(WP) La Canfora: Ravens are "anti-Skins"

[kwitt]

Don't kill the messenger. His points are valid ones. He is just trying to show over the long hall what keeping your draft picks can yield with some smart management.

[Hooper]

This is the only part of the whole blog that disturbs me. Only 2 players Arrington and Bailey have come out to say that our organization treated them bad.

That's not true. Pierce and Brad Johnson come to mind. Ryan Clark, according to the Warpath guys, felt the Skins treated him like crap as well.

[chipwhich]

That's not true. Pierce and Brad Johnson come to mind. Ryan Clark, according to the Warpath guys, felt the Skins treated him like crap as well.

Shall I list all the ex-ravens that do the same. How bout the Ravens in the locker room after the playoff loss dogging the organization. That stuff doesn't make j la c's article. Just the negative Redskin stuff...even though last year the Ravens ALMOST imploded. They were a mess.

[Mercuryrising]

The Ravens are draft guru's without a doubt. At least that is what the talking heads are all saying now...

From 2003 draft

Without a doubt, Baltimore paid a hefty ransom to obtain New England's second first-round pick, the 19th overall selection. The Ravens handed the Patriots their second-round pick, No. 41 overall, and their No. 1 in 2004 for the privilege of taking the most intriguing passer in this year's draft. (Kyle Boller)

It's always dangerous to trade future No. 1 picks, but I think it was a calculated move that Baltimore needed to make, given its history at the position. The Ravens in essence gave up the chance to get a possible impact player in next year's draft -- plus another strong contributor in this year's second round -- in order to immediately address the franchise's longstanding quarterback problem.

Baltimore's assessment that next year's draft will be a weak one at quarterback is shared by many. At this point, there's only one prospect -- Mississippi's Eli Manning -- who looks like a certain top-10 pick. The Ravens reasoned that they'll be at least an 8-8 or 9-7 club in 2003, and thus won't have a legitimate shot to land a big-time quarterback at the top of the draft.

Billick/ Newsome good thing you guys didn't wait until 2004 draft and try to land Phillip Rivers. He is no where near as impressive as Kyle Boller.

Ratbirds!

Edited note added: With that pick in 2004 NE selected DE Vince Wilfork. Had the Ravens held onto that pick they could have also grabbed Stephen Jackson (STL) or JP Losman.... all of whom are infinitely better than the most intriguing QB named Kyle Boller....

[Hooper]

Shall I list all the ex-ravens that do the same. How bout the Ravens in the locker room after the playoff loss dogging the organization. That stuff doesn't make j la c's article. Just the negative Redskin stuff...even though last year the Ravens ALMOST imploded. They were a mess.

Good points. But still, just going by wins and losses, the skins and hell, 80 percent of the league, fare much better than the Skins since Danny took over. It's a fact.

I don't think JLC has has it out for the Skins (if you read his blog you'll see he's actually a big fan). I think he just spent some time with the Ravens and was shocked by how differently they did things than the Skins. He just has the same problem with the front office a lot of us do.

[pjfootballer]

That's not true. Pierce and Brad Johnson come to mind. Ryan Clark, according to the Warpath guys, felt the Skins treated him like crap as well.

Those were more money issues than anything. All players will have issues if the team doesn't pay them what they want. Arrington was playing time and GW. He was getting paid. Bailey was Money also, plus I think he felt slighted because we "traded" him.

[TMK9973]

Good points. But still, just going by wins and losses, the skins and hell, 80 percent of the league, fare much better than the Skins since Danny took over. It's a fact.

No - It's not a fact. I would guess at least half, if not more, have done worse. I.E - Cowboys actualy have a 2 game worse record then us since 1999. Bears? Well, before this year their record was worse then our over the same time by 3 games. Saints? Worse.

There were many years where the skins were 8-8, 9-7, 7-9... Not good, clearly, but don't make it sound like Dan Synder turned us into the Lions

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/

[Hooper]

Those were more money issues than anything. All players will have issues if the team doesn't pay them what they want. Arrington was playing time and GW. He was getting paid. Bailey was Money also, plus I think he felt slighted because we "traded" him.

BJ wasn't a money issue. That was Snyder bringing in Jeff George. Man, the Jeff George era. What a nightmare that was. My three favorite highlights --

Jeff George telling interim coach Robiskie "he'll do what he wants" and then promptly thowing a pick.

George seeing a d-end coming his way and taking a knee instead of a sack.

George getting crushed against Dallas and his teamates letting him stay on the ground forever.

[supadrummer]

This whole draft vs FA crap needs to stop. Why, because regardless what you do, you need to have good talent evaluators. Thats the problem here. We go for names, not talent. Look at the Giants, they sign a lot of FAs every year, but dont get bashed about it. The reason is, they have a guy who knows how to put a team together and evaluate talent for the system.

Our org doesn't get that part. I do not mind building through FA, because it can work with great success, if you just put the right man in charge to build the team.

The Giants go further but look how the have done. They are the ones who lost to the Ravens in thier Superbowl year. I'm pretty much on the fence when it comes to FA Vs Draft. In the Draft you could have a #1 prospect that does nothing like Desmond Howard. Then again you could have a FA bust like Arch. Not to forget they can get hurt before they hit the field like Barrow did.

I am still on the fence but I do have a formula that Could work: Rebuild squad through Draft and Plug in your FA. For Example:

Need a CB go through FA how ever if you need to rebuild the secondary go through the draft.

At this point the Redskins are such a mess being 5-11 I don't have a suggestion as a Fan\GM. They don't have the draft picks and the Free agent market doesn't favor our Salary Cap.

Gibbs and the front office laid eggs in this mess by trying not to use a GM. Now the chickens are on thier way home to roost.

I don't see us turning this thing around without resurgance of are team as it is.

Ok He fired the Linebackers coach. Mabe now we can make use of Rock Mcintosh. Who knows the impact here but The LB's can only get better.

I know you guys at this point want to try something new like build through the draft but honestly that's not an option.

offense is set as it is and the D.....well you know our Defensive players will only ad a 2nd rounder in trade at best.

Gibbs is gonna have to work some magic.....hope he learns to get a GM....

As for the Ravens, They are a good team that does build through the draft but if you look at them they have had Stability like another poster said. We have changed coaches like seasons have changed until Gibbs got here.

If gibbs gets a GM that could save him. I think another losing season and Snyder will loose patients.

I don't have a solution but I tell you what. The report has no more of a solution to this than we do. He's just throwing rocks at a team that's down.

I'll let you draw your own conclusions on that.

I don't disagree with the reporters idea. I just disaggree with how he comes across because different teams have different recipes for success.

Supa

[pjfootballer]

BJ wasn't a money issue. That was Snyder bringing in Jeff George. Man, the Jeff George era. What a nightmare that was. My three favorite highlights --

Jeff George telling interim coach Robiskie "he'll do what he wants" and then promptly thowing a pick.

George seeing a d-end coming his way and taking a knee instead of a sack.

George getting crushed against Dallas and his teamates letting him on the ground forever.

Crap, good call, I forgot about Jeff "the team killa" George. I try to forget players like him.

[elkabong82]

Except LaCanfora forgets that the Ravens were terrible last year, DUE TO INJURY! They improved this year, but only made it to the postseason because of McNair coming to town. Boller couldn't cut it. But gee, did they draft McNair? Hell no. He was a free agent, just like another key component to the offense, Mike Anderson. He was brought in to keep Jamal Lewis fresh, as he had been struggling last season.

The Ravens are defintely NOT the anti-skins. All that happened was for one season, Baltimore's free agents panned out. That is what put them over the top. Yes they built up well through the draft, but it is all mostly defense. The Skins, since Gibbs took over, have only had 3 seasons, the Ravens have had alot more w/ Billick, and a lot more time to develop their guys.

LaCanfora is basically griping that the Skins couldn't do what the Ravens did, even though he only gave us 3 years, and the Ravens about a decade. Of course, this is guy who has also cried about how "offensive" the team name is. This guy rarely writes an intriguing article, a lot of his work is obviously lacking in research also. the guy couldn't even spell Springs' first name correctly.

[pjfootballer]

But we did. When CP was injured, our DRAFT pick Betts filled in. When Brunell stunk, our DRAFT pick JC came in. We have done it just like they have. Unfortunately we didn't get it done on the field.

[drowland]

Except LaCanfora forgets that the Ravens were terrible last year, DUE TO INJURY! They improved this year, but only made it to the postseason because of McNair coming to town. Boller couldn't cut it. But gee, did they draft McNair? Hell no. He was a free agent, just like another key component to the offense, Mike Anderson. He was brought in to keep Jamal Lewis fresh, as he had been struggling last season.

The Ravens are defintely NOT the anti-skins. All that happened was for one season, Baltimore's free agents panned out. That is what put them over the top. Yes they built up well through the draft, but it is all mostly defense. The Skins, since Gibbs took over, have only had 3 seasons, the Ravens have had alot more w/ Billick, and a lot more time to develop their guys.

LaCanfora is basically griping that the Skins couldn't do what the Ravens did, even though he only gave us 3 years, and the Ravens about a decade. Of course, this is guy who has also cried about how "offensive" the team name is. This guy rarely writes an intriguing article, a lot of his work is obviously lacking in research also. the guy couldn't even spell Springs' first name correctly.

Of the Ravens 22 regular starters, only 6 were FAs. McNair, Mason, Rolle, Pryce, Keydrick Vincent and Kelly Gregg.

On the flip side, of the Skins 22 regular starters only about 8 or 9 were drafted. Sean Taylor, Carlos Rogers, Chris Samuels, John Jansen, Derrick Dockery, Chris Cooley, Jason Campbell and then Betts and Golston due to the injury.

That's a pretty drastic difference in makeup.

[Drex]

No - It's not a fact. I would guess at least half, if not more, have done worse. I.E - Cowboys actualy have a 2 game worse record then us since 1999. Bears? Well, before this year their record was worse then our over the same time by 3 games. Saints? Worse.

There were many years where the skins were 8-8, 9-7, 7-9... Not good, clearly, but don't make it sound like Dan Synder turned us into the Lions

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/

For clarity's sake, courtesy of pro-football-reference.com:

10 teams have a worse record than the skins over the 1999-2006 timeframe:

Buffalo, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Houston, Oakland, Atlanta, Dallas, Detroit, New Orleans and San Francisco.

21 teams (65% of the league) have a better record over that timeframe.

[NoCalMike]

See here is the thing though that none of the writers take into account....

The NFL is a different league ever since The Salary Cap took over....

Now you have teams that go from worst to first in a single season, and vice versa....

Rarely do you have situations like pre-Salary Cap where a team stays playoff calibur for 10 straight years.

It's not like the Redskins haven't drafted plenty of good players over the years, however most of the time those players CHOSE TO LEAVE....

You can only build so much via the draft now because at the end of their initial contract, any and every player has the option to leave for another team. The player can be on a superbowl calibur team, yet up and leave when he is a free agent over as little as $250,000 more guaranteed money.

With the Salary Cap there are only so many long-term big money contracts to go around, and once those are spent, you are basically handicaped by the Salary Cap and forced to make these FAKE 5 year contracts where all the money is backloaded, and the player will actually be gone after three years and never see the BIG MONEY that was offered in the contract.

[TMK9973]

For clarity's sake, courtesy of pro-football-reference.com:

10 teams have a worse record than the skins over the 1999-2006 timeframe:

Buffalo, Cincinnati, Cleveland, Houston, Oakland, Atlanta, Dallas, Detroit, New Orleans and San Francisco.

21 teams (65% of the league) have a better record over that timeframe.

Ok. Thanks for doing the math. So 35% was worse. Out of those 21 teams that have done better - I would guess (Just guess) that at least 5 or 6 of those teams are within 5 games of our 7 year record

[JoeGibbsThickandthin]

These people who keep talking about the draft can not analyze football.

There is no magic dust on guy because he is drafted. You get a player anyway you can.

Look at the Saints. They drafted, high for years. And did not become good until they got the QB from the Chargers.

You need to draft well when you have a high pick. You can not waste the 6th on a bust.

But there is really no difference between a guy drafted and a free agent. As long as u do not over pay.

[matty dread]

Ozzie Newsome does a helluva job

[hail2skins]

So clearly the Ravens know what they are doing, right? F that. Why is that the right time frame? What about what happens next year? This is just a moment in time. Some here keep meationing the Ravens SB 6 years ago. Ok. Well what if we did this compersion last year.

1999 -2005 seasons

Skins 57-55

Ravens 59-53

2 game difference! Over 6 seasons! WOW! We should be JUST like them!

Give me a freakin break....

Don't know about your math.......just counting regular season, I get the Skins at 54-58 for the '99-'05 season, and the Ravens at 62-50 for the same timeframe. That's a difference of just over 1 game per season for the timeframe, which often can mean the difference between the playoffs and going home.

[hail2skins]

No - It's not a fact. I would guess at least half, if not more, have done worse. I.E - Cowboys actualy have a 2 game worse record then us since 1999. Bears? Well, before this year their record was worse then our over the same time by 3 games. Saints? Worse.

There were many years where the skins were 8-8, 9-7, 7-9... Not good, clearly, but don't make it sound like Dan Synder turned us into the Lions.

Since Dan fired Marty the Skins have gone 7-9, 5-11, 6-10, 10-6, and 5-11. Not quite getting into Lions or Cards territory but enough to make me nostalgic for the prime Norv years.

[chipwhich]

Since Dan fired Marty the Skins have gone 7-9, 5-11, 6-10, 10-6, and 5-11. Not quite getting into Lions or Cards territory but enough to make me nostalgic for the prime Norv years.

But not the not so prime Norv years :doh:

[AzSkinsFan63]

The Skins went from 9th to 31st in defense...on that side of the ball they failed miserably in the off season. But some can argue the case that the main reason the Skins were not successful on defense was the injuries to Shawn Springs and Pierson Preiliou.

That put all the pressure on 2nd year CB Carlos Rogers who was not ready to be the sole number 1 CB and changed the whole outcome of the 06 season. The lack of depth at CB killed the Skins defense.

When Springs was back in and at full strength. That was the only 2 times the defense showed up and it was sandwiched in between Springs also being out after tweaking his hamstring or calf muscle.

With solid cover guys GW's defense showed it's ability but alas it was only 2 games.

The offense was a new system and a QB change midway.

The Skins already won a playoff game under this FO philosophy and played the SB contender pretty closely. In fact some say that Brunell was the reason for the loss to Seattle last season.

Baltimore is never successful with the defense they have had for years!!!

losing the first round of the playoffs with a bye is laughable.

I'll take our front office thanks....

[JoeGibbsThickandthin]

The Skins went from 9th to 31st in defense...on that side of the ball they failed miserably in the off season. But some can argue the case that the main reason the Skins were not successful on defense was the injuries to Shawn Springs and Pierson Preiliou.

That put all the pressure on 2nd year CB Carlos Rogers who was not ready to be the sole number 1 CB and changed the whole outcome of the 06 season. The lack of depth at CB killed the Skins defense.

When Springs was back in and at full strength. That was the only 2 times the defense showed up and it was sandwiched in between Springs also being out after tweaking his hamstring or calf muscle.

With solid cover guys GW's defense showed it's ability but alas it was only 2 games.

The offense was a new system and a QB change midway.

The Skins already won a playoff game under this FO philosophy and played the SB contender pretty closely. In fact some say that Brunell was the reason for the loss to Seattle last season.

Baltimore is never successful with the defense they have had for years!!!

losing the first round of the playoffs with a bye is laughable.

I'll take our front office thanks....

I will take it too Brunell is the only reason we did not win the super bow last year.

He could not drop back in the pocket and throw a pass down the middle. I thought it was our talent. But as soon as Campbell comes in. Everything looks normal again.

This year Washington was hurt all year. Springs hurt all year basically. Griff and Salivia played like old men because they were hurt.

They should not workout year around. They should get surgerys and be back in time for a hard training camp.

Just my opinion.

I say this off season we make sure everyone gets their proper surgerys. Everyone was playing hurt from pre season on.

I kept saying to myself. WTF was the offseason for.

[kovachs]

He is a Reporter for the post AND does online Blogs. I can't do an online blog there.

He is a Washington Post Redskins Beat Reporter...

A blog is simply a *published* article you can comment on.

I'm not surprised you can't discern the difference between a blog post and his articles. They are completely different in substance.

[MRMADD]

Only 2 players Arrington and Bailey have come out to say that our organization treated them bad. .

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Coles say nasty things about Snyder? About Snyder threatening him? And didn't Barber and Pierce express relief to be out of Washington? And Smoot? And Walt Harris?

In fact, I'm hard-pressed to think of an ex-Redskin who has good things to say. Maybe you can clear this up?