Califan007 The Constipated Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/08/08/holmgren-may-have-some-explaining-to-do-to-haslam/ One of the cruel realities of football is that guys who have injury issues at one level typically don’t hold up at the next level. Yes, Adrian Peterson largely overcame a history of getting banged up and beaten around at Oklahoma; but he entered the NFL with two good ankles, knees, and hips.Richardson didn’t. And now the team that we put at No. 32 in the our preseason power rankings could be in danger of sliding down a rung or two if we added a few teams from Richardson’s college conference to the mix. The risk Holmgren took makes us wonder what he knew about a possible sale of the team (to Jimmy Haslam or to anyone) when pulling the trigger on Trent Richardson in April. If Holmgren sensed at the time that 2012 could be his last year in Cleveland, it explains why he’d lean toward a higher-risk, higher-reward top-five strategy, not to mention a 28-year-old, game-ready rookie quarterback. (It also helps explain why Holmgren would take a round-two flier on receiver Josh Gordon in the supplemental draft; if Holmgren may not be there to use the second-round pick in April 2013, why not use it now?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taylor703 Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 I think Holmgren has done an absolutely terrible job as President. Why would you take a RB of all positions in the top-5, not to mention actually trade up to get one? Choose a wide receiver in the 2nd round who hasn't played football in two years and a 28-year old QB in the first round? Nothing he does there has made much sense to me but then again much of his personnel decisions in Seattle made little sense as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I_Bleed_B&G Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 Couldn't happen to a better team and city. Both are garbage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Well, it won't matter. The new owner will be cleaning house after the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Ya know...I find myself thinking that the Browns could've avoided a lot of this bull**** if they had just taken Julio Jones at number 5 in 2011. Would it help in the long run? Who knows. But Colt McCoy would've had a much more reliable receiver. Defenses would be kind of forced to actually pay attention to Julio, which probably would've opened up some passing lane for Mohammed Massaquoi as a complementary receiver and Ben Watson and a couple of their young tight ends. And yeah, Peyton Hillis was kind of a douche and got a big head and didn't perform, but he was also facing 8 and 9 man fronts because defenses didn't fear anyone they had at wide receiver. And for all the "Colt McCoy has no arm strength" stuff, . He could be a guy like Matt Schaub who never has the big arm but is smart. And I've seen Pat Shumur scheme up some pretty good plays.But instead they went conservative, and then proceeded to get out manuevered at every turn because they didn't take a chance. I mean, just think about this for a second; their 2010 first round draft pick Joe Haden is looking at a four game suspension to start the season because he took Adderall (though he didn't have a history of character or drug issues, it's possible it's some sort of mistake. Their 2011 first round draft pick Phil Taylor is missing training camp. Their 2012 first round draft pick Trent Richardson has to get his knee scoped. Not to mention their front office basically set up Colt McCoy to fail and refused to trade him. They put like a third round pick on him, which of course no one is going to pay for the guy. So then they have this "quarterback competition" between Colt and Weeden, but the first thing they did was stick Colt McCoy with the third team reps. They don't want Colt, clearly he has no future for the Cleveland Browns, but they refuse to trade the guy for a low round draft pick, and they won't cut him so he can go into someone else's camp and at least be the number 2 quarterback. So he's probably going to get cut at the end of the preseason, or have to sit a whole season being inactive on game day as the 3rd QB. Both scenarios are total bull****. And Browns fans pin all their woes on Colt McCoy. It's the damndest thing I've ever seen. I mean I'm not saying the dude had a Pro Bowl year, he struggles, he's got a limited skillset. But the Browns front office and fans have scapegoated Colt McCoy, like McCoy was the only reason they were bad. Like their receivers didn't lead the league in drops and they didn't get demolished against the run. Not to mention on top of all that their drafts the last couple seasons have sucked. Yeaaah, Holmgren's not going to have a job much longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolblue13 Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 I feel awful for McCoy. I didn't think he was that bad last year. Holmgren must have some kind of personal thing going on against Cleveland, because this is almost intentional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 I feel bad for Cleveland, the city. They should have the Ravens organization and Baltimore should be stuck with the fiasco that is the current Browns... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 If Haslam follows football, like I think he does. He should give Holmgren the ax. I bet McCarthy scoops up McCoy as soon as the Browns cut him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martytheman Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 If Haslam follows football, like I think he does.He should give Holmgren the ax. I bet McCarthy scoops up McCoy as soon as the Packers cut him. Holmgren deserves to be fired. His running of their FO is vinny-esqe at best, he's made some terrible decisions, and like someone mentioned earlier, has been outmaneuvered at every turn. Then they want to blame all their suckitude on Colt? Give me a break. I got ragged on for pointing out about a month ago that their fans are nuts for thinking this was the year they win their division... I'm not buying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Holmgrem is a good coach. That's it and I'm not minimizing that fact, but he's a LOUSY personnel guy and his track record shows that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2cents Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Holmgrem is a good coach. That's it and I'm not minimizing that fact, but he's a LOUSY personnel guy and his track record shows that. Didn't the new owner at the time in Seattle take away his GM duties and that's when they got good and went to the SB? I'm trying to remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Didn't the new owner at the time in Seattle take away his GM duties and that's when they got good and went to the SB? I'm trying to remember. You would be correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HailToTheRedskins14 Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Both scenarios are total bull****. And Browns fans pin all their woes on Colt McCoy. It's the damndest thing I've ever seen. I mean I'm not saying the dude had a Pro Bowl year, he struggles, he's got a limited skillset. But the Browns front office and fans have scapegoated Colt McCoy, like McCoy was the only reason they were bad. Like their receivers didn't lead the league in drops and they didn't get demolished against the run. Not to mention on top of all that their drafts the last couple seasons have sucked. Yeaaah, Holmgren's not going to have a job much longer. Didn't wanna quote a lot of text, but I agree with everything you said. Granted, most of us are on the outside looking in, but damn they seem to be a mess. Reading your post, I could only think of Jason Campbell here in DC. Most fans realized Jason Campbell (Colt McCoy) wasn't a great or even very good QB, but we also realized that he wasn't the only thing missing with our team. And we realized that our front office was monkey poop, while Browns fans are still holding out hope on their front office. Sure, McCoy isn't Tom Brady or Peyton Manning, but that front office isn't New England either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hiro Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Holmgren deserves to be fired. His running of their FO is vinny-esqe at best, he's made some terrible decisions, and like someone mentioned earlier, has been outmaneuvered at every turn.Then they want to blame all their suckitude on Colt? Give me a break. I got ragged on for pointing out about a month ago that their fans are nuts for thinking this was the year they win their division... I'm not buying it. On top of that, when he tried to get cute and play hardball with the Rams, he got outmaneuvered by us for RG3, and he blames Shanahan's and Fisher's "prior relationship" to have made the scales unfair. I actually don't think the players he's picked in the 1st round this year are awful (Joe Haden, for what its worth, is actually a top flight corner), but Julio Jones would have been way more valuable to them than Phil Taylor has been. And plus, I do think Trent Richardson and Brandon Weeden are good players. The way Holmgren has put the roster together though is very Vinny-esque. No clear cut plan, no savvy trades or strong maneuvering in the draft, just random picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.A.C.O.L.B. Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 I feel bad for Cleveland, the city. They should have the Ravens organization and Baltimore should be stuck with the fiasco that is the current Browns... **** Cleveland. I hope they go another 60 years without a title. And go read a Browns forum. They are easily the most delusional fanbase in football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 I'm with Hero 21. It's not like they've picked bad players. But it sort of reminds me of what Gibbs, Dan and Vinny used to do; draft for need first, create a gaping whole that you should've addressed in the first place, then go back and draft for need again while being a lot more panicked and rushed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.A.C.O.L.B. Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Does anyone else not get the Weeden pick? He's not old like fifth-year senior old. He is old, old. He'll be 30 a month into his sophomore season. And they took him with a first round pick. By the time they got the talent around him to really win, he could very well be entering the twilight of his career. I could understand the pick for a team like Denver (if they didn't get Peyton), in that they have already built a team to win and are probably just good QB play away from contending. But that's hardly the case with the Browns. And they took him in the 1st freaking round, lol. I guess his draft position kills me more than anything. And even moreso when you consider he almost certainly would've been there with their 2nd round pick. Maybe it's just me though. It's probably not a good sign when you have two 1st round picks and BOTH are probably the most questionable picks in the entire draft (though Seattle's pick is up there). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 The thing about Weeden is...age aside, he has the talent to be a first round pick. You're basically banking on his talent and maturity helping him excel quickly. But again, they only took Weeden because they got outmanuevered again. The traded up to get Richardson. They planned on using their second 1st round pick to draft Kendal Wright, and then draft Brandon Weeden in the second. But the Titans drafted Kendall Wright before the Browns could. So the Browns basically panicked and drafted Weeden in the first round so they could be reasonably assured they'd actually be able to get him. I agree, though; they have GOT to put a team around the guy in a hurry. Bad enough the Browns went into cheapskate mode and wouldn't splurge for any receiving talent on top of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 **** Cleveland. I hope they go another 60 years without a title. And go read a Browns forum. They are easily the most delusional fanbase in football. Between the Bravens skipping town and then the humiliating "Decision" (and LeBron subsequently winning a championship in Miami)...I will cut some of them a break... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Holmgren, You have some Splainin' to do!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.A.C.O.L.B. Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 I agree, though; they have GOT to put a team around the guy in a hurry. Bad enough the Browns went into cheapskate mode and wouldn't splurge for any receiving talent on top of that. According to Browns fans, Josh Gordon is that WR splurge. He's going to do big things and take the league by storm, THIS year. Question: Say Weeden performs well, shows some promise, nothing jaw dropping though and the Browns only win 3 or 4 games again. They're picking in the top 3 and Barkley OR WHOEVER is still available. Do they go QB? Or are they now stuck with a 30-year-old, 2nd-year QB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNSkinsFan Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 It's sad, but I think Vinny might actually be able to do as well as Holmgren has so far. That franchise will not be relevent for a LONG time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Does anyone else not get the Weeden pick?....At first I didn't.But, it makes perfect sense for Holmgren. Which isn't to say that it was the right pick or the right decision. But, drafting Weeden in his mind probably bought him time. (not anymore with a new owner) But ostensibly he blame shifts the Browns predicament on a failed QB=Colt McCoy. While selling them the promise of a 1st round rookie QB. Thus buying him time, well up until new ownership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 ^^ Wow, I agree with you. Go figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCClybun Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 Ahem... Brandon Weeden--- 3/9, 62 yards, 1 INT, 1 Fumble Lost Colt McCoy--- 6/8, 88 yards, no INTs, no Fumbles Weeden's pick was horrible, like he couldn't even read a simple coverage on the INT. I know, I know, only preseason. But still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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