Fox NFL Sunday via Jay Glazer: Dan Snyder not Happy with Coach Shanahan's Comments After Carolina Game.

[pjfootballer]

I'm all for being patient........when I see progress. Unfortunately, I see us progressing in areas that are over-looked by some of you that are important aspects of the game. The amount of penalties, clock management, lack of discipline, team being flat when the coach called it a "must-win" game, etc. Those aspects of the game should be improving in year three regardless of talent level and they haven't.

I think this is where I'm at. I don't think firing Shanahan at this point is in the best interest of the franchise. I've been as patient as anyone the last 2.5 years, but there comes a time where Shanahan and the team will have to show real progress. They'll have to stop doing the stupid things they do week in and week out and start translating them to wins. A team is judge by wins. Not stats, not moral victories and not would, coulda, shoulda. I'm at the end of my rope with the losing. It's just wearing on me. I maybe could take losing if real progress was shown this year. We probably got 2, maybe 3 good games this year. I'm kind of where you are at KG.

[pjfootballer]

I'm a bit torn on Shanny right now. I agree that he had a monumental task to turn the roster over. He had next to nothing in the cupboard and an unfair FA class the first two years he was here (the restricted tender pre-lockout year and then the lockout year 2010-2011). And then this year, the cap penalty. I got it, that sucks and that is hard.

But I also don't see development and I don't see discipline or smart decisions on the football field, which is where a guy like Mike Shanahan should be thinking to himself, hey... this is the easy part, I've got this. Clock management, stupid penalties, effort, and being outcoached are not excuses that we should be listening to three years into a program insallations. In fact, you shouldn't be "installing" anything at this point, your program should be in more of a "reactionary" mode.

Bottom line for me, I am happy with a lot of the moves made, and I understand the ones that weren't. But I am not happy with the football side of things in terms of what's gone on during actual games. To me, that leaves a lot to be desired and I am not confident Shanahan is the guy for the job and I am also not confident that Shanahan thinks he is the guy for the job anymore.

Another post that I agree with.

[Thinking Skins]

Alternatively, Snyder could revert back to his form early on his career and simply fire Shanahan in mid-contract, but what does that accomplish? It won't improve the situation, and merely proves to the NFL that he is an impatient owner who pulls the trigger without thinking. And should Snyder actually find a good coach willing to come to Washington, and continue a rebuild under these kind of conditions -- Redskins fans will get to enjoy watching the team be done over to fit the new coaches philosophy, and also to deliberate on the eventual fate of the latest entrant in the coaching carousel.

The important thing to note is that if an owner and fan-base can't tolerate a rebuild taking longer than two years, and only want 'quick fixes' -- they are probably doomed to a parade of teams that are cobbled together to give the appearance of being competitve in the current season. And under that approach, eventually you run into a situation that resembles 2009, when the wheels start to fall off. Real progress is when you build a foundation of talent to support the stars that emerge on your team, and establish a tradition of continuity in managing a time-tested system, especially on offense.

Long quote, but I'll reply to this part.

First, many of Shanny's moves have been HATED here by fans, (running RG3 so much, installing a 3-4 defense, keeping Smith as special teams coordinator, hiring and keeping Haslett as DC, his draft decisions, not re-signing Carlos Rodgers, not benching D. Hall, ..., there's a pretty long list). So lets not act like he's been a saint of a head coach and what we're seeing is that we're right in many of these instances.

Second, the question is what do coaches consider a fair chance? If you look around the league you'll see that most coaches get three years to prove themselves and if they have a bad record in those first three years they're generally let go. Snyder has given Shanny that chance, so its fair game.

Add to that point that if a coach is that afraid of Snyder we don't want him here. We need a coach who isn't afraid to stand up to Snyder and say NO. Its not like we've got an Al Davis on our hands who's fired a coach who just took his team to the SB. In this league there will be candidates who are willing to come here for the mere reason that they want a head coaching job and there are only 32 of those. We are not in such a dire situation that we've got to settle for Shanny. Cause if that's the thinking then we're no better than we were when we settled for Zorn. What I want to do is have an INTERVIEW PROCESS and look at a number of candidates and have Snyder and Allen (or whoever is the GM) consider their PROs and CONs and say that "this guy just wowed me and I think he'll make a great coach!". I don't want another one of Snyder's man-crushes to come to life where its a guy he grew up idolizing and has a chance to hire. Those haven't worked. But people are out there. We couldn't get Spags in 2008, but he got fired anyway and his team sucked.

[Redskins4ever]

Snyder enabled this by giving Shanny full control over everything. It's Snyder's fault. Snyder MADE Shanny the boss. He handed him the keys to the front office and the back office.

Now, most of us on here wanted Snyder to have less control, but don't you need organizational leadership to accomplish this?

I could understand handing the keys to a seasoned GM who has proven his worth, but Shanny isn't a proven team builder.

This is why the formula the Redskins are using is wrong. Bruce Allen should be picking the draft picks, signing the key free agents, and making solid trades but he isn't. Shanahan is the one who has full control over the roster. I think if push came to shove, Bruce Allen would take personnel decisions away from Shanahan and do those duties himself like he should have been doing all along.

[KingGibbs]

ooooppppss. accidently quoted myself.

[RedskinParadigm]

You don't kno that it'd hurt this team just like you can't say that not doing those things would help (I kinda agree that those weren't the right moves, but who is to say that drafting more OL and say signing Victor Cruz wouldn't have helped us).

Well none of us know anything for sure about what would have made us better in the past or what will make us better in the future, but we have these discussions anyway. Vincent Jackson may be the next Jerry Rice or Terrell Owens churning out 1000-yard seasons at 34+, but the probability of that isn't very high.

Maybe, but maybe not. QB is the most important position on the field, but when your GM is unable to find talent at other positions it means he's playing with a bunch of scrubs and that's not quite the setup for playoffs. Look at what Gibbs 2 did. He took us to the playoffs and handed a playoff team over to Snyder. That Snyder hired an inept coach in Zorn is his own fault, but at that time this franchise was set up for a successful future. And the problem I have with that last sentence is that (unlike Gibbs) Shanny may have lost the team, it seems like they're not playing for him and if you believe the podcast posted earlier, neither are his coaches. That's not a playoff environment.

The point about talent is well-taken, but that only applies here if RG3 was devoid of surrounding talent. He's not.

As for Gibbs, he handed Snyder a playoff-ready team, but not one that was built for sustained success. The lynchpins of that team were Clinton Portis, Chris Samuels, and London Fletcher. Portis last about half of a season before hitting his wall, while Samuels lasted one season. That team was not built to have sustained success. It was built for an immediate run.

Youth is only the first part of it. We also need competition at positions. We don't need Hankerson/Robinson/etc knowing they'll make the team and figured as starters. I want to see our guys competing for starting spots. I want to hear about veterans losing their jobs to young guys. We don't see that unless (a) the veteran is injured and the young guy performs EXCEPTIONALLY (ala Alfred Morris and Fred Davis) or ( the young guy is a first round draft pick (ala Orakpo, Williams, Kerrigan and RG3). Look at Fred Davis as a prime example. He wasn't given a chance til Cooley got hurt and the he becomes a franchise TE. Why wasn't he getting more opportunities before? Was it all part of Shanny's grand scheme to get RG3?

Competition is the one thing that Shanahan has brought to the on-field product. Robinson earned his spot on this team by beating out Anthony Armstrong (the team's #2 WR in 2010) and Terrence Austin (a former Shanahan draft pick). Leonard Hankerson worked his way up from not dressing to part-time player to rotational starter. He wasn't given anything. Shanahan has inserted youngsters over veterans based on merit, not injury (Lichtensteiger over Derrick Dockery, Perry Riley over Rocky McIntosh, Darrell Young over Mike Sellers, pre-injury Hankerson over Gaffney/Moss in 2011). I don't get your complaints on this one.

I get what you're saying and though it doesn't directly apply to me, I'll comment that I find it sad that so many fans feel so attached to certain players on this team JUST BECAUSE they're on this team. If Hankerson was on the Dolphins people wouldn't know him from Waldo, but the fact that he's on the Skins people talk about hope and optimism and how he needs more chances. I say bring in (legit) competition. If he's meant to be, then he'll beat the guy out. If not, then he gets cut. But when we start the roster with 9 guys competing at WR, but none of them really can show that they're even legit NFL players, then there's something wrong with the guys we're bring in. Same goes for Safety where we had at least 6 guys at that position this summer. I don't believe that NOBODY was available at our price, I'd bet that if I looked at the cheap free agents brought in and the draft picks this year, there are probably quite a few that are playing on legit pass defenses. We shouldn't be married to a guy just because he's on our team. Otherwise how would we grow?

I understand the complaints on this one, and this is where there have been mistakes. Clearly there were better options at safety and in the secondary. The WR complaint is bogus, though; the guys we have are plenty good enough to play in a top 10 offense (which they are), and that's without the #1 guy on the field. Two poor games does not etch their status in stone.

If you remember in 2005, we made the divisional round of the playoffs and were a few plays away from making the championship game. Saying that we couldn't have done it without a star QB is like saying that Baltimore won't make it (although they were a missed FG away). Even with all the love for RG3, we can easily say that he'll never be a legit threat for the SB if his only plays are screens and QB draws.

Careful with the "if only" game. Using that, I could easily say this team would be the division leader at the moment, if only for a few plays this season.

As for the QB draws and screens comment: we must be watching different offenses. Not sure where this idea is coming from, but the mischaracterization of this offense is nowhere close to being true.

Based on what? First sustained success? We're 3-6 right now. I don't call that success. Until he (we) makes changes, I don't see success, and the change should start with Shanny.

I didn't say we're successful at the moment, I said we're on the way. This is based on the composition of the young and talented roster we see. I would like to see in progress as the season continues, however.

The Packers under Mike McCarthy were NEVER 4-12. His WORSE record with them was 6-10, but that was after he went 8-8 and 13-3 which bought him some leeway.

I didn't say under Mike McCarthy, I said the GB Packers. It's the same idea as the Giants under Ernie Accorsi, who built the foundation for their two SB rosters, but didn't last long enough to see it come to fruition.

[DC9]

I understand the complaints on this one, and this is where there have been mistakes. Clearly there were better options at safety and in the secondary. The WR complaint is bogus, though; the guys we have are plenty good enough to play in a top 10 offense (which they are), and that's without the #1 guy on the field. Two poor games does not etch their status in stone. .

I agree with you here. But this also gets back to the coaching of the team in regards to the WRs. You and I seem to be thinking along the same lines here.

Regarding Safety... I truly believe if we can get Tanard Jackson eligible and keep him clean (paging Phillip Daniles), then he will be a steal. Watching him live against the Colts during the preseason game, he just seemed to move so much faster as a player than the rest of the secondary. He was very instictive and noticably the best player in that secondary. He absolutely controlled the middle part of the field against a pretty good Quarterback in Andrew Luck, who decided to take his chances on the side of Madieu Williams... go figure.

I didn't say under Mike McCarthy, I said the GB Packers. It's the same idea as the Giants under Ernie Accorsi, who built the foundation for their two SB rosters, but didn't last long enough to see it come to fruition

And this, this seems to be a lot of the norm these days. And I would have no problem with a Jon Gruden, Bill O'Brien, James Franklin or whoever coming in here and winning a couple of Super Bowls and saying "Yeah, he did it with Shanahan's players." I'd say that all day long. It's rare to find a coach who can "pick out the ingredients and make the meal" as they all like to say. That marraige doesn't really work very often these days especially.

And to me, at this press conference that Shanny was at on Sunday, he truly seemed like he didn't have the answer. He seemed shocked that his team put up such a poo poo effort when he said it was a must win... he seemed like he didn't know what to say or do going forward. And for those who think this was some kind of a reverse psychology thing to use on the players... well, in my opinion, it should never come to that. Especially with such a young group. I can see you saying stuff like that with an older, more veteran group like the Giants or Ravens... but not a group where most of the roster is under 26 years old. That's where I get the opinion that he's losing touch.

[RedskinParadigm]

DC9, I think we're on the same wavelength. I just hope our instincts about Shanahan losing touch with the players are wrong. I really hope this team comes out of the bye with a vengeance.

[Oldfan]

...Just give this coaching staff some time to continue to build through the draft, pick up some free agents, and keep building.. it will get to where we want to go. Blowing up everything and expecting different results is what we've done that the last 20 years, what makes you think that will work this time?

Our problem in the past has not been dumping coaches. It has been hiring coaches who couldn't cut it.

Pat Bowlen gave Mike Shanahan full control of his football team in 1999. Then he backed every move Mike made. Bowlen's return on his 10-year investment was one playoff win. Mike was fired in 2008.

Given full control here, the progress has been disappointing. Why are you so confident that our patience will be rewarded this time?

I didn't want to hire Mike Shanahan, and I'm not in favor of firing him now, but please don't preach patience to me.

[KCClybun]

Youth is only the first part of it. We also need competition at positions. We don't need Hankerson/Robinson/etc knowing they'll make the team and figured as starters. I want to see our guys competing for starting spots. I want to hear about veterans losing their jobs to young guys. We don't see that unless (a) the veteran is injured and the young guy performs EXCEPTIONALLY (ala Alfred Morris and Fred Davis) or ( the young guy is a first round draft pick (ala Orakpo, Williams, Kerrigan and RG3). Look at Fred Davis as a prime example. He wasn't given a chance til Cooley got hurt and the he becomes a franchise TE. Why wasn't he getting more opportunities before? Was it all part of Shanny's grand scheme to get RG3?

Hank and Josh Morgan competed all training camp for who would be the Z receiver opposite Garcon, and Aldrick and Hank have basically been competing for who would take the X spot in Garcon's absense. The reason Armstrong and Terrence Austin aren't here is because they were beat out in the competition by Dez and Aldrick Robinson. With Helu and Hightower hurting Royster was penciled in as the starter at running back, and then Alfred came on and they competed for that job.

And Fred didn't get his shot because Cooley played relatively well and well in the Shanny's first training camp. In 2011, Fred basically blew Cooley out of the water when he came back in much better shape and as a much better all around tight end.

The idea that people don't compete for jobs under Shanahan is bull.

Maybe, but maybe not. QB is the most important position on the field, but when your GM is unable to find talent at other positions it means he's playing with a bunch of scrubs and that's not quite the setup for playoffs. Look at what Gibbs 2 did. He took us to the playoffs and handed a playoff team over to Snyder. That Snyder hired an inept coach in Zorn is his own fault, but at that time this franchise was set up for a successful future. And the problem I have with that last sentence is that (unlike Gibbs) Shanny may have lost the team, it seems like they're not playing for him and if you believe the podcast posted earlier, neither are his coaches. That's not a playoff environment.

Gibbs left the team with an aging team where the inmates ran the asylum, in a situation where the players would pretty much only play for him---guys like Rocky McIntosh, Carlos Rodgers and LaRon Landry all more or less quit and wanted out of town once Gibbs left. Gibbs did not deliver unto Dan Snyder a playoff capable team; he handed him a team teetering on the ragged edge of irrelevancy that only needed the tiniest of shoves to fall off a ****ing cliff, and the age of the team and the injuries to key players destroyed the whole team over the course of two years. Pretending Gibbs left the Redskins with a team ready for a run is misguided, if not flat out wrong. Gibbs was a great man, but he was also a short-sighted man, a man who could motivate average players to do really good things, but who had lost the ability to develop really good talent to do great things. That we somehow made the playoffs is a testament to his ability to motivate, but the depths to which the team fell is also a testament to his lack of foresight and inability to build a team that could win now, and in the future.

Take off the burgundy colored glasses for a while and you're realize that while Gibbs was a great man, he left this organization just as it's foundation was cracking and about to come tumbling right the **** down.

[DC9]

Gibbs left the team with an aging team where the inmates ran the asylum, in a situation where the players would pretty much only play for him---guys like Rocky McIntosh, Carlos Rodgers and LaRon Landry all more or less quit and wanted out of town once Gibbs left. Gibbs did not deliver unto Dan Snyder a playoff capable team; he handed him a team teetering on the ragged edge of irrelevancy that only needed the tiniest of shoves to fall off a ****ing cliff, and the age of the team and the injuries to key players destroyed the whole team over the course of two years. Pretending Gibbs left the Redskins with a team ready for a run is misguided, if not flat out wrong. Gibbs was a great man, but he was also a short-sighted man, a man who could motivate average players to do really good things, but who had lost the ability to develop really good talent to do great things. That we somehow made the playoffs is a testament to his ability to motivate, but the depths to which the team fell is also a testament to his lack of foresight and inability to build a team that could win now, and in the future.

Take off the burgundy colored glasses for a while and you're realize that while Gibbs was a great man, he left this organization just as it's foundation was cracking and about to come tumbling right the **** down.

NLC, I agree with you on everything except this statement. I think with the right coach (who knows, maybe Greg Williams?) that 2008 team could've made a playoff run. Not a deep run, but a run nonetheless. The issue we ran into with that team (aside from guys breaking down at the midway point) was the lack of adjustments made by Zorn in the second half of the season. The book was out on him and he never adjusted. We could see it coming after the Steelers game, the Ravens game, and into the rest of the games that year and 2009. Zorn was a terrible coach and so predictable I think we all knew where the ball was going on offense. That said, in 2009 we would've stunk regardless... maybe 5-6 wins at the most.

But I don't disagree with your comments on Gibbs leaving. However, that also goes into my reasoning for 2008 being a "decent" season with the right coach. But agree that there was no long term success that should've been expected out of that group at all.

If "if's and but's were candy and nuts."

[THE HAMMER'IN HOG]

So you were okay with the Head Coach of this team saying that we were in "evaluation mode" and packing in the rest of the season?

So he said we were packing it in for the season?

[DC9]

So he said we were packing it in for the season?

the quotes were around what was said...

[Thinking Skins]

Competition is the one thing that Shanahan has brought to the on-field product. Robinson earned his spot on this team by beating out Anthony Armstrong (the team's #2 WR in 2010) and Terrence Austin (a former Shanahan draft pick). Leonard Hankerson worked his way up from not dressing to part-time player to rotational starter. He wasn't given anything. Shanahan has inserted youngsters over veterans based on merit, not injury (Lichtensteiger over Derrick Dockery, Perry Riley over Rocky McIntosh, Darrell Young over Mike Sellers, pre-injury Hankerson over Gaffney/Moss in 2011). I don't get your complaints on this one.

Uh, maybe we're remembering things differently. Dockery was playing decent and he was benched for Kory not because of competition but because of personal preference. In fact, you can look at the archives on here, Kory was playing HORRIBLE that year, strait missing blocks. Its amazign that McNabb didn't get killed that year. Same goes for Jamaal Brown given the job at RT. Same goes for Perry Riley. McIntosh wasn't outplayed, Riley just became the starter one day after we had decided that we didn't want Rocky any more.Same goes for Young. How many FBs did we bring in? None, or should I say one. And he got the job.

We did bring in WRs, but ask yourself how are our rookie FA WRs doing? How are our low draft pick FAs doing? Who are our top WRs this year?

Hankerson - the top WR drafted by Shanny

Moss - a veteran he inherited who's been starting for years

Morgan - a free agent he brought in this offseason.

And the guy who's hur, Garcon who was also a free agent addition.

If there's competition we'd see young guys competing for playing time. We'd see them being given a chance. Robinson gets 1/3 of the pass attempts as the other guys. And we cut Austin who looked better than most of these guys. And we can even talk about Stallworth who we just cut after he led the team in recieving yards. Where's the competition there? We have an underperforming unit and yet there's no shakeup in the lineup? Where's the competition?

---------- Post added November-16th-2012 at 03:02 PM ----------

I didn't say under Mike McCarthy, I said the GB Packers. It's the same idea as the Giants under Ernie Accorsi, who built the foundation for their two SB rosters, but didn't last long enough to see it come to fruition.

That's exactly the point though. They had a crappy coach in Sherman and fired him. McCarthy was a good coach for that franchise and he proved it immediately by going 8-8 and then 13-3. Can't say the same for Shanny.

Even Tom Coughlin with the Giants, who was close to being fired after his third year, had gone 6-10, 11-5, 8-8.

Jim Fassell for the Giants went 10-5-1, 8-8. 7-9.

Dan Reeves went 11-5, 9-7, 5-11

See a pattern here?

[KCClybun]

And we can even talk about Stallworth who we just cut after he led the team in recieving yards. Where's the competition there? We have an underperforming unit and yet there's no shakeup in the lineup? Where's the competition?

You know, I was going to give you a big long rebuttal about why you were wrong, and then I realized you can't even get basic details of what actually happened. Stallworth didn't lead the team in receiving; Gaffney did. And Gaffney, while a decent possession receiver, got no YAC and broke no tackles.

And then there was the whole thing where he embarrassed himself on Twitter for like two days over his wife cheating on him.

---------- Post added November-16th-2012 at 03:41 PM ----------

NLC, I agree with you on everything except this statement. I think with the right coach (who knows, maybe Greg Williams?) that 2008 team could've made a playoff run. Not a deep run, but a run nonetheless. The issue we ran into with that team (aside from guys breaking down at the midway point) was the lack of adjustments made by Zorn in the second half of the season. The book was out on him and he never adjusted. We could see it coming after the Steelers game, the Ravens game, and into the rest of the games that year and 2009. Zorn was a terrible coach and so predictable I think we all knew where the ball was going on offense. That said, in 2009 we would've stunk regardless... maybe 5-6 wins at the most.

But I don't disagree with your comments on Gibbs leaving. However, that also goes into my reasoning for 2008 being a "decent" season with the right coach. But agree that there was no long term success that should've been expected out of that group at all.

If "if's and but's were candy and nuts."

Thing is...you mention Gregg. We all know the scandal he's going through right now. Thing about Gregg was, he wasn't well liked outside the defensive meeting room. Dan interviewed him for the job a bunch of times and decided to move in another direction, and Gregg had a past of being difficult to work with and kind of an *******. He got his defense to respond to him, but I think that offense still would've fell off.

Not that Zorn was the right choice either, but I think the only person who could've done what Gibbs did is Gibbs.

[Thinking Skins]

You know, I was going to give you a big long rebuttal about why you were wrong, and then I realized you can't even get basic details of what actually happened. Stallworth didn't lead the team in receiving; Gaffney did. And Gaffney, while a decent possession receiver, got no YAC and broke no tackles.

And then there was the whole thing where he embarrassed himself on Twitter for like two days over his wife cheating on him.

Ok, Gaffney, point still remains - he didn't get to compete for his job and our WR core could probably use more talent. The key thing was that he caught the ball, YAC don't really matter if you don't make a catch.

---------- Post added November-16th-2012 at 04:38 PM ----------

Hank and Josh Morgan competed all training camp for who would be the Z receiver opposite Garcon, and Aldrick and Hank have basically been competing for who would take the X spot in Garcon's absense. The reason Armstrong and Terrence Austin aren't here is because they were beat out in the competition by Dez and Aldrick Robinson. With Helu and Hightower hurting Royster was penciled in as the starter at running back, and then Alfred came on and they competed for that job.

And Fred didn't get his shot because Cooley played relatively well and well in the Shanny's first training camp. In 2011, Fred basically blew Cooley out of the water when he came back in much better shape and as a much better all around tight end.

The idea that people don't compete for jobs under Shanahan is bull.

Glad you're here to point things out. Notice your words though. According to you, Shanny had Hank and Robinson set up to compete for that spot. Why not an open competition? I'd also like to see the point where Royster and Morris were in competition. The way I remember it, and you can check the game logs, is that Royster and Helu were both hurt for the preseason and couldn't go so we had a 6th rounder starting. He played but he only wound up starting the regular season because the other guys were still injured. When they were healthy, it was going to be too hard to replace him. Lets not act like he came into camp with plans to get snaps with the starting unit cause it just didn't happen.

---------- Post added November-16th-2012 at 04:45 PM ----------

Gibbs left the team with an aging team where the inmates ran the asylum, in a situation where the players would pretty much only play for him---guys like Rocky McIntosh, Carlos Rodgers and LaRon Landry all more or less quit and wanted out of town once Gibbs left. Gibbs did not deliver unto Dan Snyder a playoff capable team; he handed him a team teetering on the ragged edge of irrelevancy that only needed the tiniest of shoves to fall off a ****ing cliff, and the age of the team and the injuries to key players destroyed the whole team over the course of two years. Pretending Gibbs left the Redskins with a team ready for a run is misguided, if not flat out wrong. Gibbs was a great man, but he was also a short-sighted man, a man who could motivate average players to do really good things, but who had lost the ability to develop really good talent to do great things. That we somehow made the playoffs is a testament to his ability to motivate, but the depths to which the team fell is also a testament to his lack of foresight and inability to build a team that could win now, and in the future.

Take off the burgundy colored glasses for a while and you're realize that while Gibbs was a great man, he left this organization just as it's foundation was cracking and about to come tumbling right the **** down.

Gibbs left it like that? You're kidding right. This team was disciplined under Gibbs. Thats the only reason that we started off 6-2 the next year, because of what Gibbs had installed. Once it broke down in that loss to Pitt, everything fell apart. And Rocky and Carlos never quit on this team. Carlos was still putting up good numbers his last year here, people just didn't like the drops. But I'm not sure what you call a playoff capable team but in my opinion its one that makes the playoffs. Gibbs retired from this team after taking them to the playoffs in 2007. Thats a playoff capable team. To act like it wasn't ready to run is to act like we didn't go 6-2, and finish 8-8 that next year. You're telling me that a team that starts 6-2 isn't a playoff capable team?

And please tell me you're not saying that this team right now is better than the team that we had in 2007. Cause I'd have to disagree. STRONGLY.

[KCClybun]

Glad you're here to point things out. Notice your words though. According to you, Shanny had Hank and Robinson set up to compete for that spot. Why not an open competition?

It is an open competition. It's the definition of an open competition. What more do you want? If Dezmon Briscoe practices hard and shows that he is capable of being a starter, than he too will get the opportunity. "Open competition" does not mean "throw everyone in and hope one of them sticks eventually". The definition of competition is lost if you're given an opportunity to start or receiver more playing time over someone else when you don't deserve it. Right now, Josh is in a position where he's going to start every game at the "Z" position, and Santana only plays the slot, and they have both earned those roles. The only spot left is the role of who's going to star opposite Josh, and every one left worth playing is competing for that spot.

I'd also like to see the point where Royster and Morris were in competition. The way I remember it, and you can check the game logs, is that Royster and Helu were both hurt for the preseason and couldn't go so we had a 6th rounder starting. He played but he only wound up starting the regular season because the other guys were still injured. When they were healthy, it was going to be too hard to replace him. Lets not act like he came into camp with plans to get snaps with the starting unit cause it just didn't happen.

If I recall correctly, Royster didn't injure his hamstring until after the Bears game in preseason. He started versus the Bills and fumbled the exchange, and was mostly ineffective. Alfred Morris went off in the second half versus the Bills. Maybe Royster did get nicked up, but Morris solid performance helped elevate him into the role of starter. And if Morris had just been okay, then when Royster came back, he likely would've been replaced.

[THE HAMMER'IN HOG]

the quotes were around what was said...

Well I guess Shanny had no plans of packing it in after all, I wonder how the evaluation went?

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Well I guess Shanny had no plans of packing it in after all' date=' I wonder how the evaluation went?[/quote']

A 'told you so' HH? Off the back of the following game when it's indisputable what he said, and how he said it at the time? (Whatever the backtracking PR exercise the following day spun it into.).

Unlike you to stoop to that man.

Hail.

[Boss_Hogg]

Everybody be cool.

Mike's gotta a new hat.

[wantarace17]

Everybody be cool.

Mike's gotta a new hat.

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRZnxWDlD2FgAFYZJvilo0zy1EdVB8nb0F6DhszqlYr16w-9djX7A

He needs to never wear that again

[pjfootballer]

He looks like he belongs in A Clockwork Orange. In the Owned thread, someone photoshopped Colonel Sanders with the gang. We need a photoshop of Shanny in that photo.

[DogofWar1]

Shanahan looks so happy with that hat in the picture.

Shanahan never looks happy. Let him keep the hat so he stays happy.

[DC9]

Well I guess Shanny had no plans of packing it in after all' date=' I wonder how the evaluation went?[/quote']

I don't think anyone in here was rooting for the Redskins to do poorly. You should wait and see how we play vs a team that hasn't quit, though. Let's see how the stretch run goes...

[THE HAMMER'IN HOG]

I don't think anyone in here was rooting for the Redskins to do poorly. You should wait and see how we play vs a team that hasn't quit, though. Let's see how the stretch run goes...

Well the word was we had quit. Just because Shanny is not jumping up and down like a cheerleader doesn't mean he's quit, and even if your evaluating talent from a vantage point of a lost season does not mean your not going to give your best effort which I think many were trying to imply, coaching is about motivating and that comes in many different forms, I do agree that the Eagles have packed it in at this point, and we looked much better than we really are, but it was a nice way to come back after the break. Now lets dispatch the Cowgirls with extreme prejudice!