Who would you choose if you had a choice? Ramsey, Carr, Harrington?

[Posse81]

Same as 69 Yards--I cannot be objective about this. I'd take Patrick.

[earl]

Ramsey has a better arm, and his actuall IQ is probably better then both combined. how that translates to on field IQ i don't know, but i think it counts for something. Furthermore, ramsey didn't have camp, and still did descent. He is also fearless. i'd go Ramsey no doubt.

[Art]

At the time I think I would have wanted Harrington. Given how much better Ramsey played, especially so when considering the time missed in camp and the greater reliance on the QB in Spurrier's offense, it's hard to not give Ramsey an edge today. He's got a better arm than Harrington and at least as good as Carr. He's smart and has a fast release and has a great pocket presence in terms of shrugging off guys around him and staying focused downfield.

In the end we can hope he's the best of the batch. He was a year ago. Hopefully that'll continue to be the trend .

[codeorama]

Originally posted by Burgold

Code,

I've heard that last argument, but it really isn't true for Ramsey. He didn't play with an offensive group that was tremendously superior, talent-wise. The Redskins o-line including the tackles were horrible at the beginning of the year last year. The entire line was pretty weak and I don't know if they were considerably weaker than Houston or Detroit, but Wilbert and Loverne couldn't be much of an upgrade for those teams. The WR corp never really established itself either. I think you can make a fair comparison of Ramsey, Carr, and Harrington simply on the basis of offense and offensive weapons. Our only weapons were Gardner (who's a really a fine possession receiver, but not a gamer changer yet) and Davis (who was subpar and underutilized). Ramsey, in reality played on an offensive team that required and got a overhaul, pretty much from top to bottom. That he did as well as he did, in spite of the offensive line is a testament to him.

I didn't mean it to come across the way you took it. You can't compare Ramsey's team with Marino's rookie year Fins, no comparison, but I would say that in general, you have to admit the Skins are a better team than either the Lions or Texans.

That's all.

[Die Hard]

After watching Ramsey last year... what more can anybody want from a QB? Even comparing him to Harrington and Carr... he stacks up against them about equally in almost every department (ie. smarts, arm strength, intelligence, heart, a "will" to get better and humility). I think Carr is a bit of a better scrambler than Ramsey.... but that's about all I can think of that seperates Ramsey from the other 2.

I really wasn't all the impressed with Harrington last year with his onfield play. I saw a person with a fiery passion on the sidelines though that I liked.

I don't know what to expect from Carr. Playing on a team like the Texans can stunt a player's growth for 5-7 years. And most players don't get that long to prove themselves worth the contract that Carr signed for. I think it'll take longer to evaluate Carr's career.

[SonnyJ]

The short answer is that I would be happy with any of them.

Ramsey, at this point, is a FAR better value than either of the other two. Given that, I will pick Ramsey every time. Any personnel choice has cap ramifications.

[Burgold]

Yeah, the 'skins as an overall team last year were probably superior, but I still think Ramsey overcame a lot of adversity. The O that was left over from Norv, reshaped by Marty, and then jigsawed by Spurrier was really nothing to make a quarterback smile about last year. Still, as I think Art said, when he came in he somehow made it operate in the top ten his last few games and that was despite batterings, o line problems, and lack of speed playmakers. On the other hand, I kind of like Derrius Thompson and McCants and think they really did perform pretty well for us, so maybe I'm being a little overly hard on last year's talent.

[mardi gras skin]

I'm with Navy Dave. You get a quarterback whose best friend is a top flight tackle that will be protecting him for years...you gotta give him the edge.

I think he's got Farve written all over him...minus the dozen illegitimate kids running around Hattiesburg. :laugh:

[Stricknine]

I remember I wanted Harrington pretty badly. My draf****ching buddy (a Bears fan) and I discussed at length the possibilities of our teams getting him. We also both talked alot about the kid from Tulane. Once Harrington was gone the first round went about exactly how I wanted it to. Never much liked Carr. I remember, already liking Ramsey, being even more sold when listening to Mort and Jaws rave about his abilities and potential.

[Skins26]

I would take Ramsey cause im bias

But Carr is really really good, definitly better than Harrington. I wasnt very impressed with Harrington's decision making when under pressure

[Romberjo]

Close one. At the time, I thought Ramsey was a lot better than most thought, but was a half-step behind Carr and Harrington. I also thought Harrington was only slightly behind Carr -- and was in a minority here, given that many thought he'd still be available at 18, and that we shouldn't take him if he was.

Now, it's pretty much a toss-up, and we got by far the best value, but I have to admit that I'd give a very slight nod to Harrington, but Ramsey is a close second (and Carr a close third).

[bulldog]

1. Ramsey had less time to prepare for the 2002 season yet looked as good at the end of the year if not better than either of the other young quarterbacks.

2. Ramsey is working for pennies on the dollar compared to Carr and Harrington. From a relative value perspective the other two quarterbacks are going to have to put up some damn good numbers to justify the difference in their salaries over time.

3. Ramsey has a history of being 'the franchise'. At Tulane, Ramsey worked without all-America linemen and top flight receivers and backs. He has shown he can make lemonade out of lemons, stand in take the hit and deliver the ball accurately in traffic............

and he has more talent around him now than he has had at any time of his career to date

[W&M]

Don't tell me this is an apples to oranges experiment, because all three QB's had a dearth of talent on the offensive side of the ball. There is no way that the Skins interior line or WR's were any better then the Lions or Texans ... so comparison is warranted ... plus Ramsey held out of camp, giving him less time to catch up.

I think the draft order went about right, but after a full season of play ....

Carr is the potential Dog of the bunch.

Ramsey has the best physical tools and seems the most comfortable standing in the pocket, reading defenses, and slinging it in there like a ****y pro.

But I'd give Harrington the nod as the best QB, just because he seems to have all the intanglibles ... a true player who is better then the sum of his physical parts.

But regardless of how you pick them, when you factor in the salaries, I'm much prefer having Ramsey and his puny contract relative to Harrington and his cap buster ... it's not even close.

Looking back, Ramsey was far and away the better value pick, making him the better one for the franchise.

[Joey T]

What W&M said:

Don't tell me this is an apples to oranges experiment, because all three QB's had a dearth of talent on the offensive side of the ball. There is no way that the Skins interior line or WR's were any better then the Lions or Texans ... so comparison is warranted ... plus Ramsey held out of camp, giving him less time to catch up.

I think the draft order went about right, but after a full season of play ....

Carr is the potential Dog of the bunch.

Ramsey has the best physical tools and seems the most comfortable standing in the pocket, reading defenses, and slinging it in there like a ****y pro.

But I'd give Harrington the nod as the best QB, just because he seems to have all the intanglibles ... a true player who is better then the sum of his physical parts.

But regardless of how you pick them, when you factor in the salaries, I'm much prefer having Ramsey and his puny contract relative to Harrington and his cap buster ... it's not even close.

Looking back, Ramsey was far and away the better value pick, making him the better one for the franchise.

Harrington NEVER looked good in the second half of games last year. Don't know if that was the game plan or his lack of composure. I believe it was the game plan of Morninwheg(sp).

Ramsey had good pocket presence for the most part and took a ton of hits. I just hope he doesn't turn out like our veteran backup QB with the strong arm from USC, who is known for taking sacks during his career.:gus:

[brandies]

Geez, this topic is still going. Remind me not to get drunk again and post a poll. :laugh:

[OrangeSkin]

Since its hard to distinguish their respective performances, I'll say Ramsey because he's a real man.

Harrington is kind of fruity, and Carr is whipped (he wears his damn wedding band DURING GAMES).

[DIESEL TROLL]

I'd take Ramsey simply for having more experience in the Spurrier system. Would also keep Harrington.....could be excellent backup with the correct "grooming.";)

[The Consigliere]

At the time of the draft I had Harrington rated #1, and Carr #2 with Ramsey as a good value at slot 24 or thereabouts. The great thing right now is that one can't see a bit of difference in franchise QB value between the three. In fact there is more reason to rank Ramsey #1 than either Carr, or Harrington right now (showed more as a rookie in terms of production, poise, leadership, and in the ability to cope w/adversity although Carr is damn close).

We won't really know until about February 2005 who likely will be the gem of the class, but what I like is that all three of them have shown a lot more than any previous QB class in the past decade w/the possible exception of '99 ('99 had two stalwarts in McNabb (who I was not at all high on. Ooops), and Culpepper (who I was very, very high on), and two flops in Smith and McNown, and a mediocrity in Couch, and a fader in King). I still love all three of these guys as franchise QB's, although Harrington has had little to work w/and still needs help on offense to succeed. We'll see, but right now I'm quite happy with Ramsey.

[Boy2Der]

I was wonderin did anyone else other than myself noticed that in last years draft the three teams that picked a Qb with there first pick the Texans, Lions, and Redskins all picked a wideout with there first pick this year.

Which pair do you think will be better?

Joey Harrington-Charles Rogers

David Carr-Andre Johnson

Patrick Ramsey-Taylor Jacobs

[scottb]

Good question Boy2Der, but it's a season too early and needs it own thread.

[The Consigliere]

Rogers, definitely Rogers. I heard some ESPN guys chatting on the radio during the draft, saying that the consensus by virtually all the personel men, was that AJ was the best WR in the draft, and I found that quite surprising.

I think AJ can do some things that Rogers, can't and is certainly a better intermediate route target, particularly when it comes to routes in the middle of the field. Still, I think Rogers has a fundamental feel for the position, and hands and explosivness that are lacking with AJ. AJ has nearly all the measurables you want, and the heart and the fire, but he simply isn't the same kind of consistent pass catcher that Rogers is.

As much as I like Jacobs, I don't see him becoming a Chambers or a Gardner to D. Terrell a la '01. I just don't see that same talent there. We knew that Chambers was hugely explosive at Wisconsin as a deep threat, the questions about him, concerned his hands, his route running and his ability to run a greater variety of routes, questions still unanswered at this point. In regards to Gardner, his game was size, and decent speed and great hands. While the hands were missing two years ago, they showed up this past season and he's really come to take advantage of his size and strength. Jacobs is not a size threat, and doesn't have the same explosiveness or ability to break tackles that both Rogers and AJ have. He is a more fundamentally consistent WR when it comes to route running and the mechanics of the position, so it wouldn't surprise me if he looked better than one or both of them this fall. But by 2005, he should certainly not be better than either of them. Still, he's a wonderful asset for the team to have, and a much more valuable acquisition at 44 than Doss would have been (and there are lots of questions about Doss's ability to make it at the next level, not so in regards to Jacobs, the only concerns w/him regard the college he went to).

[Skinster]

Ramsey has all the tools the other QB's have & more!! One thing stands out in my mind is his pocket presence.... to handle the NFL's speed & having a less than average O'line he showed amazing ability & awareness!!

Its hard for me not to be biased, but Ramsey really shows more potential for future success.

Got my # 11 Ramsey Jersey in Da mail TODAY!!!! :notworthy

Skinster!!

Skin 4 Life

[BayouBrave86]

It is a pretty close choice between Ramsey and Harrington. But I would have to give the nod to Ramsey, because his pocket presence as a rookie was great. Harrington was a fun QB to watch during the year, I remember Fox switching to a couple of Lions games when the Lions were attempting a comeback and it was fun to see Harrington lead his team to victory a couple of times. But then there is Ramsey, his ability to step in against the Titans early in the season told me this kid was going to be special. I know the Titans weren't playing their best ball of the season at that time, but they only lost what? 1-2 more games after that game? Ramsey lit them up and in his final 2 games he showed more promise to me. I am indeed excited about Ramsey and can't wait to see how he does this year. Oh and did anyone else have a huge grin on their face when hearing Jansen and Ramsey were becoming best friends? Now that is good news to hear!

[yank]

Originally posted by The Consigliere

... Jacobs is not a size threat, and doesn't have the same explosiveness or ability to break tackles that both Rogers and AJ have. He is a more fundamentally consistent WR when it comes to route running and the mechanics of the position, so it wouldn't surprise me if he looked better than one or both of them this fall. But by 2005, he should certainly not be better than either of them...

Sounds like a kid named Marvin Harrison coming out of the draft ...

[phantom]

I would have definitely taken Joey Harrington. Sure, Carr and Ramsey also have NFL arms and toughness but it's Harrington's intangibles that really stand out for me.

Leadership, confidence in one's own abilities and smarts are more to a QB than anything else. PLUS, in college, Harrington had shown the ability to lead his team from behind on MANY occassions.