WP Insider: Chris Cooley wants to be more than a fullback

[F Landry]

I just hope all of you former Coooooooooooley fans know that we are one Fred Davis DOOBY away from starting Logan Paulsen or 'dropsies' Niles Paul at Tight End.

Not the best way to start RG3's growth with NO security blanket at a now KEY offensive position in the NFL.

You cannot go wrong with Cooley as a #2 TE, especially for our team considering we have NO PROVEN DEPTH behind him. I just hope you idiots feel ashamed after our back-up TEs start proving that there was a reason none of them were drafted earlier than the 5th round.

There is also a huge reason we didn't sign Freddy D long term this offseason. Even our own FO/Coaching Staff doesn't believe he is mature enough for a big investment in him.

NOW GIVE ME SOME FACTS OR REASONS WHY HE SHOULD BE CUT! Other than "hes not a good blocker."

:point2sky:logo::evilg:

---------- Post added August-14th-2012 at 06:39 AM ----------

Where did all these Cooley-haters sprout from? Geez, take it easy, boys. Cooley still has talent & passion for the game. We'll see whether or not his body is healthy enough to make the team.

Usually people personally attack others because of their own personal issues ...

Good post, Operations.

---------- Post added August-14th-2012 at 06:51 AM ----------

What I will share is that he was too busy drinking/partying/etc. to rehab his injury properly and just took his talent for granted. Until I found this out recently I was pulling for him to make the team, after learning this and other things I'm pulling for him to be cut.

Who cares if he was partying?? By your logic, Brandon Banks and Santana Moss should also be cut for being at a club in which Banks was STABBED.

What these NFL players do in their off-time is none of yours or my business. As long as they don't get arrested or hurt, WHO GIVES A F.

You sound very petty, sorry to say. I want the best players to play on this Redskins team, thats it.

[#BgMase76#]

I wasn't impressed w/ his play at FB but I gotta be honest. I just don't see him as the back-up FB. Maybe I'm missing something as well but from what I saw of Niles he has a ways to go. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt but I didn't walk way from that game thinking goodbye Cooley. I understand he's going to be faster than Cooley but has he shown enough in camp to warrant dropping Cooley? I'll reserve judgement until the end of preseason.

[KCClybun]

NOW GIVE ME SOME FACTS OR REASONS WHY HE SHOULD BE CUT! Other than "hes not a good blocker."

Okay, I'll play a long.

1.) He's got a bum knee and has made frequent trips to Dr. James Andrews to deal with it.

2.) He's slow.

3.) He's a number 2 tight end getting paid like a mid-tier starter.

4.) He has a big mouth.

5.) Homeboy is smoking cigarettes. Not the best for one's cardiovascular conditioning.

I'll pause and let you make the lame Fred Davis joke you probably spent five minutes trying to work on here. In the meantime, I'll just point everyone here where I address that point.

6.) He hasn't been fully healthy for the past three seasons.

7.) He's only scored 6 touchdown in the past four seasons.

8.) He's not that good a blocker, and that's a fact, at least according to Pro Football Focus.

9.) He's an older player blocking the path of younger player who may have more upside, but we'll never get the opportunity to know if Niles Paul can be a successful tight end if Cooley is still on the roster.

10.) He was really, really good once. He hasn't been really good for a couple years now. Get over it.

[TSO]

I've gotta be honest. The reason I don't really get into the Cooley debate here is because I simply don't care too much about it, lol. I haven't cared much about Cooley for like 3 years now. Furthermore, ever since Shanahan has come in I'm fully on board with his rebuild and have appreciated every move he's made thus far, even the perceived negative ones. So, in my mind and with solid grounds for a basis, whatever decision is made by Shanahan about Cooley will be the best one. I don't mean to make light of the situation, but the matter to me really is that easy. I'm not at all invested in it otherwise... there's much more interesting and significant things going on with our personnel right now than whether or not Cooley makes the team.

I appreciate how well he's played for us and how hard, but there is plenty of evidence out there to show that he hasn't put his all into the offseason on numerous occasions and, furthermore, I'm not too fond of his off the field antics though I fully understand that is of personal preference and many love him for his "wild side".

[Califan007 The Constipated]

Okay, I'll play a long.

1.) He's got a bum knee and has made frequent trips to Dr. James Andrews to deal with it.

So do you think we were gonna replace Cooley with John Carlson if not for the cap penalties? Because it would be all kinds of ironic, if so lol...

9.) He's an older player blocking the path of younger player who may have more upside, but we'll never get the opportunity to know if Niles Paul can be a successful tight end if Cooley is still on the roster.

This argument never holds up to the light of logic. Who was the last young player whose development was "blocked" by having an average veteran player ahead of him on the roster?

We heard that Thrash would keep Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly from developing.

We heard that Galloway would keep Armstrong and Austin from developing.

We heard that Gaffney and Stallworth would keep Hankerson and Paul from developing.

Now we're being told Cooley will keep Paul from developing. (poor Niles, everyone's blocking his development, it seems lol)...

And there have been many other examples over the years where fans head-shakingly insist that a veteran's presence on the roster will stunt a younger player's development. Yet in each case I outlined above, the veteran never played any role whatsoever in the younger player's development, outside of providing competition that is absolutely necessary FOR development, and offering advice and guidance. Thrash offered guidance to Thomas and Kelly...Paul is on record as saying Cooley and Davis have been a big help in him becoming acclimated to the TE role and have provided constant encouragement (you can hear Cooley giving that encouragement himself in press conferences). Hankerson said Moss' tutelage had been a seriously beneficial aspect for him his rookie year.

To me, the "keeping a young player from developing" argument is an incredibly poor one, to the point that the young players themselves dispute it. And Shanahan's mantra of "competition" is completely undermined by the idea that young players should ONLY compete with other young players. Nonsense. "Promise" may land you a spot on the roster, but you earn your playing time by competing against whoever else is in camp and outperforming them...not just in practice, but in games, in the meeting rooms, in your attitude, etc, etc.

10.) He was really, really good once. He hasn't been really good for a couple years now. Get over it.

Right now, Cooley needs to be better than Paul...and unfortunately, so far Paul is helping him in that regard. I doubt Paul will have 4 preseason games like he did against the Bills...but as of right now it's looking like Allen's comment of keeping 4 TEs might be the best way to go. Because none of them are giving any reasons to just go with three (although Paulsen might be at least doing better than expected).

---------- Post added August-14th-2012 at 02:38 AM ----------

I've gotta be honest. The reason I don't really get into the Cooley debate here is because I simply don't care too much about it, lol. I haven't cared much about Cooley for like 3 years now. Furthermore, ever since Shanahan has come in I'm fully on board with his rebuild and have appreciated every move he's made thus far, even the perceived negative ones. So, in my mind and with solid grounds for a basis, whatever decision is made by Shanahan about Cooley will be the best one. I don't mean to make light of the situation, but the matter to me really is that easy. I'm not at all invested in it otherwise... there's much more interesting and significant things going on with our personnel right now than whether or not Cooley makes the team.

I appreciate how well he's played for us and how hard, but there is plenty of evidence out there to show that he hasn't put his all into the offseason on numerous occasions and, furthermore, I'm not too fond of his off the field antics though I fully understand that is of personal preference and many love him for his "wild side".

I'm disappointed in some of Cooley's actions, I gotta admit...immature and disrespectful.

I also, though, know that if we were winning and regularly making the playoffs, most of it wouldn't matter to fans. Riggins' antics were endearing because we were winning while he was producing. Jack Kent Cooke makes Cooley look like a choir boy by comparison, but we're ok with him because we were winning under his guidance (plus we didn't find out about stuff until years later lol...no internet to make it instant). Dexter Manley was snorting cocaine and was functionally illiterate...we still love him to this day, because we were winning while he was producing. Fred Davis smokes a joint, and half of this board wants him traded lol...we're not winning while he's producing, so in FanPerspectiveville he's not needed. If Orakpo was caught doing cocaine a large percentage of fans here on ES would want him gone, no matter how many sacks he might have...because we're not winning while he's producing. Hell, a fight on twitter is enough now ...

[pjfootballer]

:ols:Trust me when I say that that was not my intention when I posted the article. It was just a good read that I wanted to share.

I know you didn't. But you can bet that it will morph into that. :mad:

Check that, it already has.

[KDawg]

I know the team loves Paul, but this certainly doesn't bode well for Paul:

Per rotoworld.com

According to the Washington Examiner, the "belief" is that Redskins TE Niles Paul could "learn fullback soon enough."

Beat writer John Keim isn't reporting that another position switch is imminent for the 2011 fifth-rounder, but it bodes poorly for Paul's future as a pass-catcher that the idea is even in the embryonic stages. Paul dropped multiple passes in the preseason opener. He's headed for another season as a special teamer.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

I know the team loves Paul, but this certainly doesn't bode well for Paul:

Per rotoworld.com

it doesn't bode well for Paul, but I think rotoworld is painting it as a more dire picture than Keim did.

From what I remember, Keim basically said that Cooley's ability to at least be halfway decent at FB bodes well for his argument to remain on the team, and that Paul said he's not comfortable in that role. Then he says Cooley felt it would only take like 3 weeks of regular season play for Paul to be halfway decent at it as well lol ("halfway decent" are my words). That's why Keim would have said Paul could learn FB "soon enough".

Rotoworld wrote it as if Paul is on his way to being demoted soon, though.

[Lavarleap56]

I know the team loves Paul, but this certainly doesn't bode well for Paul:

Per rotoworld.com

Lol Rotoworld butchering information like usual. The Redskins ask and teach the TEs to be able to play FB as well.

[authentic]

I don't want to be lumped into a group of "haters", but i think the quicker we all come to terms that Cooley is DONE as a productive player, the easier it would be to go on with our football lives. Chris Cooley is DONE!

[Lavarleap56]

Hell Evan Royster is learning the FB position as well.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

I don't want to be lumped into a group of "haters", but i think the quicker we all come to terms that Cooley is DONE as a productive player, the easier it would be to go on with our football lives. Chris Cooley is DONE!

you realize that just pronouncing it--even in bold and all-caps lol--does zero to lead anyone to feel that way, right? In fact, it probably does just the opposite.

[authentic]

you realize that just pronouncing it--even in bold and all-caps lol--does zero to lead anyone to feel that way, right? In fact, it probably does just the opposite.

all i'm doing is getting straight to the point.. as i think about it, the situation with Cooley is similar to CP a couple of years back. CP carried a high cap number, tried to get in shape to salvage any residue of career he had left, but all the years of poor health to go along with the injuries and rigors of the position took its toll. Thus he was released.

[Califan007 The Constipated]

all i'm doing is getting straight to the point.

That's not all you're doing lol...because you could have done that without bold, underlined and all-caps...as well as connecting it to being better for "our football lives" (whatever that means).

[Lavarleap56]

So do you think we were gonna replace Cooley with John Carlson if not for the cap penalties? Because it would be all kinds of ironic, if so lol...

What is ironic?

This argument never holds up to the light of logic. Who was the last young player whose development was "blocked" by having an average veteran player ahead of him on the roster?

We heard that Thrash would keep Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly from developing.

We heard that Galloway would keep Armstrong and Austin from developing.

We heard that Gaffney and Stallworth would keep Hankerson and Paul from developing.

Now we're being told Cooley will keep Paul from developing. (poor Niles, everyone's blocking his development, it seems lol)...

And there have been many other examples over the years where fans head-shakingly insist that a veteran's presence on the roster will stunt a younger player's development. Yet in each case I outlined above, the veteran never played any role whatsoever in the younger player's development, outside of providing competition that is absolutely necessary FOR development, and offering advice and guidance. Thrash offered guidance to Thomas and Kelly...Paul is on record as saying Cooley and Davis have been a big help in him becoming acclimated to the TE role and have provided constant encouragement (you can hear Cooley giving that encouragement himself in press conferences). Hankerson said Moss' tutelage had been a seriously beneficial aspect for him his rookie year.

To me, the "keeping a young player from developing" argument is an incredibly poor one, to the point that the young players themselves dispute it. And Shanahan's mantra of "competition" is completely undermined by the idea that young players should ONLY compete with other young players. Nonsense. "Promise" may land you a spot on the roster, but you earn your playing time by competing against whoever else is in camp and outperforming them...not just in practice, but in games, in the meeting rooms, in your attitude, etc, etc.

Im not so sure the argument is really "Cooley is holding younger players back". My opinion is that Cooley will not be a part of this team when they are ready to really make a run so get started sooner rather than later finding your #2,#3 Tes so they can grow with the offense. Cooley fan or not him being on the field this season will not be the difference in winning or losing because at this point hes not critical as a player. I see and agree that Cooley alone is not holding guys back from developing.

Right now, Cooley needs to be better than Paul...and unfortunately, so far Paul is helping him in that regard. I doubt Paul will have 4 preseason games like he did against the Bills...but as of right now it's looking like Allen's comment of keeping 4 TEs might be the best way to go. Because none of them are giving any reasons to just go with three (although Paulsen might be at least doing better than expected).

Allen did not say the team is defiantly keeping 4 Tes and the roster dynamics will be influenced by injuries as camp goes along. I believe Allen said "looks like we will" or something along those lines but not really worth arguing about cause its petty.

---------- Post added August-14th-2012 at 02:38 AM ----------

[/color]

I'm disappointed in some of Cooley's actions, I gotta admit...immature and disrespectful.

I also, though, know that if we were winning and regularly making the playoffs, most of it wouldn't matter to fans. Riggins' antics were endearing because we were winning while he was producing. Jack Kent Cooke makes Cooley look like a choir boy by comparison, but we're ok with him because we were winning under his guidance (plus we didn't find out about stuff until years later lol...no internet to make it instant). Dexter Manley was snorting cocaine and was functionally illiterate...we still love him to this day, because we were winning while he was producing. Fred Davis smokes a joint, and half of this board wants him traded lol...we're not winning while he's producing, so in FanPerspectiveville he's not needed. If Orakpo was caught doing cocaine a large percentage of fans here on ES would want him gone, no matter how many sacks he might have...because we're not winning while he's producing. Hell, a fight on twitter is enough now ...

[authentic]

That's not all you're doing lol...because you could have done that without bold, underlined and all-caps...as well as connecting it to being better for "our football lives" (whatever that means).

some of us need to be taken by the shoulders and shaken just a little bit..

[SWFLSkins]

I just hope when the pre-season is done the final cuts are in the best three TE's on the team are playing. After watching Cooley the last two years I personally don't think that is him. But if he proves me wrong good for him. As for LL's point that I have made before, this is also about building the team for beyond this year. With a rook QB playing it would be nice for him to start to build relationships that are going to last more than this or next year.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

I shall be REAL glad when final cuts are made and this things official one way or the other. (Presuming we don't keep him and look trade him before that deadline as we've brilliantly managed to do with certain vets. no longer wanted.).

Some of the pettiness flying around is wearisome. To be kind.

Hail.

[authentic]

I shall be REAL glad when final cuts are made and this things official one way or the other. (Presuming we don't keep him and look trade him before that deadline as we've brilliantly managed to do with certain vets. no longer wanted.).

Some of the pettiness flying around is wearisome. To be kind.

Hail.

i would be floored if we got anything in a trade for him.. I don't see how Cooley has any value at this point.

[KingGibbs]

I've been pissed at Chris ever since he dropped the ball inside the five against Seattle in the playoffs. Crucial part of the game and completely changed the dynamic of the game. That play has stuck with me for some reason.:mad:

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

i would be floored if we got anything in a trade for him.. I don't see how Cooley has any value at this point.

I thought exactly the same on McNabb and the Fat Man, but somehow Allen and his guys managed to get something for them.

Just a possible if he did make the 53.

Hail.

[Lavarleap56]

I just hope all of you former Coooooooooooley fans know that we are one Fred Davis DOOBY away from starting Logan Paulsen or 'dropsies' Niles Paul at Tight End.

Not the best way to start RG3's growth with NO security blanket at a now KEY offensive position in the NFL.

You cannot go wrong with Cooley as a #2 TE, especially for our team considering we have NO PROVEN DEPTH behind him. I just hope you idiots feel ashamed after our back-up TEs start proving that there was a reason none of them were drafted earlier than the 5th round.

There is also a huge reason we didn't sign Freddy D long term this offseason. Even our own FO/Coaching Staff doesn't believe he is mature enough for a big investment in him.

NOW GIVE ME SOME FACTS OR REASONS WHY HE SHOULD BE CUT! Other than "hes not a good blocker."

Do you wake up and pound a six pack of mountain dew ?

1.Cooley does not even think he is a safety blanket

2. Griff at Baylor did not go to the TES much but its hard for us to tell if it was offensive design or QB choice. A few weeks into camp it is looking like QB choice.

3. Read here what Cooley things of being a "Safety Blanket" and have a nice day http://washingtonexaminer.com/rg3-report-aug.-13/article/2504847#.UCpIuKOt_k8

[Califan007 The Constipated]

What is ironic?

That we would be replacing Cooley, who has "got a bum knee and has made frequent trips to Dr. James Andrews to deal with it", with this guy:

"John Carlson was spotted lightly jogging Monday for the first time since sustaining his knee injury on July 31.

It's a minor step in the right direction. Carlson was wearing a large brace on his knee and had a hitch in his stride. He's still not close to returning from that Grade 2 MCL sprain. Aug 8 - 8:42 AM"

That we'd be replacing a guy who spent the last 11 weeks on IR last season, with a guy who was on IR the entire year last season...

That we'd be replacing a guy who "hasn't done anything since 2008" with a guy who hasn't done anything since 2009 lol...

That we'd be replacing an "aging" 30 year old vet with a guy who's 28 years old...

That we'd be replacing the guy who was the 3rd worst pass blocking TE between 2008-2010 with the guy who was the 2nd worst blocking TE during that same timespan lol...

And that we'd be replacing a guy whose salary is said to be too big, with a guy whose FA value apparently was $25 million for 5 years...

Yes, I find all that ironic lol :yes:

Im not so sure the argument is really "Cooley is holding younger players back".

I don't think it is, either...but NCL/NLC listed it as one of his arguments why Cooley should be jettisoned. My stance against it has nothing whatsoever to do with Cooley...I just think it's an incredibly uninformed stance to take, no matter who you're talking about.

Allen did not say the team is defiantly keeping 4 Tes and the roster dynamics will be influenced by injuries as camp goes along. I believe Allen said "looks like we will" or something along those lines but not really worth arguing about cause its petty.

All I said was that, right now, it looks like Allen's comment about keeping 4 TEs might be the wisest way to go.

[TK]

Do you wake up and pound a six pack of mountain dew ?

Bwahahahahahahahaha

[Califan007 The Constipated]

some of us need to be taking by the shoulders and shaken just a little bit..

...Ok, I'll give you that lol...