jthor99 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Because a great playcaller calls things to counteract an overagrresive defense. Zorn kept things remarkably basic last night. Stretch runs, pump fake draws, 3 step drops. That was pretty much all that was run all night. No reverses, no tosses, 1 screen. Everything he called last night is on tape for everyone to disect. When was the last time we ran a reverse this season? Fred Davis..and we saw how well that turned out. I'm not sure if some of you exactly understand what Pittsburgh was doing to us last night. There were dropping a cover-2 to cover the deep pass, and they were also blitzing LB on the edge and zoneing out with there other 2 LB for check down plays. Our OL was allowing the pocket collapse often times by a simple 3 or 4 man rush. Protection is everything. Don't you think Zorn took that into consideration in his playcalling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood1127 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 And I think more gadget plays to score would work for the Redskins. They confuse the other team when they see the ball go one way and then fly another way and then get launched down the field at a lonely man in the corner. To me, those are the better plays that the Redskins should be calling. We would be able to beat out a lot of teams if we practiced more gadget plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelHack Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Just a bit of trivia here, but Lebeau created the 3-4 zone blitz scheme to counter the WC offense that Bill Walsh had recently started. HACK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jthor99 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 And I think more gadget plays to score would work for the Redskins. They confuse the other team when they see the ball go one way and then fly another way and then get launched down the field at a lonely man in the corner. To me, those are the better plays that the Redskins should be calling. We would be able to beat out a lot of teams if we practiced more gadget plays. If you cannot establish a base offense then how in the heck is a gadet play going to confuse another team? I guarantee you if Randel El would of came around for a reverse handoff last night the Pittsburgh Steelers would of been all over him. Gadget plays are to be called when an offense is establishing their scheme. It's not to be used as some type of last resort, or panic button notion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saqs Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Just a bit of trivia here, but Lebeau created the 3-4 zone blitz scheme to counter the WC offense that Bill Walsh had recently started.HACK And remember he shut down this offense a couple years ago in the Super Bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jileib Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 JZ is beginning to lose his nerve as a coach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood1127 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 In ways it can be used as a panic button. It just has to be executed the right way. That means understand where and when you are during the play. No misdirection can be tolerated during a gadget play. If you ask me its all these standard plays that are getting the Redskins killed offensively. People can read when we need to make a big pass, which happened last night when the Redskins were running out of time and we needed to make a play. Normally we want to be able to fool the D-line so that we can fake from a running play to a passing play and vise versa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins4SB Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I personally think we got away from the run too early. While we weren't getting the usual chunks of yardage we have come to expect, it would have still been somewhat effective and helped the passing game. I'm also disappointed we didn't see any screens to Cooley and Portis against a blitzing defense like the Steelers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood1127 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I personally think we got away from the run too early. While we weren't getting the usual chunks of yardage we have come to expect, it would have still been somewhat effective and helped the passing game.I'm also disappointed we didn't see any screens to Cooley and Portis against a blitzing defense like the Steelers. I have to agree with Skins4SB. There should have been more screens. Thats something that I think the Steelers would have had a tough time reading. We needed them when they kept blitzing up the middle and knocking Campbell to the ground. Why the O-line could not block for him I don't know. On second thought let me take that back. There was a lot of misunderstanding when the Redskins were on offense in the second half. A lot of the O-line men were trying to send Campbell as message that they were going to negate the block and run out for a quick pass of 5 or 10 yard but Campbell could not read that for some reason. I knew thats what the O-line men were trying to do before Campbell got sack again last night at the end of the game. Campbell should have taken the quick drop back and hit the wide open to the left which would have clearly gave us a run for a touchdown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jthor99 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I personally think we got away from the run too early. While we weren't getting the usual chunks of yardage we have come to expect, it would have still been somewhat effective and helped the passing game.I'm also disappointed we didn't see any screens to Cooley and Portis against a blitzing defense like the Steelers. I agree. That was my one complaint about last night. I was actually expecting to see some screens to Cooley since they were so effecitve in the weeks prior. I believe Zorn had them in the gameplan, but changed when Zorn figured out that his Tackles were getting abused. At which time we altered his gameplan and made Cooley block more then anything. As I mentioned it's honestly hard to opinionate on Zorn's playcalling with the OL never allowed the execution of his call to take place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hollywood1127 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 He is correct. All we can hope for is that we come good off the bye week and beat Dallas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinzFoLife Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 So how is the Coach beating Zorn when the rush 4 Dlinemen and they beat our 5 O-linemen with a running back helping with blocking? That was no coaching, that was getting beat man on man. Half the blitzes were from a straight rush, no blitzing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntotoro Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I agree. Is it that big of a surprise when arguably the top D-coordinator in the league (or at least top 3) out-coaches a rookie play caller? I think people have been seeing "6-2" as well as how we beat Philly & Dallas and are forgetting Zorn is new at playcalling. He got beaten by one of the best in the business over a great amount of time. There's no shame in that and hopefully he'll learn from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benskins26 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Man' date=' I hope you're right. I know it was Pittsburgh and all but this offense has been worrying me for a while. I just hope the nice 1st half record doesn't become all for not. I don't know how I would handle this team collapsing.[/quote']that would be as devastating as someone running over my dog. It would be devestating Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimm Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I think people have been seeing "6-2" as well as how we beat Philly & Dallas and are forgetting Zorn is new at playcalling. He got beaten by one of the best in the business over a great amount of time. There's no shame in that and hopefully he'll learn from it. Good post, people need to remember that Zorn is very new at this and will get out-coached at times, as long as he learns from it he will be out-coaching people soon enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Nice comparison to the Giants game by the OP. Ironic how the same gripes people are making now to try and cast the team off were used in week 1. I guess some of you missed the 6-1 record in between those two games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hiswadeness Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Lets hope Zorn learns from this, and stays medium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsInFebruary Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I think people have been seeing "6-2" as well as how we beat Philly & Dallas and are forgetting Zorn is new at playcalling. He got beaten by one of the best in the business over a great amount of time. There's no shame in that and hopefully he'll learn from it. I think maybe Zorn has been benefitting from being an unknown but now teams are figuring out patterns and tendencies and have zeroed in on ways to stop our offense. Hope I'm wrong and Zorn can coach his way out of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 I think people have been seeing "6-2" as well as how we beat Philly & Dallas and are forgetting Zorn is new at playcalling. He got beaten by one of the best in the business over a great amount of time. There's no shame in that and hopefully he'll learn from it. Zorn is new to playcalling, but that doesn't change that IMO he got outcoached. The 2 games where we faced a defense that blitzes and mixes coverages we've struggled. Jason should take some of the blame, he was off target early on and it cost us when he missed ARE coming across the field: 3-5-PIT 25 (11:12) (Shotgun) J.Campbell pass incomplete short middle to A.Randle El (T.Polamalu). But, after that Jason settled down somewhat but it didn't seem there were many open receivers especially on third down. Zorn's playcalling was baffling to me this game. The passing game was struggling. The offensive line was having issues, Moss was hurt, Jason wasn't comfortable and Zorn hinted in the presser that the receivers weren't running precise enough routes to get open.(Probably Devin) With Pittsburgh's DBs playing off coverage why didn't he run any screens? They worked against man coverage against the Saints and Cards it should have been easier against off the Steeler's off coverage. I think if we're gonna compete for the division the Zorn and Campbell must improve in the passing game. They got to be able to muster something against a good defense like the Steelers. They were completely shut down in the passing game (3-15 on third down). I think, i know we have enough weapons to put up a better showing. Even if its not screens Zorn has got to find something that works for Jason despite how the offensive line is playing. You know what? I think he will. :2cents: HTTR! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shakinaiken Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 i dont understand how nobody could see this coming... i've been saying for weeks that Zorn is a mediocre playcaller, he just is. i of course got my head taken off by everyone on this board when i first introduced this idea a few weeks ago, so i've kept quiet... we could only muster 17 points against a horrible rams defense that was missing half their secondary, 14 against cleveland, and 25 against maybe the worst defense in the league in the lions, and one of those td's was a special teams td. luckily for him, the running game has been working. what happens when opposing teams stack 8 in the box? or 9? answer: we lose... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Voice_of_Reason Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 I completely agree that Zorn was out coached, and he wasn't the first play caller and won't be the last to be out coached by Dick Lebeau. Look, Zorn's called plays in exactly 9 games. He's still learning also. EVERYTHING is going to take some time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenMgr Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 i dont understand how nobody could see this coming... i've been saying for weeks that Zorn is a mediocre playcaller, he just is. i of course got my head taken off by everyone on this board when i first introduced this idea a few weeks ago, so i've kept quiet... we could only muster 17 points against a horrible rams defense that was missing half their secondary, 14 against cleveland, and 25 against maybe the worst defense in the league in the rams, and one of those td's was a special teams td. luckily for him, the running game has been working. what happens when opposing teams stack 8 in the box? or 9? answer: we lose... I agree with this, however, Zorn is currently short-handed at receiver with an injured Moss and no contributions from the rookies. I expect that during the bye, VC and Zorn will be scouring the wires for a veteran receiver to help take the load off Moss, especially if Kelly's knee doesn't improve. A trade may be possible that no one saw coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wysknz1 Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 This team cannot score touchdowns plain and simple. We can work the ball from 20 to 20 (except for this game) and once we hit the red zone' date=' I have no confidence in them being able to punch it in and that starts with play calling. No reverses, no counters, no shovel passes (which could have beaten a very aggressive and ball hawking defense like Pittsburgh's), 1 screen pass (which worked for 15+ yards), no half back pass attempts...not one damn thing to try and throw the Steelers defense off balance. The play calling was so bland I can't believe I forced myself to watch the entire game. We played into their hands. And the play calling has been abysmal going back to the Rams game. quote'] Send your resume to Danny. I'm sure he's looking for a new head coach after that loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phatboy41 Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 Zorn is a first year guy and being 6-3 is pretty nice considering the first half of our schedule. I give him high praise for that. He went up against a great team/defensive coordinator/head coach in the Steelers. Not to mention, our team was outplayed on all 3 phases of the game. Sure we came out swinging, but our offense couldn't convert any first downs and our defense was getting worn out and had to send all linebackers and all lineman at BR just to generate pressure. And, our offensive line is not good. All these people got high on Jansen after the Cowboys game and all he has done thus far is run block well and absolutely horribly utterly suck in pass protection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texasthunder Posted November 5, 2008 Share Posted November 5, 2008 Sorry- I dont believe Zorn got out coached- I believe the team did not execute. Weather they were tired, dinged up or mentally exhausted, the players flat out, got out played. Its the NFL that stuff happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.