We Have To Keep The Shanahans...

[Redskins Diehard]

He is responsible for the lousy OL we have now. If we give him the last year if his contract what is to say he doesn't use our cap space bringing in more undersized undervalued OL that won't fit for the next coach.

That's the next, you give him this offseason he is going to use that cap space and the team will be shaped in MS image for the next 3-5 years regardless of if he is here or not

there is nothing to suggest he is going to bring in a bunch of tiny offensive linemen and overpay them. and certainly nothing to suggest he is going to sign people that we will be stuck with for 5 years.

[Redskins Diehard]

Mortgaging the franchise for a QB that you can barely protect has nothing to do with a cap penalty

I love when people look at things in isolation.

what are some of the ways that you can take a team with bad players and turn it into a team with good players?

suppose 2 of the ways are "draft" and "free agency". now suppose you decide to go "all in" on the good old "franchise quarterback" by the using the draft. And the AFTER that decision is made you find out that you for all practical purposes CAN'T use free agency for anything other than tier 2 players. an 18 million penalty would allow us to spread 3 million over 6 positions the last 2 years. right now we have a 2 million a year center and 4 million a year guard. is it your contention that 5 million center and 7 million guard are of the same caliber?

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

there is nothing to suggest he is going to bring in a bunch of tiny offensive linemen and overpay them. and certainly nothing to suggest he is going to sign people that we will be stuck with for 5 years.

His scheme calls for it and FA nowadays is nothing but overpayment. If he is signing guys, he would be doing it with the idea that he'll be there to stay. He isn't going to sign guys to team-friendly deals that gives the team an out if he is fired. 

ask yourself this...what is the quickest way for the Redskins to make it back to a Super Bowl? Keep Shanahan and give him more time...stay the course.  Or hire another coach, another philosophy, having to bring in his players. etc. etc.  Maybe we see a Super Bowl by 2017 or 2018?  Look how long it took Bill Cowher to win a Super Bowl.  Years

Stay the course with a coach that annually starts 3-6, routinely has awful defenses, and is hit-or-miss with talent acquisition. That doesn't seem very close to a SB to me. 

 

And using other team's as examples proves nothing. How long did it take for the Harbaugh's to get to the SB?

[RG3Hunna]

For the fans who want to take the "Blow everything up and start all over" approach are you patient enough to wait 3 years for the new coaching staff to build a new offense and a new defense? more often than not new coaching regimes become disasters it's very rare to find a coaching staff who comes in and finds instant success. These are some things that you really need to think about ladies and gentleman.

 

If we fired the staff and brought in a new coaching staff and they had a lack of success like say a Greg Schiano then what? Blow it up and start all over again? Jason Garrett's regime hasn't had much success they have been a laughing stock since leaving the Bill Parcells regime. When Shanahan was fired in Denver and they hired McDaniels he destroyed the broncos and alienated their franchise QB and WR (Cutler & Marshall), these are some of the things we really need to think about.

 

When you terminate your coach you have to be sure without a shadow of a doubt.

 

Personally I feel the staff should stay together the only person i'm sure should be terminated without a shadow of a doubt is Jim Haslett he needs to go but the rest of the staff should stay. We need a new DC who runs a extremely aggressive 3-4 defense. 

[Redskins Diehard]

His scheme calls for it and FA nowadays is nothing but overpayment. If he is signing guys, he would be doing it with the idea that he'll be there to stay. He isn't going to sign guys to team-friendly deals that gives the team an out if he is fired.

his draft record is contrary to your assertion. and of course he isn't going to sign guys to team friendly deals so there is an out if he is fired. he is going to do it so he has an out if he isn't. I find it extremely agenda driven to assert that he is going to overpay for linemen that nobody else wants. But that is a pretty common theme in most of these threads

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

For the fans who want to take the "Blow everything up and start all over" approach are you patient enough to wait 3 years for the new coaching staff to build a new offense and a new defense? more often than not new coaching regimes become disasters it's very rare to find a coaching staff who comes in and finds instant success. These are some things that you really need to think about ladies and gentleman.

 

If we fired the staff and brought in a new coaching staff and they had a lack of success like say a Greg Schiano then what? Blow it up and start all over again? Jason Garrett's regime hasn't had much success they have been a laughing stock since leaving the Bill Parcells regime. When Shanahan was fired in Denver and they hired McDaniels he destroyed the broncos and alienated their franchise QB and WR (Cutler & Marshall), these are some of the things we really need to think about.

 

When you terminate your coach you have to be sure without a shadow of a doubt.

 

Personally I feel the staff should stay together the only person i'm sure should be terminated without a shadow of a doubt is Jim Haslett he needs to go but the rest of the staff should stay. We need a new DC who runs a extremely aggressive 3-4 defense. 

This post operates on the idea that the anti-Shanahan crowd was ready for him to leave after one season. DUDE IT'S BEEN FOUR SEASONS. I gave him the benefit of the doubt in 2010, 2011, and 2012 (only because it was RGIII's first season) but now it's 2013 and we seem the same ol' ****. We've been patient with him. It's not like it's his first season. Your Schiano comparison is a joke. He's been there for just two seasons. Your Shanahan in Denver example is bad as well since the Broncos weren't good in his last few seasons.

 

We gave Shanny plenty of time. If we get a new coach and he'll get the same leash (at least with me). If by year four, the squad is still hoping for late season miracle runs, then he should be gone as well

[Redskins Diehard]

This post operates on the idea that the anti-Shanahan crowd was ready for him to leave after one season. DUDE IT'S BEEN FOUR SEASONS. I gave him the benefit of the doubt in 2010, 2011, and 2012 (only because it was RGIII's first season) but now it's 2013 and we seem the same ol' ****. We've been patient with him. It's not like it's his first season. Your Schiano comparison is a joke. He's been there for just two seasons. Your Shanahan in Denver example is bad as well since the Broncos weren't good in his last few seasons.

We gave Shanny plenty of time. If we get a new coach and he'll get the same leash (at least with me). If by year four, the squad is still hoping for late season miracle runs, then he should be gone as well

it's been 3.5 seasons. and one of those was a division championship. Something we had seen 1 time in the prior 20 years. sure, let's start over every 4 yours.

[RG3Hunna]

This post operates on the idea that the anti-Shanahan crowd was ready for him to leave after one season. DUDE IT'S BEEN FOUR SEASONS. I gave him the benefit of the doubt in 2010, 2011, and 2012 (only because it was RGIII's first season) but now it's 2013 and we seem the same ol' ****. We've been patient with him. It's not like it's his first season. Your Schiano comparison is a joke. He's been there for just two seasons. Your Shanahan in Denver example is bad as well since the Broncos weren't good in his last few seasons.

 

We gave Shanny plenty of time. If we get a new coach and he'll get the same leash (at least with me). If by year four, the squad is still hoping for late season miracle runs, then he should be gone as well

That's my point the way you seem to want to run the franchise is STUPID. Fire shanahan hire a new staff if they struggle by year 4 which is more likely to happen then you want them fired as well?! lol

 

Marvin Lewis Bengals Coach 2003-present day

 

2003 8-8

2004 8-8

2005 11-5 bounced out the playoffs no wins

2006 8-8

2007 7-9

2008 4-11-1

2009 10-6 bounced out the playoffs no wins

2010 4-12

2011 9-7 bounced out the playoffs no wins

2012 10-6 bounced out the playoffs no wins

2013 6-3

 

The bengals (prior to Mike Brown deciding continuity wins and staying with lewis) and browns were the two laughing stock franchises of the NFL the bengals decided continuity while the browns decided your strategy "Push the reset button if we don't build a consistent winner by year 4" 

 

The bengals are number 1 in their division while the browns will finish the season last in their division AGAIN. hahaha

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

That's my point the way you seem to want to run the franchise is STUPID. Fire shanahan hire a new staff if they struggle by year 4 which is more likely to happen then you want them fired as well?! lol

 

Marvin Lewis Bengals Coach 2003-present day

 

2003 8-8

2004 8-8

2005 11-5 bounced out the playoffs no wins

2006 8-8

2007 7-9

2008 4-11-1

2009 10-6 bounced out the playoffs no wins

2010 4-12

2011 9-7 bounced out the playoffs no wins

2012 10-6 bounced out the playoffs no wins

2013 6-3

 

The bengals (prior to Mike Brown deciding continuity wins and staying with lewis) and browns were the two laughing stock franchises of the NFL the bengals decided continuity while the browns decided your strategy "Push the reset button if we don't build a consistent winner by year 4" 

 

The bengals are number 1 in their division while the browns will finish the season last in their division AGAIN. hahaha

Dude. Are you seriously using the Bengals and Marvin Lewis as a serious example. How many coaches in the NFL get that kind of leash for mediocrity? That is an exception and a dumb one on the Bengals part as they still haven't won a playoff game and are currently getting smacked by a ****ty Ravens team and loss to a weak Miami team last week. 

 

Is that we are striving for? Mediocrity? Sorry, I'll pass.

 

If you can use that example, I'll use Pete Carroll, John and Jim Harbaugh, and Chuck Pagano. They sure started winning pretty quick (and they even won playoff games!! lol).

[Redskins Diehard]

Dude. Are you seriously using the Bengals and Marvin Lewis as a serious example. How many coaches in the NFL get that kind of leash for mediocrity? That is an exception and a dumb one on the Bengals part as they still haven't won a playoff game and are currently getting smacked by a ****ty Ravens team and loss to a weak Miami team last week.

Is that we are striving for? Mediocrity? Sorry, I'll pass.

If you can use that example, I'll use Pete Carroll, John and Jim Harbaugh, and Chuck Pagano. They sure started winning pretty quick (and they even won playoff games!! lol).

pagano is on his way to an ass whooping by st louis....FIRE HIM. and hw doesn't get credit for last year for any victories except his triumph over cancer.

[RG3Hunna]

Dude. Are you seriously using the Bengals and Marvin Lewis as a serious example. How many coaches in the NFL get that kind of leash for mediocrity? That is an exception and a dumb one on the Bengals part as they still haven't won a playoff game and are currently getting smacked by a ****ty Ravens team and loss to a weak Miami team last week. 

 

Is that we are striving for? Mediocrity? Sorry, I'll pass.

 

If you can use that example, I'll use Pete Carroll, John and Jim Harbaugh, and Chuck Pagano. They sure started winning pretty quick (and they even won playoff games!! lol).

That's my point Pete Carroll John and Jim Harbaugh and Chuck Pagano are RARE what do you not get? They are as rare as drafting a QB and having instant success with that QB. Just because the seahawks colts ravens and 49ers had instant success does not mean we are going to have instant success. When have you EVER seen a washington franchise have instant success with anything? If you really think we're going to hire a new staff and magically the wins are going to come pouring in you have to be delusional.

 

You stay the course Mike Shanahan has created an identity with his team which is an semi explosive offense, no reason to blow it up and let a new regime build a new offense and defense. All that needs to be done is haslett needs to be fired and we need to build a new defense that's where our problems stem from. 

pagano is on his way to an ass whooping by st louis....FIRE HIM. and hw doesn't get credit for last year for any victories except his triumph over cancer.

The "great Pagano"

 

Exactly and that guy lucked up on Andrew Luck and the weakest divison/schedule I have seen in quite some time. I'm sure we would be 6-3 too if we played the jaguars titans and texans twice every season. lol 

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

pagano is on his way to an ass whooping by st louis....FIRE HIM. and hw doesn't get credit for last year for any victories except his triumph over cancer.

 

Except his team is a legit SB contender that has defeated other sb contenders this season

 

That's my point Pete Carroll John and Jim Harbaugh and Chuck Pagano are RARE what do you not get? They are as rare as drafting a QB and having instant success with that QB. Just because the seahawks colts ravens and 49ers had instant success does not mean we are going to have instant success. When have you EVER seen a washington franchise have instant success with anything? If you really think we're going to hire a new staff and magically the wins are going to come pouring in you have to be delusional.

 

You stay the course Mike Shanahan has created an identity with his team which is an semi explosive offense, no reason to blow it up and let a new regime build a new offense and defense. All that needs to be done is haslett needs to be fired and we need to build a new defense that's where our problems stem from. 

holy **** dude...my point was a team keeping a mediocre coach like Lewis past his contract is just as rare as having instant success. Read. Damn. 

 

So if you're going to use Lewis as an example, I can use Harbaugh and co as well.

 

Shanahan has sucked for the majority of his tenure here. What identity does he have? One of losing? He has been here four years. Most coaches don't even get that far. He's had plenty of time. 

 

And if you blame Haslett for why the team sucks, then you have to blame Shanahan since he is the head coach that brought him here, kept him here, and has given him the players that are underachieving with him. 

[Redskins Diehard]

Except his team is a legit SB contender that has defeated other sb contenders this season

We were 3-0 against not super bowl contenders but actual Super Bowl winners the last 2 years.

Out of curiosity...where do you draw the line at "legit contender"?

And you really should consider recognizing that there is a lot of year 4 left to play out. the last full season was the first division championship in a decade. only the 2d in 2 decades. if you don't think that is dramatically different than the zorn culture then you just are committed to change. which has proven to yield marginal results

[BraunMan92]

Fire him.

 

We need Offensive and Defensive Linemen who drive their men 5 yards back and onto the turf off the snap.  Power football.  Stop trying to play tiddlywinks with the ENEMY.  SEEK AND DESTROY.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

We were 3-0 against not super bowl contenders but actual Super Bowl winners the last 2 years.

Out of curiosity...where do you draw the line at "legit contender"?

agree that is a subjective term but guess i mean teams like SEA, SF, DEN, etc. (i.e. strong records at the time).

 

Colts (with the exception of today) are good-to-decent on both sides of the ball and feature an elite QB. They destroy team they are supposed to (except today lol) and find ways to beat the ones that are top flight while not having to rely on improbable late season streaks to make the playoffs

Fire him.

 

We need Offensive and Defensive Linemen who drive their men 5 yards back and onto the turf off the snap.  Power football.  Stop trying to play tiddlywinks with the ENEMY.  SEEK AND DESTROY.

 

 x10000

[Redskins Diehard]

agree that is a subjective term but guess i mean teams like SEA, SF, DEN, etc. (i.e. strong records at the time).

Colts (with the exception of today) are good-to-decent on both sides of the ball and feature an elite QB. They destroy team they are supposed to (except today lol) and find ways to beat the ones that are top flight while not having to rely on improbable late season streaks to make the playoffs

x10000

if the streak is "improbable" then that gives even more credit to the coaching staff. they beat the eventual super bowl champ. they won a game with their backup rookie qb.

the colts have played 9 games under pagano. in 10 percent of all games he gets not beat but embarrassed by poor teams.

fire him

[RG3Hunna]

Except his team is a legit SB contender that has defeated other sb contenders this season

 

holy **** dude...my point was a team keeping a mediocre coach like Lewis past his contract is just as rare as having instant success. Read. Damn. 

 

So if you're going to use Lewis as an example, I can use Harbaugh and co as well.

 

Shanahan has sucked for the majority of his tenure here. What identity does he have? One of losing? He has been here four years. Most coaches don't even get that far. He's had plenty of time. 

 

And if you blame Haslett for why the team sucks, then you have to blame Shanahan since he is the head coach that brought him here, kept him here, and has given him the players that are underachieving with him. 

I gave blame to Shanahan for hiring Haslett but we have won an NFCeast crown we hadn't done that in almost 20 freaking years until shanny came here. We didn't even accomplish that when the messiah Joe Gibbs was here.

 

I just don't overreact like most who use emotion to make their decision. Sure 3-6 sucks but you nor I can sit here and say things haven't improved since Shanny has been here.

 

If you were expecting us to be 6-3 with the worst defense in the league and a QB who has been up and down due to injury/knee brace, then you were the foolish one for not being reasonable.

 

I still think we finish the season 7-9 and next year we take hold of the NFCeast and win it because we will have cap to fix the defense and the RT spot.  

 

Most people predicted for us to take a step back and now that we're taking a step back the "Homers" are having a nervous breakdown because we're actually taking a step back?

 

Even Tom Brady looked like TRASH when he came back from his ACL injury. 

[BraunMan92]

Indianapolis FINISHED THE KILL on Denver.  We couldn't even close the kill on the Vikings.

 

We could not do this.

 

Yet Indianapolis got beaten by San Diego, who we handled.

 

Go figure.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

if the streak is "improbable" then that gives even more credit to the coaching staff. they beat the eventual super bowl champ. they won a game with their backup rookie qb.

the colts have played 9 games under pagano. in 10 percent of all games he gets not beat but embarrassed by poor teams.

fire him

Once again, your sarcasm only works if Mike had been here for like a year or two. No. FOUR YEARS. I will go on a limb and say 80% of the ppl that voted "no" in the poll above gave him the benefit of the doubt the first three seasons. Patience isn't the problem here

I gave blame to Shanahan for hiring Haslett but we have won an NFCeast crown we hadn't done that in almost 20 freaking years until shanny came here. We didn't even accomplish that when the messiah Joe Gibbs was here.

 

I just don't overreact like most who use emotion to make their decision. Sure 3-6 sucks but you nor I can sit here and say things haven't improved since Shanny has been here.

 

If you were expecting us to be 6-3 with the worst defense in the league and a QB who has been up and down due to injury/knee brace, then you were the foolish one for not being reasonable.

 

I still think we finish the season 7-9 and next year we take hold of the NFCeast and win it because we will have cap to fix the defense and the RT spot.  

 

Most people predicted for us to take a step back and now that we're taking a step back the "Homers" are having a nervous breakdown because we're actually taking a step back?

 

Even Tom Brady looked like TRASH when he came back from his ACL injury. 

Once again, if this current convo was happening in 2010 or 2011, this argument would make sense. But unfortunately it is 2013 and four years in. This is not being reactionary or emotional. We've been patient for four seasons. As I've stated before, most coaches don't even sniff a third year after the start that Shanahan had. Finally, I am striving for something bigger than just division titles. Yeah we are better than maybe 5-7 years ago but honestly, is being crap better than ****? Is it? 

[PapaLazarou]

Marvin Lewis this, Tom Brady that. Stop clutching at straws and look at the product on the field right now.

[BraunMan92]

Once again, your sarcasm only works if Mike had been here for like a year or two. No. FOUR YEARS. I will go on a limb and say 80% of the ppl that voted "no" in the poll above gave him the benefit of the doubt the first three seasons. Patience isn't the problem here

Once again, if this current convo was happening in 2010 or 2011, this argument would make sense. But unfortunately it is 2013 and four years in. This is not being reactionary or emotional. We've been patient for four seasons. As I've stated before, most coaches don't even sniff a third year after the start that Shanahan had. Finally, I am striving for something bigger than just division titles. Yeah we are better than maybe 5-7 years ago but honestly, is being crap better than ****? Is it? 

 

 

The thing is - last year Shanahan brought about the CODE OF THE WARRIOR with the team the last half of the season.  Discipline and curfews were instilled - and players were ready to go fight each Sunday and play with guts and heart.

 

Something happened in the locker room this off-season - that has the players questioning Mike as their Chief Warrior.  They are no longer willing to fight with 100 percent of what they have, and it shows.

[Redskins Diehard]

Once again, your sarcasm only works if Mike had been here forlike a year or two. No. FOUR YEARS. I will go on a limb and say 80% of the ppl that voted "no" in the poll above gave him the benefit of the doubt the first three seasons. Patience isn't the problem here

Alright...since you can't be convinced that year 4 is not finished then you go ahead and rant on and on about FOUR YEARS.. You may as well just say all 5 years of his tenure have been bad. And ignore the fact that one of the 3 complete seasons was in fact a Division championship. we should also pretend like that didn't happen.

clearly if you are going to choose to ignore the good. focus only on the bad. and then exaggerate that. I can see how folks reach a particular conclusion

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

The thing is - last year Shanahan brought about the CODE OF THE WARRIOR with the team the last half of the season.  Discipline and curfews were instilled - and players were ready to go fight each Sunday and play with guts and heart.

 

Something happened in the locker room this off-season - that has the players questioning Mike as their Chief Warrior.  They are no longer willing to fight with 100 percent of what they have, and it shows.

....wow lol.

 

You are probably a very intense dude in real life arent you?

[RG3Hunna]

Once again, your sarcasm only works if Mike had been here for like a year or two. No. FOUR YEARS. I will go on a limb and say 80% of the ppl that voted "no" in the poll above gave him the benefit of the doubt the first three seasons. Patience isn't the problem here

Once again, if this current convo was happening in 2010 or 2011, this argument would make sense. But unfortunately it is 2013 and four years in. This is not being reactionary or emotional. We've been patient for four seasons. As I've stated before, most coaches don't even sniff a third year after the start that Shanahan had. Finally, I am striving for something bigger than just division titles. Yeah we are better than maybe 5-7 years ago but honestly, is being crap better than ****? Is it? 

Most coaches don't sniff a third year? And those are franchises who continue to lose that is my point what do you not understand? Sure lets fire a coach every 3-4 years if we don't have instant success because that will lead us to the superbowl........

 

This isn't a sprint it's a marathon you're going to have years where you are terrible if things are improving (even if you aren't having instant success) you stick with it. Once things aren't improving but are getting worse (Haslett) that's when you terminate the coach.

 

You even admitted things are better than they were 5-7 years ago so that proves you agree with me things have improved which means you would be insane to terminate something that is improving simply because it's not improving fast enough.

 

So when you fire shanahan and hire a new coach and if that coach doesn't improve fast enough in 4 years you want to terminate him again? by then RGIII is in year 6-7 of his career asking to be traded because we're a mess.

 

The problem is the defense we need to fix the defense....He (haslett) needs to be terminated and players on defense need to be replaced, you keep the rest of the coaching staff intact because they have improved the offense but you totally rebuild the defense. 

[Redskins Diehard]

Once again, your sarcasm only works if Mike had been here for like a year or two. No. FOUR YEARS. I will go on a limb and say 80% of the ppl that voted "no" in the poll above gave him the benefit of the doubt the first three seasons. Patience isn't the problem here

Once again, if this current convo was happening in 2010 or 2011, this argument would make sense. But unfortunately it is 2013 and four years in. This is not being reactionary or emotional. We've been patient for four seasons. As I've stated before, most coaches don't even sniff a third year after the start that Shanahan had. Finally, I am striving for something bigger than just division titles. Yeah we are better than maybe 5-7 years ago but honestly, is being crap better than ****? Is it?

dude, learn to count. and be honest that year 3 was hardly a "failure"