ES Coverage & Game Day Thread for Preseason Game #1 "Brady's scared" Picture link added (Final)

[KDawg]

Not sure anyone said it was everything. In fact, I'm not even sure what you're talking about. At all. Remember when I said Young was the best pass blocker, could run and could catch the ball? I also said that makes him a solid fit as a third down back after many insinuated he couldn't do it because he's not a scat back.

You can use a scat, too. But with a porous OL or an overload, you better hope that scat can get in the way or your franchise QB is toast. Sure, there's times the O will win, but sometimes those pros on the D are going to win, too.

The answer, like I said in one or my first posts on the subject, is using variety and versatility.

What's the the madden/real life thing at the end, by the way?

[DC9]

The game has changed a lot over the past decade, but anyone here that would have predicted it would have been laughed it 

 

Hurry up? Unthinkable. Teams winning without a stellar defense? No way. Ben able to get to the bowl with no OL? Wait, I thought he needed pass pro.  Passing on first down? Minds blown. 

 

Pass pro is not everything when it comes to designing a team. We made it to the playoffs with perhaps THE worst pass drop back pass pro I have ever seen. 

 

Madden Real Life 

 

The four best teams in the NFL for me?

 

1. Seahawks

2. 49ers

3. Broncos

4. Panthers

 

3 out of 4 of those teams are smash mouth.  Why do you think we are buying beef in bulk.

You can use a scat, too. But with a porous OL or an overload, you better hope that scat can get in the way or your franchise QB is toast. Sure, there's times the O will win, but sometimes those pros on the D are going to win, too.

The answer, like I said in one or my first posts on the subject, is using variety and versatility.

What's the the madden/real life thing at the end, by the way?

 

I'm predicting right now... people are going to lose their minds on Tuesday with the Cleveland blitz.

 

I almost watched that whole game and Pettine was bringing at least five every time.  Sometimes as many as 7.

 

Protection will be a premium on MNF against the Browns.  If it's not, we'll be in here talking about Moses and friends not being worth the pick.

Blocking has to be solid and passes need to come out/run plays need to be executed.

[RG3Hunna]

The four best teams in the NFL for me?

 

1. Seahawks

2. 49ers

3. Broncos

4. Panthers

 

3 out of 4 of those teams are smash mouth.  Why do you think we are buying beef in bulk.

 

I agree with the premise of your argument 100% but we're also "Smash mouth" and we suck. The difference between those 3 teams is they have top 10 defenses in the NFL so they can be smash mouth because they know their defense will keep the score low so they don't need to light up the scoreboard.

 

Our defense gives up 29 ppg you can't get 30ppg running the football down teams throats. I mean by the 3rd quarter we're usually down 14 points and we abandon the running game anyways. lol

 

We can win being smash mouth when our defense becomes a feared physical defense like the panthers, 49ers and seahawks, until then we'll continue losing games unless we somehow have an explosive offense to make up for our terrible defense (Peyton  Manning colts) (Drew Brees Saints before Greg Williams & Rob Ryan)

[DC9]

I agree with the premise of your argument 100% but we're also "Smash mouth" and we suck. The difference between those 3 teams is they have top 10 defenses in the NFL so they can be smash mouth because they know their defense will keep the score low so they don't need to light up the scoreboard.

 

Our defense gives up 29 ppg you can't get 30ppg running the football down teams throats. I mean by the 3rd quarter we're usually down 14 points and we abandon the running game anyways. lol

 

We can win being smash mouth when our defense becomes a feared physical defense like the panthers, 49ers and seahawks, until then we'll continue losing games unless we somehow have an explosive offense to make up for our terrible defense (Peyton  Manning colts) (Drew Brees Saints before Greg Williams & Rob Ryan)

 

You will get no arguments from me on how bad our defense is.  Along with DG, I'm normally at the beginning of the line to **** about Haz.

 

That's why he's my avi... I'm trying to give him awesomeness through osmosis.

 

But we also don't have a line like the Panthers, Seahawks, or 49ers.  We don't have a line that can take charge of a game by itself and be on the field for 35 - 40 minutes a game and beat up the other team.

 

That's as big a part of smashmouth as anything --- if not more.  What we did to New England was a great example.  Our defense wasn't the best... but we went out there and just pounded the **** out of them while we were on offense.

 

So yes... defense sucks.   But if you have a good o-line, you can burn time (thus playing defense/keep away) and control the game.  One hand washes the other.

[skinny21]

Given our speed on offense and the strength of our running game, I think teams are best off trying to beat us by attacking our weakness... the Oline. Sure, we'd get good chunks of yardage when we beat the blitz (running and passing), but I think quick pressure limits the effectiveness of PA as well as the deep passing game. Yes, Robert has been good against the blitz, but I think teams would rather test him (as a passer) than to either drop in coverage or stack the box against the run.

I also think this is why Gruden's quick passing attack can be very beneficial to the team. The focus on dump offs and screens should help both Griffin (getting him in rhythm/comfortable) and the Oline. If we show we can beat the pressure with the quick passes then that should in turn open up the deep game and PA.

So, with all of that said, Cleveland should be a good test.

Or maybe I'm completely wrong

[TK]

 Along with DG, I'm normally at the beginning of the line to **** about Haz.

 

 

 

I'm already camped out waitin for the chess match between Hazhole & Kyle. 

[KDawg]

I'm already camped out waitin for the chess match between Hazhole & Kyle.

I think they both will move the bishops and queens too early and expose the king... And then they'll both somehow not find a way to get checkmate.

[FuriousD]

 

But when the hands are not really contributing in the passing game for more than blocking, as ours have not done for what seems like a decade +, fixating on all our RBs having to be great blockers first gets stale for some. We can use TEs or our full instead. 

 

You know, I was leaning in the same direction when I read KDawg's post and thinking, I know what Gibbs would have done with that blocking-back.  But it's never that simple and he wasn't implying it was.

 

Bottom line is we should look to the Bengals for answers.  Below are Giovani Bernards numbers from last year and they're quite telling. First of all, please bare in mind that Bernard is 5-9 and 208 lbs and then consider that Bernard was the #2 back behind Green-Ellis and the number #2 receiver overall.  Only AJ Green caught more balls!  That should speak volumes for how Gruden likes to use his change-up back.

 

Rushing                                 Receiving

Att   Yds   Avg  Lng  TD  .....  Rec  Yds  Avg  Long  TD  

170  695   4.1   35T  5     .....  56    514  9.2    41      3

 

And then there's Bernard's numbers. Pretty impressive! The 9.2 receiving average and long of 41 yds outdistance Helu's numbers; especially the 41 yarder (compared to Helu's 28).  I think this should suggest to even the casual observer why a scat-back with nimble feet and good hands is so dangerous.  I think it's also safe to assume that Giovani Bernard kept defensive coordinators up late at night.  DY, with all due respect....... not so much.

 

Gruden will have to play the hand he's dealt this year and he'll find ways to get DY more involved.  But the ghost of Giovani Bernard is going to haunt Gruden.  CT is virtually a goner.  Seastrunk can try all he wants but he's no receiver. Redd may make it to the PS but he's a FA depth player at best.  This year it's gonna be Helu but he's no Giovani Bernard.

 

No folks, I see another RB in our future come draft day next year.  A scat-back with speed, hands and skills.  Our very own Giovani Bernard.  I can see it coming....

[darrelgreenie]

Helu can fill the "3rd down back" role until or if Seastrunk proves to be reliable in blitz pickup and receiving

[KDawg]

I think a lot of you missed the overall emphasis of my message... A third down back has to be able to block, catch and run. They don't have to be amazing in all three, but must be proficient.

My point wasn't that a third down back had to be some big bruiser... It was that Young could do it just fine, AND be effective.

[FuriousD]

I think a lot of you missed the overall emphasis of my message... A third down back has to be able to block, catch and run. They don't have to be amazing in all three, but must be proficient.

My point wasn't that a third down back had to be some big bruiser... It was that Young could do it just fine, AND be effective.

I think it was your reference to third down backs re: first and foremost being able to block and blocking as a primary asset that got me thinking.

Giovani Bernards size, speed and athleticism obviously brought different dynamics to the role. His numbers would seem to suggest that Gruden was far less interested in having him block than getting him the ball in space. Bernard's 56 receptions would seem to be testament to that.

[KDawg]

Bernard CAN block. That's the key point. Saying that they must first have the ability to block is different than saying it's the skill that must be their best.

[Koolblue13]

I think a lot of you missed the overall emphasis of my message... A third down back has to be able to block, catch and run. They don't have to be amazing in all three, but must be proficient.

My point wasn't that a third down back had to be some big bruiser... It was that Young could do it just fine, AND be effective.

don't worry buddy, we're on the same page.

[FuriousD]

Bernard CAN block. That's the key point. Saying that they must first have the ability to block is different than saying it's the skill that must be their best.

Hey, unbunch those panties, I wasn't challenging you. We're just talking... Perhaps I read a little too much into your using "primary asset, third down back and blocking", all in the same sentence.

But it's cool. I'm glad we agree that Bernard's primary assets are his hands and feet and not his blocking.

[Zazzaro703]

Why do you say seastrunk can try all he wants but he is no receiver? Catching the football isn't all that hard, especially when the RB normally slips out of the backfield and is uncovered. I've never understood how football players in the NFL can't catch a football especially when you can practice that.

[KDawg]

Hey, unbunch those panties, I wasn't challenging you. We're just talking... Perhaps I read a little too much into your using "primary asset, third down back and blocking", all in the same sentence.

But it's cool. I'm glad we agree that Bernard's primary assets are his hands and feet and not his blocking.

 

Alrighty then. Glad we could have a civil conversation.

[Die Hard]

I'm already camped out waitin for the chess match between Hazhole & Kyle.

[Die Hard]

Fuy

Rstxttyynss3yr:6fzd

Why do you say seastrunk can try all he wants but he is no receiver? Catching the football isn't all that hard, especially when the RB normally slips out of the backfield and is uncovered. I've never understood how football players in the NFL can't catch a football especiallyj when you can practice that.

[DaGoonie55]

I think it was your reference to third down backs re: first and foremost being able to block and blocking as a primary asset that got me thinking.

Giovani Bernards size, speed and athleticism obviously brought different dynamics to the role. His numbers would seem to suggest that Gruden was far less interested in having him block than getting him the ball in space. Bernard's 56 receptions would seem to be testament to that.

 

Great conversation back and forth between you and Coach K.

 

I would also add that you can't blitz a LB/DB when they are responsible for the RB coverage without the risk of getting gashed for huge gains.  A 3rd down back with hands is = a good blocking back IMO.  Sometimes, more so.  If we can get them ponies on the edge, we'll chew up yardage fast.

 

HAIL

[skinny21]

Great conversation back and forth between you and Coach K.

I would also add that you can't blitz a LB/DB when they are responsible for the RB coverage without the risk of getting gashed for huge gains. A 3rd down back with hands is = a good blocking back IMO. Sometimes, more so. If we can get them ponies on the edge, we'll chew up yardage fast.

HAIL

It's an interesting debate. 3rd and 3 or less, I'd trust DY between the tackles. 3rd and medium, I'd trust him to be able to catch the ball for a 1st. 3rd and long I'd trust his blocking to buy Robert time.

That's not taking anything away from our speedier backs, but bottom line, I think DY could absolutely handle the job. Not saying he should, just that he could. He wouldn't, however, fit the role of a change of pace back.

[LuRedskins]

That's not taking anything away from our speedier backs, but bottom line, I think DY could absolutely handle the job. Not saying he should, just that he could. He wouldn't, however, fit the role of a change of pace back.

 

 

Well technically he would, that pace would just be slower than normal

[darrelgreenie]

Cooley film breakdown of the 1st preseason game coming up next on ESPN 980.

[Conn]

Cooley film breakdown of the 1st preseason game coming up next on ESPN 980.

Anyone that would care to post a detailed recap of this, it would be greatly appreciated. I'm offering "likes" and the intangible, invaluable appreciation of a fellow fan.

[darrelgreenie]

Cooley's breakdown is up in the audiovault:

 

Click:

http://www.stationcaster.com/player_skinned.php?s=65&c=428&f=3193223

 

Click:

Redskins Media - ESPN 980

 

Click:

Aug 13 - Cooley film breakdown (23:24)

 

Quick-

Loves Keenan, says the coaches love him too.

~'Keenan played great'

 

RGIII-Went through his progression got to his checkdowns

 

Lauvao-good fit for ZBS; doesn't 'move' guys with power, lacks explosion but uses his hands/feet well

 

Morgan Moses-talked about him playing LT said he was consistent, can get bull rushed, shows good power,

has slow feet/hands though, says hands are easily correctable, fix those he's in great shape

RT-said Tyler is better right now but Moses could be better and could play RT now with help

 

Spencer Long-gets beat too often but will battle, Long is slower then Moses hands/feet not ready for the speed

 

Really, really likes Andre Roberts. Competes well, blocks well, gets after it in the run game. Robert and Kirk trust him. Gruden says he had a great camp, Thinks Roberts could be 2nd leading receiver on the team

[darrelgreenie]

Cooley break defense coming up on ESPN 980