Brandon Lloyd Christmas Posted February 5, 2008 Author Share Posted February 5, 2008 Do you have the same kind of statistics for running backs under Norv Turner in Washington? 1994 (3-13) - ricky ervings: 185 attempts, 650 yards, 3.5 per carry 1995 (6-10) - terry allen: 338 attempts, 1309 yards, 3.9 per carry 1996 (9-7) - terry allen: 347 attempts, 1353 yards, 3.9 per carry 1997 (8-7-1) - terry allen: 210 attempts, 724 yards, 3.4 per carry 1998 (6-10) - terry allen: 148 attempts, 700 yards, 4.7 per carry 1999 (10-6) - stephen davis: 290 attempts, 1405 yards, 4.8 per carry 2000 (8-8) - stephen davis: 332 attempts, 1318 yards, 4.0 per carry 2 years with guys over 4.5 per carry, same as gibbs did in half the years. frankly i wasnt following the skins when norv was around so i dont know what kinda offense he was running, but i know it couldnt have been that good. another topic for another thread, but how this guy kept his job is beyond me. i can only imagine how disgusted this fanbase was with this guy with year after year of failure or mediocrity. 1 good year out of 7, damn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeBass Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Or did Portis' running hinder Gibbs' offense? Gibbs' past offenses did not excel because his backs ran for 5 yards per carry but they were very effective in getting the needed yards. Riggins built a Hall of Fame career out of getting the tough yards that moved the chains and controled the clock. I think that we are looking for that Brian Westbrook type of runner because we want a exciting run or 2 but we are not really thinking about what it takes to win games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoot Point Really Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Since 2006 and 2007 were Al Saunders' system, then I don't know if those years really apply. Basically, health of the OL contributed to Portis' numbers. When Randy Thomas was healthy, we did much better than when Randy Thomas went down. I'm also not so sure that our OL is as good supporting the rush as it is good supporting the pass. Think of it this way: 2004 - lost Jansen in Preseason 2005 - Portis' best year as a Redskin, lost Randy Thomas with 2 games to go in the season (key reason why we couldn't run or pass in the playoffs) 2006 - Portis injured in Preseason (not sure if he ever recovered fully). OL healthy and Betts has a good year. 2007 - Lose Jansen and Randy Thomas in first couple weeks of season. BTW, who is our strength and conditioning coach now? Can we fire that guy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
909997 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Portis is not elite. and gibbs is not a good coach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smoot Point Really Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 another topic for another thread, but how this guy kept his job is beyond me. i can only imagine how disgusted this fanbase was with this guy with year after year of failure or mediocrity. 1 good year out of 7, damn. It's funny how people complain about Dan Snyder, but fail to remember the John Kent Cooke era where we settled for and were happy with mediocrity. I often wonder if John Kent Cooke actually wanted to buy the franchise, because the only time we ever really made any substantial moves to improve this team was when the team was going up for auction. It's almost like he was trying to improve the value of the franchise instead of driving the value down so he could buy it. Maybe I'm reading too much into the tea leaves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paintrain Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I think Portis is due for a career year in '08. Zorn is going to spread the field out a little more, not just with 3 & 4 WR sets to run out of, but with wider splits for the WR and less motion leaving defenders lingering in the box following players in motion. If I'm Brian Kozlowski, I'm a bit nervous going into camp. We're not going to be carrying 3 TE and Lorenzo Alexander anymore. LoAx and Mike Pucillo are going to play their one position from now on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Portis is not elite. Enlighten us. What's your definition of elite? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 and gibbs is not a good coach Same to you. Be more pacific. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlinginSammy HOF '63 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Betts is the man! but he wasn't the ONLY man. It takes a team to go 5-11. Can't blame that on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlinginSammy HOF '63 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 With a new coach and Portis being 27 to start 2008 I wouldn't be to shocked if he isn't our starter come 2009-2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abu69 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 i disagree, i think gibbs system is dated and weak. it took a 5 game miracle run against a string of weak opponents for us to get into the playoffs that year, where gibbs offense produced the worst post season numbers in a playoff win (and frankly, i cant imagine how much worse an offense could be, even in a loss). and 1500 for a franchise record isnt a big deal in my opinion, portis had already done that and more twice in denver two years in a row in the system were gonna be running now (or close to it) and he did it with far less carries.the reason our rushing record was so low is exactly why i think gibbs hindered portis, his system is made for high attempts and low gains to wear defenses down, not homerun hitting running plays and 5.0+ averages. People always talk about "the denver days" Without realizing that he played KC twice, Oakland twice, and SD twice per season. in '02 and '03, those teams had TERRIBLE run defenses. You don't see holes open like that in the NFC East. Tiki and Westbrook, arguably the best RBs in recent NFC East play, are/were tackle-breaking machines. Portis is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdryan99 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Yes it did. What offense did they run in Denver? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbodiesel#44 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I have been saying Gibbs mis-used CP for years. The spread field that a WCO will create should put CP back in the elite status. Gibbs used CP like he was Riggo (minus the Hogs). Two totally different skill sets and body types. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.T.real,lights,out Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Yes, we need a new age 'O' for a new age player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Lloyd Christmas Posted February 5, 2008 Author Share Posted February 5, 2008 People always talk about "the denver days"Without realizing that he played KC twice, Oakland twice, and SD twice per season. in '02 and '03, those teams had TERRIBLE run defenses. You don't see holes open like that in the NFC East. Tiki and Westbrook, arguably the best RBs in recent NFC East play, are/were tackle-breaking machines. Portis is not. im sure portis was breaking tackles in denver. he was just misused by gibbs like he was john riggins and it was 1983. hes not that kind of runner, but gibbs used him that way. if we go to this WCO, he'll be a lot more productive, and wont get bulldozed to death. and i know the afc west isnt known for great defense, but in 2002 every team in that division was at 500 or above, and in 2003 KC was 13-3. yes the other teams in that division were horrendous. either way, he was in a different offense in denver and it suited him much better. it looks like were going back to a similar style, so we'll see how much it helps him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norvitis Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Unfortunately, Portis has taken such a pounding under Gibbs that he never again will be the back he was in Denver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbodiesel#44 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Unfortunately, Portis has taken such a pounding under Gibbs that he never again will be the back he was in Denver.Brandon Lloyd will never be the rapper he was in SF either. But CP could rebound and approach those Denver numbers. He still has those speed bursts and remarkable cutting ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illone Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I think Gibbs style hindered the offense, not just Portis. Plus, I've already proven why Portis overall numbers went down when he came to the Skins. It was due to better run defenses in the NFC East than what he was facing from 02-03 while in Denver. Portis didn't change, other than he added some elements to his game. Now he's a top 3 running back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
expensivegift Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I think Ladell is more of a Joe Gibbs RB than Clinton Portis is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rm8899 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Portis will be all over the field next season especially with Randy and Jansen (possibly) back in there. wish a good off-season for Portis and every skin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Da_Truth Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Gibbs hindered the whole offense and was a medicore coach at best. Nothing like he was in the 80's, but as they say, bad things sometimes happen for the good, so hopefully the next coach we get will lead us to a championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bzapf Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Yes he did he used to be much more explosive than he is now. He gained weight and became a hard nose runner and I think thats why he was so banged up. Can you even imagine him doing this now http://youtube.com/watch?v=XBvSfY-gaF4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canethang 305 Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 Portis is not elite. His stats say otherwise as mentioned, the scheme may have not suited or been what he wanted but it was similar to Rob Chudzinski ran with the 'Canes when he was there Portis breakout season. Postis is also now the best blocking/ blitz recognition back in the league. As for Betts, he fumbled away games just like Davis did, he couldn't get in the end zone against NY in week three and he looked horrible this past season. A lot can be said about running for a contract like he was when Portis went down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeBass Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I don't know maybe Gibbs WAS thinking that the game was like it was in the '80's when football players were real men and his runners would be able to take on tacklers and get the extra yard after contact instead of going down like a sack of rocks at the first hint of contact. Maybe he thought that players could still stand to get their jerseys dirty and compete in a contact sport without having to avoid each and every defensive guy and could possibly run through a guy or 2. What WAS Gibbs thinking by assuming that his backs would be able to find seams and exploit them? Boy that Gibbs, what is wrong with this man's logic ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 I noticed during the end of the year (exempting the playoff game) that Portis had some moves. He looked good avoiding tackles and didn't try to play the power running game. He's not a power back, he's not Riggins and some fans in here need to stop living in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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