I am So Tired of Laron Landry

[KDawg]

You don't build around a safety.

---------- Post added November-2nd-2011 at 08:20 AM ----------

I agree with you for the most part.

Although I'm not sure we can let him walk after this year because we have no legitimate options to replace him with. Reed is a good guy to have on the team in a small role, but the thought of starting him for 16 games makes me cringe. A couple years ago I would have said Moore or Horton, but those guys didn't work out at all. They had less discipline than Doughty, and nowhere near the athleticism of Landry, I don't think Horton is even in the NFL anymore.

Gotta wonder what Gomes developement has been like... Not that I don't trust the judgement of the coaches, because obviously they know better, but if he is developing well, he's the cog that makes Landry even more expendable.

[Skinzfever2010]

You don't build around a safety.

Nope, but since one of the best safeties fell into your lap and you need that position to be great for your 3-4 you don't mess with that either. Remember that old saying Kdawg, if it an't broke.....

[Botched]

Gotta wonder what Gomes developement has been like... Not that I don't trust the judgement of the coaches, because obviously they know better, but if he is developing well, he's the cog that makes Landry even more expendable.

Honestly I forgot he even existed. I don't know why we're not playing him, he looked pretty good in preseason.

[Skinzfever2010]

*EDIT* Also, there seems to be this unwritten rule of lets see whats behind door 2 & 3 here with allot of our fans. Sometimes I can't blame you given the history of crap we have dealt with from old has beens here for the money. However, just because you don't "like" a player the player that behind him may not automatically be as efficient.

I remember the cries for cutting Carlos Rogers just because Kevin Barnes showed flashes here and there. Well here it is a year later Kevin Barnes is horrible.

I remember the cries about Doughty being one of the best Safeties in the NFL. Well given opportunities to produce in this new system he looks well below average. Now there is the Gomes cries. Lets see what Gomes has got? hmm, really guys? I think we should calm down. Nothing is wrong with having one of the better defensive players on your team. No he's not perfect and no he's not Sean Taylor. I upped a thread here before the season that showcased the attacks SEan Taylor got when he was alive here. Same old criticisms.

Bruce runs the show

[KDawg]

Nope, but since one of the best safeties fell into your lap and you need that position to be great for your 3-4 you don't mess with that either. Remember that old saying Kdawg, if it an't broke.....

Yup, I know the saying. But I have to contend that it is broke. Not safety, but the entire freakin' team. Landry is a luxury item for this squad. A luxury item with a bad wheel, and mediocre at best discipline. He can and does make HUGE plays for us. I love the fact that he's nasty on the field. I'd say, though, that he makes more bad plays than he does great ones. You don't need a stud SS to run the 3-4, either.

[Skinzfever2010]

Yup, I know the saying. But I have to contend that it is broke. Not safety, but the entire freakin' team. Landry is a luxury item for this squad. A luxury item with a bad wheel, and mediocre at best discipline. He can and does make HUGE plays for us. I love the fact that he's nasty on the field. I'd say, though, that he makes more bad plays than he does great ones. You don't need a stud SS to run the 3-4, either.

I have to disagree again. Another misconception exaggerated by an emotion. He has made one bad play this year. That play took place last game. The taunting isn't a bad play or a missed tackle. In this short season he has had more positive impact than anyone on D not named London Fletcher and maybe Ryan the stellar Rookie. Had our offense been able to capitalize off his big plays I'm sure you wouldn't be saying this and this thread wouldn't be up.

[KDawg]

I have to disagree again. Another misconception exaggerated by an emotion.

No, it's not. Trust me. I'm not the least bit emotional about this team. Emotion was drained from me about three years ago.

He has made one bad play this year.

One bad play? Really? One? London Fletcher has made more than one bad play this year, in fact, more than one, and he's BY FAR the best player on this team, and you want to feed me that Landry has made one poor play? Come on.

That play took place last game. The taunting isn't a bad play or a missed tackle.

Missed tackles ARE bad plays, especially the way he misses. Who cares about the taunting? I'd prefer he didn't do it, but it's not my hangup on him.

In this short season he has made more impact than anyone on D not named London Fletcher. Had our offense been able to capitalize off his big plays I'm sure you wouldn't be saying this and this thread wouldn't be up.

Are you SURE I wouldn't be saying this? I actually would be. I'm not someone that wants to let go of our young guys. I like Rak, even though h'es mediocre in run support and coverage, he's an elite pass rusher. I like Cooley, who isn't young, and given the opportunity to take a paycut, I think he needs to be brought back as a #2 TE if we manage to resign Sleepy. Landry is a different animal.

I'll debate you all day long on why I feel the way I do, but do me a favor, don't make assumptions. "I'm sure you wouldn't be saying this..." is quite incorrect. However, that said, if the defense was performing, perhaps that would also mean that Landry was actually doing his job (among other guys, he's not the only reason our D has been abused. And I've never claimed that he was.)

We have a bunch of problems, Landry being just one of them.

---------- Post added November-2nd-2011 at 08:41 AM ----------

Oh, by the way, I think the biggest problem with our defense (besides Haslett) is our offense.

[Skinzfever2010]

No, it's not. Trust me. I'm not the least bit emotional about this team. Emotion was drained from me about three years ago.

One bad play? Really? One? London Fletcher has made more than one bad play this year, in fact, more than one, and he's BY FAR the best player on this team, and you want to feed me that Landry has made one poor play? Come on.

Missed tackles ARE bad plays, especially the way he misses. Who cares about the taunting? I'd prefer he didn't do it, but it's not my hangup on him.

Are you SURE I wouldn't be saying this? I actually would be. I'm not someone that wants to let go of our young guys. I like Rak, even though h'es mediocre in run support and coverage, he's an elite pass rusher. I like Cooley, who isn't young, and given the opportunity to take a paycut, I think he needs to be brought back as a #2 TE if we manage to resign Sleepy. Landry is a different animal.

I'll debate you all day long on why I feel the way I do, but do me a favor, don't make assumptions. "I'm sure you wouldn't be saying this..." is quite incorrect. However, that said, if the defense was performing, perhaps that would also mean that Landry was actually doing his job (among other guys, he's not the only reason our D has been abused. And I've never claimed that he was.)

We have a bunch of problems, Landry being just one of them.

Sorry bro I didn't mean to get you all worked up thus morning. What missed tackles and bad angles are you referring to in the 2011 season? Please don't state the obvious, we know about the miscue from last game. What else?

London Fletcher is the leader of the defense and arguably this team. He isn't the best player on the D. Brian and mabe Ryan are easily better at this stage of the game.

Assumption made is Landry is a problem by KDAWG and others on the Extremeskin forum. The Head Coach of the Washington Redskins is in love with his SS. The taunting is what kills most of his detractors on the forum. This next sentence is not an opinion. In the 2011 season LaRon Landry has made more positive plays than negative plays. Several of the positive plays were game changing.

We do indeed have a bunch of problems on this team. Our young stud safety isn't one of them.

[KDawg]

Sorry bro I didn't mean to get you all worked up thus morning. What missed tackles and bad angles are you referring to in the 2011 season? Please don't state the obvious, we know about the miscue from last game. What else?

I don't have specifics. I've watched the games and I've seen him miss quite a few tackles. Rewatch the games if you want to see for yourself.

And I'm not worked up. At all. Quite calm, actually.

London Fletcher is the leader of the defense and arguably this team. He isn't the best player on the D. Brian and mabe Ryan are easily better at this stage of the game.

Disagree here as well, then. London is the best player we have. An argument may be able to be made for Kerrigan right now, but to say that Kerrigan (or Rak) are "easily" better at this stage is a folly.

Assumption made is Landry is a problem by KDAWG and others on the Extremeskin forum. The Head Coach of the Washington Redskins is in love with his SS. The taunting is what kills most of his detractors on the forum. This next sentence is not an opinion. In the 2011 season LaRon Landry has made more positive plays than negative plays. Several of the positive plays were game changing.

You're telling me you've broken down every play and have counted positive/negative plays? Do you have a copy of that? I'd like to delve into it a bit.

We do indeed have a bunch of problems on this team. Our young stud safety isn't one of them.

[Skinzfever2010]

I don't have specifics. I've watched the games and I've seen him miss quite a few tackles. Rewatch the games if you want to see for yourself.

And I'm not worked up. At all. Quite calm, actually.

Disagree here as well, then. London is the best player we have. An argument may be able to be made for Kerrigan right now, but to say that Kerrigan (or Rak) are "easily" better at this stage is a folly.

You're telling me you've broken down every play and have counted positive/negative plays? Do you have a copy of that? I'd like to delve into it a bit.

We do indeed have a bunch of problems on this team. Our young stud safety isn't one of them.

I watched every game including the games hes been in and I haven't seen the wiffs. When he wasn't playing I did see his backup miss allot and give up big plays. Remember I'm countering you, your claim is missed tackles but you never cite any. Maybe your talking about the 2009 season? I dunno but I'm a little confused by it.

But then again you did come out and admit you have no specifics. A few posts back you alluded to Reed being more serviceable. How? Reed's play has regressed in the 3-4 like many other players on this team. The Gomes thing is ludicrous lol? Obviously he isn't ready yet.

London is not this team's best player. Is he the leader? easily but the best as in skill set and stats no. I don't even know if he will be here next year. One thing we do agree on is D is the least of our problems.

[KDawg]

I watched every game including the games hes been in and I haven't seen the wiffs. When he wasn't playing I did see his backup miss allot and give up big plays. Remember I'm countering you, your claim is missed tackles but you never cite any. Maybe your talking about the 2009 season? I dunno but I'm a little confused by it.

How can I cite any without film? You want me to remember every play that he participated in. I'm telling you what I remember. You told me it's a fact that he made more positive plays than negative. I'd like to see the proof of this fact. You're going by memory as well. Which tells me you're doing the same thing I am here.

Three possible outcomes:

1. I'm right, you're wrong.

2. You're right and I'm wrong.

3. It's somewhere in the middle.

I'd guess that the answer is probably closer to #3 than it is #1 or #2. But your opinion is hardly fact, just as mine isn't.

But then again you did come out and admit you have no specifics.

I did.

A few posts back you alluded to Reed being more serviceable. How? Reed's play has regressed in the 3-4 like many other players on this team. The Gomes thing is ludicrous lol? Obviously he isn't ready yet.

I don't think I said he's more serviceable, although I may have worded it that way. I firmly believe Reed Doughty is serviceable in the fact that he will not leave his assignments like LaRon does. He's not overaggressive. Even the Bills said that LaRon is aggressive and they attacked our defense with that in mind. Doughty makes several mistakes, to be sure. But, he's much more cost effective. He's not a freak athlete like LaRon, I agree there 100%.

And neither you, or I, know what Gomes development is like.

London is not this team's best player. Is he the leader? easily but the best as in skill set and stats no. I don't even know if he will be here next year.

Stats rarely tell the whole story.

But, I'll counter the stats argument:

He leads the team in solo tackles: 33

He leads theteam in assisted tackle: 30

He leads the team in total tackles: 63

The next closest total tackler is Rocky with 52 (which is how you know stats don't tell the whole story). DeAngelo Hall has more tackles than Landry does (37-29).

He's got a full sack, which is .5 better than Landry.

He's got 1 forced fumble... He's second on the team behind Rak/Kerrigan who each have 2. Reed Doughty, LaRon Landry, Stephen Bowen, Kedric Golston and Byron Westbrook also each have recorded 1 forced fumble.

London Fletcher leads the team in interceptions. He has 2.

LaRon Landry has yet to record one.

[Lavarleap56]

Sorry bro I didn't mean to get you all worked up thus morning. What missed tackles and bad angles are you referring to in the 2011 season? Please don't state the obvious, we know about the miscue from last game. What else?

London Fletcher is the leader of the defense and arguably this team. He isn't the best player on the D. Brian and mabe Ryan are easily better at this stage of the game.

Assumption made is Landry is a problem by KDAWG and others on the Extremeskin forum. The Head Coach of the Washington Redskins is in love with his SS. The taunting is what kills most of his detractors on the forum. This next sentence is not an opinion. In the 2011 season LaRon Landry has made more positive plays than negative plays. Several of the positive plays were game changing.

We do indeed have a bunch of problems on this team. Our young stud safety isn't one of them.

Game changing? Im pretty sure we are 1-3 since his return.

[KingGibbs]

Game changing? Im pretty sure we are 1-3 since his return.

Anybody that uses "game changing" and Landry in the same breath must be referring to Madden.

I'd much rather have Doughty in there in regards to discipline and results. People will bring up his weakness in coverage. Guess what? Landry is no better and that's odd considering he is way more athletic.

[Boss_Hogg]

LaRon Landry with the help of Mike Shanahan is one of the best SS in the NFL today. Coach isn't asking him to be 30 yds deep and giving him a plethora of coverage responsibilities hes actually utilizing him where he thrives most.

i didn't know Mike Shanahan ran the defense too.

[IrepDC]

When Landry forced the fumble against Dallas it was game changing. Our offense just doesn't capitalize. No different than when we didn't capitalize on Fletchers interception, or Halls interception against the Eagles(off a Landry hit). Just because our offense fails miserably shouldn't discredit the play of our defense.

I'm still reading through this thread trying to understand the meat of everyone's problems with Landry.

I've seen mentions of his taunting.

I've seen mentions that we can't afford him. Which doesn't seem true considering our cap room, the new rookie wage scale, and our FOs history of FA spending. Someone could fill me in?

I've seen mentions that he misses too many tackles and blows too many coverages. Although I haven't seen any specific plays or even games that people are referring to. Just general things that I think were more accurately his first two seasons.

I've seen that he is one of the "problems" on our team. Not much elaboration though.

I've even seen a few posters say they have reasons that they don't wish to discuss.

My only issue is I am having trouble truly understand what's going on in this thread. I remember Landry playing well so far this season as in specific plays. Yes our team is still rebuilding, and we've lost games, and Landry cost us a TD by biting on a play fake to one of the top rushers in the NFL. But how does this lead to "Im so tired of Laron Landry"? Maybe I'm missing something?

[Houston2Taylor2Landry]

Anybody that uses "game changing" and Landry in the same breath must be referring to Madden.

I'd much rather have Doughty in there in regards to discipline and results. People will bring up his weakness in coverage. Guess what? Landry is no better and that's odd considering he is way more athletic.

King Gibbs. The guy with no examples, just opinions.

King Gibbs-Landry and Reed are the same in coverage!

Truth? Reedn allowed a 65 yard TD to Nicks and a long strike to Ballard in the same game. Landry hasn't been beaten in coverage in the 4 games before Buffalo. Against Buffalo...He was "beaten" once.

King Gibbs- Reed is just as good as Landry against the run.

Truth? Reed was responsible for 2 long runs in Giants game. Including a TD, where he was juked out of his shoes. Landry? He's been pretty decent against the run so far. Did have a missed tackle on Fred Jackson, but the play was called back. 1 bad play in 5 games. Reed 3 bad plays in 2 games.

King Gibbs- Landry isn't game changing.

Truth? he forced a fumble in Cowboy territory. Offense failed to capitalize. Landry forces Jones out of bounds for a loss with 2:__ left in game. That should be counted as game changing because he allowed the offense to not call a timeout, which is huge in 2 minute offense. Offense failed to score. Forces Vick out of game vs Eagles....Next play, HE FORCES Vince Young to throw INT to Hall. Hall brings it to the 30 yard line...Rex throws an interception on next play.

I just gave you 3 examples...How is Landry supposed to be "Game Changing" if the offense doesn't do anything with the "Game Changing" plays he's given them?

King Gibbs- Landry woofs with other team after 1st down.

Truth? In 2009? Yes. It was very annoying. Last Year through the first 3 games? Yes. Again, very annoying. His last 6 games of last year and his first 5 this year? No. Let me start by saying his first 4 games so far he was VERY "Straight Edge" he wasn't dancing or anything. The first sign of taunting he did was after his forced pick vs Philly where he and Dhall celebrated for a good 45 seconds, but that is NO DIFFERENT than Fletch doing it after his big plays. Now, against the Bills, he was WOOFING, A LOT. But...Not after Bill First downs. After the Bill's had nice gains of 5 or 6? Yes. But never after a first down. He stopped after the first half, though. As he should of.

Now, I'm not saying that his taunting doesn't annoy me, because it does. Not as much as it does most of you, because I realize that sometimes, it's the Opposing teams player that starts it with him and he just never stops. But for the most part it's annoying.

I don't dislike you, King.

On other topics, I value your opinion. But on this topic, it's very clear that you just don't like Landry, and it shows.

[flock53]

I was reading some previous posts and seen how 'Rak got throw in the conversation......WHY???? If you think he hasnt lived up to the hype or whatever....DO YOU NOT realize that he is playing a different position?? Just like Kerrigan?? They both played DE at college w/ their hands on the ground. I guess its encouraging if they decide to scrap the 3-4 that we would have some good DEs and a servicable DTs in Coefield and Carriker.

[KingGibbs]

King Gibbs. The guy with no examples, just opinions.

King Gibbs-Landry and Reed are the same in coverage!

Truth? Reedn allowed a 65 yard TD to Nicks and a long strike to Ballard in the same game. Landry hasn't been beaten in coverage in the 4 games before Buffalo. Against Buffalo...He was "beaten" once.

King Gibbs- Reed is just as good as Landry against the run.

Truth? Reed was responsible for 2 long runs in Giants game. Including a TD, where he was juked out of his shoes. Landry? He's been pretty decent against the run so far. Did have a missed tackle on Fred Jackson, but the play was called back. 1 bad play in 5 games. Reed 3 bad plays in 2 games.

King Gibbs- Landry isn't game changing.

Truth? he forced a fumble in Cowboy territory. Offense failed to capitalize. Landry forces Jones out of bounds for a loss with 2:__ left in game. That should be counted as game changing because he allowed the offense to not call a timeout, which is huge in 2 minute offense. Offense failed to score. Forces Vick out of game vs Eagles....Next play, HE FORCES Vince Young to throw INT to Hall. Hall brings it to the 30 yard line...Rex throws an interception on next play.

I just gave you 3 examples...How is Landry supposed to be "Game Changing" if the offense doesn't do anything with the "Game Changing" plays he's given them?

King Gibbs- Landry woofs with other team after 1st down.

Truth? In 2009? Yes. It was very annoying. Last Year through the first 3 games? Yes. Again, very annoying. His last 6 games of last year and his first 5 this year? No. Let me start by saying his first 4 games so far he was VERY "Straight Edge" he wasn't dancing or anything. The first sign of taunting he did was after his forced pick vs Philly where he and Dhall celebrated for a good 45 seconds, but that is NO DIFFERENT than Fletch doing it after his big plays. Now, against the Bills, he was WOOFING, A LOT. But...Not after Bill First downs. After the Bill's had nice gains of 5 or 6? Yes. But never after a first down. He stopped after the first half, though. As he should of.

Now, I'm not saying that his taunting doesn't annoy me, because it does. Not as much as it does most of you, because I realize that sometimes, it's the Opposing teams player that starts it with him and he just never stops. But for the most part it's annoying.

I don't dislike you, King.

On other topics, I value your opinion. But on this topic, it's very clear that you just don't like Landry, and it shows.

Clearly 'skins fans are split when it comes to Landry. I don't need to and I don't care to cite examples. It's called the eyeball test.

You're right, I don't like Landry, but it's obvious your love for Landry runs deep. A little too deep if you ask me. You are hung up on the occasional highlight hit and fail to look at his overall play.

[Houston2Taylor2Landry]

Clearly 'skins fans are split when it comes to Landry. I don't need to and I don't care to cite examples. It's called the eyeball test.

You're right, I don't like Landry, but it's obvious your love for Landry runs deep. A little too deep if you ask me. You are hung up on the occasional highlight hit and fail to look at his overall play.

Yeah, I just wrote a somewhat big response to you and I accidentally deleted it...So..Some quick things...

-I would stand up for any player on this team who had a 37 page thread filled with lies about them

-LL is my favorite player, but I would take the team>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Landry 700% of the time.

-That's why we should re-sign him, for the better of the team moving forward.

-Get ya eyes checked, King. Because clearly....They ain't working :pfft:

Now.....For the betterment of this board and me..can we just get ready for San Fran?

:helmet:

[KDawg]

-I would stand up for any player on this team who had a 37 page thread filled with lies about them

They aren't lies. They're opinions. Many would view your opinions as the ones that are wrong. Many also agree with you. Just sayin'.

-LL is my favorite player, but I would take the team>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Landry 700% of the time.

-That's why we should re-sign him, for the better of the team moving forward.

That's not a reason.

[Houston2Taylor2Landry]

They aren't lies. They're opinions. Many would view your opinions as the ones that are wrong. Many also agree with you. Just sayin'.

That's not a reason.

How about we just focus on San Fran and my awesome new sig?

[KingGibbs]

Was pleasantly surprised by Gomes play yesterday. 13 tackels and 7 solos. Seems more technically sound than does Landry. Not sure how Gomes did in coverage, but the fact that it was his first start I thought he did a good job.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

yeah, as much as i love landry, its tough to argue that he was somehow missed yesterday. its a shame because we've seen his potential but his injury concern combined with how much money he's going to want is a major issue.

we might end up letting him walk and spend the money on other offensive positions we need.

[Boss_Hogg]

Landry may have one of those nagging Achilles injuries that may never heal properly. I would be content with just letting him walk, let's focus on spending some green on the offensive line.

[KingGibbs]

Landry may have one of those nagging Achilles injuries that may never heal properly. I would be content with just letting him walk, let's focus on spending some green on the offensive line.

Yep. He is becoming an afterthought as far as I'm concerned.