skinfan133 Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/12/02/walmart.trampling.suit/index.html NEW YORK (CNN) -- Two customers are suing Wal-Mart for negligence after being injured in a mad rush for post-Thanksgiving bargains that left one store employee dead, the men's attorney said Tuesday. Temporary Wal-Mart worker Jdimytai Damour, 34, was crushed to death as he and other employees attempted to unlock the doors of a store on Long Island at 5 a.m. Friday. Attorney Kenneth Mollins said Fritz Mesadieu and Jonathan Mesadieu were "literally carried from their position outside the store" and are now "suffering from pain in their neck and their back from being caught in that surge of people" that rushed into the Wal-Mart. New York Newsday reported that the Mesadieus are father and son, ages 51 and 19. The lawsuit alleges that the Mesadieus' injuries were a result of "carelessness, recklessness, negligence." In a claim against the Nassau County police department, the men also contend that they "sustained monetary losses as a result of health care and legal expenses ... in the sum of $2 million." "This is a tragic situation that could have and should have been avoided with the exercise of reasonable care. There are very simple measures that could have been put in place to avoid this, such as barriers along the line to spread people out, extra security and a better police presence," Mollins said. ------ I don't know if anyone else is following this, but this is absolutley rediculous. I can't even describe how incredible this **** is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[[ghost]] Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 The family of that guy who died should sue the hell out of Wal Mart. And get every penny they demand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan133 Posted December 2, 2008 Author Share Posted December 2, 2008 ];5889376']The family of that guy who died should sue the hell out of Wal Mart. And get every penny they demand. agree 100%. the people (like these guys in the article) who were in the stanpede should have no legal ground to sue wal-mart. much less sue them for 2 million dollars over some bruises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Evil Genius Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 agree 100%. the people (like these guys in the article) who were in the stanpede should have no legal ground to sue wal-mart. much less sue them for 2 million dollars over some bruises. That's the same as saying they shouldn't sue because the ceiling caved in on them while shopping. Or because they slipped on a spilled item in the store. Stores do have the responsibility of providing a safe place to shop. And I would imagine crowd control falls under than realm. While I don't agree with the lawsuit, I can see that it might have merit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman#21 Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 The only person who should sue is the familt of the worker who died no one else, scary thing too is i was gonna go to that mall in green acres (Valley Stream) but i changed my mind at the last minute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoony Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 Shocked I tell you - Wal Mart half-assing it again, flying by the seat of their pants, doing the minimum to get by, and it ends up costing them more than if they just do it correctly to begin with. ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan133 Posted December 2, 2008 Author Share Posted December 2, 2008 That's the same as saying they shouldn't sue because the ceiling caved in on them while shopping. Or because they slipped on a spilled item in the store. Stores do have the responsibility of providing a safe place to shop. And I would imagine crowd control falls under than realm.While I don't agree with the lawsuit, I can see that it might have merit. If you're part of a mob, I'm pretty sure you're guilty by association in starting it. the customers created the dangerous situation, not wal-mart. if anything, the worker's family should sue wal-mart for failing to give him the proper employee backup. as I understand it was him and a few other employees against 500 greedy, angry shoppers.I hate wal-mart with every ounce of my being btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinfan133 Posted December 2, 2008 Author Share Posted December 2, 2008 http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/11/28/AR2008112802455.html NEW YORK, Nov. 28 -- A Wal-Mart worker was killed Friday after "out-of-control" shoppers desperate for bargains broke down the doors at a 5 a.m. sale. Other workers were trampled as they tried to rescue the man, and customers shouted angrily and kept shopping when store officials said they were closing because of the death, police and witnesses said. At least four other people, including a woman eight months pregnant, were taken to hospitals for observation or minor injuries, and the store in Valley Stream on Long Island was closed for several hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panel Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 Wal Mart is rich, so they are going to be the ones targeted, which isn't fair, because they didn't kill anyone, these crazy shoppers did. The individual shoppers should be held responsable. Even though it may be impossible to track these people down, you can't just point your finger at where you can find that was near by with a lot of money. Why would wal mart be at fault, because they should have known that their bargins are so good that it would naturally cause a rush of 500 crazy people. Things like this are unpredictable. Just as if he was hit by a car in the crazy parking lot while trying to orginize shopping carts, wal mart should not be at fault for not forseeing this and building out pervenitive measures, the guy who hit him should be at fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 I disagree that the only people that should sue are the family of guard. I'm sure some of the people in line weren't trying to part of a stampede. Didn't the security guard die because he was trying to protect a pregnant woman? If the woman got hurt she shouldn't be able to sue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 Wal Mart is rich, so they are going to be the ones targeted, which isn't fair, because they didn't kill anyone, these crazy shoppers did. The individual shoppers should be held responsable. Even though it may be impossible to track these people down, you can't just point your finger at where you can find that was near by with a lot of money. Why would wal mart be at fault, because they should have known that their bargins are so good that it would naturally cause a rush of 500 crazy people. Things like this are unpredictable. Just as if he was hit by a car in the crazy parking lot while trying to orginize shopping carts, wal mart should not be at fault for not forseeing this and building out pervenitive measures, the guy who hit him should be at fault. Bingo this is not Wal-Marts fault, if people would behave like adults then no one would have gotten hurt. This is all on the people in the line. I would be shocked if anything comes from this bogus lawsuite. This happens in other stores across the country but you didn't hear anything bad like this. NY people what can you say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panel Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 I disagree that the only people that should sue are the family of guard. I'm sure some of the people in line weren't trying to part of a stampede. Didn't the security guard die because he was trying to protect a pregnant woman? If the woman got hurt she shouldn't be able to sue? Not wal mart, the people that hurt her are the people that should be responsable. What if instead of being killed by people walking and stomping over him, he was killed by customers that came in to shoot up the place, should wal mart also be held responsible for them, and if not, why? Is the difference the fact that the coustomers didn't mean any harm when they stampeeded people, so the store should be at fault? What if I had a party at my house, and more people that I expected showed up, and someone died at my house, should I as home owner be at fault? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted December 2, 2008 Share Posted December 2, 2008 It's pretty simple really. Two years ago our daughter waited in line at Circiut City on Black Friday so we could get a few of the hot items. One being a laptop and the other a digital camera. They only had so many of each. They had an employee walk up the line asking each customer what they were there for. Theyhanded out vouchers for those limited items and when people realized they were gone before the doors opened they either left or shopped for other items. There was no stampede and people walked in calmly when the doors opened because of their precautionary measures. Walmart wouldn't take the same precautions because they wouldn't want to scare away customers and would rather be the greedy ****s that they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Not wal mart, the people that hurt her are the people that should be responsable.What if instead of being killed by people walking and stomping over him, he was killed by customers that came in to shoot up the place, should wal mart also be held responsible for them, and if not, why? Is the difference the fact that the coustomers didn't mean any harm when they stampeeded people, so the store should be at fault? What if I had a party at my house, and more people that I expected showed up, and someone died at my house, should I as home owner be at fault? The store could prevent people from physically ripping apart their doors and stampeding. Maybe more security, maybe having a better system like the post earlier suggested. You can't sue the people who did the stampeding for the same reason you can't arrest them. It's hard to know who to sue unless someone was wearing customized shoes with their name, address, and social security number on the bottom and left a imprint on your face. You won't see me getting mad if people want to sue a mega corp like Wal Mart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81artmonk Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 So people who acted like stupid idiots by rushing into Walmart injured two men and KILLED one man, and it's walmarts fault?? This is real simple, you cannot control stupidity. To expect Walmart to do so is not only ridiculous but just plain stupid!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoony Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 You guys are missing the point- if Wal Mart had provided the proper security and managed their facilities properly, this would not have happened. As usual though, they have 1 part time 80 year old standing up front with a hi-lighter. That's their idea of facilities management. Maybe the people suing will somehow get them to clean up their ****ty parking lots once a month or so. That would be nice too. ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 So people who acted like stupid idiots by rushing into Walmart injured two men and KILLED one man, and it's walmarts fault?? This is real simple, you cannot control stupidity. To expect Walmart to do so is not only ridiculous but just plain stupid!! Are you serious? You mean to tell me it's too much for one of the richest companies in the world to add extra security and take the necessary steps to prevent these type of things from happening. Not to mention that there's been a history of these incidents and therefore they should have been prepared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOF44 Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 WalMart set up the conditions that fed the events of that morning. There have been fights and altercations in these exact types of situations in the past. So there is a prior knowledge of violence in these types of settings. There are plans in use by other stores to avoid this from happening. WalMart did nothing after setting up the conditions that morning to help control the frenzied crowd they knew they would draw. I see them as culpable in the events that took place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbeals Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 are you serious???? I mean, i know Walmart should have better prepared for it, but how much control can you have over a stampede of people?? No matter how confined you get people it didnt really sound like it would have done much. I do say that the stampeded worker's family should be the only one allowed to sue...the rest of the people, if they were hurt, probably deserved it if they were up there in the stampede anyways Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOF44 Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 are you serious???? I mean, i know Walmart should have better prepared for it, but how much control can you have over a stampede of people?? No matter how confined you get people it didnt really sound like it would have done much. I do say that the stampeded worker's family should be the only one allowed to sue...the rest of the people, if they were hurt, probably deserved it if they were up there in the stampede anyways Did you read the thread? KingGibbs outlined how you set up an operation like this to avoid the stampede, as done by Circuit City. Simple measures really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron78 Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Why don't you sue the ****heads who killed a guy to save $25? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsHokieFan Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 In talking to some people, it is very clear WalMart 100 percent failed, not the shoppers There were many big problems with that Walmart Store. I'll post what I saw on another messageboard Pressure builds up in a crowd, physical and emotional pressure. If you're hosting an event that's going to draw a large crowd it behooves you to exercise safe crowd control procedures. The very first thing that should have happened was to control access to the door. You can't have 2000 people pointed straight on at a damn door. You have to route the people through a series of pathways made with portable fencing or stanchions. See in the diagram that using this kind of system alleviates the pressure of people from behind shoving forward towards the door? The red arrows show the path in. The blue arrows show the path out. As soon as the swell of shoppers has passed you can remove these temporary barriers and everything goes back to normal. (The little black dots at the bottom of the rectangle represent the doorway and the black lines represent barriers) As you can see the barriers don't need to weave through the whole parking lot - just a few rows will stop unwanted forward momentum and the rest of the line can form more casually. And yes - I did say line. No more than two abreast, and in fact I usually say I want single file and then let people "get away" with two abreast.The little green guys represent security - which can be any combination of store security staff, off duty police officers hired for the event, or store managers. They need to have walkie talkie communication and the outside security should be outside well before the doors open. At least an hour before, but best practice is as soon as the line starts to form. The outside staff talks to the crowd and kinda "works the line" - making sure everyone is in a good mood, is calm, is feeling okay. You don't let people stand around getting nervous and fixated. You play nursemaid, comedian and friend as well as authority. You let people know that there's not going to be any line jumping. That anyone pushing or shoving ain't gonna make their purchase even if they're first to get to it. If you notice any loudmouths talking about how they're going to get their widget and perhaps making the other people in line feel apprehensive you squash that **** right away and remind everyone that they're going to be treated respectfully and we're going to get everyone in in a calm and orderly fashion. Have you seen the Dog Whisperer? Calm submissive? That's how you want your crowd. You don't want them fixated. If someone is looking too tense you make some casual conversation - "where you from?", "what time did you get here?", "how was your holiday?" I don't know who put up that "Blitz Line Starts Here" sign, but that was a BIG mistake. If properly trained security was outside that wouldn't have been there. If a store employee put that sign up he can probably kiss his ass goodbye. Another thing I've seen in other Walmart videos is shoppers running through the doors with shopping carts. WTF!?!? NOBODY on line should have been permitted to have a cart upon entering. NOBODY! The carts should have been dispersed throughout the store so people could pick them up at different points without creating a situation at a central indoor cart corral. I know this post is long, but I wanted to be clear in explaining what I know. In 20 years I've never been involved in an event that didn't go off as planned - and no one has ever been injured. Walmart however consistently and deliberately ignores proper crowd control procedures. Every Black Friday and every major game system release brings "rioting" at Walmart cause Walmart enjoys the free publicity and hype when it makes the news. They have operated for years with total disregard for their customers and their employees. I hope they pay for this one and pay dearly. Also - to those that are blaming the shoppers - please don't. In my opinion, from what I've seen and read so far, the worst I can judge them for are being the kind of people who would stand in line all night to get into a Walmart. I don't believe anyone CHOSE their holiday purchase over someone elses life. Individually you probably wouldn't find a single soul in that crowd that would have knowingly or willingly participated in someones death. They were permitted to ferment into a competitive mob fixated on their goal. The people pushing from the back had no idea that they were pushing people onto someone who had been knocked down. The people being pushed over him had no power to stop the mob pushing them forward. And even the people who became fleetingly aware that someone was down probably didn't appreciate the seriousness of the situation or that they could have done anything to assist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaxskinsville Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 There will be so many lawsuits from this. Not only will people who were there, like those two guys, claim damages but, also, opportunists who weren't anywhere near there try to cash in. Such is life in our "Grandma spills coffee on herself and sues McDonalds and burgler falls through skylight and sues school " society that we have created. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slacky McSlackAss Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Walmart definitely approached this wrong. I work at Sears in the Electronics department at Sears and we hired extra security for the day. We also had to deal with a rush of people, but we kept it orderly at the same time. Then again, it is Walmart after all. :doh: They deserve to get sued for this. Their lack of organization and safety killed one man and couldve severely injured MANY MANY more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renaissance Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 While I agree that Wal-Mart was completely irresponsible in this instance, I have to ask: at what point is it up to individuals to decide to remove themselves from that kind of situation? Seriously. You get to Wal-Mart at 3am to stand in line for a $400 TV. The crowd is obviously starting to build up and there is no order or line or anything. You know they're going to open to the doors at some point and everyone else in that crowd is after the same deals as you. What the **** do you think is going to happen? Nobody can convince me that the people in that crowd didn't realize they were in for a giant cluster-****. IMO the only people who might have a justified argument against Wal-Mart would be the family of the employee who died opening the doors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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