How would you fix the hole at WR??

[jfactor]

I love how some of you act like a 1st round WR draft pick is some type of sure thing.

I hear ya on this. All too often the first rounders don't live up to the hype. Someone mentioned too about drafting a young guy who will "be here awhile." Not so. These guys usually sign a 4 year deal and don't (if at all) break out until the 4th year. And if they breakout before then, they want to renegotiate to receive "fair market value." Roll the dice with 85 or Roy Williams, Fitzgerald. A proven dude as opposed to potential. The window to win is small in the NFL so if you are in top tier (the playoffs) you play for NOW instead of the FUTURE. The Giants won the super bowl. 3 weeks before the playoffs we went to their house and slapped them around. We blew the game against them earlier in the season, as we did in several other games against playoff teams (green bay, dallas, tampa bay). This tells me that we are not that far off. SO, get the immediate fix now before the window starts to close. Worry about the future in the future, that is essentially what the mindset in the NFL has come to.

A few other random thoughts. I hate hearing the phrases "qb of the future" and "fair market value." The QB that comes out of college making more than anybody on the team should never sit out a year holding a clipboard. If so, give a small signing bonus and load the base salary in the second year of the contract. Basically, you pay him so play him.

Fair market value is something you hear from the players wanting the big payday. Let's use Nate Clements as an example. Last year he received a huge contract and didn't play up to it. The team did not receive fair market value in terms of the level of his play. Therefore, he should willingly give up a percentage of his salary for not playing up to the level that he should have based on the numbers in his contract. Furtermore, where is the fair market value for the fans who highly over pay for a parking space that is free all during the other 40 weeks out of the year. Where is the fair market value for the fans who buy $8 beers at the game?

[KCJDLJ]

That IMO is the worst option. Trading a 1st for Chad or Roy lands you a known commodity. Drafting a WR in Round 1 to me is a waste. Use your 1st rounder on premium positions like DE and Corner....

I agree that The Redskins should use the 1st and 2nd on DL or maybe CB. But if they do that they can't trade for either receiver because either would most likely cost this years 1st rounder and maybe some to boot. Which path should be taken? I say use this years picks on defense and find a free agent receiver who's had WC offense experience. Dosen't need to be a top 5 receiver. Philly, Denver, Tampa Bay and Seattle have all done very well with average receivers.

[Veretax]

Good point.

Keep in mind, everyone that neither of our current starting WRs are big enough to be thought of as "West Coast Offense" WRs. I'm not saying they CAN'T do the job. I'm just saying this scheme prefers bigs.

The height isn't the problem, its their lack of catching that has me worried. I posted earlier this week, very few of the teams you think of when you say WCO have a really BIG WR that they play alot and produces.

I'm not arguing that I wouldn't like a WR like Plaxico Burres, TO, or Chad, I'm just saying that other teams (see the Packers), do a lot without any really big WR threats (most are 6'1 or shorter) Check out these stats:

WRs by Team

2007 Stats

Phily: (Tallest WR Basket 6'4)

Jason Avant 6-0 212 lbs 23 rec 267yds

Hank Baskett 6-4 220 lbs 16 Rec 142Yds

Reggie Brown 6-1 197 lbs 61 Rec 780 Yds

Kevin Curtis 6-0 186 lbs 71 Rec 1110 Yds

Michale Gasperson 6-4 220 lbs (Did not play) - Rookie

Greg Lewis 6-0 180 13 rec 265 yds (Disappeared in a lot of games)

Bill Sampy 5-11 192 lbs (Did not play)

Green Bay (Tallest WR Ruvell Martin)

Shaun Bodiford 5-11 186 lbs 1 Rec 13 Yds (was on IR I believe)

Donald Driver 6-0 190 lbs 82 Rec 1048 Yds

Carlyle Holiday 6-2 217 lbs (Was on IR for most of the season and never played in 2007)

Greg Jennings 5-11 197 lbs 53 Rec 920 Yds

James Jones 6-1 207 lbs 47 Rec 676

Ruvell Martin 6-4 210 lbs 16 Rec 242 Yds (Didn't have the most snaps cause he wasn't Green Bay's best Receiver, so I can forgive his limited production, but he did make an average of a catch a game he did play in)

Koren Robinson 6-1 205 lbs 21 Rec 241 Yds (Was suspsended early in the season, but made the most of his touches after Week 9, but again not a huge WR)

Seahawks (Tallest WR DJ Hackett)

Deion Branch 5-9 192 lbs 49 Rec 661 Yds

Nate Burleson 6-0 198 lbs 50 Rec 694 Yds

Bobby Engram 5-10 192 lbs 94 Rec 1147 Yds

D.J. Hackett 6-2 208 lbs 32 Rec 384 Yds

Ben Obomanu 6-0 206 lbs 12 Rec 180 Yds

Logan Payne 6-2 205 lbs (Did Not Play)

Courtney Taylor 6-1 205 lbs 5 Rec 38 Yds (not much playing time)

So my Conclusion, you need WRs who can catch the ball consistently. Which means if Moss or ARE aren't going to catch what's thrown at them, they will be gone and replaced with someone who wants to make catches. That's my anaylsis of the WR position for WCO.

Another Example, the 1996 Packer team that defeated the New England Patriots in the Super Bowl Their Wide Receivers were

Beebe, Don 5-11 185 lbs 39 Rec 699 Yards

Freeman, Antonio 6-0 187 lbs 56 Rec 933 Yards

Howard, Desmond 5-10 180 lbs 13 Rec 95 Yards

Mayes, Derrick 6-1 200 lbs 6 Rec 46 Yards

Mickens, Terry 6-1 198 lbs Terry Mickens 18 Rec 161 Yards

Rison, Andre 6-1 188 lbs Andre Rison 13 Rec 135 Yards

(And Robert Brooks who was also 6-1) 23 Rec 344 Yards

That may be shocking to you, but consider this, the tight ends:

Jackson, Keith 6-2 258 lbs 40 Rec 505 Yards

Chmura, Mark 6-5 250 lbs 28 Rec 370 Yards

Thomason, Jeff 6-4 250 lbs 3 Rec 45 Yards

That still may not seem like a lot of yards, the two running backs:

Dorsey Levens 121 Carries 566 Yards 5 TDs

Edgar Bennett 222 Carries 899 Yards 2 TDs

So that's a LOT of carries for the Running backs and decent yardage

Incidentally both also caught a few passes:

Levens: 31 Rec 226 Yards

Bennet 31 Rec 176 Yards

This my point, running is just as important in the WCO as it is in any offense. the WCO Thrives when you have a number of quality receivers all who can catch the ball well. We had POOR pass catching last year. Some of it was JCs fault but a number of them were balls that should have been held on to.

That's my point, we need a hands guy that catches everything from a steak to a dump truck thrown at him, way more then we need a 6'6 WR.

I'm not saying that height wouldn't be great to have in a WR, I'm saying Hands >>>>>>>>> Height. (look at Steve Smith for example.)

[gorebd82]

I was all on the Chad bandwagon...until I heard a 1st and a 3rd. If we're gonna pay that kinda price, then we should look at other options. I thought we could get him at an undervalued price.

In this case, I would much rather do what it takes to get Fitzgerald. He's 24 and a monster. The reason he's even available is that he's played so well that he's hit almost all of the escalator clauses in his contract and has a bloated cap figure.

If we're gonna give up high picks and a big contract for a top tier receiver, then it should be a young Fitzgerald.

[Veretax]

I was all on the Chad bandwagon...until I heard a 1st and a 3rd. If we're gonna pay that kinda price, then we should look at other options. I thought we could get him at an undervalued price.

In this case, I would much rather do what it takes to get Fitzgerald. He's 24 and a monster. The reason he's even available is that he's played so well that he's hit almost all of the escalator clauses in his contract and has a bloated cap figure.

If we're gonna give up high picks and a big contract for a top tier receiver, then it should be a young Fitzgerald.

The only way I give up a 1st and a 3rd is if we get their 2nd in the deal. (About a 587 pt value placed on Chad in the end)

[rwleshin]

I would draft (hoping he would be available) James Hardy, or DJ Hall.

I don't know a whole lot about Hardy but noticed he was 6'7 and runs a 4.55 40. Any chance he is available second round for us? And is he worth it?

[Wyndorf25]

If the Skins were going to make a trade for a WR, I would prefer Chad. However, from what Ive been hearing it would take the 1st and 3rd round picks to get him (assuming picks are the only ingredient to the trade).

If it came down to taking a WR at #21 in the first round or trade that pick (and nothing more) to Detroit for Williams--I would do that.

[TheItalianStallion]

Bring back 50/50!

Or not.

[turbodiesel#44]

If it came down to taking a WR at #21 in the first round or trade that pick (and nothing more) to Detroit for Williams--I would do that.

I would do that too. WR is the one postition outside QB that is often just a draft gamble. And kicker too, but that doesn't count. Williams would be a good move for the Skins for our #1. Chad Johnson would not be a good move at any price.

[JoeKnowsBest]

Chad Johnson for me =:adoration

I can only imagine how great and fun it would be to put him with Clinton Portis... and all their alter egos. You wouldn't need anybody esle to throw a party, they've already got all the characters covered.

I'm serious though. You put personalities like that and it can only lift a teams spirits and keep things refreshing. Their talent alone speeks for it's self. Veteran recievers as good as CJ usually help a young QB develope and blossom alot quicker so I'm all for CJ with JC and CP.

That said, if there was a chance to draft Malcoom Kelly from Oklahoma, I'd be very happy with that too. He's a big hands WR with nice speed for his size and would fit in great with the west coast scheme.

[NYskins]

As a follow up, I dont want to trade Moss. I think he would be great running slants but we use him mostly for deep patterns. I like what Moss brings to the table stretching the field so im not sold on losing that only to bring in a deep threat when we have one (Moss). I like ARE possibly being the over the middle guy but we definitely need a #2 or a #3.

I would keep Moss as our deep threat and look for a possession guy.

I dont want to lose that. Maybe if ARE can thrive in the slot, we can find someone opposite of Moss but I dont know if I want someone to cause headaches in the offense.

[JoeKnowsBest]

To add to that point about Moss, he was an awesome Punt Returner (as is El) so having little short crossing routes and screens where he can get behind some blockers and just run free style would be a tremendous assett and use of his tallents. That's why that quick screen to him always worked so well. Those, and of course the deep balls are good for him. What he should not be doing though is intermediate over the middle routes. That's where we need to improve with a guy like a Malcom Kelly in the draft or a Roy Williams in a trade with the Lions.

[jtyler42]

I was on the CJ bandwagon and if not him then Roy Williams or Larry Fitz...

I've actually changed my thinking on this, and I feel that we should go after Jerry Porter, and maybe draft a WR in the 5th round...We won't need to give up any draft picks, he will come with a much cheaper price tag than CJ, Roy Williams or Larry Fitz...He also fits what we need, a big bodied WR that can go across the middle, is sure handed, can get YAC, and is a red-zone threat...Plus he is a local kid!

[SkinsSyco4Life]

No trades!!!!!! Draft either James Hardy or Malcolm Kelly at #25 in the first round after trading down to this spot with Seattle from #21 for their 2nd and 4th round picks in this years draft. Seattle will want this deal so they can get the running back they want ahead of Dallas who also will be looking for a running back. Then we will have 2 second round picks for the O and D lines,a third round for a CB. Picks in the 4th,5th,6th and 7th can be used to fill at any position.

:dallasuck

[prufRock]

D.J. Hackett is the best bang for the buck. He could probably be picked up for a moderate price. The Skins have to stop breaking the bank for high-priced, high-profile names who may or may NOT fit the profile of the team. Hackett is a low-risk player who knows the system. It would be a sensible, cost-effective signing.

[UltimateSkins]

Ocho Cinco. Nothing more to say really.

[Muzzah]

We NEED a big body/tall guy. ARE can be our Wes Welker. Moss our deep threat. Just need that big guy that can't be blanketed easily on short routes.

[USNationalist]

I dont think there is a hole at WR. Aside from an underachieving moss. We had some solid veteran depth at Wide out at the end of the year. Get rid a loyld, maybe get a big possession guy to play slot. But I don't see us a weak at WR.

[Peregrine]

Yes you can make the case that we dont need any WR help. It takes three to complete a pass. The coach who calls it, the QB who throws it, and the WR that catches it.

If you want a better judge of WR ability, drops are generally a better indication. Look at the abilities of whos on our team. We have Moss, ARE, and multiple other recievers that can step up, as well as youth in the wings. Most importantly, we know there are few times that Cooley wont be on the field. This team has few reasons to run a 3 WR set because we have three recieving threats without it. All this team really needs is a reliable 3rd WR for those times.

This offense is not going to be turned around by a WR, its going to be turned around by a coach.

[Gator Bait]

D.J. Hackett is the best bang for the buck. He could probably be picked up for a moderate price. The Skins have to stop breaking the bank for high-priced, high-profile names who may or may NOT fit the profile of the team. Hackett is a low-risk player who knows the system. It would be a sensible, cost-effective signing.

bingo

[NavyDave]

I love how some of you act like a 1st round WR draft pick is some type of sure thing.

No different than thinking a star on one team will also be one when he comes here. And how has that worked out?

[bigswanny]

I think that our best bet is to get a WR in the draft but only if all the quality DEs have been drafted already. Another route to go that I haven't seen mentioned is Ernest Wilford (Jacksonville). He is a tall receiver that produced well last year and would come at a better price then most of the other options in FA.

[#44XTREMEPOWER]

You need a possesion style reciever like art monk a utility man which we may already have Anthony Mix from the Giants. Stop searching for the big name and promote from with in. The best teams to come out are the teams of men that had to earn there name through play not a one man show at another team. Cooley is a great story make stories from the personal you have now add at the weak area's put everyone on notice it's performance now!We had so many injuries this year you can't really gauge the performance unless you have a full cast. We gave up way too many big runs and toooooo many long passes. so with that said you need corner back and a good back up SS and a relieable back up one big enough to cover Plax and TO. I agree with the statement our pass rush has been anemic so we need a presents on the line and some beef at middle line backer is Blades it? Rocky is good and don't forget not too many changes. Our second string has had a lot of reps on both lines. The D line needs a boost we gave the Offenses way too much time to throw the ball that's why Williams got his can canned. If you don't believe me go back and watch the games way too much time and inconsistant pressure on the other teams QB. Big pressure comes from big play ends we are minus one. Hail

[Skins2010]

They could fix it with a new QB

[turbodiesel#44]

If you want a better judge of WR ability, drops are generally a better indication.

Moss was tied for 3rd most drops in the NFL this year. That's using the most friendly stats on drops I could find.

http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/leaders.asp?year=2007&range=NFL&type=Receiving&rank=232

Other sites had counted as many as 23.:doh:

I like Moss and hope he can make a comeback, but you can't blame those drops on JC. His TD's have gone from 9 in '05 to 6 in '06 and 3 in '07. The last two years, he's had slightly over half of his 1483 '05 yards.

Not ALL his fault I know, but there is little argument against us needing WR help IMO. Either draft a prospect to bring up, or find an affordable FA to be the #1. I do not want to trade Moss, because I feel he might rebound and we would get little value for him as it is.

JC will fail as a skin if we don't find the other end of those passes.