Prosperity Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 :laugh: :laugh: someone's taking a 200 level philosophy class :laugh: it's a 300 level class damnit! seriously though I thought of that idea in one of my debates with sf51 like 2 years ago... though honestly I'm sure several hundered people may have said something like it before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted September 28, 2007 Author Share Posted September 28, 2007 Justice and mercy are opposing virtues. In this case the more ethical position is to be merciful since the benefit out of being merciful in this case outweigh the nonexistant systemic problems of being slightly unjust in this case. Does that mean let him keep his money minus the amount he owes in back taxes, penalties, and fines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prosperity Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Does that mean let him keep his money minus the amount he owes in back taxes, penalties, and fines? taxes yes, but penalties and fines are more of a gray area, and I would be inclined to say don't fine this particular person, at least not to the amount where he would still lose his entire life savings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted September 28, 2007 Author Share Posted September 28, 2007 taxes yes, but penalties and fines are more of a gray area, and I would be inclined to say don't fine this particular person, at least not to the amount where he would still lose his entire life savings. I believe that any citizen that fails to pay income tax for a prolonged period of time will pay more than just the taxes they would have owed had they paid on time. I guess my question is should this guy be treated like any American that fails to pay taxes(which I would assume includes fines and penalties...otherwise I think I will take a few years off on the tax front) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 j/k... but you've pointed out an example where efficiency will MOST DEFINITELY be out-paced by inflation. The economy suffers. There is a mountain of real-world examples out there. Honestly this isn't even open to debate. :whoknows: And now zoony will change his position from declaring that it's impossible to function without importing criminals into our economy (which is utterly untrue), to claiming that it would be bad for the economy (which I've already agreed may be true, and which we both know is impossible to prove, either way). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rainmkr Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 It comes down to this. IGNORANCE does not make you innocent nor does it make his actions ok. I guess I should goto Europe, get paid under the table and then try to bring a duffle bag full of cash back. I'm sure customs would kick my butt when I tried to leave too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stew Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Did he brake a law? Then he should be punished for breaking the law. If I brake the law, one would assume i would get punished... Why doesnt the illegal immigrant have to follow our laws? because he isnt from around here or cant peak the language? I hope he never sees a penny of that money, and I hope it happens to more illegals. Illegal immigrants give legal immigrants everywhere a bad name. People who have come to this country and are taking the steps to intigrate and become American citizens are being slapped in the face by Ricky and Ponzo who sprinted accross some field in Texas or Califorina with Cheech Marin so they can collect money and bring it tax free back to Mexico. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoony Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 And now zoony will change his position from declaring that it's impossible to function without importing criminals into our economy (which is utterly untrue), to claiming that it would be bad for the economy (which I've already agreed may be true, and which we both know is impossible to prove, either way). I think you're embarassed about being completely wrong on an issue. I don't blame you. Seriously Larry, your position is embarassing from an intellectual standpoint. ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cjcdaman Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Personally I think most of the illegals that work in this economy are treated like slaves and trash anyway... Should we treat them like royalty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted September 28, 2007 Author Share Posted September 28, 2007 Should we treat them like royalty? Probably not but there might actually be a spot between "royalty" and "slave" that would be appropriate:2cents: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Probably not but there might actually be a spot between "royalty" and "slave" that would be appropriate:2cents: "Employee"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted September 28, 2007 Author Share Posted September 28, 2007 "Employee"? or "criminal"... but not slave or royalty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 or "criminal"... I'm kind of fond of the term "career criminal". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellis Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 F this guy and the other 10million just like him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helptheSKINS Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Let's not overlook the title of the story from the left leaning CNN. "Mistake costs dishwasher $59,000". What mistake was made? Was it the forgetting to pay taxes? What is illegally entering the US? This was not a mistake, he didn't claim the money because he knew he was here illegally. I do not feel sorry for him. He should pay back taxes plus interest, a fine for not filing his taxes and be sent home. He should also not be allowed to come back. I don't blame people for wanting to come here, but do it the right way. Don't tell me it takes too long. If you want it bad enough, you can wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DjTj Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Let's not overlook the title of the story from the left leaning CNN. "Mistake costs dishwasher $59,000". What mistake was made? Was it the forgetting to pay taxes? What is illegally entering the US? This was not a mistake, he didn't claim the money because he knew he was here illegally. I do not feel sorry for him. He should pay back taxes plus interest, a fine for not filing his taxes and be sent home. He should also not be allowed to come back. I don't blame people for wanting to come here, but do it the right way. Don't tell me it takes too long. If you want it bad enough, you can wait.The mistake was trying to get on a plane with $59,000. Even a U.S. citizen would have gotten themselves in a little bit of trouble for that. If he just did what every other illegal does and sent a little bit of money back each month, he would have been fine.I think you're completely right that he should pay back taxes plus interest (which will not amount to very much if he wasn't making that much and had pay stubs that likely deducted taxes for him). He should pay a fine for not paying his taxes and not declaring the cash, and he should be sent home. Actually, it sounds like all that has already happened - he has been ordered to depart and right now has given all his money to the government. If his lawyer keeps fighting, he'll likely get a chunk of it back, but there's no way DHS is giving this guy a green card. As far as waiting in line, chances are there isn't even a line to wait in. There is waiting list for people who are related to a citizen or who have certain job skills or connections to a business that will sponsor you, but there's no general waiting list for people like this guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins2010 Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 The employer should also be responsible here. send home with some of his money and have the company pay the taxes and expenses involved in sending the person home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Our economy doesn't need foreign workers. Yes it does. What planet are you on? Our economy has depended on an imported work force since day 1 and does right now this very minute as I type this. There are 12 million illegals here vast majority of which is working - tell me what percentage of the total american workforce that is. Now include the legal immigrants working in the US. Claiming the US doesn't need workers from outside the borders is absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 I don't blame people for wanting to come here, but do it the right way. Don't tell me it takes too long. If you want it bad enough, you can wait. Why am I not surprised to see the boards most partisan non-partisan chiming in with bad facts. It's not that it takes too long (for the 1000th time!) it's that it is a fairy tale. Unskilled workers have no path for legal entry. It's not a question of time or willingness to play by the rules. The problem I have with you and other spreading this myth is that it work to ease the conscience of the rabid anti-immigrant crowd. They can tell themselves that these people simply chose to break the law because they are impatient and too quick to ignore our laws for their own gains. It provides a path around the truth, that illegals are largely poor people with no other options other then to simply lay down and accept their fate in whatever hell hole birthed them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prophet Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Give him his money back, minus the taxes, and send him back to latian american. I think if you want to live in American you need to speak engrish !!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popeman38 Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Yes it does. What planet are you on? Our economy has depended on an imported work force since day 1 and does right now this very minute as I type this. There are 12 million illegals here vast majority of which is working - tell me what percentage of the total american workforce that is. Now include the legal immigrants working in the US. Claiming the US doesn't need workers from outside the borders is absurd. Our economy has depended on the immigrant worker form day one....the LEGAL ONES. Undocumented worker, illegal immigrant - both names that are too soft. I prefer criminal. If you knowingly comer her illegally, you are not protected by the constitution. Reasonable search and siezure? Sounds reasonable to search a criminal. A parolee can be searched at any time, for any reason.And that would be 4%. Do you really want to stand by your "the economy depends on these people" statement? Because if they were replaced by the "unemployed" citizens, this country would still be running at full employment +. Your logic doesn't quite make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Why am I not surprised to see the boards most partisan non-partisan . . . Um, I agree with most of your post, but I'm not certain I'd agree with your bestowing that particular title on this particular poster. (Not sure exactly who I would nominate for that title. Can we have a playoff system, maybe? Competition's pretty stiff.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popeman38 Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Why am I not surprised to see the boards most partisan non-partisan chiming in with bad facts. It's not that it takes too long (for the 1000th time!) it's that it is a fairy tale. Unskilled workers have no path for legal entry. It's not a question of time or willingness to play by the rules.Why do we want to let other countries unskilled workers come here again? Immigration is not a right. Our legal immigration may not work perfectly, but that is no reason to encourage people to immigrate illegally. Sort of like justifiable homicide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 Our economy has depended on the immigrant worker form day one....the LEGAL ONES. Undocumented worker, illegal immigrant - both names that are too soft. I prefer criminal. If you knowingly comer her illegally, you are not protected by the constitution. Reasonable search and siezure? Sounds reasonable to search a criminal. A parolee can be searched at any time, for any reason.Sure, just let me know how you know which have rights to "reasonable search and siezure" prior to searching them. I'm a legal hispanic immigrant so I'm all ears.And that would be 4%. Do you really want to stand by your "the economy depends on these people" statement? Because if they were replaced by the "unemployed" citizens, this country would still be running at full employment +. Your logic doesn't quite make sense. 4% of the total population... not the working population. It's about 8% (source). You going to tell me that 8% of the total labor force can be removed easily? And let's remember this 8% isn't evenly spaced. My guess is that argiculture and construction are heavily dependent on illegal workers. You think those two pieces of the economy can fall without dragging a lot more down with it? So yeah I'd say we depend on imported workers a great deal. I'd say that kicking them out would shrink our economies growth significantly. I'd even go as far as saying the US has absolutely no way of replacing them legally at the current time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twenty-eight Posted September 28, 2007 Share Posted September 28, 2007 :doh: ****ing disgusting. Give the man his HARD EARNED money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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