The Official Washington Basketball Thread: Wizards, Mystics etc

[StillUnknown]

This doesn't have anything to do with the Wiz tonight, it's about NCAA.

And it doesn't have anything to do with either game, specifically, tonight but more overall.

Shabazz M. just isn't a dominate player. He's not a ... elite body. He's not an intimidating presence on the court. Athletically, he doesn't live above the rim, enough so, even at the NCAA level to dominate and he'll certainly not be a high-flyer in the NBA.

And just when you realize that he's not eye popping, looks smaller than his alleged height and measurements, you realize that he jogs and half-asses a bunch.

Nothing to do with the UCLA loss tonight, but more about something you see.

Is he good? - Certainly, has skills, can drive at times and shoot outside.

But again, doesn't have the elite, above the rim style. Doesn't dominate people physically to where you see that translating to the NBA. Doesn't have a domineering body to make an impact against truly men sized guys in the NBA.

He's going to have to rely on that slipstream, less aggressive, backed off style of shoot the ball kind of approach rather than trying to break people down or physically take it to the hole - I don't see him doing that in the NBA.

Turns out he's also a year older than everyone thought.

[Going Commando]

Wall put Nash on his ass and put the ball down on the baseline and gave the staples crowd the "go **** yourselves" look. Loved it! He was the best player on the floor, like Steve said.

Yeah it made me giddy how good his second half was. Speed is LA's Achilles heel. They couldn't guard Wall, he just diced them. I think the best they can do is put Kobe on him but then you've got mismatches on Ariza and Webster when you put Nash and Blake on them. They're so long for SGs. Temple too.

Wall is getting to the point where he can harness his ridiculous physical attributes to be a huge mismatch.

I love that we beat a vet laden LA team with as much big game experience as anyone, and we did it in winning time. We made the plays we had to and LA didn't. That's a sign of some maturity from the team.

---------- Post added March-23rd-2013 at 01:29 AM ----------

Turns out he's also a year older than everyone thought.

Did you read the LAtimes article that broke that story? It's fascinating stuff. And pretty damning IMO. His father sounds like a total scumbag conman. That kind of family background for Shabazz is a HUGE red flag to me. Are you getting his father with Shabazz when you draft him? Who knows what the man's current name even is?

At the very least, Shabazz has been lying about his age for who knows how long. He knew what was up, he's not a moron. Doesn't that seem like something that could get you kicked out of school? At worst, he's cut from the same cloth as his father--someone who only cares about his brand and making money and not being an actual human being. I think his father might have made him an egomaniac. Frankly I don't want a kid like that in our locker room. He's not good enough to deal with that kind of BS. I'd much, much rather have a smart, sincere player who is a little less talented in Porter or Zeller.

[StillUnknown]

Did you read the LAtimes article that broke that story? It's fascinating stuff. And pretty damning IMO. His father sounds like a total scumbag conman. That kind of family background for Shabazz is a HUGE red flag to me. Are you getting his father with Shabazz when you draft him? Who knows what the man's current name even is?

At the very least, Shabazz has been lying about his age for who knows how long. He knew what was up, he's not a moron. Doesn't that seem like something that could get you kicked out of school? At worst, he's cut from the same cloth as his father--someone who only cares about his brand and making money and not being an actual human being. I think his father might have made him an egomaniac. Frankly I don't want a kid like that in our locker room. He's not good enough to deal with that kind of BS. I'd much, much rather have a smart, sincere player who is a little less talented in Porter or Zeller.

I got a similar feeling about his father after reading the article. I'm hesitant to judge anyone on the actions of their parents, but Shabazz's father certainly isn't doing him many favors.

Edited March 23, 2013 by StillUnknown

[SiCkSoULjA]

Wall is the LeBron of PGs athletically. He's the best athlete at PG in the NBA. Faster than everyone else, bigger and stronger and a better leaper than almost everybody else too.

Westbrook says Hi

I am just loving the way John Wall has been playing the past week, I didn't see the game but 16 assist is very impressive but I like is the 19 shot attemps. I understand the past first mentality and the true point guard crap but we need Wall too be aggressive looking for his shot and then that just opens everything else up for others too get those easy assist, teams can't just play off of him knowing hes going too pass or he has no confidence in his mid range jumper. Last 2 weeks dude has been playing like a stone cold beast. I have been very critical of him but dude has been straight ballin!

[RonArtest15]

Yeah it made me giddy how good his second half was. Speed is LA's Achilles heel. They couldn't guard Wall, he just diced them. I think the best they can do is put Kobe on him but then you've got mismatches on Ariza and Webster when you put Nash and Blake on them. They're so long for SGs. Temple too.

Wall is getting to the point where he can harness his ridiculous physical attributes to be a huge mismatch.

I love that we beat a vet laden LA team with as much big game experience as anyone, and we did it in winning time. We made the plays we had to and LA didn't. That's a sign of some maturity from the team.

---------- Post added March-23rd-2013 at 01:29 AM ----------

Did you read the LAtimes article that broke that story? It's fascinating stuff. And pretty damning IMO. His father sounds like a total scumbag conman. That kind of family background for Shabazz is a HUGE red flag to me. Are you getting his father with Shabazz when you draft him? Who knows what the man's current name even is?

At the very least, Shabazz has been lying about his age for who knows how long. He knew what was up, he's not a moron. Doesn't that seem like something that could get you kicked out of school? At worst, he's cut from the same cloth as his father--someone who only cares about his brand and making money and not being an actual human being. I think his father might have made him an egomaniac. Frankly I don't want a kid like that in our locker room. He's not good enough to deal with that kind of BS. I'd much, much rather have a smart, sincere player who is a little less talented in Porter or Zeller.

I just came across the Shabazz article. I really feel sorry for him. For one, the timing of the article absolutely SUCKS. Another, it sheds light as to how overbearing his dad is. I don't think his age will be a problem when it comes to the draft, but teams will definitely be turned off due to how his father has/is controlling his life. You have to ask yourself if Shabazz even likes the sport? To me, this is somewhat similar to how Marv Marinovich raised Todd. The Wizards have dealt with Pam McGee, and she seems to be tame compared to how Shabazz's father goes about his business. Whatever team that drafts him will absolutely need to set up parameters for his family. I just hope that Shabazz has a good NBA career and HIS money stays safe. The dad is too shady.

[Going Commando]

Westbrook says Hi

I am just loving the way John Wall has been playing the past week, I didn't see the game but 16 assist is very impressive but I like is the 19 shot attemps. I understand the past first mentality and the true point guard crap but we need Wall too be aggressive looking for his shot and then that just opens everything else up for others too get those easy assist, teams can't just play off of him knowing hes going too pass or he has no confidence in his mid range jumper. Last 2 weeks dude has been playing like a stone cold beast. I have been very critical of him but dude has been straight ballin!

Wall is bigger and faster and more explosive than Westbrook. He's probably 15 pounds heavier than him and had a better vertical and lane agility score than Westbrook. Westbrook can probably sprint a tiny bit faster than Wall and he's got less body fat and he's in better condition. But he's not faster than Wall with the ball in his hands IMO and he's only got those things over Wall compared to all of the other things Wall can do. You see it in the way Wall can do non-guard things like block shots whereas those aren't part of Westbrook's repertoire.

I think Wall is the fastest player in the league dribbling the ball. He's faster with the ball in his hands than CP3 and Tony P were sprinting flat out when they were young. The only guy who could challenge Wall at this is Lawson, and he's much smaller.

Wall is also bigger and stronger and faster than DRose but I'd say Rose is the closest to Wall as an athlete. He's got better body control than John and he's more vertically explosive.

[Skin'emAlive]

Wall might be faster and bigger, but his handles still need some work. Speed still will only get you so far. Gotta get better with the ball handling in the half court set. He has been playing amazing the past month though, and his confidence in his shot has increased considerably

[SiCkSoULjA]

Wall is bigger and faster and more explosive than Westbrook. He's probably 15 pounds heavier than him and had a better vertical and lane agility score than Westbrook. Westbrook can probably sprint a tiny bit faster than Wall and he's got less body fat and he's in better condition. But he's not faster than Wall with the ball in his hands IMO and he's only got those things over Wall compared to all of the other things Wall can do. You see it in the way Wall can do non-guard things like block shots whereas those aren't part of Westbrook's repertoire.

Wall is also bigger and stronger and faster than DRose but I'd say Rose is the closest to Wall as an athlete. He's got better body control than John and he's more vertically explosive.

No one in the NBA outside of Lebron James is more explosive than Westbrook I disagee with the vertical and lane agility. I will say this John Wall with the ball in his hands is a speed deamon hes the fasted hes like flash. Westbrook regularly does insane dunks in games over players, better handles as well. Wall when he drives too the paint and makes contact he goes flying too the ground like a rag doll, Westbrook doesn't he delievers the contact.

My favorite players in the nba 1. Westbrook, 2.Wall (it may seem like I am tuff on him but I see his game and expect so much and have been disappointed with his progress until recently)

Edited March 23, 2013 by SiCkSoULjA

[RonArtest15]

Combine results out of college:

3/4 Court Sprint:

Westbrook - 3.08

Rose - 3.05

Wall - 3.14

Lane Agility:

Westbrook - 10.98

Rose - 11.69

Wall - 10.83

Vertical:

Westbrook - 36.5

Rose - 42

Wall - 39

Before the knee injury, I'd say it would be Rose, Wall, and Westbrook.

Edited March 23, 2013 by RonArtest15

[SiCkSoULjA]

Combine results out of college:

3/4 Court Sprint:

Westbrook - 3.08

Rose - 3.05

Wall - 3.14

Lane Agility:

Westbrook - 10.98

Rose - 11.69

Wall - 10.83

Vertical:

Westbrook - 36.5

Rose - 42

Wall - 39

Before the knee injury, I'd say it would be Rose, Wall, and Westbrook.

Westbrook the the high flyer but has a much lower vertical

Wall has super speed but hes much slower

Rose has the best handle and crazy quickness but his lane agility is way worst.

Those numbers don't really show a accurate picture as now now.

My list would be

1. Westbrook (strength,quickness, jumping)

2. Rose (great at everything)

3. Wall (speed)

Edited March 23, 2013 by SiCkSoULjA

[RonArtest15]

Trey Burke is TOO good....

Mitch McGary going HAM as well....a strong tourney run could sway his decision whether to stay or go. Dude is a horse.

[Samuels]

Yeah it made me giddy how good his second half was. Speed is LA's Achilles heel. They couldn't guard Wall, he just diced them. I think the best they can do is put Kobe on him but then you've got mismatches on Ariza and Webster when you put Nash and Blake on them. They're so long for SGs. Temple too.

Wall is getting to the point where he can harness his ridiculous physical attributes to be a huge mismatch.

I love that we beat a vet laden LA team with as much big game experience as anyone, and we did it in winning time. We made the plays we had to and LA didn't. That's a sign of some maturity from the team.

---------- Post added March-23rd-2013 at 01:29 AM ----------

Did you read the LAtimes article that broke that story? It's fascinating stuff. And pretty damning IMO. His father sounds like a total scumbag conman. That kind of family background for Shabazz is a HUGE red flag to me. Are you getting his father with Shabazz when you draft him? Who knows what the man's current name even is?

At the very least, Shabazz has been lying about his age for who knows how long. He knew what was up, he's not a moron. Doesn't that seem like something that could get you kicked out of school? At worst, he's cut from the same cloth as his father--someone who only cares about his brand and making money and not being an actual human being. I think his father might have made him an egomaniac. Frankly I don't want a kid like that in our locker room. He's not good enough to deal with that kind of BS. I'd much, much rather have a smart, sincere player who is a little less talented in Porter or Zeller.

This has actually been known for awhile. Alot of people in the know already knew this including Shabazz's friends its been considered rumor since his high school years.

If we pick in the 8-11 range I'd gladly take him there its the perfect spot to steal a high upside player. He is the type of ISO scorer we lack but his overall game needs developed he can play alittle 2/3 off the bench with no pressure. I'd love Noel or Porter to fall and he might but I really hope he returns to GU the team would be stacked with the freshman coming in and Whittingtons return.

[8181]

Is this the article?

http://www.latimes.com/news/columnone/la-fi-shabazz-muhammad-inc-20130322-dto,0,3133186.htmlstory

If so, not really sure what the big deal is... If it's the travel expenses that were covered, that's peanuts... And if there ever is a scandal about gifts or whatever, I always blame the school/boosters/agents/sharks rather than the players.

Didn't really get the vibe that Shabazz's dad is a scumbag anymore than the thousands of fathers throughout the country that push their kids through camps and trainers and whatever in hopes they become a professional athlete. Or a doctor/lawyer as mentioned by Shabazz's dad. Heck, even RG3's dad drilled him to death.

The age thing is shady, but at least it's not like those 30 year olds pretending to be 18 in Central America.

Edited March 23, 2013 by 8181

[Destino]

Wall isn't strong. There is no part of his game that screams strength. He gets knocked to the floor routinely by contact and you never see him powering through defenders. Westbrook is a tank by comparison and I'd say he stronger than most SGs and many SFs. Rose is also a lot stronger going through the lane. If anything I'd say wall is much more of a finesse player and he should pattern his game to Tony Parker's. With the midrange game he needs to add some floaters and he can be a bigger faster Tony Parker. He's got much better court vision than Westbrook and better decision making too. Rose us unique in that he handles being eight feet from the basket like a layup, and I don't think that can be taught.

Wall needs to keep doing what he's doing and add tools to his offensive game. Then I think he'll need a more advanced offensive system to maximize what he and his team can do. The wizards starting unit could run the spurs offense from a personnel stand point. They don't have the horses to try playing like the Heat or Thunder. I'm not really sure what the hell the nuggets do despite watching more of their games than I care to admit.

Anyway back to the point, Walls strength are speed, length, agility, and court vision. He's not as soft as Steph Curry but he's not amongst the strong point guards either, not in the way he plays anyway. This sudden explosion of production might be the third year leap NBA fans look for in perimeter players. If he keep it up this team has found it's first Star. Ideally we'd find and interior star to pair with him. A bruiser not some stretch nonsense. Someone that is going to force the defense to double inside giving Wall and the shooters tons of space.

Edited March 23, 2013 by Destino

[Going Commando]

Is this the article?

http://www.latimes.com/news/columnone/la-fi-shabazz-muhammad-inc-20130322-dto,0,3133186.htmlstory

If so, not really sure what the big deal is... If it's the travel expenses that were covered, that's peanuts... And if there ever is a scandal about gifts or whatever, I always blame the school/boosters/agents/sharks rather than the players.

Didn't really get the vibe that Shabazz's dad is a scumbag anymore than the thousands of fathers throughout the country that push their kids through camps and trainers and whatever in hopes they become a professional athlete. Or a doctor/lawyer as mentioned by Shabazz's dad. Heck, even RG3's dad drilled him to death.

The age thing is shady, but at least it's not like those 30 year olds pretending to be 18 in Central America.

Yeah that's the article. Really, you didn't get the vibe Shabazz's dad was a scumbag? What about how he essentially blackmailed the NCAA into dropping their investigation of Shabazz by taping their phone conversations (that's illegal isn't it)? What about how he was given house arrest for fraud and how he has no clear or seemingly legit source of income and yet his family "always lived in nice houses and drove nice cars" and he put Shabazz through an expensive private school. What about him having like five different aliases? What about how he essentially tries to bribe the reporter writing the article by making him his publicist if he wouldn't write about his criminal past and the lying about Bazz's age? Nevermind all of the sad Marv Marinovich wannabe stuff, which is a whole different level of creepiness.

I don't understand how Shabazz hasn't gotten kicked out of UCLA for lying about his age. Shouldn't that be an honor violation? How did he even get to play college ball if he was so obviously accepting benefits for his play back in H.S.?

[Destino]

I have to agree with Steve, dad seems like shady character. Lying about his sons age to gain advantage, using several false aliases to scam mortgage companies, and his explanation for his current income is unspecified rental properties not own under his name. The guy seems to spend his entire life planning the next scheme and is clearly ok with breaking the rules and lying to make it work. He even offered the reporter a chance to be Shabazz's PR guy and in doing implied that it was in exchange for not reporting his criminal history and his sons real age.

Big red flag.

[mmzznnxx]

I missed the game last night. I missed the Wizards, without Okafor and Beal, come back from almost 20 points against the Lakers on the road with players like Bryant, Nash, Howard, Pau.

It feels like I missed witnessing Haley's comet passing Earth.

[8181]

Yeah that's the article. Really, you didn't get the vibe Shabazz's dad was a scumbag? What about how he essentially blackmailed the NCAA into dropping their investigation of Shabazz by taping their phone conversations (that's illegal isn't it)? What about how he was given house arrest for fraud and how he has no clear or seemingly legit source of income and yet his family "always lived in nice houses and drove nice cars" and he put Shabazz through an expensive private school. What about him having like five different aliases? What about how he essentially tries to bribe the reporter writing the article by making him his publicist if he wouldn't write about his criminal past and the lying about Bazz's age? Nevermind all of the sad Marv Marinovich wannabe stuff, which is a whole different level of creepiness.

I don't understand how Shabazz hasn't gotten kicked out of UCLA for lying about his age. Shouldn't that be an honor violation? How did he even get to play college ball if he was so obviously accepting benefits for his play back in H.S.?

I dunno. He may have done bad things but nothing screamed at me that he was a bad person.

Blackmailing the NCAA... Didn't seem like blackmail to me. An NCAA official approved the benefactor's funding of travel costs.

Fraud... He lied about his income. I've seen worse crimes.

Being well-off... Plenty of people live above their means.

Not saying it's all morally great, but I don't really see how this really sets them apart from numerous other athletes... Plenty of players at Miami benefited from that one booster, but I wouldn't use that as a red flag not to bring them to the Redskins. I wouldn't call Reggie Bush or Chris Webber scumbags for some of the monetary stuff they were involved in. Yeah, bad things, but I can't say they're bad people based on those matters.

[RonArtest15]

I dunno. He may have done bad things but nothing screamed at me that he was a bad person.

Blackmailing the NCAA... Didn't seem like blackmail to me. An NCAA official approved the benefactor's funding of travel costs.

Fraud... He lied about his income. I've seen worse crimes.

Being well-off... Plenty of people live above their means.

Not saying it's all morally great, but I don't really see how this really sets them apart from numerous other athletes... Plenty of players at Miami benefited from that one booster, but I wouldn't use that as a red flag not to bring them to the Redskins. I wouldn't call Reggie Bush or Chris Webber scumbags for some of the monetary stuff they were involved in. Yeah, bad things, but I can't say they're bad people based on those matters.

My red-flag w. Shabazz has nothing to do with his playing ability. It's more so because of his dad. He seems entirely overbearing and will want all control of his son's professional career.

[StillUnknown]

Looks like Ariza caught the flu from Okafor, he's out tonight.

[Destino]

Looks like Ariza caught the flu from Okafor, he's out tonight.

Damnit Emeka stop sipping people's Gatorade!

[StillUnknown]

Pretty bad start.

After the hard fought comeback last night, figured this would be a tough one.

[Destino]

Rough start.

[StillUnknown]

Chris Singleton is off the milk carton, lets see if he can make something of it.

[Destino]

This team has to find a way to upgrade the depth. This second unit is shockingly bad.

Temple

Martin

Singleton

Booker

Seraphin

Really makes you appreciate Ariza.