The Official Washington Basketball Thread: Wizards, Mystics etc

[Bozo the kKklown]

1 hour ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Houston has made almost no team building mistakes in the past six years or so, and they've take a bunch of smart risks that panned out big time

untrue.

 

Ryan Anderson's contract salary may cost them 80 million in luxury tax fees if they bring everyone back.

http://rockets.clutchfans.net/11189/ryan-anderson-cost-rockets-100-million/

1 hour ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

In Hockey, you can keep drafting well and punching your ticket to the postseason and then eventually the stars align for you.

you don't know much about hockey lol

 

1 hour ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Our franchise doesn't have the appeal and popularity to attract the kind of marquee talent from outside the organization to truly compete for rings.  In terms of pure basketball fit, the Wizards would be one of LeBron's best options for getting back to the Finals and matching up with Golden State.  But we're not even in the discussion of legitimate options for LeBron.  We have a tiny fanbase and no outside appeal.  The basketball world forgets we exist.

we dont have the cap space 

[Long n Left]

2 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

This is what Ted is trying to do with the Wizards.  I think Ted viewed Wall as his Ovechkin.  

Alex Ovechkin is a top 5-10 all-time NHL player, Wall is a top 10 player of his generation. BIG difference, and it wasn’t until Ovi dedicated himself to being a team first player that the Caps won the Cup.

 

Also, I disagree with your assertion that DC is not a good basketball town. Basketball has always been number 1 sport in DC from the time of Red Auerbach, Dave Bing and the like. Sure, the Redskins are DC’s team, but the NFL is America’s most popular sport for years. If the Wizards became relevant, and made a run for the championship, DC would be all over them, at least as fervently as with the Caps.

[Bozo the kKklown]

7 minutes ago, Long n Left said:

Wall is a top 10 player of his generation.

I know what you are saying, but Wall isnt even a top 10 player of his generation either.

8 minutes ago, Long n Left said:

If the Wizards became relevant, and made a run for the championship, DC would be all over them, at least as fervently as with the Caps

100% true.

 

And players LOVE DC. They have loved it since forever. Thats why they always have their bday parties here and the like.

[Renegade7]

2 hours ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

we dont have the cap space 

 

Will getting rid of Gortat get us down to $10 million over the luxury tax?  I keep looking at these charters, I don't understand why the NBA cap is so much more complex then the NFL.  Are we really $20+ million over the luxury tax right now?

[Renegade7]

https://theathletic.com/83224/2017/08/10/how-the-repeater-tax-could-affect-the-warriors-future-its-not-for-a-while-but-it-will-get-expensive/

 

Quote

While the Warriors will not pay the repeater tax during the upcoming season, it can help quantify the burden involved. For 2017-2018, Golden State is expected to have a total team salary just over $135 million, which produces a luxury tax payment of $30.3 million and a total player cost of $165.7 million.

 

All of those elements would still be in play if the Warriors face the repeater tax along with an additional charge of $16.1 million, the amount they are over the luxury tax line. So that $165.7 million figure jumps to $181.8 million without adding anything to the team on the floor for that extra money.

 

[Going Commando]

 

4 hours ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

Ryan Anderson's contract salary may cost them 80 million in luxury tax fees if they bring everyone back.

 

That's why I said almost no mistakes.  He's really the only one they've made since they traded for Harden.

[Going Commando]

4 hours ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

we dont have the cap space 

 

We had cap space in 2016 and Ian Mahinmi was our big get.  This franchise has no outside appeal.  Gilbert Arenas is the only big name FA we've pulled since the 80's, and he hadn't blown up yet.  A washed up MJ and Paul Pierce are the only HoFers we've had walk through our door.  You can't say players want to play here until someone whose good enough to get a job with anyone they want actually chooses us.

[Going Commando]

3 hours ago, Long n Left said:

Also, I disagree with your assertion that DC is not a good basketball town. Basketball has always been number 1 sport in DC from the time of Red Auerbach, Dave Bing and the like. Sure, the Redskins are DC’s team, but the NFL is America’s most popular sport for years. If the Wizards became relevant, and made a run for the championship, DC would be all over them, at least as fervently as with the Caps.

 

Basketball is popular in almost every urban center but the Wizards are not popular at all.  Their fan base essentially extends from Montgomery county to Fairfax.  Outside of this small area, the Lakers are actually the most popular team in the market.  And it's not particularly close.

 

The Wizards are the red headed stepchild of DC sports and a distant fourth in popularity.

[Kosher Ham]

Technically MJ was traded to DC. 

[Skin'emAlive]

The name of this thread should be changed to the Ernie Grunfield Era. John Wall should be furiously ****ting down EG's throat for pissing away another draft. But he can't be bothered with giving a damn unless someone calls him out on Twitter or something. Dude either doesn't have the foresight to see how terrible our roster moves will turnout repeatedly, or just gives no ****s during the offseason. Super max players should have some pull on roster moves. Especially when said super max is the facilitator of 80% of the offense. But it's worse than that. This draft while not just ignoring the most blaring front court needs in the NBA, but if "successful" would make Oubre/Porter/Sato expendable. That's just ****ing stupid. But not nearly as stupid as this franchise basing this pick on whether or not a guy who will NEVER EVER see the ball in his hands in the 4th of any game that means anything, can draw up a play in a iso-centric "coaching scheme." It's all just so stupid. And yet so expected. 

 

Its mindboggling how how far this team has fallen for me this year. I am a step away from abandoning this team for atleast a year. I'll wait and see what idiocracy EG draws up in the FA. Completely expecting picks and Ian for Alex Len or some other unathletic 5, as well as an injury discounted gunner. 

Edited June 23, 2018 by Skin'emAlive

[Going Commando]

Come on man, Troy Brown looks like a solid pick.  This kid hits all the right notes for me.  Good size, cerebral playing style, great passing, good handle, strong D, strong rebounding, strong finishing in the lane.  And he's still 18.  He's the guy the Warriors would have picked if they were in our spot.

 

The truth is we can afford to take a wing who is a bit of a project because John and Brad and Otto are all locked up long term.

 

But even if he can't shoot, the kid is a smart player with an NBA ready body.  He's going to get the chance to play early and he's good enough to not crap his pants.

 

Robert Williams was the only viable big at 15, and we can't take it for granted that he would have solved our front court problems.  I am bullish on him, but he has issues and wasn't super clean.  Motor is sketchy and the reason he dropped is because teams questioned his professionalism and off court habits, plus he has a knee injury.  And there were other deficiencies in his game.  He's not a true glass eater and he's a 6'9 pure center who will get chewed up by the real seven footers at the position because he can only ever get so big with that frame before he starts losing his vertical and lateral athleticism.

 

We don't need to drastically remake the front court, we just need to get rid of Gortat and find one quality five man.  Probably not Mahinmi, but I am interested to see what he can do as a regular starter for 26 minutes a game.  The game has changed anyway.  Golden State has won three rings in four years with garbage center play.  It's all about positionless perimeter-oriented play and being able to put the best combination of switchers, passers, and shooters on the court at the same time.  Brown is going to help us do that.

[Long n Left]

4 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

Come on man, Troy Brown looks like a solid pick.  This kid hits all the right notes for me.  Good size, cerebral playing style, great passing, good handle, strong D, strong rebounding, strong finishing in the lane.  And he's still 18.  He's the guy the Warriors would have picked if they were in our spot.

 

I’m not saying the kid isn’t a good player, and the pick was terrible, just uninspiring. These kind of players are littered throughout the league. Tweener size, good at a lot of things, but not great at anything. If you wanted a cerebral backup 2, I’d have gone for Huerter who has as good, if not better, handles, excellent passer, super IQ, and may be the best long range shooter in this class not named Trae.

[Captain James]

6 hours ago, Kosher Ham said:

Technically MJ was traded to DC. 

Reminds me of an article I read recently, though it's from 2015: michael-jordans-performance-as-a-wizard-was-far-better-than-you-remember

[Going Commando]

2 hours ago, Long n Left said:

I’m not saying the kid isn’t a good player, and the pick was terrible, just uninspiring. These kind of players are littered throughout the league. Tweener size, good at a lot of things, but not great at anything. If you wanted a cerebral backup 2, I’d have gone for Huerter who has as good, if not better, handles, excellent passer, super IQ, and may be the best long range shooter in this class not named Trae.

 

Huerter's handle isn't better than Brown's.  Brown leads pick and rolls and breaks and his drive and kick game is well developed, particularly for a true freshman.  Brown dribbles in traffic with his head up.  Huerter is a straight line driver attacking off the catch and/or back screen.

 

Huerter can shoot the lights out and he is a very smart player, but those were his only traits that stood out to me.  Average body, average finishing ability, average defender.  Brown is noticeably stronger than him and better at rebounding and scoring inside in traffic and he's a much better defensive player IMO.  Better length, suddenness, hands, and strength and he is much more aggressive.  He's a significantly better player than Huerter was his freshman year.  Huerter would have been a solid pick but I like Brown better.

Also, players like Brown aren't easy to find.  There are a ton of Gerald Greens out there.  But very few Andre Iguodalas.  Guys with high defensive ability who are also great passers and quality ball handlers and who can finish inside in traffic are special.  The playmaking ability makes them more than just three and D wings.  Most of the good playmakers at the position are crap defenders.

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

STILL think a big move is going to be made.

[Bozo the kKklown]

10 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

 

That's why I said almost no mistakes.  He's really the only one they've made since they traded for Harden.

That “small” mistake will cost them the chance to sign LeBron and they may have to lose Clint Capella.

 

It wasn’t a small mistake.

10 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

We had cap space in 2016 and Ian Mahinmi was our big get.  This franchise has no outside appeal.  Gilbert Arenas is the only big name FA we've pulled since the 80's, and he hadn't blown up yet.  A washed up MJ and Paul Pierce are the only HoFers we've had walk through our door.  You can't say players want to play here until someone whose good enough to get a job with anyone they want actually chooses us.

The area has a lot of appeal. The problem is the organization is not in tune with the city and has no idea how to use it to its advantage. I keep saying this because I used to be on the scene and know who comes into town, they love DC.

[Renegade7]

Steve is better at getting over the initial shock then most of us.  It's okay, it took me a minute to realize he finally drafted who he had been trading draft picks for.

 

I'm open to withholding judgement until we see what happens with Gortat getting traded and if we have a new starting center.  If its Ian, I'll go to a game with a sign.

Edited June 23, 2018 by Renegade7

[BRAVEONAWARPATH]

Fwiw in addition to having knee concerns Robert Williams apparently was less than impressive in his workouts.

 

Showed up out of shape.

 

 

[Going Commando]

18 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

That “small” mistake will cost them the chance to sign LeBron and they may have to lose Clint Capella.

 

It wasn’t a small mistake.

 

Think of all the risks and finds Morey has made work over the past six years.  Finding Capela in the first place was a great move.  Batting .900 on personnel decisions is way better than anyone can realistically ask for. 

 

And the truth is that the GM is far less influential for on court success than the players are.  The Cavs GM is horrible and that organizaion is horrible but they got a ring because of LeBron.  Mitch Kupchak is a lousy GM with five rings because of Shaq and Kobe.  Acquiring players of this stature is the real game in the NBA, and Morey was able to get two guys by essentially trading up from a paper clip to a house.

 

And still, if LeBron wants to go to Houston, he can make it happen.

[Going Commando]

28 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

The area has a lot of appeal. The problem is the organization is not in tune with the city and has no idea how to use it to its advantage. I keep saying this because I used to be on the scene and know who comes into town, they love DC.

 

I don't disagree with you at all about the city and the area.  It's easily one of the better NBA cities.  The issue is that the Wizards don't have appeal.  We're just this forgotten team with a very small fanbase whose only history of success came in an obscure era.  After Durant shut us down, we went after Horford hard and he turned us down too.  And the main reason for choosing Boston that he stated was because he loved the game day atmosphere in the TD Garden.  That franchise has prestige and appeal even though their city has an awful reputation for its treatment of Black athletes.  It has a massive fanbase that is very engaged and the atmosphere in their arena is like a college team's.

 

That's just something that we can't compete with.  The city doesn't really care about the Wizards and the greater region doesn't even follow them at all.  I live in Hampton Roads and this area is full of die-hard Redskins fans but I have only ever seen one other person wearing Wizards gear here.  They're never discussed on local sports radio.  There is just no awareness of or support for them outside the counties that immediately surround DC.

 

I don't know how you fix this short of something like LeBron coming here and making us the center of the basketball universe.

[Mooka]

39 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

The area has a lot of appeal. The problem is the organization is not in tune with the city and has no idea how to use it to its advantage. I keep saying this because I used to be on the scene and know who comes into town, they love DC.

 

The problem is that the team has sucked for the last 40 years.

[Renegade7]

20 minutes ago, Mooka said:

 

The problem is that the team has sucked for the last 40 years.

I think there's a lot more people in the area that remember the glory days of the Redskins then the Bullets glory days, always felt that had something to do with it. We went to the finals 4 times in the 70s, only the Redskins can match that in this area.

[Bozo the kKklown]

https://www.gofundme.com/gfvfh-fire-ernie-grunfeld&rcid=r01-152970207432-72f2628935554e86&pc=ot_co_campmgmt_m

 

 

 

[Warhead36]

If DC can embrace the Caps, it can easily embrace the Wizards. The product just stinks.

[Long n Left]

1 hour ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

The issue is that the Wizards don't have appeal.  We're just this forgotten team with a very small fanbase whose only history of success came in an obscure era

Guess I’m obscure then, cause I remember that era quite well. There’s still plenty of us around, with LOTS of disposable income. Granted, the Wiz needs to get the younger fan involved, and they’ve done a **** job of that, but give us a relevant winner, and fans of my age, and a **** ton of younger fans, will be out in droves.

 

I attended the very first ever Caps game, and toyed with the idea of going back home for game 5. If the Wizards are in a championship clinching game, I’m there, no doubt.