NYT: Tea Parties Forever by Krugman

[Tulane Skins Fan]

Just curious, but what about this kind of dissent is merely for dissent?? Don't these americans have legit beefs regardless of who is in charge??

That question is full of sub-questions. Do they have legit beefs? I think overall, they don't. Most of them are just upset about paying taxes... which are not higher than they were under the last three republican presidents.

Again curious. With what?? I wasn't aware that people who protest needed to come up with better solutions.

Did the war protesters have any, other than pull out now?? Are the protesters suppose to have written proposals for congress before they went out to do their thing?

I'm not saying they need to have a solution to the problem, just to protest. I'm saying, if you are just protesting without offering anything to the debate about what should be done, then I think you're a jackass. People are free to be jackasses, but I am free to call them that.

I think "pull out now" was a better option than what the T.E.A. people are asking for: which is nothing as far as i can tell. What is it they want to cut? What do they want taxes to be? What are the offering as an alternative?

Some of them have offered alternatives, but my unscientific poll/research says most are just complaining.

[mjah]

Again curious. With what?? I wasn't aware that people who protest needed to come up with better solutions.

You're right -- it's really not about the protesters. It's about the politicians the protesters predominantly seem to be in line with: Politicians who, despite being professional policy crafters and solution providers, are offering nothing but "Nononononono."

...As if they're only protesters.

It doesn't work that way.

Sorry, but protesters are volunteers (regardless of which think tank is doing the organizing and which high roller is footing the bill). Politicians get paid and they should do their job. The standard two-letter GOP protest is useless without anything better behind it, and these protesters appear for all the world to take their political pantomime cues out of the same handbook.

Gepetto; Pinocchio.

Spending is a real problem. But the GOP and its bag-wielding marchers need to act rationally if they want to be taken seriously.

[SkinInsite]

Hey I don't like paying taxes either, lets protest!

[SnyderShrugged]

Uh, except that the two have virtually nothing in common -- regardless of the organizers' historical fantasies. The lack of "taxation without representation" should be the first clue there.

mainly, you might just want to get over yourself some and enjoy the thread and the day.

You may want to study the history of other famous "tea parties" that were named in honor of the famous Boston one. A modern "tea party" doesnt have to be based on the literal term coined "taxation without representation".

It's a phrase that signifies revolution against tyranny, nothing more, nothing less.

"The Boston Tea Party has often been referenced in other political protests. When Mohandas K. Gandhi led a mass burning of Indian registration cards in South Africa in 1908, a British newspaper compared the event to the Boston Tea Party.[62] When Gandhi met with the British viceroy in 1930 after the Indian salt protest campaign, Gandhi took some duty-free salt from his shawl and said, with a smile, that the salt was "to remind us of the famous Boston Tea Party."[63]

American activists from a variety of political viewpoints have invoked the Tea Party as a symbol of protest. In 1973, on the 200th anniversary of the Tea Party, a mass meeting at Faneuil Hall called for the impeachment of President Richard Nixon and protested oil companies in the ongoing oil crisis. Afterwards, protesters boarded a replica ship in Boston Harbor, hanged Nixon in effigy, and dumped several empty oil drums into the harbor.[64] In 1998, two conservative US Congressmen put the federal tax code into a chest marked "tea" and dumped it into the harbor, but they were upstaged by two other protesters in a small raft, who were protesting conservative tax policies.[65]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_Tea_Party

[mjah]

You may want to study the history of other famous "tea parties" that were named in honor of the famous Boston one. A modern "tea party" doesnt have to be based on the literal term coined "taxation without representation".

Other people got it wrong, so now it's okay for the current crop to get it wrong too.

Got it. It's "No Bag Left Behind."

It's a phrase that signifies revolution against tyranny, nothing more, nothing less.

Revolution? Tyranny? Really?

Okay, then that's a second way the current doily patrol is getting it wrong. :hysterical:

I thought all of this echo-chamber "public awareness raising" and group-therapy-by-protest was more the domain of newly empowered and oversubscribed college kids. I guess it's actually endemic to any group that's sufficiently out of touch with mainstream reality.

[DjTj]

Are we gonna be breaking ES board rules is we start calling these protesters teabaggers, or use the term teabagging?? Just curious

teabag :thumbsup:

****skin

You may want to study the history of other famous "tea parties" that were named in honor of the famous Boston one. A modern "tea party" doesnt have to be based on the literal term coined "taxation without representation".

It's a phrase that signifies revolution against tyranny, nothing more, nothing less.

eh, I think Ghandi gets a free pass on Boston Tea Party references because he was actually leading a colony in rebelling against the British.

"The Boston Tea Party has often been referenced in other political protests. When Mohandas K. Gandhi led a mass burning of Indian registration cards in South Africa in 1908, a British newspaper compared the event to the Boston Tea Party.[62] When Gandhi met with the British viceroy in 1930 after the Indian salt protest campaign, Gandhi took some duty-free salt from his shawl and said, with a smile, that the salt was "to remind us of the famous Boston Tea Party."[63]

The salt tax was almost exactly like the Boston Tea Party because the British had a monopoly on salt and were imposing a duty. There is no such excise tax involved in today's tea parties ... maybe smokers could stage a Boston Tobacco Party?

American activists from a variety of political viewpoints have invoked the Tea Party as a symbol of protest. In 1973, on the 200th anniversary of the Tea Party, a mass meeting at Faneuil Hall called for the impeachment of President Richard Nixon and protested oil companies in the ongoing oil crisis. Afterwards, protesters boarded a replica ship in Boston Harbor, hanged Nixon in effigy, and dumped several empty oil drums into the harbor.[64]

At least those guys were in Boston.

In 1998, two conservative US Congressmen put the federal tax code into a chest marked "tea" and dumped it into the harbor, but they were upstaged by two other protesters in a small raft, who were protesting conservative tax policies.[65]"

That one is pretty weak ... weaker even than today's protests.

It's fine to try to invoke the American Revolution, but in some ways it does seem to cheapen the event, especially as other random causes try to latch on.

Ghandi definitely didn't set out to emulate the Boston Tea Party when he burned Indian registration cards in South Africa. If anything, he started his own movement with people burning draft cards. Even his salt protest pretty much started the march-across-the country style of protest.

...emulating either of those Ghandi-style protests would be better than the Boston Tea Party. Burn some 1040-EZ's. March on the Treasury. Think of something new. It's not 1773 anymore.

[Mackdaddydean]

This just proves that when you see "New York Times" you should just stop reading right then and there. I know its opinion piece, but an opinion that lacks understanding or careful analysis is worthless. I have plenty of liberal friends who attended tea parties today and many others who don't even claim to be "Republican" or "Democrat". I think there is a general frustration among people in America with what the government on both sides of the aisle have done. Not just Republicans. This is obviously using an event that hurts the Democrats (only cause they happen to be in power) and blaming it on the other side.

[Predicto]

This just proves that when you see "New York Times" you should just stop reading right then and there. I know its opinion piece, but an opinion that lacks understanding or careful analysis is worthless. I have plenty of liberal friends who attended tea parties today and many others who don't even claim to be "Republican" or "Democrat". I think there is a general frustration among people in America with what the government on both sides of the aisle have done. Not just Republicans. This is obviously using an event that hurts the Democrats (only cause they happen to be in power) and blaming it on the other side.

That's interesting. I have plenty of liberal friends too, and none of them attended a tea party.

[RedskinWill]

That's interesting. I have plenty of liberal friends too, and none of them attended a tea party.

I know some who have, as well as conservatives and independents. I will be attending one tonight.

[RedskinWill]

This just proves that when you see "New York Times" you should just stop reading right then and there. I know its opinion piece, but an opinion that lacks understanding or careful analysis is worthless. I have plenty of liberal friends who attended tea parties today and many others who don't even claim to be "Republican" or "Democrat". I think there is a general frustration among people in America with what the government on both sides of the aisle have done. Not just Republicans. This is obviously using an event that hurts the Democrats (only cause they happen to be in power) and blaming it on the other side.

Bingo! We have a winner.

[hokie4redskins]

Krugman's acting like Michael Steele organized this thing.

I got emails from Obama supporters trying to get the word out.

:whoknows:

Doesn't make sense to me either. Only confirms my suspicions that a strong percentage of the folks who sent him to the White House were either willfully or unwittingly ignorant.

Regardless, the notion that this is a "GOP thing" is nonsense.

[IHOPSkins]

.....The whole concept is, as you said, "pretty dumb sounding."

Its not like the Constitution has the phrase "Peacebly to Assemble" in it right?....RIGHT?

[NavyDave]

That's interesting. I have plenty of liberal friends too, and none of them attended a tea party.

Duh its Frisco.

[IHOPSkins]

Duh its Frisco.

CNNs premier Audience

Thats why they are covering Gay Marriage instead of the Tea Parties

[hkHog]

He doesn't get it. This really has nothing to do with taxes, it has everything to do with SPENDING! This is the problem. We are already in debt up to our eyeballs ($40,000 for every American) and now we're going to double that figure. That is just disaster waiting to happen.

[NavyDave]

It would be nice if instead of tea parties, republicans gave ideas how to fix the economic problems... as opposed to just saying this won't work and i'm mad.

The ideas conservatives have and new ones they would give, will be ignored and the GOP shut out of the talks as we saw Pelosi do with the previous earmarked pork laden bill.

[IHOPSkins]

UPDATE:

For those trying to discredit this GRASS ROOTS MOVEMENT.....

When Republican National Committee Chairman Michael Steele asked to speak at the Chicago tea party, his request was politely refused by the organizers: "With regards to stage time, we respectfully must inform Chairman Steele that RNC officials are welcome to participate in the rally itself, but we prefer to limit stage time to those who are not elected officials, both in Government as well as political parties. This is an opportunity for Americans to speak, and elected officials to listen, not the other way around."

Likewise, I spoke to an organizer for the Knoxville tea party who said that no "professional politicians" were going to be allowed to speak, and he made a big point of saying that the protest wasn't an anti-Obama protest, it was an anti-establishment protest. I've heard similar things from tea-party organizers in other cities, too. Though critics will probably try to write the tea parties off as partisan publicity stunts, they're really a post-partisan expression of outrage.

http://voices.kansascity.com/node/4274

[SkinzFoLife]

In Orange County republican politicians are making speeches, some arlready in office and some running for office. So whats your point? Its a shame that a so called non paritisan grass roots movement is being used by the GOP to further their own political gains. So please don't make it sound like all these meetings are just people protesting without a political agenda. It is what it is. Good ole American Politics.

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/tax-county-beach-2363762-government-economy

[SkinzFoLife]

Another California Congressman speaking at a Tea Paryt with Fox News to broadcast it.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2228450/posts?page=33

[Tulane Skins Fan]

The ideas conservatives have and new ones they would give, will be ignored and the GOP shut out of the talks as we saw Pelosi do with the previous earmarked pork laden bill.

I didn't know you were such a defeatist ND.

[IHOPSkins]

...... Its a shame that a so called non paritisan grass roots movement is being used by the GOP to further their own political gains......

You must have missed the "TOTAL RECALL" petitions of the Governator being circulated in Santa Ana

Oh, he's a A Republican

[SkinzFoLife]

Update, looks like someone told the politicians who were planned to speak, yes, they had them organized to speak at these raliies, are pulling them out at the last minute to keep from getting panned by critics, although some Republicans are still speaking.

http://www.flashreport.org/blog.php?postID=2009041511421611

[SkinzFoLife]

Orange County is the only republican stronghold in California. In South County, only Irvine and Laguna Beach voted Democrat in both the presidential race and on prop 8.

[SkinzFoLife]

we recalled a democratic governor too. California goes through governers like weed at woodstock.

[SkinzFoLife]

You must have missed the "TOTAL RECALL" petitions of the Governator being circulated in Santa Ana

Oh, he's a A Republican

Arnold is not a what you would consider a red Republican, more of a purple one, I guess. )

Well, its looks like Obama supports are showing up at Tea Parties now too, holding up signs that say "Where were you all 8 years ago".

Source, OC REGISTER