Why are people against the players on this?

[warpath213]

I got a chuckle out of the wanting to opt out of a 10 year contract after 7 years. Why not just sign a 7 year deal?? What am I missing?

i think we are all missing the fact that this is a HUGE contract with so many nuances that nobody but an expert could understand. why don't we all give it a rest and let the gazillionaires work it out on their own? i'm just happy to have football back (assuming this thing gets ratified, of course).

[Madison Redskin]

I'm against anyone who makes over $300k a year and complains about money.

So, you're "against" the owners and the players?

[Burgold]

Albert Haynesworth attempts to throw monkey wrench in CBA agreement.

According to the Agent of Albert Haynesworth the proposed agreement does not offer enough. While it does reduce the number of OTAs allowed, end the practice of two-a-days, and reduce the overall number of hours a player can be asked to practice Haynesworth says it's useless unless they eliminate one-a-days and get stunt doubles. His reasoning? Actors don't do the dangerous stuff. So, I'm willing to pose for team photos and stuff, but man, when it comes to playing our doubles should be doing that. Why the hell should we be getting sweaty and stuff.

[warpath213]

Albert Haynesworth attempts to throw monkey wrench in CBA agreement.

According to the Agent of Albert Haynesworth the proposed agreement does not offer enough. While it does reduce the number of OTAs allowed, end the practice of two-a-days, and reduce the overall number of hours a player can be asked to practice Haynesworth says it's useless unless they eliminate one-a-days and get stunt doubles. His reasoning? Actors don't do the dangerous stuff. So, I'm willing to pose for team photos and stuff, but man, when it comes to playing our doubles should be doing that. Why the hell should we be getting sweaty and stuff.

haha! i'll stand in for him... i can plank on the 40 yard line and pretend i'm swatting at vick's feet all day!

[wysknz1]

i think we are all missing the fact that this is a HUGE contract with so many nuances that nobody but an expert could understand. why don't we all give it a rest and let the gazillionaires work it out on their own? i'm just happy to have football back (assuming this thing gets ratified, of course).

I think it shows the pettiness of the owners and the players. I agree though there is a lot to it, but for that to be a sticking point that was quoted in an article I read is petty.

[warpath213]

I think it shows the pettiness of the owners and the players. I agree though there is a lot to it, but for that to be a sticking point that was quoted in an article I read is petty.

i can appreciate that. i think it just basically grosses out the average american to see people who have so much money squabbling with each other over it and not coming to a deal quickly. one thing i don't understand is why they waited until the 11th hour to go ahead and start the negotiations. is it not possible for them to work this kind of stuff out before the players are 'forced' to dissolve their union? why did it have to come to all of this... and should we be prepared for more of the same at the end of this new agreement?

again, i don't know all the nuances and i will hit google to look for answers, but if you know, please enlighten me.

[Poman]

However, this was not a condition of employment, but a condition in which to have this Collective Bargaining Agreement ratified and have the league year begin in a time manner which would not lose any further games; therefore, they did not break the law. There cannot be a CBA if there is no Collective Union to bargain with. Hence, without them recertifying, ther can be no CBA. The league also did not state that if they didn't agree to this by next Wednesday the deal would be off the table; they said that if no agreement was reached and signed by Wednesday that the league schedule would have to be further altered and games (money) would be lost for both parties.

I dont want to say "this" cuz I hate that....But......This.....

[Popeman38]

None of knows the numbers yet. If the pie grows, obviously everybody gets more. When you find somebody crying foul for the players.let me know.

You are missing the point. If the owners caved on almost every front, how is it the players dropped from somewhere between 54-59% of total revenue to less than half?

False flag numbers. The player got 54-59% of the revenue after the owners took $1B off the top. It was really closer to 50-50. Players get 60% after owners get their cut. So the players are literally giving up 2-3.5% max, but their actual $ will go up.

This is not an accurate depiction. Players receive approximately 50 percent of all revenues in the NFL. Or, players receive approximately 60 percent of total revenue in the NFL after the owners take a number of expense credits that add up to more than $1 billion a year.

[JimboDaMan]

False flag numbers. The player got 54-59% of the revenue after the owners took $1B off the top. It was really closer to 50-50. Players get 60% after owners get their cut. So the players are literally giving up 2-3.5% max, but their actual $ will go up.

I've seen similar numbers thrown around lately. This is counter to what I've seen reported in the past, and I've never seen anybody support them with data.

The CBA gave players 59.5% after the owner's take of $1B. In 2009 the league took in $8.5B, last year I see total revenue reported variously as $9B and $10B, let's go with the lower number. 59.5% of $8B ($9B minus owner's reserve) is $4.76B. which is nearly 53% of the $9B league-wide revenue. I don't know where people get the 50% figure from, I've never seen anybody justify it.

Under the new proposal its hard to project the players overall percentage because it varies by revenue type, but it's said to be around 47-48%.

<edit> Sports Business Journal apparently agrees with my math (his figures are for 2009 season).

Making sense of claims in NFL labor talks

The union scored what seemed like a major victory in the 2006 renewal when the league agreed to share all of its revenue. After the renewal, the union said it shared in 59 percent to 60 percent of all revenue, and the assumption was that “revenue” meant all incoming money.

So when NFLPA Executive Director DeMaurice Smith started talking in recent months about the cap only being at 52 percent, it seemed strange, but he wasn’t wrong in theory. It turned out that the CBA had an automatic 5 percent-of-revenue cost credit, and then further, smaller credits that ultimately built up to $1 billion last season. So the players last season did not share 59 percent of the league’s $8.5 billion of revenue, but rather in $7.5 billion of revenue. If you took the $4.43 billion and divided it over $8.5 billion, the cap does look like it would have been 52 percent, just as Smith argues.

Article also indicates that league claims of a $200M loss under the old CBA is achieved using accounting tricks, seems they may have actually made an $800M profit.

People are now free to resume posting "Eff those greedy ungrateful players".

[anar-k21]

But it wasn't the first offer. It was the negotiated agreement. The first offer was made months ago and there have been offers and counter offers in the hundreds since then. you make it sound like the players' association wasn't even in the room. Their lawyers were part of the team drafting the final agreement. If the players didn't know what was in there, then they ought to fire all of their association leaders and get people who will represent them and keep them advised.

i meant the "power move" by the owners....where they threw it to the players 31-0 i agree that the players took their time to look through it........i didnt make it sound like that your taking from it whaT YOU WILL which is not my problem lol

[cphil006]

The more money we pay players... the more the fans have to pay. Lower overall salaries is my goal. Higher player salaries lead to higher TV deals next time. Higher advertisement costs, higher cost of products in general so companies can pay these advertising costs... yada yada...

[ouvan59]

I think it shows the pettiness of the owners and the players. I agree though there is a lot to it, but for that to be a sticking point that was quoted in an article I read is petty.

I don't think it shows pettiness at all. It just shows that while they think everything is an acceptable deal, things change. Also certain things may not work exactly as expected and loopholes may be found around certain provisions that no one noticed when it was signed.

[Crazy Levi]

The players are being payed millions for playing a childs game. They have not put up 100s of millions just to have a game. I want to see the players go work construction for thirty years making no where close to 1 million in there life time and not have their bodies messed up. They have had chances in there life that not even 2% of people have had. Its like a child excepting more from a ice cream vender just because the kid is standing there. Because most of the retards spend all there money on stupid things doesnt mean they get more.

So how come you don't want to see the owners "work construction for 30 years?" They have a chance to own a football team that not even 2% of the people had.

The owners are making billions for inheriting the teams that play "a child's game."

Why don't you have the same animosity toward the owners that you obviously have toward the players?

[killerbee99]

So how come you don't want to see the owners "work construction for 30 years?" They have a chance to own a football team that not even 2% of the people had.

The owners are making billions for inheriting the teams that play "a child's game."

Why don't you have the same animosity toward the owners that you obviously have toward the players?

Bcos most of the players and their reps are full of ****...calling Goddell evil, calling the owners names and ****ing about the owners slipping in stuff into the new CBA when they haven't even seen the damn thing. The owners at least kept their mouths shut and got to work...

[texasthunder]

http://twitter.com/#!/AdamSchefter

One more CBA item: players wanted, and got, five consecutive days off during their Bye week.

[JimboDaMan]

Bcos most of the players and their reps are full of ****...calling Goddell evil, calling the owners names and ****ing about the owners slipping in stuff into the new CBA when they haven't even seen the damn thing. The owners at least kept their mouths shut and got to work...

Look, nobody's an angel in this deal. But the players didn't strike, the owners locked them out. And then spent the next four months trying to manuever to take things away from the players. And then were found by the courts to have bought their own lockout insurace partly with money owed to the players. So, the players didn't, and still don't, have much faith in the owners' honesty. It appears they were wrong and in this instance at least if they accused the owners of underhandedness they owe an apology. But after the owners locked them out for four months, and the players spent less than four days examining the final proposal, you think the "owners at least kept their mouths shut and got to work"?

[Crazy Levi]

Look, nobody's an angel in this deal. But the players didn't strike, the owners locked them out. And then spent the next four months trying to manuever to take things away from the players. And then were found by the courts to have bought their own lockout insurace partly with money owed to the players. So, the players didn't, and still don't, have much faith in the owners' honesty. It appears they were wrong and in this instance at least if they accused the owners of underhandedness they owe an apology. But after the owners locked them out for four months, and the players spent less than four days examining the final proposal, you think the "owners at least kept their mouths shut and got to work"?

No reasoning with these people.

Bottom line, is there is a certain amount of people who empathize, sympathize, and identify with a bunch of billionaires who have almost nothing to do with building or playing the game we love - in fact almost half of them inherited their teams. They were born on third base and many people here think they hit a triple.

For some reason, people side with them instead of the people who do all of the work in entertaining us and playing the game, and aren't nearly as rich.

I have no idea, but that's the way it is.

[killerbee99]

No reasoning with these people.

Bottom line, is there is a certain amount of people who empathize, sympathize, and identify with a bunch of billionaires who have almost nothing to do with building or playing the game we love - in fact almost half of them inherited their teams. They were born on third base and many people here think they hit a triple.

For some reason, people side with them instead of the people who do all of the work in entertaining us and playing the game, and aren't nearly as rich.

I have no idea, but that's the way it is.

Beacuse I care about the Redskins..not some whiny ass players...so YOU people need some help ass well

[tomwvr]

This is why I was against the players after last week - they moaned complained and wined about the deal then they held it up for 3-4 days just to pass it as it was. They were just UPSET that the owners passsed it before they did and they wanted to cry like babies.

Tom

[The Tris]

This is why I was against the players after last week - they moaned complained and wined about the deal then they held it up for 3-4 days just to pass it as it was. They were just UPSET that the owners passsed it before they did and they wanted to cry like babies.

Tom

I guess you signed the closing docs or lease agreement on your house without reading them, huh?

[Hitman21ST]

I guess you signed the closing docs or lease agreement on your house without reading them, huh?

Do you complain that the seller or renter "bamboozled" and "hoodwinked" you along with saying they added something to the deal then go ahead and sign the same thing anyway?

[Big Will]

They were born on third base and many people here think they hit a triple.

Interesting quote. So does being "born on third base" necessarily make one a bad person? And by your rationale, if the owner didn't inherit their wealth but earned it (Actually 'hitting a triple'), then they are free from being an evil rich person? Or is that reserved for people who inherited wealth?

And if all wealthy are bad, then lets say a small business owner's business (You know, a good non-billionaire type) starts to take off and make buckets of money. Maybe even *GASP* billions of dollars. At what point do they become a bad person for being wealthy?

I'm not taking the side of the owners or the players with this post and has nothing to do with the lockout or football. Simply equalizing the hippie dippy class warfare notion that rich equates to evil.

[JimboDaMan]

Interesting quote. So does being "born on third base" necessarily make one a bad person? And by your rationale, if the owner didn't inherit their wealth but earned it (Actually 'hitting a triple'), then they are free from being an evil rich person? Or is that reserved for people who inherited wealth?

And if all wealthy are bad, then lets say a small business owner's business (You know, a good non-billionaire type) starts to take off and make buckets of money. Maybe even *GASP* billions of dollars. At what point do they become a bad person for being wealthy?

I'm not taking the side of the owners or the players with this post and has nothing to do with the lockout or football. Simply equalizing the hippie dippy class warfare notion that rich equates to evil.

Holy smokes!

This thread has held a lot of sentiment that the players should consider themselves lucky while the owners deserve much more consideration because they've built themselves into a position to own an NFL team. A guy notes that this not true, many current owners either inherited their team or the wealth that allowed them to buy the team. And from that one short sentence, you decide he called all wealthy people bad, even "evil"?

I've read many but not all posts in this thread. As far as I recall his is the first to point out the discrepancy between reality and the many posts proclaiming respect for the owners because they bootstrapped themselves into their position in life. While some owners have earned respect on that count, some others have not. The percentage is higher than people might think. It seems to me that his post added value to this thread. Accusing him of a "hippie dippy class warfare notion" doesn't add that same value.

[Crazy Levi]

Interesting quote. So does being "born on third base" necessarily make one a bad person? And by your rationale, if the owner didn't inherit their wealth but earned it (Actually 'hitting a triple'), then they are free from being an evil rich person? Or is that reserved for people who inherited wealth?

And if all wealthy are bad, then lets say a small business owner's business (You know, a good non-billionaire type) starts to take off and make buckets of money. Maybe even *GASP* billions of dollars. At what point do they become a bad person for being wealthy?

I'm not taking the side of the owners or the players with this post and has nothing to do with the lockout or football. Simply equalizing the hippie dippy class warfare notion that rich equates to evil.

Your post is ridiculous. I'm merely questioning why people here emphatize with the owners - most of whom who have done virtually nothing to "earn" their station in life - while lambasting the players and saying they should "go work a construction job" so they can realize who lucky they are.

I have no idea how you drew the twisted conclusion you did. If you can find anywhere in my post where I say that "all wealthy people are bad" I'll buy you a new car.

So how about answering my question. You obviously feel that all workers are evil, and that people who own corporations are good.

Why do you feel all workers are evil? At what point does someone who is doing a job become evil?

Do you hate people who work in factories? Why do you think they are evil? Why do you subscribe to the conservative, right wing class warfare notion that poor/working class equals lazy and leeching?

Thanks in advance.

[tomwvr]

I read all the documents - but I did not take 3-4 days after I got them to sign them - I already knew what was in them and made sure nothing new was there.

And this was done before alot of the online documents were done - had to go to the bank and meet with real people to get it done.

If the players had just come out and said we are going to verify the document and sign when we are sure everything is good - I would not have said a word - but they all cried like the owners STABBED THEM IN THE BACK when they did that.

Tom