suffolkUniversity: Paul second in NH!!

[visionary]

Back to the newsletter thing.

I don't think Paul's a racist and anyone who uses that to label him as one is being unfair.

That said, it's a bit worriesome that he published it for years and now he says he never read it.

To use the Wright example, it would be kind of like if Obama were head of the church and Wright were a constant guest speaker.

I don't think this means he's necessarily racist, but it sure leaves his judgment in doubt.

Not trying to pile on Paul, but this has been nagging at the back of my mind a bit since I heard him say it.

[SnyderShrugged]

Back to the newsletter thing.

I don't think Paul's a racist and anyone who uses that to label him as one is being unfair.

That said, it's a bit worriesome that he published it for years and now he says he never read it.

To use the Wright example, it would be kind of like if Obama were head of the church and Wright were a constant guest speaker.

I don't think this means he's necessarily racist, but it sure leaves his judgment in doubt.

Not trying to pile on Paul, but this has been nagging at the back of my mind a bit since I heard him say it.

He was saying that he never read it before it published, I think.

[twa]

Well, odds that any of them would still be alive by then were . . .

did newt make it?...heard he was struggling

[GibbsFactor]

did newt make it?...heard he was struggling

He got it.

Romney, Paul, Perry, Newt in order of signatures.

[SnyderShrugged]

did newt make it?...heard he was struggling

I've gotta assume so. I'm sure the article would have mentioned it if he hadnt

[visionary]

He was saying that he never read it before it published, I think.

I admit I may be misremembering what he said, but I recall it striking me as kind of an odd thing to say at the time.

It just seems like he ought to have been paying more attention. I don't know, maybe I'm making too much out of this.

[SnyderShrugged]

I admit I may be misremembering what he said, but I recall it striking me as kind of an odd thing to say at the time.

It just seems like he ought to have been paying more attention. I don't know, maybe I'm making too much out of this.

You are:)

He wasnt even in politics at the time and was a full time medical doctor. He's on record for taking moral responsibility for the lack of oversight at the time and disavows all the writings with both his words and actions.

I know I'm biased so it will mean bunk, but I trust him on it, even if I think it's been handled poorly.

[Hubbs]

I admit I may be misremembering what he said, but I recall it striking me as kind of an odd thing to say at the time.

It just seems like he ought to have been paying more attention. I don't know, maybe I'm making too much out of this.

Eh, I don't even agree with SS on this one, it seems to me that you're making about the correct amount of "much" about this.

It was a dumb thing to do. He shouldn't have let anything go out with his name on it before reading it first. And I would hope that, in private, he not only chewed out whoever wrote the newsletters for including such incredibly toxic statements, but also for believing such things in the first place. But that's about as far as it goes.

[twa]

He was saying that he never read it before it published, I think.

on the other hand his partner claims it was faxed to paul and signed off on everytime(which does not mean he read it of course)

back in those days it was rather much;) less well read,perhaps the level of a minor blog today and I doubt Paul put too much oversight in.

it is nothing but a distraction and of no real importance.

Paul is not,and has never been a racist(I have even witnessed his condemnation of some back in the day)

about as much to this as Perry's rock

[GibbsFactor]

I admit I may be misremembering what he said, but I recall it striking me as kind of an odd thing to say at the time.

It just seems like he ought to have been paying more attention. I don't know, maybe I'm making too much out of this.

From what I can tell, he had gotten out of politics, fresh off his 88 Presidential campaign and started practicing medicine again. During this time, the newsletter was published to take advantage of his new popularity with libertarians.

I would have known what was on those letters. Perhaps he truly had no interest in getting back into politics at the time and let those that helped his campaigning use his name. If this is true, it's still a lack of judgment and forward thought.

At this moment it seems clear that Paul wants to quickly move past this and hopes it will simply go away. He needs to come up with something better than just saying he didn't write them and has disavowed them. His campaign had to know this was coming, it always comes up.

However, Paul has always been steadfast in his ideology that he's an individualist and that prevents him from being a bigot in any way. While true, he needs to solidify his language on that.

[CurseReversed]

Change is a good thing in general, but not all changes are for the better. Demonstrating problems that the current system has, standing alone, will never persuade me that Ron Paul's particular ideas can't be far worse. :whoknows:

They could be far worse, anything can happen. The future is uncertain. There is no perfect answer. We cannot control the ends, only the means.

Critics like yourself, build a libertarian world based upon ron pauls philosophy and ridicule it as impossible or insane because compared to what we have today, it would be.

Unfortunately once you realize that what we have now is borderline insane in itself, you know that in order to fix it we must reverse engines and head towards sanity with a philosophy that would seem insane in comparison. Truth is at its extremes it might be, but we wont get there.

There will be a middle ground, there always is. We are not going to end the power of the federal government, no matter how many people say we need too. It would be nice for sure, but there will always be a struggle, we just happen to be sorely losing ours right now.

We are losing so bad our government doesn't even print its own currency, a bunch of people we dont even know who answer to nobody do. You can say what you want, the proof is out there, they are printing dollars and giving them to whomever they please, our currency is no longer sovereign.

Our problem is that moving our current middle ground towards sanity with anything other then a true limited government philosophy is the same as trying to kill a bear with a pair of toenail clippers. We have to envision a radical new world without big government, that might even scare people like you, to even begin to fight back the enormous tsunami of big government insanity that is currently crashing on us.

How many more trillions do the FED have to print keeping this sham together, before we realize that we need to get radical, and the followers of liberty need to get cult like and evangelical to shake the sense into the rest of the world.

If we truely believe our cause is just, and that the threats are real, then we paul supporters are truely under emphasizing the importance of ron paul. If thats even possible.

[Predicto]

Good post. You cleverly illustrated the cultish aspects of the Ron Paul movement better than I ever could.

oh wait, that post was for real?

[GibbsFactor]

s

Good post. You cleverly illustrated the cultish aspects of the Ron Paul movement better than I ever could.

oh wait, that post was for real?

Change we can actually believe in.

[Jumbo]

I guess I'll go with P on the deal that there are a number (not a majority at all) of Paul supporters that do give a cult feel to the whole shmear (since no one liked my "Paul acolytes are like the Juggalos of Politics" idea). :pfft:

Really, while I think cult is 50/50 stretch/loosely-applicable-in-ways label for the more flighty of the breed, I think the same of many Palinheads and past Obamaphants. It's mixing an ideology with a personality and raising the combo to a cult-like level of more deep (sometimes fevered) emotional attachment and a impassioned lens (often kept under control but still in operation) and all that comes with that (like "extra" sensitivity, defensiveness, skewed percpetion, delusion (mild to serious), instability, etc).

<ducks>

[GibbsFactor]

I guess I'll go with P on the deal that there are a number (not a majority at all) of Paul supporters that do give a cult feel to the whole shmear (since no one liked my "Paul acolytes are like the Juggalos of Politics" idea). :pfft:

Really, while I think cult is 50/50 stretch/loosely-applicable-in-ways label for the more flighty of the breed, I think the same of many Palinheads and past Obamaphants. It's mixing an ideology with a personality and raising the combo to a cult-like level of more deep (sometimes fevered) emotional attachment and a impassioned lens (often kept under control but still in operation) and all that comes with that (like "extra" sensitivity, defensiveness, skewed percpetion, delusion (mild to serious), instability, etc).

<ducks>

I'll admit that it pains me to see him misstep. For what that's worth.

[twa]

I'll admit that it pains me to see him misstep. For what that's worth.

Tis just a emotional investment and the byproduct of unmet needs in the political sphere....perfectly harmless unless ya have more than one bumpersticker

[Willy Wonka]

I really hope that the supporters of a person don't hold too much of a bearing on whether one agrees or disagrees with what someone is saying, as that would be very illogical. In other words, I disagree with Obama all of the time because of the things he says and does, not because of what one of his supporters says or does.

[GibbsFactor]

Tis just a emotional investment and the byproduct of unmet needs in the political sphere....perfectly harmless unless ya have more than one bumpersticker

I've got a signed cookbook from Mrs. Paul.

:paranoid:

Actually, I helped his 08 campaign but marriage has prevented me this time around. I'm glad to see the fruits of my labor.

[CurseReversed]

Its funny because I used to be on the other side looking in. I would probably say the same things, ridiculing the impracticality of a libertarian philosophy and making fun of the fantasy world of conspiracy.

Then I stopped inherently trusting our government.

Things became a lot more clear after that. I stopped playing politics and saw things for what they were. I did not like what I saw. I did not see effective and efficient governance. I saw what can be best described as a system of rackets. I saw the majority of our problems being endorsed by both parties, and not even really debated in the mainstream media. Big problems, problems that I believe put our very way of life in jeopardy. Does that sound spooky? Actually believing that this country can fail, and it will be government spending that does it. Maybe I can see how that would seem cultish. Very doomsdayish.

It is not as easy as you think to see something right in front of you sometimes. We have very powerful programming. Both internally and externally imposed. Seeing the current state of the federal government for what it is and then acknowledging what it is doing, takes a break from what most of us have lived and believed our whole lives. It is not easy. So when you do it, it has a strong effect. That is why ron paul supporters dont oscillate between candidates. That is why they seem cultish.

They know, I know, I hope you will soon too. "Limit the government" *chant* *chant*

[GibbsFactor]

Its funny because I used to be on the other side looking in. I would probably say the same things, ridiculing the impracticality of a libertarian philosophy and making fun of the fantasy world of conspiracy.

Then I stopped inherently trusting our government.

Things became a lot more clear after that. I stopped playing politics and saw things for what they were. I did not like what I saw. I did not see effective and efficient governance. I saw what can be best described as a system of rackets. I saw the majority of our problems being endorsed by both parties, and not even really debated in the mainstream media. Big problems, problems that I believe put our very way of life in jeopardy. Does that sound spooky? Actually believing that this country can fail, and it will be government spending that does it. Maybe I can see how that would seem cultish. Very doomsdayish.

It is not as easy as you think to see something right in front of you sometimes. We have very powerful programming. Both internally and externally imposed. Seeing the current state of the federal government for what it is and then acknowledging what it is doing, takes a break from what most of us have lived and believed our whole lives. It is not easy. So when you do it, it has a strong effect. That is why ron paul supporters dont oscillate between candidates. That is why they seem cultish.

They know, I know, I hope you will soon too. "Limit the government" *chant* *chant*

It's true in a lot of ways. Ron Paul's support is driven by those that believe we can fail and will some day. Like by the middle of the century. We could completely destroy the dollar at the rate we are going.

Then all that we have will be worthless overnight. No thanks.

[twa]

I've got a signed cookbook from Mrs. Paul.

:paranoid:

Actually, I helped his 08 campaign but marriage has prevented me this time around. I'm glad to see the fruits of my labor.

I got cookies from Mrs Paul,and helped his 78 campaign....he's come a long way...no regrets

[PeterMP]

Did you guys know that Ron Paul accepts campaign funds from openly racist and separtists groups and refuses to return them?

http://www.americanthinker.com/2007/11/the_ron_paul_campaign_and_its.html

This stuff is going to keep "leaking" out:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/12/23/us-usa-campaign-paul-plots-idUSTRE7BM03320111223

"A direct-mail solicitation for Ron Paul's political and investment newsletters two decades ago warned of a "coming race war in our big cities" and of a "federal-homosexual cover-up" to play down the impact of AIDS.

The eight-page letter, which appears to carry Paul's signature at the end, also warns that the U.S. government's redesign of currency to include different colors - a move aimed at thwarting counterfeiters - actually was part of a plot to allow the government to track Americans using the "new money.""

Paul would be best off just releasing whatever records he has on the newletters, including old copies, and being done with it. I think the biggest stuff that will come out is not the racist stuff, but the "end of the world" "new world order" conspiracy stuff.

[GibbsFactor]

Did you guys know that Ron Paul accepts campaign funds from openly racist and separtists groups and refuses to return them?

http://www.americanthinker.com/2007/11/the_ron_paul_campaign_and_its.html

This stuff is going to keep "leaking" out:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/12/23/us-usa-campaign-paul-plots-idUSTRE7BM03320111223

Paul would be best off just releasing whatever records he has on the newletters, including old copies, and being done with it. I think the biggest stuff that will come out is not the racist stuff, but the "end of the world" stuff.

I heard a lot of whacky **** from Paul supporters. A lot of them were pretty scary in their twist of conspiracy. I'm not big on conspiracies, too hard to keep quiet, impossible, actually.

But there were truthers and every other kind of conspiracy theorist together with anti-war people, end the fed people, end the war on drug group, the young professional, etc..

If you guys want some wild stories, pray that Ron Paul's momentum grows.

[Larry]

Did you guys know that Ron Paul accepts campaign funds from openly racist and separtists groups and refuses to return them?

So would I.

Remembering a Mark Twain story. Seems that the local preacher came to him, because the local bootlegger wanted to make a big donation to the church. (Maybe the guy was getting old, and he figured that donating a lot of money to the church would get him into Heaven, or something.)

The preacher admitted that the church really could use the money for a new roof. But he was reluctant to accept it, because he felt that it was tainted money.

Twain: You're darned right it's tainted money. T'aint yours and t'aint mine.

[CurseReversed]

I heard a lot of whacky **** from Paul supporters. A lot of them were pretty scary in their twist of conspiracy. I'm not big on conspiracies, too hard to keep quiet, impossible, actually.

But there were truthers and every other kind of conspiracy theorist together with anti-war people, end the fed people, end the war on drug group, the young professional, etc..

If you guys want some wild stories, pray that Ron Paul's momentum grows.

Funny I am part of all those groups. Those anti-fed people are especially loony, steer clear of them.