Latest WP hatchet job (Re: Salave'a--another mod edited title)

[skinsn24]

Different coaches do things differently. I wouldn't exactly use the Chiefs as an example, they've got Herm ****ing Edwards as their coach, they're going nowhere. Other coaches, such as BB in NE and Gibbs, would never think of allowing that kind of access and prefer to keep those kinds of dealings private and in house. That doesn't make them wrong.

Also, I understand sports writers use opinion and should. I'm just saying it's an irrevelant and incorrect opinion based solely on emotion and devoid of logic.

The bold part of your quote i like. You are unlike others that simply dont think the post should have opinions. I am with you on devoid of logic thing but you seem to be having it both ways. Correct me if i am wrong.

You are agaisnt the article saying how good big joe was and how much a family dude he was but are ok with the coaches saying the same thing. Maybe if the coaches were a little more honest in why he was released this article never happens because Leanard says "oh ok, i see why he was cut, it makes sense now":2cents:

One last thing, Herm Edwards coached a playoff team last year. (he is not close to the coach Joe was though). But Billick in Baltimore is a pretty good coach and wins on a consistant basis and he DID allow hard knocks.

[Veretax]

You know I hate to say it, but I think you guys are over reacting just a tad. First off its the preseason. Last year we thought we were at least in a play off race at this point (before portis got injured). In light of what happened last year, you have to expect criticism. The praise will come again once the team proves it is worthy of it. MOve on already.

[DixieFlatline]

well if thats your attitude then gibbs shouldnt even talk to the media if he cant be honest. he should just say "no comment". snyder does.

Again, you're classifying what/how he says things as dishonest and not classy. You may not agree with this style, but what he says isn't dishonest. It may not be the full story. He did say though that things were crowded at the tackle position and if they let him go now, he might catch on with someone. And it was a decision that was done for the best of the team.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

You know I hate to say it, but I think you guys are over reacting just a tad. First off its the preseason. Last year we thought we were at least in a play off race at this point (before portis got injured). In light of what happened last year, you have to expect criticism. The praise will come again once the team proves it is worthy of it. MOve on already.

people expect media praise after we went 5-11. i mean good lord.

should they praise the raiders and lions too? because i dont see anyone calling reporters stupid for thinking theyre going to perform poorly.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

Again, you're classifying what/how he says things as dishonest and not classy. You may not agree with this style, but what he says isn't dishonest. It may not be the full story. He did say though that things were crowded at the tackle position and if they let him go now, he might catch on with someone. And it was a decision that was done for the best of the team.

i was joking about the class thing, i dont care if our coach is the nicest guy or the biggest jackass, as long as were winning games and progressing as a football team, thats what counts. i just hate that everything our teams does is a complete mystery. you never have a clue whats going on, and its just annoying, and hasnt been productive for us. and it would get the media off the skins back a lot. ill say it again, we probably have the worst PR in terms of head coach, "GM" and snyder. gibbs comes off as a 90 year old man, vinny shouldnt be allowed within 100 yards of a camera, and snyder wont even go on camera. and when we underperform, it makes us look even worse.

i watched the eagles owner on TV the other night, just talking about the team and whats going on, and why players were there or not there, just general football stuff. well spoken guy, seems like a good guy. we have dan snyder, a 5'6 billionare who wont address the media, makes everyone refer to him as mr snyder, and cares more about what country he is trying to overthrow than sound football decisions. it makes us a huge target.

[DixieFlatline]

i was joking about the class thing, i dont care if our coach is the nicest guy or the biggest jackass, as long as were winning games and progressing as a football team, thats what counts. i just hate that everything our teams does is a complete mystery. you never have a clue whats going on, and its just annoying, and hasnt been productive for us. and it would get the media off the skins back a lot. ill say it again, we probably have the worst PR in terms of head coach, "GM" and snyder. gibbs comes off as a 90 year old man, vinny shouldnt be allowed within 100 yards of a camera, and snyder wont even go on camera. and when we underperform, it makes us look even worse.

i watched the eagles owner on TV the other night, just talking about the team and whats going on, and why players were there or not there, just general football stuff. well spoken guy, seems like a good guy. we have dan snyder, a 5'6 billionare who wont address the media, makes everyone refer to him as mr snyder, and cares more about what country he is trying to overthrow than sound football decisions. it makes us a huge target.

I definitely agree with you that we could work on the PR aspect. Although, I think Snyder has gotten a little gunshy from being pegged early on. Of course, if we were winning, I think we wouldn't be quite under the microscope.

[skinsn24]

Win football games and there will be postive reporting, i know it.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

I definitely agree with you that we could work on the PR aspect. Although, I think Snyder has gotten a little gunshy from being pegged early on. Of course, if we were winning, I think we wouldn't be quite under the microscope.

very true, although you still have to wonder, say we did go like 11-5 or 12-4 and got deep into the playoffs, theres no way snyder could avoid the media at that point.

[pjfootballer]

I liked Big Joe, but whatever is best for the team, is all that matters to me. When players hold out, whine or throw fits, they say it's just business. Well, it's just business.

[DCsportsfan53]

The bold part of your quote i like. You are unlike others that simply dont think the post should have opinions. I am with you on devoid of logic thing but you seem to be having it both ways. Correct me if i am wrong.

You are agaisnt the article saying how good big joe was and how much a family dude he was but are ok with the coaches saying the same thing. Maybe if the coaches were a little more honest in why he was released this article never happens because Leanard says "oh ok, i see why he was cut, it makes sense now":2cents:

One last thing, Herm Edwards coached a playoff team last year. (he is not close to the coach Joe was though). But Billick in Baltimore is a pretty good coach and wins on a consistant basis and he DID allow hard knocks.

Listen to Gregg Williams interview on Redskins.com, he spells it out very plainly. He says they have young guys who are stepping it up and they wanted to improve their overall team speed. They wanted more of a pass rushing prescense from the interior and Big Joe is a run stuffer. I mean, it was a tough decision for the coaches, too, especially GW because he has a long history with and is very close with Big Joe. There's not much explanation needed, it's self explanatory. They thought overall the team would be better with someone else occupying that roster spot. That's all it is and as painful as it is, if they believed that, there's only one thing to do and it doesn't really need an explanation.

[skinsn24]

Listen to Gregg Williams interview on Redskins.com, he spells it out very plainly. He says they have young guys who are stepping it up and they wanted to improve their overall team speed. They wanted more of a pass rushing prescense from the interior and Big Joe is a run stuffer. I mean, it was a tough decision for the coaches, too, especially GW because he has a long history with and is very close with Big Joe. There's not much explanation needed, it's self explanatory. They thought overall the team would be better with someone else occupying that roster spot. That's all it is and as painful as it is, if they believed that, there's only one thing to do and it doesn't really need an explanation.

I agree, so why does Gibbs have to aviod the issue or not say that in the intial media press conference. Thats the point here, we all know about Gibbs speak but at a certain point it becomes a total joke.

[teamcal00]

how is it disrespectful by saying "were trying to get younger at this position"?? this is A BUSINESS, joe salavea understands why he was cut, theres nothing wrong with saying "joe is a great player but we'd like to try a different direction with some younger guys and see what they can offer".

instead we get the same old nonsense. i swear some of you think these guys are all sensitive 12 year old girls. these are multimillionare NFL players and businessmen. they can and should be able to handle the truth. sugar coating all of it just makes it look even worse.

BLC...we always butt heads on our opinions so I'll just leave it to that. But I can tell you that having actually worked for an NFL organization that's just not how most of these guys operate. It is disrespectful for a coach to explain why he cut a player with few exceptions. I don't know what to tell you if you can't understand that. It's called keeping it in house...it's called class. You're obviously smart enough to figure out why Big Joe got cut, as are the reporters that cover the team. Why do you need the coach to bash a player that's headed out the door....to tell you something you already know???

I pray to God that Gibbs and the team are successful this year so you and the rest of the fans / supporters of the team that question his knowledge and ways of operating an NFL team will finally stop with some of the nonsense you espouse.

[DCsportsfan53]

I agree, so why does Gibbs have to aviod the issue or not say that in the intial media press conference. Thats the point here, we all know about Gibbs speak but at a certain point it becomes a total joke.

It's just how Gibbs is. He divulges as little actual information about the interior dealings of the team as possible. GW's a little more open. It's just personality differences. I could care less, it's not really for us to know. What matters is that Big Joe has the respect of the coaches and they handled his cut with class. I feel fairly confident in believing that to be true. I could absolutely care less what Gibbs says to the media about that kind of stuff, it's not for us to know why a player gets cut. What are you actually griping about here? Is his job to coach the players or give detailed explanations to us for the decisions he makes? The only person he owes that to are the people he works for and with.

[skinsn24]

It's just how Gibbs is. He divulges as little actual information about the interior dealings of the team as possible. GW's a little more open. It's just personality differences. I could care less, it's not really for us to know. What matters is that Big Joe has the respect of the coaches and they handled his cut with class. I feel fairly confident in believing that to be true. I could absolutely care less what Gibbs says to the media about that kind of stuff, it's not for us to know why a player gets cut. What are you actually griping about here? Is his job to coach the players or give detailed explanations to us for the decisions he makes? The only person he owes that to are the people he works for and with.

Obviously his job is head coach but he is also the team president. Someone needs to explain to the customer or fans why certain things happen. Why the team does this and why they win or lose.

Its how sports are. I am not the only one tired of Gibbs speak.

[DCsportsfan53]

Obviously his job is head coach but he is also the team president. Someone needs to explain to the customer or fans why certain things happen. Why the team does this and why they win or lose.

Its how sports are. I am not the only one tired of Gibbs speak.

I understand where you're coming from but I just don't think it's justified. If Gibbs speak gets old, don't listen to it. You have to look at it from his perspective in the light of song and dance that is the media. If he says nothing, they'll find stuff to say about him (and usually not good stuff). If he gives too much information, he opens more doors for criticism and risks offending his players. It's a carefully balanced act trying to keep the team's business in house, trying to keep the media satisified ang give the fans some information. Gibbs errors toward the side of caution as far as releasing information, as do many coaches (such as Belicheck, who gives even less info than Gibbs, but he wins so people laugh about it instead of complain) and that's fine. I just really don't think he owes us more than that. Anyone with half a brain can determine why Joe was released, and that it was a difficult decision.

Honestly, what did you expect him to say? Did you expect him to come out in front of the media and say "yeah, we just kind of felt that Joe, while a good guy, is too slow and this other kid's a better player than him." Is that what you wanted to hear?

And no, his job is not to explain why they won or lost, it's to do PR work as team president. That doesn't include giving the reasons for behind personnel decisions.

[skinsn24]

Honestly, what did you expect him to say? Did you expect him to come out in front of the media and say "yeah, we just kind of felt that Joe, while a good guy, is too slow and this other kid's a better player than him." Is that what you wanted to hear?

And no, his job is not to explain why they won or lost, it's to do PR work as team president. That doesn't include giving the reasons for behind personnel decisions.

yea i think that would be a better thing to say, this is not a big issue for me, so i am not really concerned but its just become a joke. Everyone knows something and Joe still cant come out and say it.

You say his job is to do PR work which is true, cleary part of PR is giving reasons why the organization makes roster moves and what not.

[Tailgate Ted]

I really dislike the move, and think Joe deserved better too. :whoknows:

I totally agree with you and I hate what we did to Joe. He did anything we asked him and now we are asking him to leave and he has done that quietly also. He was a Skin through and throough and he should have been treated better.

[DCsportsfan53]

yea i think that would be a better thing to say, this is not a big issue for me, so i am not really concerned but its just become a joke. Everyone knows something and Joe still cant come out and say it.

You say his job is to do PR work which is true, cleary part of PR is giving reasons why the organization makes roster moves and what not.

Think about it in terms of any other company. Do they really tell the public the real reasons why they do things, or do they just say the PC thing to say? It's the same thing here.

Honestly, I agree with you that his press conferences are basically worthless. That's why I don't usually bother watching them, I know he's not going to say anything that's not overly generalized and veiled. I guess it's just that I'm ok with that and don't see an issue with it because I can put 2 and 2 together myself. But you're absolutely right, the press conferences are completely lacking in real information and are, essentially, worthless.

[skinsn24]

Think about it in terms of any other company. Do they really tell the public the real reasons why they do things, or do they just say the PC thing to say? It's the same thing here.

Honestly, I agree with you that his press conferences are basically worthless. That's why I don't usually bother watching them, I know he's not going to say anything that's not overly generalized and veiled. I guess it's just that I'm ok with that and don't see an issue with it because I can put 2 and 2 together myself. But you're absolutely right, the press conferences are completely lacking in real information and are, essentially, worthless.

I am basically with you. As i said this is not very imporatant for me. I would like to see his press conferences become something more meanful thats all. I would like to know what my head coach actually thinks of his team.

But i wont. And i cant change it. not that big of a deal.

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

And......................I'm over it.

[RabidFan]

No love for us resurrecting Big Joe's career as he was out of the NFL when we first signed him...nah, why bring that up.

[throwback37]

The national media never really showed us any respect, and now the local media is doing the same. The local media used to have an excellent working relationship with the Skinz, but since Snyder took over, that relationship has suffered.

Things like charging networks to use the Redskins name in their sports show programming, revoking game tickets from various media outlets shuch as the Post hasn't helped either. Add into the mix the fact that many of our long time local broadcast and print reporters who have had a history with the team and remember the glory days have been replaced with younger reporters whose only knowledge of the team is the current regime and this is what we get.

I'll join in the Post & SI boycott - Who needs 'em- we've got ES.

[SkinsFTW]

i doubt he gets signed either.... if you asked any nfl GM who had the worst DL in the NFL, they would probably say the Redskins. Why would anyone want an old, oft-injured, player who couldnt make a team - and one where he was a leader - that has one of the worst lines in the league? Old Joe isn't getting picked up by anyone.

Exactly, so it's almost like we have an extra guy out there in case we need him later.

Good call on releasing him IMO.

[Dirk Diggler]

Thought this would be a good bump...

Mr. Shapiro's been surprisingly quiet during this nice little run.

[refhaf4L]

WTF is wrong with these guys? Did Snyder pee in their cheerios?

Here's the bottom line - the Skins are damned if they do and damned if they don't. The hacks who never passed on a chance to blast our defense last year for being historically bad at producing sacks and turnovers, are the same hacks who are criticizing the means by which we get younger and faster on the defensive line. The painful truth is that means parting with likable grunts like Big Joe. You'd think we just kicked him out of a moving car.

I currently boycott SI and I am this freakin close to boycotting the WP.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/08/29/AR2007082901660.html?nav=rss_sports

Redskins Coach Joe Gibbs said he had coached "no greater person" than Salave'a. Gregg Williams, the team's assistant head coach-defense and the man who helped draft him in the fourth round when he was with the Tennessee Titans in 1998, described himself as "kind of like his stepfather" and that Salave'a had been very close to Williams' children.

How sweet.

........................................

But the next time you hear a club owner, a general manager, a head coach, praise a player for being such a wonderful team guy, an exemplary character guy, a loyal-to-a-fault, stand-up guy willing to play hurt and make the ultimate sacrifice for his teammates, just remember Joe Salave'a, who clearly deserved better from the Redskins than getting cut on a Tuesday afternoon in late August.

Where does this comef rom anyway...Why are you talking about this now? By the way, our young guns on the D line now are far more productive than Salivea, or Rynaldo Wynn...come on...stupid to bring this up now.