What would our offense look like with Reggie Bush-type player?

[IbleedBnG83]

I think we would be smart to draft in the next couple of years, another back, especially someone with return capabilities, because as good as Cartwright is, he doesn't have the explosivness or speed to take it to the house when he has had opportunities.

[ntotoro]

The voice of reason from a poster with 8 posts

I wouldn't quite go that far. There are far too many elements that create a good running game to go investing that kind of money in two RB's. You think Bush (or someone of that ilk) will play for peanuts?

[cyfar]

Skimmed through the first page so I apologize if I repeat a point that was already made, but i think the more accurate player to pick would be a Brian Westbrook-like back. I would kill to see the Skins have a utility back like Westbrook in this new O. That would open up and change a lot of things and truly make our O dynamic. Westbrook has the punt return skills, pass catching ability, and a decent runner. The only skills of his that I'm not sure about are his pass blocking and his durability. Bush, they are working to get him to that point, but he needs to put on more weight and muscle to get to Westbrook's level.

[flexxskins]

Reggie Bush couldn't sell programs for the Redskins.

Wow, I'm not calling you ignorant, but that was indeed an ignorant statement.

Bush is an obvious talent. He is a bonafide game changer.

Reggie Bush single handedly changed the course of Monday nights game.

But he couldn't sell programs for us?:doh:

[ntotoro]

Wow, I'm not calling you ignorant, but that was indeed an ignorant statement.

Bush is an obvious talent. He is a bonafide game changer.

Reggie Bush single handedly changed the course of Monday nights game.

But he couldn't sell programs for us?:doh:

He changed the game from a Saints win into a Saints loss... ?

[Shore-skin]

The voice of reason from a poster with 8 posts.

Listen, the OP isn't saying we need Reggie Bush. His point is having a player like Devin Hester, Chris Johnson, Reggie Bush, Roscoe Parrish, Steve Slaton, or Desean Jackson is nothing but an advantage. These types of players are not every down guys but when they're in the game on offense the defense MUST account for them. On special teams we all know what they can do, simply because they have pure speed. The Redskins acquired ARE in part because of his PR ability. How did that work out for us?

These speedster/elusive types are a new trend in the NFL and they are here to stay. So don't be surprised if within the next two years we select a guy who returned punts in college and can run a sub 4.35 40.

You're right, only posting on here eight times must make me an illogical fool, yet you say the same thing I did, except added some different names and elaborated.

[cyfar]

You're right, only posting on here eight times must make me an illogical fool, yet you say the same thing I did, except added some different names and elaborated.

Did I miss something? I think he was in agreeance with you.

[Shore-skin]

Did I miss something? I think he was in agreeance with you.

I guess I am the fool...thought he was being sarcastic.

[btfoom]

Our offense would look a little different with Reggie Bush-type player, but not necessarily much better. This team is built for an inside the tackles runner who can bounce outside and take a 3 yard play and make it 15. Yes, someone like Reggie is great in the open field, and I believe Zorn could find a way to get him involved, but I still don't see how it would be that much better.

When we got Portis, he had flashes of greatness, but the schemes were not suited to his strengths. Yes, Reggie would be a great 3rd down back in our system and a nice change of pace (similar to Sproles/LT in SD), but the bulk of our plays would still go to Portis, Cooley, and WRs. That is how our line is built and the style of play needed to win in the NFC East. Now, with Zorn, he is just the kind of runner we need and is playing great.

Lastly, RB has 64 rushes (avg 3.3 yards per) and 38 catches (avg 8.8 yards per), but already has 3 fumbles and 2 lost. That works out to one fumble every 34 touches. Over his career, his rushing average is 3.8 and receiving avg is 7.8 (neither that great). His career fumbles are about 1 per 48 touches. Compare to Portis (career rush 4.5 per, career recep 8.4 per) and fumbles about 1 per 93 touches.

Yes, RB is flashy and can make some really big plays on OFFENSE (the title of this thread), but overall he fumbles twice the amount of times CP does, gets fewer yards per rush, and even has fewer yards per catch.

Now, as a punt returner, RB is a completely different story. Yes, I really think the Skins should look to get someone like him for that role/3rd down back.

[TheGreek1973]

don't want to change a thing right now on this team. it is like having a Porsche (in Portis) but want to trade it for a Ferrari. Both great sport cars but the driving dynamics are just different. The Porsche you can drive every day and not feel quilty about it either.

[bedlamVR]

I am not sure what the OP wants . Someone with RBs talent or someone like reggie who was taken far too high for his contribution .

Bush like Hester have shown razzle dazzle in the return game but when a team becomes enamored with their skills in the return game they think they can rely on them for more in the offense and they start to force the ball to them and become predictable.

Take away Hesters return stats and what do you have ? A CB who cannot cover well enough so he gets converted to a WR where he cannot catch well enough .... Reggie Bush he has a 3.6 yard / attempt career average and 11 TDs in the three years he is in the league as a running back .

How can I strip the return aspect out of a players game like that ... simple it is what any half decent team can do with an accurate kicker . Look what the Colts did to the bears in superbowl XL they would kick the ball out of bounds rather than to Hester . What else do the bears have ? Nothing because they thought they had an offense because Hester and thier big play D kept scoring points . They convinced themselves they were something they weren't

I prefer our team the way it is . We have more than enough weapons to keep defenses honest and every team we have come across we have simply worn out towards the final quarter .

Bush type of players make the highlight reals but good teams don't need them ...especially if it leads to imbalance . Kid yourself all you want but Faulk was not what made the Pats offense run, he was a warm body, Corry Dillon was a key addition to that team who did the heavy lifting . And Marshell Faulk was just simply an outstanding RB his game had no holes, Bush could wish he could sniff Faulks Jock .

[kuraitengai]

Like I said in the original post, if we ever had a LUXURY PICK, I think it would be nice to spend it on a hybrid-type player.

some people apparently dont read entire sentences or posts before forming their misinformed opinion against what you are saying.

[Diesel Hog]

CJ Spiller from Clemson will depart after this year for the NFL draft (he's a junior). He is a very Reggie Bush like player, but faster.

His counterpart, James Davis, is probably the better NFL style running back though.

[kuraitengai]

name me a recent superbowl winning team with a player like that............

you can't, and there is a reason

pittsburg when they beat seattle a few years ago. they had randel el as the punt returner, who before hester came along, he was the premier type return man/gimmick-play player.

and chicago went to the super bowl with hester. so you cant really say that no team in recent years has success with those types of players.

if you want a full list:

super bowl XLII had no real players like that

super bowl XLI had hester on the losing team

super bowl XL had randel el on the winning team (and threw a TD on a gimmick play)

super bowl XXXIX has westbrook on the losing team (when he was still a part of the return game

and in the conference championship game before super bowl XLI, you had both bush and hester playing.

and the jags went to the playoffs last year (since maurice jones-drew was mentioned).

so you cant argue that teams with a specialized return player dont have success.

[kuraitengai]

CJ Spiller from Clemson will depart after this year for the NFL draft (he's a junior). He is a very Reggie Bush like player, but faster.

His counterpart, James Davis, is probably the better NFL style running back though.

davis will be the better NFL back.

spiller may be faster than bush on paper, but bush was a better back in college. spiller hasnt put up nearly the amount of highlight reel plays that bush did. and theres games that spiller has just disappeared from altogether. bush never really was shut out of a game that i can remember at usc.

although spiller was highly recruited by usc to be bush's replacement. but he picked us instead. granted he almost transferred out after his freshman year, but davis and bowden talked him out of it.

but unless you are getting some insider info about him leaving, its presumptuous to say that he will leave early. as someone who has seen, in person or on TV, every game spiller has played in, theres nothing out from spiller or the university saying he will leave. and why would he? davis will be graduating, so spiller will be the feature back finally, with only ellington and harper (two freshmen) behind him.

[Diesel Hog]

^good point. I heard about him transferring, then with Clemson kinda slumping this year, I figured he'd bolt. Clemson, and college football would really benefit to have him back, + he could help his draft stock (maybe he should talk to Gaines Adams about that).

[skinsfan328]

it would like some some S--T!!!!!!

[rick1796]

remember when dave megget was in his prime for the giants. a lot like that.

[HSW]

Now, obviously these types of players are hard to come by, but after watching how he changed the MNF game in a couple minutes, I was thinking that that type of player would take our offense from very good to unstoppable. We obviously have some need positions, but if we ever have a luxury pick, I think it would be nice to spend it on someone like Reggie Bush, Chris Johnson, or Maurice Jones-Drew: someone who can affect the passing game, run game, and return game.

Edit: For those quick to judge, I'm suggesting that we supplement CP with a Bush-type player, not replace him completely.

And yet they still loose more than win ... I will pass also. In this day and age I do not think there

is such a thing as a "Luxery Pick" btw.

[flexxskins]

He changed the game from a Saints win into a Saints loss... ?

I don't know what you really mean.:confused:

But, IMHO taking two punts to the house is changing the course of a game. Especially when that returners team has been unable to put points on the board.

[ntotoro]

I don't know what you really mean.:confused:

But, IMHO taking two punts to the house is changing the course of a game. Especially when that returners team has been unable to put points on the board.

Yet, somehow, the Saints still lost the game.

If nothing else, that definitively proves there are much more important and greater things than having a Reggie Bush when it comes to winning games.

[Touchdown Redskins]

There are obviously pros and cons to having a guy like Reggie. Yes he can be explosive and add an element of surprise. But I agree with the earlier poster that often times an offense will try to force the ball to a guy like that and a good defense, like ours, will shut a guy like that down. I just think a more traditional set up suits a team like ours, in a division like ours, better.

But you just proved my point. If the defense has to key in on a guy to shut him down, that opens it up for other players (like CP or Moss).

The Miami Hurricanes have that player on their roster currently:). True freshman Travis Benjamin looks like the next Devin Hester. Last Saturday against FSU he had a rushing TD on a reverse, a receiving TD, and a whole mess of return yards. He's listed as a WR.

Yeah I agree he looks good. There's going to be an influx of those types of players over the next couple of years. Hell, Florida must have like ten of those guys, like Harvin, Demps, and James.

Bush has virtually no impact in the running game.

We could use Portis/Betts in the passing game.

Bush punt returns were pretty sick :applause:

Well, I think the Sainsts use Bush to keep the defense honest. They run him up the gut to open up his runs to the outside and his screens, because then teams will have to respect him as a running threat. But I hear you, he's definitely not as impressive in the running game as he is in the passing/returning games.

God knows we need an explosive runningback who averages 3.6 yards per carry and whose longest run EVER is 26 yards (portis has had a run longer than this every single year he's been in the league). He's an over-rated primadonna. You see him pouting last year? I don't want that on our team.

Now, if you mean a chris johnson like player, yeah, that would be great!

Yeah, but you're only looking at a small percentage of what he does. And I agree Chris Johnson is a great runner, but you have to look at it in terms of how we would use the player. CP is already a great runningback, and so we would use that type of athelete like the Saints use Bush. He would be like what Wes Welker is to New England, or what Marshall Faulk was to the Rams.

I wouldn't quite go that far. There are far too many elements that create a good running game to go investing that kind of money in two RB's. You think Bush (or someone of that ilk) will play for peanuts?

Well, it's not like Betts is playing for peanuts.

Take away Hesters return stats and what do you have ? A CB who cannot cover well enough so he gets converted to a WR where he cannot catch well enough .... Reggie Bush he has a 3.6 yard / attempt career average and 11 TDs in the three years he is in the league as a running back .

How can I strip the return aspect out of a players game like that ... simple it is what any half decent team can do with an accurate kicker . Look what the Colts did to the bears in superbowl XL they would kick the ball out of bounds rather than to Hester . What else do the bears have ? Nothing because they thought they had an offense because Hester and thier big play D kept scoring points . They convinced themselves they were something they weren't

Well, if you've looked at Devin Hester's recent contributions, he's caught a touchdown in each of the past two games. He's a gamebreaking receiver, and if you look at the tape of the games, the defense is constantly pointing him out and changing schemes to account for him.

Same with Bush. The defense has to know where he is at all times because he can line up at split end, slot, runningback, or hell, even direct snap it to him. You say that they can take him away with an accurate kicker by simply kicking the ball out of bounds, but that just proves my point. Even special teams has to take him into account, and now your team has the ball at the 40 yard line in great field position. The Bears couldn't take advantage of this, but who's to say that a better offense couldn't either?

[ntotoro]

Betts is hardly making a King's ransom. Think back to when he got his new deal and how many people (here and outside) wondered why he stayed for so little when he could have gone elsewhere for starter's cash.

Think Bush would play for that kind of money?

[TuckahoeSkin]

bad idea IMO. the sainst force the ball to reggie and i feel it detracts from their offense. special teams he is a killer though

Do you think Charley Casserly recognized this and that's why he turned him down? If so, good call.

[Touchdown Redskins]

Betts is hardly making a King's ransom. Think back to when he got his new deal and how many people (here and outside) wondered why he stayed for so little when he could have gone elsewhere for starter's cash.

Think Bush would play for that kind of money?

Not necessarily, but there are plenty of other players out there who bring his kind of skills to the table. Darren Sproles plays for less money than Betts. Jerrious Norwood does, too. All I'm saying is that if we get a homerun hitter in the backfield, we can open this offense up even more.