Poor People

[DeaconTheVillain]

In your opinion, what is the main reason for poverty/poor people in western countries.

Anyone watch Colbert last night?? Excellent (as always)

Damn forgot to make poll public. OK, I think the majority are unlucky and somewhat lazy.

I say unlucky because poor people don't get the same opportunities to education that others get. Its no secret education is a joke in low income areas. I said somewhat lazy because if the inherit genetics are there, and the IQ is average, people can work hard and get out of their unfortunate situation.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

What exactly does that mean, "product of environment"?

[Pick6]

I went with product of their environment. In most cases it is just an endless cycle that goes from one generation to the next. There are programs in place to try to correct some of this, but it is never enough.

[DeaconTheVillain]

What exactly does that mean, "product of environment"?

Born poor, stay poor. Can't get out of the projects. Trapped in the ghetto.

[dockeryfan]

Product of environment could mean different things to different people.

Usually, it a combination of bad luck and circumstance.

I know a guy who is a skilled carpenter, mechanic, cabinet maker, knows a bit about HVAC, etc. He'll do most any job, and no one would ever call this guy lazy. Well he never had a ton of money to begin with, had a bunch of health problems that wiped his bank account and is flat broke.

So what is this guy? Lazy? Product of environment? There are a ton of people just like this guy, and I'd be willing to bet that a majority of this board could be in the exact same situation as this guy if things went south.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

Born poor, stay poor. Can't get out of the projects. Trapped in the ghetto.

Got ya. That's what I thought, just wanted to make sure.

Well, as a poor person this should be interesting.

[Henry]

All of the above.

Just like rich people.

[mardi gras skin]

Most poor people I know are lazy. Or, they prefer being poor to the rigorous changes they would have to make to become middle class.

[TimmySmith]

Bad money management. Which could really be a product of upbringing.

[Drew_Fl]

i wish there were an option for "Product of environment and lack of self-confidence". It seems like many people are capable of a lot but doubt themselves b/c of where and how they are brought up and never fulfill the potential.

[Kilmer17]

All of the above.

Just like rich people.

Ding Ding Ding!

[Kosher Ham]

Yeah, Henry nailed it.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

Lack of money and/or assets.

[mardi gras skin]

I don't think poor people are the same as rich people. It could be environment, upbringing, intellect, genetics. I have no idea. But the effort it takes to create and maintain wealth is much greater than the effort it takes to remain poor. Leaving out those who are emotionally or mentally incapable of functioning in society, effort seems to be primary hinderance to prosperity.

Now, by "wealthy" I'm talking about the vast majority of Americans who can afford cars, flat screen tvs, cell phones, plenty of food, rent or own a private residence of some sort, can buy a $2 coffee on a whim. From my point of view, most Americans are crazy wealthy.

There are very few people that I work with who don't have a clear path to economic prosperity if they want it. The ones who remain poor don't want it.

[Hunter44]

Education, poor people are usually not "educated".

[Henry]

But the effort it takes to create and maintain wealth is much greater than the effort it takes to remain poor.

That's only a valid point if every rich person was once poor.

While I agree that people who go from rags to riches do so through extraordinary effort, I doubt, say, Paris Hilton works any harder than I do and she's far wealthier than I am, or probably ever will be (though I am not poor).

[War Paint]

I think it's mostly bad luck and that our country has outsourced jobs to other countries. While some may be lazy, I really don't think that's the main problem. A construction worker is busting his butt a lot harder than one of the Kardashians.

[Commander PK]

My cousin has a master's degree, and can't find a job. Right now he is poor.

What does that mean?

[pointyfootball]

What's the definition of poor? As I see it, it's someone who relies upon governmental, or private, assistance because they are unable or unwilling to provide for themself, or their family. Seems like common barriers to getting out of a situation like that are:

* health

* education

* availability of decent income

* mobility

* work ethic/motivation

* other "anchors" (children, prior arrest, etc.)

The level of effort for someone that has grown up in very poor area, maybe in a single-parent household, where education is substandard, and jobs are low-level pay, will be much higher than for someone who grows up in middle-class suburbia in a good school system with college-educated parents.

[pointyfootball]

A construction worker is busting his butt a lot harder than one of the Kardashians.

I don't think so....she busts her butt...have you seen it?

[PCS]

Well, as a poor person this should be interesting.

That's my thinking too.

[Commander PK]

Why is Paris Hilton rich?

People who live off of the hard work of their ancestors have no place to judge anybody who is poor/lower class and wasn't lucky enough to be born with a silver spoon in their mouth.

The reason people are poor, is because there can't be somebody on top unless there is somebody on the bottom. The guy who owns waste management has to have employees that drive the trucks.

Sure, some people are poor through sheer laziness, and some rich people are also lazy. There are a number of reasons why some people don't succeed financially in life.

[pointyfootball]

My cousin has a master's degree, and can't find a job. Right now he is poor.

What does that mean?

I would think that the degree was not worth it, depending upon how long he's been looking for a job. You're saying he can't find ANY job, or just not any that he wants. I wouldn't consider him poor, as he should be able to make it on his own, even if he has to work two jobs that pay $7/hour and share an apartment. Poor to me, is different than what others think, I guess.

[mardi gras skin]

That's only a valid point if every rich person was once poor.

While I agree that people who go from rags to riches do so through extraordinary effort, I doubt, say, Paris Hilton works any harder than I do and she's far wealthier than I am, or probably ever will be (though I am not poor).

There are precious few people wealthy enough to remain wealthy without putting any effort into it. Certainly, Paris Hilton is not the standard we should use to contrast against the average poor person.

My parents come from southeast, dirt-poor Georgia. I remember using the outhouse and taking baths in washtubs when I visited my grandparents. My parents both worked hard, worked smart, didn't wait for the big payday and didn't roll the dice on some big score. Over the course of 25 years in the workforce, they got up in to the 6 figure household income and away they went. I saw them make most of those choices that led to reasonable wealth. Phenomenal wealth when you consider their point of origin.

At the same time, I saw the choices my aunts and uncles and cousins made that led to sustained intergenerational poverty. I saw my parents repeatedly offer up all kinds of help to their brothers and sisters--loans, gifts, paying off debts, budget counseling, setting up job opportunities, writing resumes, taking in family members to live with us so they could save money. The help my extended family got was extraordinary...far more help than my parents ever got. But for whatever reason, my extended family wasn't interested in making the change from poor and dependent to self-reliant. Nearly all of them have returned to poverty. Like my parents, two of my cousins got out of the rural ghetto. That's it. And I've got a pretty big clan tucked away in those swamps.

I've seen this same thing play out over and over again in my current job. If a person wants to remain poor, they will. Those who don't want to remain poor have extraordinary opportunities. There have been a few people who had real, overwhelming obstacles between them and prosperity. But those people are rare.

[Commander PK]

I would think that the degree was not worth it, depending upon how long he's been looking for a job. You're saying he can't find ANY job, or just not any that he wants. I wouldn't consider him poor, as he should be able to make it on his own, even if he has to work two jobs that pay $7/hour and share an apartment. Poor to me, is different than what others think, I guess.

Well, the idea in this country was always that you get good grades in school. Go to college, get a degree in a subject you like, and you should be able to find a job relative to your area of expertise.

I guess my point here, is that "working hard" and getting a college education doesn't guarantee you financial stability. The larger point I'm trying to make is that plenty of people who are "poor" right now, aren't there because of their own doing...just as it is for many who are "rich"