How is it possible we've gone this long without a "playmaker" on offense?

[NoCalMike]

Whether it be through Free Agency or the NFL Draft, most teams regardless if they are good or horrible at least have a playmaker or two on offense. The team might be losing games and end up with an awful record, but there is still something that doesn't make them completely boring to watch.

Hankerson vs. Miami looks like he might develop into that player in 2012, but again it is too early to tell, a single game albeit a very impressive one is not enough of a sample size.

Fred Davis for all the hype about how athletic and gifted he is often disappears for weeks at a time.

Helu doesn't seem to be nearly as quick and speedy as advertised (although it's not like run blocking has been especially helpful)

Anthony Armstrong is looking more and more like a one year wonder.

Niles Paul...too early to tell.

Terrance Austin.....?

Shall I go on?

Not since Portis in his prime and Cooley before the injuries has this team had players that were considered GO-TO on offense. Players that could be counted on to have big games and take over a game.

I can accept being a bad team that is rebuilding and in the process a team that loses more than they win, but at this point not only is the offense bad, it is getting downright boring to watch.

I know some will say that once we get better players in the trenches, it will open up more for the skill position players, and I do agree to a certain extent, but I can point to guys like Andre Johnson, Megatron, AP, Vernon Davis, etc etc etc who were really showing signs they would be All-Pros before the rest of the team was ready to do their part.

[Sweet Sassy Molassy]

Look at how many draft picks this team has missed on over the years (whether by trading picks away or busts). Then look at the fact that the picks we traded away were typically in return for over-priced, underperforming and/or aging vets. Then take into consideration that the team for years attempted to patch up a hollow and buckling structure by adding more veterans or clutching onto vets that once had a shining moment in an attempt to make people believe the team was better than it actually was. When you take all of that into account, you see why we've had no real playmaker on this team since CP in 04/05.

[DM72]

I hear ya. What's frustrating is that every other team in the divisiin walways have playmakers.

[RichmondRedskin88]

The lack of picks made it impossible for us to gain a luxury like a playmaker. We had to use what little picks we had on necessities. Playmakers are a bonus.

[KCClybun]

Basically, we grounded every playmaker we had to a nub. The three most consistent playmakers we had were Moss, Cooley and Portis. We wore down Portis into nothingness. Moss lost that extra spring in his step, and Cooley's knee injury is killing him.

We found three guys, and Dan and Vinny decided that was good enough for a while. They added some guys here or there, but those guys all under performed. So now, we have to pay for the lack of playmakers before by trying to draft guys now.

We wore Portis and Cooley out, and the only guy left only has a little while left.

Also, Vinny was a crappy ass talent scout of players on offense. Well, he was a crappy talent scout in general, but DEFINITELY on offense.

[SkinsHokieFan]

Basically, we grounded every playmaker we had to a nub. The three most consistent playmakers we had were Moss, Cooley and Portis. We wore down Portis into nothingness. Moss lost that extra spring in his step, and Cooley's knee injury is killing him.

We found three guys, and Dan and Vinny decided that was good enough for a while. They added some guys here or there, but those guys all under performed. So now, we have to pay for the lack of playmakers before by trying to draft guys now.

We wore Portis and Cooley out, and the only guy left only has a little while left.

Also, Vinny was a crappy ass talent scout of players on offense. Well, he was a crappy talent scout in general, but DEFINITELY on offense.

Taking Kevin Barnes at pick 81 over Mike Wallace who went at pick 84 kills me :doh:

[NoCalMike]

Why have we been pretty successful at Defense though? Is it easier to build a defense? Is defense less predicated on "playmakers" Year 2 into the 3-4 defense and it seems to be making strides already compared to last season. Sure, we have struck out big with some guys like Haynesworth and Archuleta, but we've still managed to minimize the damage they cost and been able to put a pretty decent and competent defense every season since 2004, with the exception of 2006 and 2010.

So why the difference? Why has scouting on offense been so horrible?

[SkinsHokieFan]

Why have we been pretty successful at Defense though? Is it easier to build a defense? Is defense less predicated on "playmakers" Year 2 into the 3-4 defense and it seems to be making strides already compared to last season. Sure, we have struck out big with some guys like Haynesworth and Archuleta, but we've still managed to minimize the damage they cost and been able to put a pretty decent and competent defense every season since 2004, with the exception of 2006 and 2010.

So why the difference? Why has scouting on offense been so horrible?

To me it stems from being much more focused on defense.

Have we drafted a "playmaker" on offense in the first 3 rounds in the last 2 drafts? I only think Hankerson is it. And right when he shows flashes, he is done for the year

[RichmondRedskin88]

Why have we been pretty successful at Defense though? Is it easier to build a defense? Is defense less predicated on "playmakers" Year 2 into the 3-4 defense and it seems to be making strides already compared to last season. Sure, we have struck out big with some guys like Haynesworth and Archuleta, but we've still managed to minimize the damage they cost and been able to put a pretty decent and competent defense every season since 2004, with the exception of 2006 and 2010.

So why the difference? Why has scouting on offense been so horrible?

I'd say its combination between having picks pan out great for defense and little bit of luck. We've managed to have our players learn new positions or improve in their positions remarkably fast. Sadly our offense in general is a mess and when injuries happen we see just how thin we are.

[Redskins4ever]

Well, Santana Moss is out biggest weapon on offense and Fred Davis is surely emerging. I liked what I saw out of Leonard Hankerson yesterday too. Chris Cooley is somewhat of a play maker. But the years when Cooley and Moss made the probowl, the Redskins had a QB throwing them the football. We don't have that currently. This offense doesn't have a snowball's chance in hell with the level of Pop Warner quarterback play that's being shown, so it's going to be hard for even play makers to make plays.

[KCClybun]

Why have we been pretty successful at Defense though? Is it easier to build a defense? Is defense less predicated on "playmakers" Year 2 into the 3-4 defense and it seems to be making strides already compared to last season. Sure, we have struck out big with some guys like Haynesworth and Archuleta, but we've still managed to minimize the damage they cost and been able to put a pretty decent and competent defense every season since 2004, with the exception of 2006 and 2010.

So why the difference? Why has scouting on offense been so horrible?

Luck. Blind friggin' Luck.

Brian Orakpo fell right to us when he absolutely shouldn't have. Guys like Champ Bailey and Sean Taylor were no brainers. LaRon Landry was probably BPA.

And generally thinking, I think vets on defense get better with age to an extent, while veterans on offense get worse with age. You learn more and more and more as a defensive players, and the knowledge you attain helps make up for the physical gifts. Skill position guys on offense are so dependent on system, quarterback, offensive line. I mean, Brandon Lloyd sucks in our system, is average in the Bears system, blows up in Denver in a system where he's a fit. Offenses are just far more fickle; it's a lot harder to find a "plug and play" guy on offense than it is on defense. The older you get on offense, the worse off you get. You age like a fine wine, and then usually have a sharp drop off.

[Stophovr6]

It's the curse I tell ya! I just haven't figure out who cursed us and when. I'll blame the souless fedex field

We actually have had and have playmakers, there's just no consistency due to poor QB play, constantly bad and changing o-line, and injuries.

Chris Cooley in an offense like the Colts with Manning would probably be going to the Hall of Fame. That's just my opinion but I think the same could be said about Fred Davis. Let's hope we get him and others a real QB and improved o-line.

[MartinC]

It all starts with the QB - it's tough to evaluate playmakers when you don't have a guy who can get them the ball. I'm not saying QB is the only issue we have on offense as we certainly still need better offensive line play whoever is behind centre but it's the key. You could line up Monk, Clark and Sanders at receiver on this team and I don't think it would make much difference.

[TSO]

Well, for whatever reason we just could never draft well offensively under Vinny. We picked okay to really well on defense (Taylor, Landry, Smoot, Arrington, Rogers, Mcintosh, Golston, Orakpo, Champ Bailey and I'm sure I'm forgetting some) but we failed miserably doing the same on offense; with only a couple average players (Ladell Betts, Jason Campbell), a bunch of total busts (Devin Thomas, Malcolm Kelly, Taylor Jacobs) and two really good TEs (Chris Cooley, Fred Davis). Imagine if I told you that in a span of like ten years a franchise would only draft two really good players on offense and they'd both be TEs what would you think of said offense?

---------- Post added November-15th-2011 at 01:43 AM ----------

It all starts with the QB - it's tough to evaluate playmakers when you don't have a guy who can get them the ball. I'm not saying QB is the only issue we have on offense as we certainly still need better offensive line play whoever is behind centre but it's the key. You could line up Monk, Clark and Sanders at receiver on this team and I don't think it would make much difference.

I totally get this line of thinking, and it's true to an extent... but I think it's overblown. I believe if we had Aaron Rodgers on this team right now he'd still be an awesome QB, but we'd probably still lose a lot of games. A more immobile QB like Tom Brady or Peyton Manning and we'd be even worse off. Remember last year the Packers struggled a lot because their Oline was playing poorly. Heck, we beat them and it was largely due to their Oline stinking it up. Rodgers would throw for a bunch of yards but teams would make enough plays against us and come out with a win more than you think.

So, yeah, QB would make a big difference but not as sizeable as so many think. We need to get better on our Oline, especially at the interior before we can really become a great offense.

[wildbill1952]

Vernon Davs and Alex Smth - poster children for a pair of average guys that suddenly look like world beaters after the 49ers draft 3 first round OL and a second (that second round pick coming while the Skins/Vinny drafted Devin Thomas because the Skins couldn't find any quality OL to draft), It starts in the trenches and the Skins are always taking OL that other teams are discarding as too old or have too little talent to play elsewhere. See the entire front line except Trent Williams for examples. Even Mongomery and Lichtensteiger, the best of the rest, were cut by their teams because they found someone better. Too bad the Skins don't bother drafting top quality OL. It makes the "skill players" look skilled and makes average QB's (see Williams, Rypien, Theismann) Super Bowl winners.

The 6-2 Zorn first year started the same, looking like a fair team until the inevitable OL injuries started taking their toll. But Skins management never followed up on that promising start by building up the trenches. We'll see if Shanny and Allen get more "skill players" in the draft or finally decide that one first round draft pick every ten years and 4 OL deemed expendable by other teams is not how you build an OL.

[Chump Bailey]

The lack of picks made it impossible for us to gain a luxury like a playmaker. We had to use what little picks we had on necessities. Playmakers are a bonus.

Speaking of draft picks - anyone know the number of picks we have going into the 2012 draft?

[MartinC]

So, yeah, QB would make a big difference but not as sizeable as so many think. We need to get better on our Oline, especially at the interior before we can really become a great offense.

Oh I agree we certainly need to improve our O'Line play significantly - at least 2 new good quality starters IMO. That would give us a running game to take the pressure off whoever is at QB. But we need a QB - right now we dont have a guy on the roster who is an NFL starter. Its not an either or if we want to be a good offense.

[darrelgreenie]

If a tree falls in the forest and no one is around does it make a sound?

A play maker doesn't happen in a vacuum unless they're a kick or punt returner.

[Old Bay]

Speaking of draft picks - anyone know the number of picks we have going into the 2012 draft?

Nine total. One in every round.

[Chump Bailey]

Nine total. One in every round.

Cool - what about the Hightower trade though? Do you remember?

[paloosa]

I have always said that the talent evaluators and scouts on this team are not very good. We have found some really good players in the draft but no one that could be considered a steal except maybe Hankerson. Now he is done for the season but there is some glimpses of a playmaker there. They need to draft a guy like Alshon Jefferies from South Carolina because he stands out in the national spotlight. You go after guys that are from winning programs and from talent filled teams. You don't draft players from Vandy, Kentucky, Tulane, Purdue, Iowa State, Maryland, and the other mediocre to bad teams that hae one or two players that are good. Alabama, USC, Oregon, Ohio State, LSU, Oklahoma, Texas, Wisconsin, and other teams that are in the top 25 of the football polls every year. Yes you can find talent anywhere but how many Tom Brady's, Walter Payton's, Drew Brees, Kurt Warner's, Jerry Rices, and other players that were drafted in the late rounds or undrafted are you going to find. Not many.

[Old Bay]

Cool - what about the Hightower trade though? Do you remember?

http://www.prosportstransactions.com/football/DraftTrades/Future/Redskins.htm

Says there that a late round pick is conditional based upon how much and how well Holliday plays for the Cards.

[S.T.real,lights,out]

The lack of picks made it impossible for us to gain a luxury like a playmaker. We had to use what little picks we had on necessities. Playmakers are a bonus.

Yup, think about all the GREAT guys we passed on b/c we needed a position. AP is a big one that comes to mind.

And to me we always try to find that playmaker in the later rounds. Usually doens't work out well when that happens. Need to get a big time guy in the 1st round.

[Geneva]

Whether it be through Free Agency or the NFL Draft, most teams regardless if they are good or horrible at least have a playmaker or two on offense. The team might be losing games and end up with an awful record, but there is still something that doesn't make them completely boring to watch.

Hankerson vs. Miami looks like he might develop into that player in 2012, but again it is too early to tell, a single game albeit a very impressive one is not enough of a sample size.

Fred Davis for all the hype about how athletic and gifted he is often disappears for weeks at a time.

Helu doesn't seem to be nearly as quick and speedy as advertised (although it's not like run blocking has been especially helpful)

Anthony Armstrong is looking more and more like a one year wonder.

Niles Paul...too early to tell.

Terrance Austin.....?

Shall I go on?

Not since Portis in his prime and Cooley before the injuries has this team had players that were considered GO-TO on offense. Players that could be counted on to have big games and take over a game.

I can accept being a bad team that is rebuilding and in the process a team that loses more than they win, but at this point not only is the offense bad, it is getting downright boring to watch.

I know some will say that once we get better players in the trenches, it will open up more for the skill position players, and I do agree to a certain extent, but I can point to guys like Andre Johnson, Megatron, AP, Vernon Davis, etc etc etc who were really showing signs they would be All-Pros before the rest of the team was ready to do their part.

I'm sure that we will look hard at the free agent market again this year. Mr.Dan can't stand looking at his team these last few weeks. He wants to win NOW... This won't be the same team next season. Look for a QB with our 1st pick in the draft...

[gchwood]

I think that Helu could become a playmaker, if given the opportunity. But for some reason the coaches love Torain.