2011 Comprehensive NFL Draft Database

[darrelgreenie]

Steve-

If they can get top 15(ish) level of play from Beck/Rex I think they'll draft and develop a QB without having to invest a high pick.

---------- Post added August-17th-2011 at 07:11 PM ----------

Of the top flight rookie QB's who do you guys think performed the best? The worst?

Mallett (it makes me sick to watch him) I thought he played the best: poise, mobility and that arm, wow. Unleashed a 25+ yard bebe.

Locker had a ho-hum/safe outing, good poise and pocket presence, fumbled one center exchange then kinda lucked into an absolute quick strike bomb showing off his quick/solid motion and arm strength. Also had a nice toss on a rollout(of course).

Gabbert was ho-hum flashed his arm intermediate arm strength and accuracy, but I thought he could have done a better job with pocket presence (sacks etc).

Threw a nice seam/post early between 3 defenders. (I wonder how the Jags will screw this up?)

Newton was decidedly aggressive took a lot of chances down and almost hit on some big time plays, threw a few gorgeous passes (30 yd slot seam route, an 18 yard bang 8 that Matt Ryan couldn't have thrown any better).

But he also left some points/yards out there due to a couple of bad throws, missed blitz pick-up and lack of pocket awareness.

Didn't really pay that close attention to the other guys, but I thought Tyrod played alot better then his stats indicate Torrey Smith didn't finish his post route on Tyrod's first interception, then second he forced a 50/50 ball in the RZ (a no-no) trying too hard to make a play.

But, he flashed decent arm strength and that was one of my questions about him.

He did flash them wheels, this kid can really scoot.

---------- Post added August-17th-2011 at 07:13 PM ----------

A lot of there pre-season games cut-ups are available on youtube, I could post them if people are bored and want to discuss.

You see Colt McCoy? Just giving you a hard time.

[Dukes and Skins]

DG Colt was very impressive the other night definitely exceeded my expectations of him

[Mahons21]

A lot of there pre-season games cut-ups are available on youtube, I could post them if people are bored and want to discuss.

You see Colt McCoy? Just giving you a hard time.

Haha, didn't see him, you got a cut-up of his game as well?

EDIT: caught a glimpse of his game on some youtube clips, some very impressive throws, but it is worth noting neither tramon williams nor woodson were playing in this game.

Why were you sickened by Mallett? Disdain for him personally, or like me you wish we had drafted him?

BTW, how do you consistently find these awesome cut-ups?

[darrelgreenie]

EDIT: caught a glimpse of his game on some youtube clips, some very impressive throws, but it is worth noting neither tramon williams nor woodson were playing in this game.

Sure they didn't play but if you look at the starting line-ups for any preseason game you'll find several starters not playing league wide.

BTW You already know that DVOA has McCoy ahead of Bradford but did you know that ESPN new Total QBR rating has Colt ahead also?

Why were you sickened by Mallett? Disdain for him personally, or like me you wish we had drafted him?

I said it draft day and as usual was getting attacked from all sides because of it.

What of the rookies? Someone should start a thread in the stadium.

[Mahons21]

Sure they didn't play but if you look at the starting line-ups for any preseason game you'll find several starters not playing league wide.

Oh I know, look no further than the skins who were missing both Landry/Atogwe, however I still felt it should be noted. For example is that gorgeous pass to cribs still completed, or is it a batted ball with a starting corner in this league? I don't mean to take anything away from McCoy's game, he looked poised/comfortable and fired some real rockets in there, he certainly looked good in my opinion.

BTW You already know that DVOA has McCoy ahead of Bradford but did you know that ESPN new Total QBR rating has Colt ahead also?

To be honest I haven't even checked out this new QBR done by ESPN, only heard about it.

As far as mallett is concerned, I was right there with you. I think we missed out big time on that one.

[darrelgreenie]

To be honest I haven't even checked out this new QBR done by ESPN, only heard about it.

As far as mallett is concerned, I was right there with you. I think we missed out big time on that one.

I try not to think about it too much about coulda/woulda with QBs it makes me quesy.

I try not to resent all the QBs we didn't draft, but I have to admit that part of me wants them to fail and I'm the type of guy that roots for all QBs to succeed.

You should check out the new QBR its pretty cool stuff its not perfect but imo its a more meaningful metric then the QBR.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKwZu02drHM

(but I don't understand how they assign fault on sacks)

Anyway I stuck the vids from the rookie QBs here:

http://www.extremeskins.com/showthread.php?349318-Which-rookie-QB-will-have-the-most-success-in-2011

[postong]

DG Colt was very impressive the other night definitely exceeded my expectations of him

A little off topic, but how about those renovations to Bridgeforth stadium? Very nice!

[Going Commando]

Colt looked very sharp. He's blossoming much earlier than is normal. I think the reasons for this might be that he came into the league with a ton of starting experience in college, has a pretty good offensive line, and Pat Shurmur is a great teacher of the position and should know how to bring a QB along.

Even still, the speed of Colt's progression is pretty shocking. I liked Colt before the draft, but I wouldn't expect any QB to be really good at the start of his second season. I've been perusing the young quarterbacks for sleeper candidates in preparation for my fantasy draft. There's no way Colt can have high fantasy value as only a sophomore right? I'm crazy for thinking he might be a legit starting option right? I play in a league where passing touchdowns are 6 points instead of 4.

Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco are entering their fourth seasons. John Beck is entering his fifth season (although he's never started). Ryan and Flacco have pretty minimal cost and Beck has basically no cost right now. Those should be the best sleeper candidates IMO. This draft is also usually a 12 team snake, which really sucks because if you pick at the top of the order you risk all 6-8 top QBs being gone by the time it gets back around to you. I hate the snake draft format but my pleas for an auction have fallen on deaf ears. I don't like Bradford, Stafford, Sanchez, or Freeman for fantasy yet. I think I'm going to go for Matt Ryan in the middle rounds.

[wilco_holland]

About the QBR...it doesn´t really matter to me. I do think the number might be more accurate but who cares. I only care about the W at the end....stats are nice but most of the time don´t tell the hole story.

And that new rathing is not like math, is not like you and I can calculate it. There are a lot of varibles which they rank and could ´push´ to create a story. Just saying, we are talking about ESPN and Gruden. ;P

@SteveMcQ

Wouldn't be a bad idea to gamble on a QB. If you can get great WR's in the first rounds that can push your team. I mean RB's generally earn a lot of point but the difference between the middle guys isn't huge. If you really have two #1 go to WR's that gives you a huge advantage. I'm looking for Stafford in my draft, hope he somehow falls a bit. But you just need to see how the draft works out.

[Going Commando]

Yeah WRs are just about as valuable as running backs now Wilco. There are too few sure thing RBs at the top of the draft IMO. I remember just five or six years ago that there were always 4 or 5 bankable studs and probably 10-12 guys who were good #1 backs. Now the only bankable stud is Adrian Peterson and there are probably . The talent boom at RB league wide makes for the carries being spread around too much. It's no longer stupid to target top WRs in the first round.

I've never taken a QB in the first two rounds before because I've always been confident in my ability to jump on a QB trending up later on. Derek Anderson carried me to the playoffs one season. Michael Vick won me my league last year. I spent my first four picks on RBs and WRs and it ended up working out because I had Calvin Johnson, Greg Jennings, Steven Jackson, and Ray Rice (I was horrible early in the year but crushed the second half and the playoffs and won the league as the low seed).

Beware Matt Stafford as your only starting QB Wilco. If you take a chance on him, make sure you get another good starting QB option. He's in a similar position as Joe Flacco was last season--lots of surrounding talent and 3rd year player with an enticing talent level. I drafted Flacco last season and he was a disappointment. Quarterbacks usually don't start putting up big numbers until their fourth or fifth seasons though. It's pretty rare for a player to put up big fantasy numbers before that. The only recent examples I can think of are Cutler, Peyton Manning, and Palmer. It's safer to go with older QBs IMO.

[Going Commando]

Who do you all like this year for the rookie awards?

Here are my early predictions:

OROTY - Mark Ingram, HB, New Orleans

DROTY - Mason Foster, LB, Tampa Bay

I guess I could see Julio Jones winning the award too if he returns punts. I think an offensive lineman will be the best offensive rookie though even though one will never win the award. My money would be on Gabe Carimi or Danny Watkins being the best. Derek Sherrod is in Green Bay and they run an extremely complicated blocking scheme that's tough for rookie to pick up, otherwise I would guess that it'd be him.

On defense it'll be a linebacker. Marcell Dareus will probably be the most impactful rookie but he plays a position that doesn't put up numbers so he won't win it. I like the scheme and setting Mason Foster settled into. He'll put up 150+ tackles and be the focal point of the defense and that should be enough to win him the award unless some pass rusher like Brooks Reed or Von Miller has double digit sacks.

---------- Post added August-18th-2011 at 10:59 AM ----------

What do you all think about our plan to start Will Montgomery at center? I think this is one of the most interesting developments to watch this season. New center and new QB this year.

Check this out, someone actually made a highlight video of him last season with three or four games of cutups:

!

I wish more people would make highlight videos of offensive linemen.

One of the things I noticed is that he had a really good comfort level snapping in that TN game. He looks like a smart lineman, picking up the right rushers and executing the help blocks well. It was also interesting to see him play next to Rabach because it showed off how much stronger he is than Rabach. He plays with good pad level and didn't give up a whole lot of ground in the passing game. There were times when he was still basically at the LoS and all of our other linemen were back at the QB. I also like how active he looks in that video, using his hands to punch and engage and just be a general nuisance to his opponent. Looks like a velcro type lineman in how he sticks to his man.

Of course the video is only a highlights and doesn't show any of his mistakes (except for the small hold he got away with).

Those were almost all passing plays too. Who knows what kind of push he gets when he run blocks? My guess is not a whole lot, and that's fine for a center in a ZBS. The lateral running didn't seem to bother him, I assume he can get down field. He should easily be an upgrade over Rabach but that's not a high bar.

All in all, he looks like a massively improved player from the Zorn years.

I think improvement from him and Trent will largely determine how our season goes. I think we know what to expect from Jammal Brown. If TW and Monty play really well.this year then we'll run the ball well and have a top 10-15 offense this season despite questionable QB play.

[Dukes and Skins]

A little off topic, but how about those renovations to Bridgeforth stadium? Very nice!

Trust me its got us extremely excited down at JMU will be a fun year no doubt

---------- Post added August-18th-2011 at 11:42 AM ----------

As for OROY and DROY

OROY- Mark Ingram

DROY- Patrick Peterson

I think Peterson will surprise a lot and have a big time first year in Arizona, he's got what you want as a CB and will be given the chance early on to show he can produce at a high level.

Ingram is almost self explanatory IMO, because outside of probably Julio Jones I really dont see another rookie offensive player having a big time first year with the exception of maybe Julio Jones like Steve said

[Champskins]

Trust me its got us extremely excited down at JMU will be a fun year no doubt

JMU was never boring. I miss that place more than anything and may need to come down and visit soon

[Dukes and Skins]

JMU was never boring. I miss that place more than anything and may need to come down and visit soon

Never has been overall, just that the stadium has brought a lot of energy and excitement considering the last two years we've only had 6-5 seasons

[Champskins]

Never has been overall, just that the stadium has brought a lot of energy and excitement considering the last two years we've only had 6-5 seasons

I was down there when we won the AA National Championship in 2004. Place was nuts man. Never a lack of females down there either, amazing!

[Dukes and Skins]

I was down there when we won the AA National Championship in 2004. Place was nuts man. Never a lack of females down there either, amazing!

Makes me jealous then

Also my sleeper DROY pick this year I really like Marcell Dareus out of Buffalo as well. Had a good start to his playing career and is going to have chances to make big time plays with a good player like Kyle Williams next to him

[Champskins]

I like the Ingram pick for OROY

I like Robert Quinn for DROY.

[Going Commando]

Yeah I really can't find anyone else to pick for OROY. A lot of the best rookies fell into situations where they are unlikely to start, particularly the HBs and QBs. A.J. Green could win the award since Cincy will probably have to throw it a lot.

I just looked at the draft class once again and several times I found myself thinking, "hmm I liked him, Cleveland took him?" and "oh that was a nice pick, well done Kansas City."

I think my favorite draft class is Tampa Bay's, closely followed by Kansas City's, Cleveland's, and Houston's. Detroit did well too. Tampa Bay didn't have a single bad pick IMO and got good value on almost every selection. I think they laid the foundation for some dominant freaking defenses the past two drafts. They are going to be so unbelievably good in a season or two. Kansas City is right behind them. Tons of upside in the class and they added talent in all of the right places. Green Bay had a nice class too. And it goes without saying that the Ravens and Steelers did pretty well in the draft. As did the Giants.

Outside of Blaine Gabbert (who they might not have needed given that Garrard is a pretty good QB), I thought Jacksonville had a pretty bad draft. I think Seattle's was the worst class by far. That FO is completely amateur and one of the worst at drafting in the league. James Carpenter in the first is just ****ing terrible value. From there you can argue that just about every pick they made involved a reach. I don't think Pete Carroll has a clue about how the rest of the league values draft picks and the players he likes. That Charlie Whitehurst trade last season pathetic, worse than the McNabb deal at the time. I feel sorry for Seahawks fans because that truly is an organization stuck in neutral. They'd have a 3 or 4 win season in a real division.

---------- Post added August-18th-2011 at 12:35 PM ----------

Oh, and whatever happened to Aaron Curry? I know that pick predates the current Seattle FO but it shows another massive missed opportunity on their part. They should have taken Orakpo, thank God they didn't.

Curry has to be considered a huge disappointment. 25 and barely replacement level 4-3 linebacker.

Curry is the quintissential illustration that anyone who says or thinks there is such a thing as a "sure thing" or "can't miss prospect" in the NFL draft is a fool.

[Soup]

jeez that total QB rating is going to be a nightmare for the person that has to sit there and analyze each play. I think it will be bias as hell, don't trust ESPN.

Rex or Beck could throw a 4000 yard season and they'd probably rank them low.

[The Tris]

Curry is the prime example of why you don't take a WLB in the first round (much less the top 10).

As for the ROY, you are pretty much guaranteed the OROY will be a QB or RB, and DROY will be a LB or DE.

So for me:

OROY: I'll break the Mark Ingram hegemony and say Ryan Williams (since Ingram is technically 3rd on the depth chart and Beanie Wells kinda sucks)

DROY: LB is usually the safest bet, but it was a bad LB class. So I'll go with the most talented DE that is currently starting, Robert Quinn.

[Dukes and Skins]

See I like Quinn and I wanted to just go the easy route on picking an LB but I really do feel like Patrick will be something to watch especially in the NFCW where there aren't the toughest receivers to cover. Now he'll have some challenges in non divisional games against teams like Philly, NY, Us, but he should show out really well this year and be in the final discussion for DROY

[The Tris]

See I like Quinn and I wanted to just go the easy route on picking an LB but I really do feel like Patrick will be something to watch especially in the NFCW where there aren't the toughest receivers to cover. Now he'll have some challenges in non divisional games against teams like Philly, NY, Us, but he should show out really well this year and be in the final discussion for DROY

I think Patrick Peterson struggles out of the gate ala Malcolm Jenkins and is eventually moved to safety.

Jenkins, incidentally, is primed to have a DPOY season.

[Going Commando]

Does anyone think one of our rookies can win an award? I seriously wouldn't rule out Kerrigan. He was so productive in college, you can't rule him out.

Also, no one thinks a QB will win OROTY? Cam Newton and Andy Dalton will most likely start. I could see Newton winning it if he gets enough rushing yards and touchdowns.

Tris, Patrick Peterson is a much better athlete than Malcolm Jenkins. He's got cornerback speed whereas guys like Antrel Rolle and Jenkins had below average recovery speed for cornerbacks. Arizona just traded DRC, I doubt they'll want to move Peterson from CB. If he's not a good enough athlete/player to stick at corner in the NFL then who is?

[Soup]

Steve, what do you think about Gomes? I'm hearing Gomes a lot during coaches interviews / beat writers. Don't know anything about him

[Going Commando]

Steve, what do you think about Gomes? I'm hearing Gomes a lot during coaches interviews / beat writers. Don't know anything about him

I think he was a remarkable find. I thought he had no chance since he wasn't even a starter in college but he looks like he's going to stick and maybe even become a valuable nickle/dime defensive back down the line.

It's also nice that he can play both CB and FS.

I see him as a nice zone DB that can clearly blitz and offer run support around the box and LoS. I think he's definitely going to make the roster.