Anthony alridge: Long awaited homerun threat?

[RandyHolt]

When he came here from Denver, Portis was the worst RB pass receiver in the NFL. He deserves credit for improving his skills. He's now average. But, IMO, Ladell has the second best hands on the team after Cooley and he runs precise patterns. Portis doesn't.

Clinton's weight has little bearing on the skill involved with running patterns and catching a football.

I guess I was too busy admiring this 5+ yds per carry to notice he was the worst pass receiving back in the NFL. Can you expound on why that was, since i missed the boat? Bad hands, bad routes? Classic turn to run before catching the ball?

I just seem to remember him always trying to go through defenders on his catches last year; albeit very few. He evolved into an up the gut runner over the past few years, and those guys are rarely your top receiver threats.

[NoVaSkins21]

bye bye rock...thanks for the years!

I think Rock's still got a place on this team. It's possible that they are trying to replace Rock and get younger, but I hope not.

[Oldfan]

I guess I was too busy admiring this 5+ yds per carry to notice he was the worst pass receiving back in the NFL.

Can you expound on why that was, since i missed the boat? Bad hands, bad routes?

Bad hands, stiff, clumsy, intent -- like he was afraid he'd drop the ball. He still doesn't look relaxed -- makes easy catches look hard and often doesn't transition from the catch to the run smoothly.

He evolved into an up the gut runner over the past few years, and those guys are rarely your top receiver threats.

I've never noticed any relationship between running styles and receiving skills.

[TheLongshot]

You are mangling an analogy. The change of pace is effective for a pitcher only when the batter is surprised. If the pitch is tipped off, he'll kill it.

In football, the defense knows what's coming with personnel packages in the one-back offense. That's the point I was making . Because they know, the "change of pace" angle is ineffective.

If Portis is in the backfield, force him wide. If Alridge is in the backfield, force him inside. There's no mystery.

But, I wasn't talking about the element of surprise. Yes, there is some of that for a baseball pitcher, but you still need to be able to make the adjustment between the two.

Maybe a better analogy would be replacing one pitcher with another with a different delivery style. Batters aren't likely to be "surprised" since they probably have faced the pitcher before, but they still have to adjust to a different style. Even that analogy isn't perfect since you can change between the two rather quickly so that defenses don't get used to a particular style.

[Stew]

Uh, no. Betts was going to be a FA at the end of 2006, so they had the choice of letting him go or resigning him. They chose the latter.

Once he was given a new deal, he wasn't going to get traded. So no, Betts has never had trade value for us.

Oh, I forgot...Snyder told you what he was thinking. :hysterical:

Seriously dude, whether or not you thought so, there were rumors of trading him and there was talk of him and a pick for Vilma. So yes, dispite your ****y attitude, its true, there was trade talk for Betts a few years ago, and i think the fact that he had just redone his deal was part of the reason other teams found his him desirable. If I remember correctly i think it was 6 years 11 mil. I could be wrong about the details, but yeah that actually happened whether or not you thought it was a good deal then,now whatever.

I dont know what Ive done to warrent responses from you that are condiscending and rude in general, but contrary to what you think,you are not the last word in every discussion. I usually try to side with you because your points are at least rational and for the most part well thought out. However you have a smugness in a lot of your post's as if you have some inside info or as if your words hold weight. they dont, and you are the only one believe that they do. Come down off your high horse.

[flexxskins]

You obviously realize that the stats argument is unintelligent, but you made it anyway, predicting my response.

Although you were probably correct in that the stats argument is not the best argument to use in this case, I wouldn't have gone the personal route with the "unintelligent" remark. It just wasn't necessary. But maybe that's just you and what you do.

And no, it doesn't mean the coaches are just as confident in Portis as a pass receiver. It means nothing except that they aren't going to pull Clinton and substitute Betts every time passes are called so as not to tipoff the defense.

Isn't this all a matter of your opinion when it comes down to it? You stated somewhere else in this thread that in your opinion Betts has the second best hands on the team after Cooley. I maybe wrong but there might be members here that disagree with that. There also just (as incredible as it may sound) might be coaches that disagree with you and might think that Moss has better hands than Betts...or that Portis is just as good of a receiver.

My point is that your quote above is worded as though it is a fact and it isn't, it is merely your opinion.

[Backpack3r]

Have him return punts

[TheLongshot]

Oh, I forgot...Snyder told you what he was thinking. :hysterical:

And all trade talk is fact. :doh:

There may have been. Hell, I've found some rumors about us trading Portis for Vilma. That rumor was wackier. There were rumors that we would trade them the 6th pick for Vilma and the 25th pick and Betts. That one doesn't back your idea that Betts had value. (about as much value as the Jets gave up for Thomas Jones.)

But, you need to sit down and think things through. They just gave Betts a 3m signing bonus. They weren't likely to take a hit on that to trade him anywhere, particularly when they had a lot of things they had to fix that year. Does it really make sense that Betts would be available to a team unless they made an offer that blew people away? Betts isn't that special and most teams in the league probably would agree with that assessment.

I dont know what Ive done to warrent responses from you that are condiscending and rude in general, but contrary to what you think,you are not the last word in every discussion. I usually try to side with you because your points are at least rational and for the most part well thought out. However you have a smugness in a lot of your post's as if you have some inside info or as if your words hold weight. they dont, and you are the only one believe that they do. Come down off your high horse.

Ironic that you are being rude to me when you don't have any cause to act like that. As for being rude to others, well I don't suffer fools. If you are foolish, I'm going to say so. If that's rude, so be it.

[bulldog]

I don't see Alridge as a regular back and I don't think the Redskins see him in that role, either.

I think he is here to compete for a spot as a return man, a specialist.

If he adds something in the run game as a regular back, that is a bonus.

Alridge is not Sproles. He doesn't have the lower body development/frame to take the pounding that #43 does for San Diego.

[Oldfan]

Although you were probably correct in that the stats argument is not the best argument to use in this case, I wouldn't have gone the personal route with the "unintelligent" remark. It just wasn't necessary. But maybe that's just you and what you do.

You say that the stats argument was "not the best argument to use in this case." Arguments are either valid or invalid. If you are admitting that your argument was invalid, was your usage of it intelligent or unintelligent? Since you saw the obvious flaw right from the outset, and used it anyway, I thought the usage of the argument unintelligent.

Labeling your argument unintelligent is not personal criticism because we all make unintelligent arguments on occasion. It's not the same as calling you unintelligent (meaning generally). I think you're being a tad hyper-sensitive to interpret it that way.

Isn't this all a matter of your opinion when it comes down to it?...

My point is that your quote above is worded as though it is a fact and it isn't, it is merely your opinion.

The remark you quoted isn't an opinion, nor is it a fact, It's a conclusion which you are free to debate.

In your previous post, you drew a conclusion based on evidence. I countered that your conclusion was not supported and gave you another conclusion that could be drawn from the same evidence. You can argue that my conclusion isn't logical if you like, and give reasons, but you can't debate it logically by claiming it's just an opinion.

[Oldfan]

I don't see Alridge as a regular back and I don't think the Redskins see him in that role, either.

I think he is here to compete for a spot as a return man, a specialist.

If he adds something in the run game as a regular back, that is a bonus.

Alridge is not Sproles. He doesn't have the lower body development/frame to take the pounding that #43 does for San Diego.

I see it the same. We really need a player who can return both punts and kickoffs. The first report was that Alridge didn't look good in the punt return drill.

I don't think Norv wanted to be in the position of having to depend on Sproles as his primary back. That's too big a workload.

[cjbrown]

You can tell a lot about a prospect by what they don't say about him. I've never heard anyone with an expert opinion say anything about Alridge except that he's fast. I figure he's a track star, not a football player.

We need a punt returner, maybe that's Dorsey, but I think Vinny was just caught up in the Darren Sproles fad when he signed him. He's not going to help this team at RB.

We don't need a "change of pace back." Z is building a ball control offense. What we need at RB for this WCO is a Steven Jackson clone, a power back who can also catch the ball....

I remember how effective Joe Washington and Kelvin Bryant were playing with a power back. The main problem with Kelvin was injuries. I remember his long distance pass catching made him a real threat and defenses had to adjust for him. It gives the offense a versatility that a defense may not be able to adjust to if it is geared to stopping power backs.

[fnkdctr(007)]

Speed kills but we'll see it isn't track and NFL speed is different

Mike Shanahan probably knows better than I

or does he

[redskns21]

all the hating on rock shows how quickly we as fans can forget what he has done for us.

rock may not always break off a big one for a TD, but the man constantly puts us in good field position and occasionaly on the other side of the 50 yard line.

whenever rock was back to return, i knew we would be starting around the 30 yard line or better, and for the most part this was true.

You are so right. Beyond that, he contributes on teams as a defender as well. Though I believe we'll see the emergence of Kareem Moore help out a bit in losing Khary Campbell, I think Rock makes the team because we lost him and need a ST ace now that both he and Thrash are gone.

[redskns21]

When he came here from Denver, Portis was the worst RB pass receiver in the NFL. He deserves credit for improving his skills. He's now average. But, IMO, Ladell has the second best hands on the team after Cooley and he runs precise patterns. Portis doesn't.

Clinton's weight has little bearing on the skill involved with running patterns and catching a football.

No offense Oldfan, but I really think you are overestimating Ladell's hands if you place him above Santana and think he's THAT much better than Portis. I agree with you completely that CP looks clumsy as heck sometimes trying to catch the ball whereas it's a bit more natural for Ladell. I just don't see the value in how natural it looks when Portis is still getting the job done.

[Stew]

And all trade talk is fact. :doh:.

I never said anything about it being fact... alli said was that it was out there, going on what I heard in the media and read. Again,I never once claimed it as fact and in fact called it "rumor" when i said it.

There may have been. Hell, I've found some rumors about us trading Portis for Vilma. That rumor was wackier. There were rumors that we would trade them the 6th pick for Vilma and the 25th pick and Betts. That one doesn't back your idea that Betts had value. (about as much value as the Jets gave up for Thomas Jones.):.

Again, as far as rumors go,and thats all i was speaking about, he had value with the Jets. I never once claimed to have any factual knowledge. You on the other hand were matter of fact and quite certain in your retort that he had no trade value. As if your word was the last word,its not.

But, you need to sit down and think things through. They just gave Betts a 3m signing bonus. They weren't likely to take a hit on that to trade him anywhere, particularly when they had a lot of things they had to fix that year. Does it really make sense that Betts would be available to a team unless they made an offer that blew people away? Betts isn't that special and most teams in the league probably would agree with that assessment.

No,I knew about the extension and the signing bonus, all that jazz. It was all over this board and there was the whole trade CP thread,i remember. The message board I was reading ( a jets board) was talking about how with his deal the Jets wouldnt even have to rework it and its a cap friendly deal, and so on. I have family in New York that were calling me about it telling me what was in their media. So again, I was just mentioning and referencing the past rumors of his market value with the Jets at least in context of his trade value.

Ironic that you are being rude to me when you don't have any cause to act like that. As for being rude to others, well I don't suffer fools. If you are foolish, I'm going to say so. If that's rude, so be it.

Look Jason, I wasnt trying to pick a fight with you in the first place. The point I was trying to make,and i apologize if i didnt spell it out, but the point i wanted to make was that if there was a time to trade Betts, it was when the Jets were reportedly interested. I made that comment in regards to the potentially crowded backfield we may have in training camp. Thats where you jumped all over my original post.

If you dont like the rumors then thats on you, but i never claimed them as anything else. Dont jump my post as foolish for rehashing what the media put out there.

[Ashburn Dave]

Love those home run threats. Sure hope he makes the team even if it means Rock doesn't.

[TheLongshot]

I never said anything about it being fact... alli said was that it was out there, going on what I heard in the media and read. Again,I never once claimed it as fact and in fact called it "rumor" when i said it.

I'm glad we got that established. The problem a lot of times people act like rumored trades are all deals that the team seriously considered. There are plenty of them that never were considered. There are many deals that were seriously considered that we never hear about.

Now that we have that established:

Again, as far as rumors go,and thats all i was speaking about, he had value with the Jets. I never once claimed to have any factual knowledge. You on the other hand were matter of fact and quite certain in your retort that he had no trade value. As if your word was the last word,its not.

How did he have value with the Jets? Were the Jets even interested in Betts? A rumor doesn't prove that a player is coveted by a team, because a rumor can be started by anyone. Actually, that trade rumor sounds rather similar to the Briggs trade, yet we seem to be paying MORE for Vilma. It doesn't make much sense.

To me, that looks like someone looking at needs of teams and putting together the dots. Hey, we needed a linebacker, the Jets needed a running back. How could we make it work?

No,I knew about the extension and the signing bonus, all that jazz. It was all over this board and there was the whole trade CP thread,i remember. The message board I was reading ( a jets board) was talking about how with his deal the Jets wouldnt even have to rework it and its a cap friendly deal, and so on. I have family in New York that were calling me about it telling me what was in their media. So again, I was just mentioning and referencing the past rumors of his market value with the Jets at least in context of his trade value.

No, the problem wouldn't have been Vilma's contract (which was still his rookie deal) but the 3m in cap space (and maybe other guarantees) we would have had to eat to trade Betts. There is a reason why players like signing bonuses, outside the fact that they get the money now. It is also contract protection from getting cut or traded.

Look Jason, I wasnt trying to pick a fight with you in the first place.

Well, if you aren't, don't get personal.

The point I was trying to make,and i apologize if i didnt spell it out, but the point i wanted to make was that if there was a time to trade Betts, it was when the Jets were reportedly interested. I made that comment in regards to the potentially crowded backfield we may have in training camp. Thats where you jumped all over my original post.

Except that we gave him a new contract and whatever value he did have would have been offset by that contract. So again, I think his trade value has been lacking his whole career, in part due to the actions of the team.

Course, we are conjecturing that the team was interested in trading Betts at any point in his career. That is something we can't confirm.

[Justsomeguy]

I hope Aldridge really shines and makes the cut.

[Oldfan]

No offense Oldfan, but I really think you are overestimating Ladell's hands if you place him above Santana and think he's THAT much better than Portis. I agree with you completely that CP looks clumsy as heck sometimes trying to catch the ball whereas it's a bit more natural for Ladell. I just don't see the value in how natural it looks when Portis is still getting the job done.

Santana drops too many passes -- always has. I think it's his technique on crossing patterns. He uses what I describe as "basket catching." TO does the same and has a lot of drops. So does Billy McMullen who was a late cut here last year. Otherwise, Santana has great hands.

Portis and Sellers make easy catches look like adventures. They catch the ball most times, but they seldom catch the ball, tuck it away, and go smoothly which cuts down on their YAC. Zorn is a perfectionist, big on YAC, so I'd bet he's noticed. Portis caused a turnover last season, one of Jason's INTs, when he lazily reached up with one hand and tipped a high, short pass to a defender. With a better effort, and better technique, he could have made the catch with two hands.

[Chris0894]

has anyone posted this vid of him? don't really want to read through all 7 pages to see lol....

personally i think this guy may turn out really good for us.

[Skins3000]

I am curious to know how many backs did the Skins carry in a game last year. I want to say three. If that is the case Rock would be the old man out especially when Rock was a free agent and no one was clamoring for Rock's services. Personally I would like to see Rock and Betts out and make a youth movement with Dorsey and Aldridge. Betts is just a one year wonder period.

[Oldfan]

I remember how effective Joe Washington and Kelvin Bryant were playing with a power back. The main problem with Kelvin was injuries. I remember his long distance pass catching made him a real threat and defenses had to adjust for him. It gives the offense a versatility that a defense may not be able to adjust to if it is geared to stopping power backs.

Giving an offense versatility is one concept. The "change of pace" is a different concept, one which suggests an interaction in play.

If a defense could stop Riggins but not Washington, then it was a match-up problem for them that had nothing to do with changing pace. There isn't any deception in having Riggins or Washington at RB in a one back offense.

[Chris0894]

I am curious to know how many backs did the Skins carry in a game last year. I want to say three. If that is the case Rock would be the old man out especially when Rock was a free agent and no one was clamoring for Rock's services. Personally I would like to see Rock and Betts out and make a youth movement with Dorsey and Aldridge. Betts is just a one year wonder period.

I really like rock returning though...he may not return a lot for TD's but he almost always gets us good field position

[Oldfan]

Betts is just a one year wonder period.

On what evidence did you come to that conclusion? Ladell's lifetime average is 4.1 as a runner and in his only chance to start, in 2006, it was much better. Plus, he's a grade A receiver.

What kind of production do you expect from a backup player?