2011-12 CAA Basketball Thread

[Skinz4Life12]

I will not say anything on the "advantage"

I didn't even bother reading the rest of your post. This was all I needed to read.

So, holding the tourney at the VC = advantage GMU. But holding the tourney in Richmond =/= Advantage VCU?

[Popeman38]

I don't think most people would deny that it is nice to play in your hometown, and it's a great for their fans who don't have to travel far. But that's as far as the advantage goes for VCU. You guys complain like VCU wins the tournament every year. If they did, then yea, I think you'd have a valid complaint. But they're not. They're winning it in years that they are good in the regular season, which is when you'd expect any team to win the tournament.

If you want to complain that you just don't want to go to Richmond for the tournament every year (you'd rather travel to Charlotte, Philly, DC, etc) because the city is simply not a desirable/accessible/affordable destination, then that's a much more valid complaint. But when you make it out to be an unfair advantage for VCU basketball, then I don't think the complaint is really justified. At least from what I can tell.

Finally, this is just my own stream of consciousness thought that I just came up with so I don't know if it really holds true: I don't think holding the tournament in a bigger market like Philly or DC is the greatest idea. Joe Philly or Joe DC who are casual sports fans, don't care so much about a small conference tournament. But Joe Richmond cares a lot, because the CAA tournament is one of the bigger sporting events to come through the city. Perhaps Joe Norfolk/Hampton/Newport News would care as well. I don't know how big Charlotte is, but I'd definitely put it in a bigger sports market category.

VCU gets to stay home during the tourney. AT HOME. They sleep in their beds. They can follow semi-normal routines. EVERY other team is in a hotel. So basically you believe that winning on the road is just as easy as winning at home and there is no advantage to playing at home. To say there is no advantage built in for VCU to play their "neutral court" tourney games 1.8 miles from home and maintain normal routines, all the while sleeping at home where you are comfortable is asinine.

[RichmondRedskin88]

I didn't even bother reading the rest of your post. This was all I needed to read.

So, holding the tourney at the VC = advantage GMU. But holding the tourney in Richmond =/= Advantage VCU?

I'm not gonna answer your question. There's no point in arguing with you. I brought facts to my argument in my post but you wouldn't read them. If you don't show respect to address the facts I brought to the discussion why should I show you respect of answering your question?

---------- Post added March-8th-2012 at 11:34 AM ----------

VCU gets to stay home during the tourney. AT HOME. They sleep in their beds. They can follow semi-normal routines. EVERY other team is in a hotel. So basically you believe that winning on the road is just as easy as winning at home and there is no advantage to playing at home. To say there is no advantage built in for VCU to play their "neutral court" tourney games 1.8 miles from home and maintain normal routines, all the while sleeping at home where you are comfortable is asinine.

Wrong sir. They stay in a hotel. If you don't believe me look it up. Our team has always stayed in a hotel.

[Popeman38]

I will not say anything on the "advantage"

I will say we have won the CAA 5 times since joining in 1996. Every tourney since 1990 has been held in the Coliseum(Back then people complained U of R had the advantage. Guess why? They were good). The complaining about the location didn't really start until the Grant/Maynor era. People only complain now about the location because VCU has been good. Is it nice for VCU fans to have the tourney close by? Yes. I guaran damn tee you that if the tourney was held at Towson's home court no one would complain. Why? They are terrible. The best team always comes out of the tourney. We've gone down in the Quarterfinals, Semis, and Finals. Were people talking about a advantage when W&M upset us in 08? Were people talking about our advantage when we went down in 06 to Hofstra? Were people talking about advantage during a McCarthy era when VCU finished top 3 once? How about the Sonny Smith era? Outside of winning the conference the first year(We left the Metro league which was home to many future ACC/BE teams like VT, Louisville,GU,etc) VCU didn't do much. The "advantage" only appeared recently because of VCU's success. Rather than give us the credit due people make excuses. Hell all week all we hear from ODU and GMU is that our titles aren't legitimate because where we won them. How about we say your Final Four isn't legitimate because you won it across the river from campus? Would you appreciate that? I don't think so. You beat Uconn to reach the Final Four. The location is irrelevant. Was is great for you guys that you played it closer to home? Yes. Does that take away from the win? NO.

Across the river from Campus? 21.2 miles from campus to Verizon Center is equitable to 1.8 miles?

[Skinz4Life12]

I'm not gonna answer your question. There's no point in arguing with you. I brought facts to my argument in my post but you wouldn't read them. If you don't show respect to address the facts I brought to the discussion why should I show you respect of answering your question?

its odd you refuse to answer a simple question.

also, why does it matter how many times you have won the CAA tourney? Does not winning the CAA tourney mean there is no home court advantage all of a sudden? So if the tournament was held in DC and GMU lost in the semi-finals, does that mean there was no advantage to GMU? Of course not.

the reason people have started complaining about the location of the tourney the past decade is because of how much attraction the CAA has drawn in recent years. Not because VCU has been good. No one cared about the CAA back in the 90's and no one cared where the tournament was held.

lol, I've already addressed how our final 4 run isn't remotely equatable to the CAA tournament in Richmond. We lucked out that we got to play our elite 8 game in the VC after beating MSU and UNC. That happened one time. It doesn't happen every single year unlike the CAA tournament.

[renaissance]

VCU gets to stay home during the tourney. AT HOME. They sleep in their beds. They can follow semi-normal routines. EVERY other team is in a hotel. So basically you believe that winning on the road is just as easy as winning at home and there is no advantage to playing at home. To say there is no advantage built in for VCU to play their "neutral court" tourney games 1.8 miles from home and maintain normal routines, all the while sleeping at home where you are comfortable is asinine.

You can talk about advantage to your heart's content, but you have yet to show anything resulting from that supposed advantage. They've won the tournament when they were good in the regular season. Just like every other team that's won (I think 7 of the last 10 tourney winners were regular season champs).

[rictus58]

You can talk about advantage to your heart's content, but you have yet to show anything resulting from that supposed advantage. They've won the tournament when they were good in the regular season. Just like every other team that's won (I think 7 of the last 10 tourney winners were regular season champs).

Obviously, the only good solution is to have the tourney in Baltimore. Where everyone will be an away team. it's not like Towson would have a home field advantage.

[RVAbrendan]

The truth to this argument lies somewhere in the middle. I don't think anybody would argue that VCU doesn't have an advantage playing in their hometown. However, I don't believe that advantage necessarily translates to wins. When the team was average, fans really didn't show up. The final 4 run last year really injected life into the program. VCU has participated in 17 CAA tournaments - all in Richmond. They have won 5 of them.

If it was as big of an advantage as some claim, you would see more frequent winning, and/or lower seeds.

Basically, (and I'm a VCU fan) - VCU fans underestimate the advantage. Opposing fans over exaggerate the advantage. $0.02

[Skinz4Life12]

The truth to this argument lies somewhere in the middle. I don't think anybody would argue that VCU doesn't have an advantage playing in their hometown.

RR88, would like to have a word with you.

And you are right, home teams lose all the time and a home court advantage doesn't always translate to wins. It also doesn't mean that there isn't an advantage.

I believe the contract for the tournament expires in another year or two, so it will be interesting to see if Richmond gets the tourney again on the re-bid

[RichmondRedskin88]

Across the river from Campus? 21.2 miles from campus to Verizon Center is equitable to 1.8 miles?

So I tried to find something 21 miles from Richmond. The best I could come up with would be Petersburg(25 miles). Aprox 31 min drive. VCU usually takes on W&M on week nights at Williamsburg or at least the last 3-4 years we have. We bring thousands and thousands of fans take over the upper level of Kaplan. Williamsburg is aprox 52 miles or just over a hour from Richmond. So are you telling me it would be too hard for GMU fans to travel to a Elite 8 game(Or any game for that matter) less than 30 mins away from GMU? If the tourney was 21 miles from Richmond we'd still have the same amount of fans.

[Skinz4Life12]

So I tried to find something 21 miles from Richmond. The best I could come up with would be Petersburg(25 miles). Aprox 31 min drive. VCU usually takes on W&M on week nights at Williamsburg or at least the last 3-4 years we have. We bring thousands and thousands of fans take over the upper level of Kaplan. Williamsburg is aprox 52 miles or just over a hour from Richmond. So are you telling me it would be too hard for GMU fans to travel to a Elite 8 game(Or any game for that matter) less than 30 mins away from GMU? If the tourney was 21 miles from Richmond we'd still have the same amount of fans.

dude your argument isn't a valid one here.

no one is saying GMU didn't have a lot of fans at the VC. We had to go through a very tough schedule to get to that point and happened to luck out with the venue. Not to mention we were matched up with the #1 overall seed in the tournament. if you want to say that is the only reason that GMU went to the final 4, go right ahead. you will be in the extreme minority of people that feel that way.

That scenario is not the same as holding the CAA tourney in richmond every year.

[RichmondRedskin88]

this whole argument only got brought up again because a Mason fan had to claim Mason only lost because we played it in Richmond. Rather than give us credit our win was torn down. VCU controlled every game against GMU this year. We would have won 3 times if not for GMU's miracle buzzer beater. The same guy claimed we only dominated the first half because of the crowd. Wrong. We dominated because our coach has a blown up picture of GMU's team disrespecting VCU during the senior night presentation. He had a wall size picture up in the locker room when talking to the team the night before the game. They were already pissed about that incident and that picture just fired them up. VCU was the better team. Rather than admitting it a fair amount of GMU fans have resorted to making excuses. The fact is you haven't ever beaten us in the CAA tourney. We were the better team on paper going into the game and we won. No different from when better teams on paper beat us in the CAA tourney. If the advantage was what you said it was why did ODU come back from 12 down in the semis a couple years back to beat us and advance to the Final to win the CAA? If the advantage is so great why didn't VCU take the lead after coming back from 25 down to ODU last year and win? ODU was the better team that year. You don't see Drexel fans blaming the location for the championship. They said that night we were the better team and moved on.

---------- Post added March-8th-2012 at 12:22 PM ----------

dude your argument isn't a valid one here.

no one is saying GMU didn't have a lot of fans at the VC. We had to go through a very tough schedule to get to that point and happened to luck out with the venue. Not to mention we were matched up with the #1 overall seed in the tournament. if you want to say that is the only reason that GMU went to the final 4, go right ahead. you will be in the extreme minority of people that feel that way.

That scenario is not the same as holding the CAA tourney in richmond every year.

Unbelievable. I swear you don't read anything I have typed. I just earlier mentioned that GMU won that game against Uconn by being the better team not for the location.

I'm done with this argument. No point in continuing this discussion when clearly you don't even read what I'm typing before responding. All this sounds to me is sour grapes that once again GMU couldn't beat VCU. RR88 out.

[The X-Factor]

If it was as big of an advantage as some claim, you would see more frequent winning, and/or lower seeds.

An advantage is simply that, an advantage. It makes your chances of winning better, but does not guarantee wins. There is a reason Vegas gives the home team an automatic three points, because it makes a difference. Guess how big the difference was for the VCU-Drexel game. Yep, three points. The reason you don't see VCU winning the tournament more is because 1) it's hard to win the tournament consistently and 2) factoring in the advantage, VCU has probably overachieved with 5 wins in 17 years.

I do believe that VCU was one of the two best teams in the league this year, but I'm not so sure they would have won the tournament outside of Richmond.

[Skinz4Life12]

this whole argument only got brought up again because a Mason fan had to claim Mason only lost because we played it in Richmond. Rather than give us credit our win was torn down. VCU controlled every game against GMU this year. We would have won 3 times if not for GMU's miracle buzzer beater. The same guy claimed we only dominated the first half because of the crowd. Wrong. We dominated because our coach has a blown up picture of GMU's team disrespecting VCU during the senior night presentation. He had a wall size picture up in the locker room when talking to the team the night before the game. They were already pissed about that incident and that picture just fired them up. VCU was the better team. Rather than admitting it a fair amount of GMU fans have resorted to making excuses. The fact is you haven't ever beaten us in the CAA tourney. We were the better team on paper going into the game and we won. No different from when better teams on paper beat us in the CAA tourney. If the advantage was what you said it was why did ODU come back from 12 down in the semis a couple years back to beat us and advance to the Final to win the CAA? If the advantage is so great why didn't VCU take the lead after coming back from 25 down to ODU last year and win? ODU was the better team that year. You don't see Drexel fans blaming the location for the championship. They said that night we were the better team and moved on.

---------- Post added March-8th-2012 at 12:22 PM ----------

Unbelievable. I swear you don't read anything I have typed. I just earlier mentioned that GMU won that game against Uconn by being the better team not for the location.

I'm done with this argument. No point in continuing this discussion when clearly you don't even read what I'm typing before responding. All this sounds to me is sour grapes that once again GMU couldn't beat VCU. RR88 out.

You did say that, but then you keep driving home a point about GMU playing at the VC like its actually comparable to the advantage VCU gets every year. You are really something else when it comes to having a discussion and making logical points. You should probably keep posting in your "girl problem" threads and stay out of this one

[RichmondRedskin88]

You did say that, but then you keep driving home a point about GMU playing at the VC like its actually comparable to the advantage VCU gets every year. You are really something else when it comes to having a discussion and making logical points. You should probably keep posting in your "girl problem" threads and stay out of this one

wow....What does girl issues have to do with the CAA? I put up facts on the table that you can't handle so you take a cheap shot? Grow up sir.

[Skinz4Life12]

wow....What does girl issues have to do with the CAA? I put up facts on the table that you can't handle so you take a cheap shot? Grow up sir.

How is that a cheap shot? Maybe you shouldn't discuss your personal issues on a public forum if you can't handle it.

Every other VCU fan on this board can openly admit the advantage you have in the CAA tourney, except you. I believe you are the one who needs to grow up

[RichmondRedskin88]

How is that a cheap shot? Maybe you shouldn't discuss your personal issues on a public forum if you can't handle it.

Every other VCU fan on this board can openly admit the advantage you have in the CAA tourney, except you. I believe you are the one who needs to grow up

You took a discussion about a basketball game and home advantage and decided rather than bring a better argument to just take a shot at me with something that has no relevance to this discussion. That just make you look like a douche. If you can't handle someones argument perhaps you shouldn't post here. As both me and Ren mentioned you didn't bring signficant evidence to prove your point. All you said repeatdly was the location gives VCU a advantage. When you saw that we brought facts rather than straight opinions you decided to take the discussion beyond basketball and take a shot at me about girl problems. How is that not a cheap shot? That would be like GMU winning against us and me turning around to you and saying "yeah you won but hey I saw you girlfriend sleeps around with everyone. HAHA". Completely uncalled for.

[Skinz4Life12]

dude i really have no idea what you are talking about. what facts have i ignored? the fact that VCU has only won the tourney 5 times? So what?

You are basically saying that the other 12 years they didn't have an advantage because they didn't win the tournament? How the **** does that make any sense? You really are delusional and seem to be the one who can't admit your team has an advantage because they hold the tournament in their backyard every year. Its not a hard concept to wrap you feeble mind around.

Oh yea, at least I have a girlfriend and don't sound like a douche whining about woman problems on a message board. Ren can attest to that, she's met my g/f.

take your own advice and stop posting in this thread like you said you were going to do weeks ago

[RVAbrendan]

An advantage is simply that, an advantage. It makes your chances of winning better, but does not guarantee wins. There is a reason Vegas gives the home team an automatic three points, because it makes a difference. Guess how big the difference was for the VCU-Drexel game. Yep, three points. The reason you don't see VCU winning the tournament more is because 1) it's hard to win the tournament consistently and 2) factoring in the advantage, VCU has probably overachieved with 5 wins in 17 years.

I do believe that VCU was one of the two best teams in the league this year, but I'm not so sure they would have won the tournament outside of Richmond.

That's fair. I honestly think they win that game either way. Granted, it was by 3 points, but that defense has been incredible. Drexel went on an impressive run - I believe that would have happened regardless of location.

[renaissance]

An advantage is simply that, an advantage. It makes your chances of winning better, but does not guarantee wins. There is a reason Vegas gives the home team an automatic three points, because it makes a difference. Guess how big the difference was for the VCU-Drexel game. Yep, three points. The reason you don't see VCU winning the tournament more is because 1) it's hard to win the tournament consistently and 2) factoring in the advantage, VCU has probably overachieved with 5 wins in 17 years.

I do believe that VCU was one of the two best teams in the league this year, but I'm not so sure they would have won the tournament outside of Richmond.

Am I reading correctly that you're saying VCU has overachieved each of the 5 years they've won the tourney? Didn't I post a little while back that they were regular season champs 4/5 of those years? Seems to me they were just achieving.

[Gator Bait]

Well perhaps CAA fans need to step up their game.

or they could just be fair about the tourny and not have it on VCU's home court every year

[RVAbrendan]

[renaissance]

or they could just be fair about the tourny and not have it on VCU's home court every year

Actually it'd be nice if they'd play on VCU's actual home court which is 100x nicer than the Coliseum.

[RichmondRedskin88]

Oh yea, at least I have a girlfriend and don't sound like a douche whining about woman problems on a message board. Ren can attest to that, she's met my g/f.

[rictus58]

You're a Jerk!

No You're a Jerk!

Na-uh!

Ya-huh!

You all are adults?