidal ideation with specificity (a specific idea/plan on how) is a huge red flag and should expedite any delays that can be a hassle re: getting an appointment.  

 

It may be nothing - many middle-school age kids go through these kind of things, and the non-medical advice in this thread is all solid and valuable.  Still, better safe than sorry and I would get into a psychiatrists office as soon as possible.  

 

If you are dealing with suicidality and are acutely worried that something is imminent, that would be a good reason to get to an ER immediately.  

 

Good luck. 

 

You can listen to this guy.

 

I personally do not recommend going through the ER. You can end up sitting in the ER for two or three days (literally) until a bed opens at a psych hospital. And that's all the ER can usually do for you. Unless your child is in an actual psychotic episode or is harming or trying to harm himself, the ER will typically give you a valium and make you wait until a psych hospital is open. If your child is actually harming himself, do that. Otherwise, get a list of the psych hospitals in your area (which can include cities 4 hours away) and call all of them. Ask if they provide services for adolescent males. Ask if they "have a bed available."

 

If they do, drive there. It can take 4 or 5 hours to do the intake at one of these places, and they don't let you bring keys or phones into the secure areas so be prepared to sleep or read. But, 4 or 5 hours at the actual facility is better than 48 hours in an ER - which is what we did the first time with my daughter. (She enjoyed herself in a bed with a tv and all the popsicles she could eat while we waited.

9 minutes ago, bcl05 said:

I'm a physician, but not a psychiatrist. I am the parent of an angry/angsty 13-year old...

 

For your son, I would strongly recommend an urgent psychiatric evaluation.  Suicidal ideation with specificity (a specific idea/plan on how) is a huge red flag and should expedite any delays that can be a hassle re: getting an appointment.  

 

It may be nothing - many middle-school age kids go through these kind of things, and the non-medical advice in this thread is all solid and valuable.  Still, better safe than sorry and I would get into a psychiatrists office as soon as possible.  

 

If you are dealing with suicidality and are acutely worried that something is imminent, that would be a good reason to get to an ER immediately.  

 

Good luck. 

 

You can listen to this guy.

 

I personally do not recommend going through the ER. You can end up sitting in the ER for two or three days (literally) until a bed opens at a psych hospital. And that's all the ER can usually do for you. Unless your child is in an actual psychotic episode or is harming or trying to harm himself, the ER will typically give you a valium and make you wait until a psych hospital is open. If your child is actually harming himself, do that. Otherwise, get a list of the psych hospitals in your area (which can include cities 4 hours away) and call all of them. Ask if they provide services for adolescent males. Ask if they "have a bed available."

 

If they do, drive there. It can take 4 or 5 hours to do the intake at one of these places, and they don't let you bring keys or phones into the secure areas so be prepared to sleep or read. But, 4 or 5 hours at the actual facility is better than 48 hours in an ER - which is what we did the first time with my daughter. (She enjoyed herself in a bed with a tv and all the popsicles she could eat while we waited.

[Llevron]

Only thing I can add to this is that my niece goes through similar swings of anger and depression. She HATES her medicine. But it does work. Used to make me worried to see her taking it even knowing that. But I can trust her to not get into serious freaking trouble (she is a loud mouth, angry, skinny black girl who does not back down for ****) when she is on it. When she is off of it i'm worried sick. So, yea. Don't be afraid of it if they tell you it will help. Potential consequences are serious if he really cannot control himself like my girl cant. 

[dfitzo53]

3 hours ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said:

I know more about child psychologists, therapists, and long term care facilities than anyone without a degree should.

 

The disassociations he is having are the biggest concern, and my initial thought is that he needs medication for them sooner rather than later.

 

My initial advice is this: Do not be afraid of any plan of action. As an adoptive parent of kids with issues, I know a dozen other adoptive parents of kids with issues. Half of them deal with reality. Half of them think **** is going to get better or that hospitalization is not really needed or whatever. Those parents are failing their kids.

 

Having said that, get a children's psychiatrist (not psychologist yet). Do not get medication from your pediatrician. They don't know this stuff, and they can't monitor. It's going to take some time to figure out what the right medication/medications are and the correct doses. But medications can help. I would think some kind of anti-psychotic like Risperidone and maybe something for impulse control, like, Clonidine.

 

Try to find a therapist associated with that psychiatrist. Therapists and psychiastrists have to work hand in hand. We made the mistake for a year of separate offices.

 

Do NOT be afraid of hospitalization. My oldest has been to a psych hospital 5 times. It's almost like taking your car for a tune-up at this point. These hospitals are awful and depressing, but they can work for everyone. It's typically less than a week stay. You know they are safe. You get a break from worrying. And they will be able to closely monitor medications to make sure they are doing what they are supposed to.

 

Do NOT listen to anyone else here. I'm sorry, but unless you've been through this, you don't know what the hell you are talking about.

 

 

Well said, I agree my initial reaction probably wasn't stringent enough.

 

I've had several students go through various iterations of home and hospital treatment or inpatient treatment at a hospital and it's always been helpful to those kids.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

I think parents get embarrassed at the idea of their children needing psychiatric hospitalization. If they needed heart surgery, no one would consider you a failure. But if they need a shrink, you have to be doing something wrong.

 

In a way, I don't have to deal with that shame, because it's not my genes and I didn't raise them their entire lives. But it still screws with adoptive parents too.

 

I say, "Own it."

[Kosher Ham]

18 hours ago, Vilandil Tasardur said:

Again, I teach for free (non profit), so I'm not selling you anything; it's just something I do. But even if it weren't with me, I can't recommend martial arts enough. It teaches control of body and control of mind, it is a physical sport that doesn't come with "winning and losing" on a weekly basis, it's a sport you can do well past high school or college, and it comes with philosophic training and character building that can really make a difference for a young adult.

 

Man...aahh... 

I agree and disagree. We all grew up learning martial arts and sports as release options. 

It is a different philosophy and can be potentially dangerous if the only thing the child takes from it is the physical part. 

Worked for me also, and thus the reason that I hate fighting. I know my triggers and also how far I will take it if that trigger is pulled. 

I fear the potential weapon that I became more than I fear the people or circumstances that I may face.

Thankfully I am a peaceful person that just wants to live life happily. 

 

 

17 hours ago, Llevron said:

Only thing I can add to this is that my niece goes through similar swings of anger and depression. She HATES her medicine. But it does work. Used to make me worried to see her taking it even knowing that. But I can trust her to not get into serious freaking trouble (she is a loud mouth, angry, skinny black girl who does not back down for ****) when she is on it. When she is off of it i'm worried sick. So, yea. Don't be afraid of it if they tell you it will help. Potential consequences are serious if he really cannot control himself like my girl cant. 

 

Serious question ? Single parent home for your niece ? 

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

Another option would be to get a QEEG done to evaluate his brainwave activity.  That could possibly be addressed using neurofeedback therapy and other non-pharmaceutical methods.  

 

I am not sure of the reputation of this place, but I found it online as an example of a place that could be worth looking into.  They appear to offer brain training as well as medication.  

 

https://www.amenclinics.com/washington-dc/

 

Wishing you and your family the best during this difficult time.

[codeorama]

Man, I’m sorry you are going through this. Please seek help. Don’t try to handle it alone. I wish I could help more.

[Llevron]

1 hour ago, Kosher Ham said:

 

Serious question ? Single parent home for your niece ? 

 

Yea my brother died when she was 5 (military). She says all the time to me that is the reason she is so mixed up (among a few other things). I want to tell her to get over it, cause....she has to. But im not sure my brand of 'tough, get over it' love would actually help in this case so I just give her an outlet for when shes losing it. Best I can do right now. 

[Kosher Ham]

Keep trying to teach her. 

That is your best. 

Know the mother and help more. 

Mixed up is one thing, a deviant is another. 

[Llevron]

 

10 minutes ago, Kosher Ham said:

Keep trying to teach her. 

That is your best. 

Know the mother and help more. 

Mixed up is one thing, a deviant is another. 

 

Yea. Its complicated. Shes grown now so it makes it more difficult. Shes 22 and this stuff is just starting to effect her over the last year or two. But we will get through it as a family, we always do. Shes got strong roots so I have in the family pulling her out of this tail spin. 

 

Thanks for the words tho homie 

[Long n Left]

Late to the dance, but I'll chime in.

 

I have an 18 year old HS senior daughter who had expressed suicidal thoughts, and was stressing way too much over getting and maintaining a perfect academic record, though I've never pushed her to succeed...she is very self motivated. She has been on medication and been seeing a therapist for some time, and it is working very well for her.

 

Just last week, she came home in tears one night, and we talked together about a huge fight she'd had with a very close friend. In the past this event would have sent her into a spiral of self loathing where hurting herself seemed an option. That night, we talked till she calmed down, and the next morning I got a hug and a "thank you" from her, for just talking her through it. She and the friend are settling their differences now.

 

I truly believe that the therapy has given her a positive direction to take when stressful and/or emotional events threaten to consume her, and I believe she is in a far better place because of it.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

2 hours ago, AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy said:

Another option would be to get a QEEG done to evaluate his brainwave activity.  That could possibly be addressed using neurofeedback therapy and other non-pharmaceutical methods.  

 

I am not sure of the reputation of this place, but I found it online as an example of a place that could be worth looking into.  They appear to offer brain training as well as medication.  

 

https://www.amenclinics.com/washington-dc/

 

Wishing you and your family the best during this difficult time.

 

We've done a little bit with neurofeedback. It's interesting stuff, and I think it can work. The one concern I have with it is that it seems like you need complete and total buy-in to get it to work, and it's really hard for teens to be THAT committed to therapy.

 

There's a lot out there though.

[AlvinWaltonIsMyBoy]

3 minutes ago, Lombardi's_kid_brother said:

 

We've done a little bit with neurofeedback. It's interesting stuff, and I think it can work. The one concern I have with it is that it seems like you need complete and total buy-in to get it to work, and it's really hard for teens to be THAT committed to therapy.

 

There's a lot out there though.

I would tend to agree with you here, in that it helps to have buy in.  It has helped me a lot personally. 

 

I just caution the use of anti-psychotic medications without exhausting other options first.  As much as I totally respect and understand your position (these are incredibly difficult issues and complex situations), I offer a view from the other side.  My wife spends a lot of her day trying to unwind and piece back together the brains of children/teens/adults who have been heavily medicated with psychiatric drugs.  It's not a pretty sight.

 

I'm just trying to give the OP some options to consider.  And I also appreciate you sharing your experience in these matters, LKB.    

[Fergasun]

All,

Bumping this to say -- thanks for the advice, experiences and thoughts. 

 

One thing I'll share is that we had a breakthrough a couple nights ago where he finally told us that he's been dealing with these thoughts for a long time, much longer than just the past 2 years.  He even shared how some of the stupid little things I would tell him as a parent trying to guide, discipline, even if I thought it was benign was damaging to him.  Perhaps his brain or genetic makeup make any type of harsh word 10x worse than it would be to me -- but he and my wife and I just want to see him get to a place where he can be his happy self.  

 

He had his first counseling visit -- I don't really want to ask him "how do you like it?" because at some level it annoys him; but I think seeing a professional M.D. will give me some confidence that we are going to get some type of starting and "professional evaluation" about what is going on in his mind.  My wife seems more scared of putting him in therapy/counselling, "sharing too much" which seems a bit annoying to me and she acts like, "you don't have to do this if you don't want to".  Screw that -- I want him in with a professional at some level for whatever we can get initially (going through employee assistance program).  I want someone else to look at him closely and let us know, without any pre-conceived notion or bias what we are dealing with -- depression, average tweenager pains, someone who has a hard time listening to his parents and needs to hear advice/wisdom from 3rd parties.        

 

 

[Captain James]

Hey brother, sorry to hear about this stressful situation. I'll pitch in and share some of my own quick two cents. Couple of things: I'm the pastor/director of care and counseling at our largish church, and I also work full-time in a mental health organization. I've seen a thing or two similar to your story, but I'm certainly no expert...

 

Just like you said, the things he's doing and expressing aren't "normal," but they are unfortunately becoming increasingly prevalent. Is there any good, solid, Christian counseling offered at your church? If not, does anyone in your church know of any good Christian counselors in the area? At the very least, it sounds like he could use someone wise, mature, and personable to talk to. It doesn't sound like he needs pushed towards any medication (unless he gets diagnosed with clinical depression), nor hospitalized in any way. Still, we should always take it VERY seriously when someone begins to express any thoughts of self-harm. Do you know of any bullying at all? Any relationship issues?

 

Vilandil offered some solid advice. Helping him find some good outlets for any built up anger/aggression/testosterone would be beneficial. Maybe he's just an intense young man that needs better ways to cope? Just thinking out loud. If this behavior has increased or heightened recently, I would take that as a warning sign to try something new/offer him some professional help. In the meantime, encourage him, build him up, and remind him of your unconditional love. You can always check through your insurance (if you have) for some in-network mental health services.

 

I hope everything works out.