Imus on the Hot Seat for Rutgers Comments

[Warpath81]

That is a great column by Whitlock...I agree with most of the stuff in his article...but what is so ironic about the posting of his article is that i remember in some of the previous articles he has written, many people on this board labeled him as a racist, and now his article is being posted as a defense for what Imus did.

I don't think he is defending Imus, he's basically saying 'who cares'.

IMO, the likes of Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson and Robert Johnson have moved the people more towards segregated races. I don't believe they help and at times I wonder what their mission is.

[Major Harris]

whitlock isn't defending imus at all.

[Spaceman Spiff]

So in a nutshell, blame rap music and not Imus.....ooookkkkkkaaaaayyyyyy.

I'm blaming the rap culture. Imus, like I said, is a byproduct. Pay attention.

This further proves my point that alot of hisfenders on this board share the same opinion as Imus and have their own racial issues. For one the word N***er was not invented with RAP niether was the word Ho. Second contrary to alot of your popular beliefs a small percentage of Hip Hop uses such demeaning references but you only know what you want to know. Third RAP sells millions of units each year of which roughly 70 percent is bought by caucasions HIP HOP on the other hand (which most blacks listen to) is a totally different form of expression, with that said how ignorant of some of you to suggest that "Ooh they say it in Rap so it's ok" B.S... I listen to some Rock and i have heard Murder, Drugs, Racism, Bi-Sexuality and Hate but what in the Hell would that have to do with some idiot saying the white girls on "Duke's" team being shaped like 12yr old boys, sweating smelling like German Shepards and being products of wild orgies with family members and Catholic priest. It would have nothing to do with it. I am just so disturb by the recent racist and underlying hate that have become political fodder in the tailgate. Being a black man i have seen, felt, observed and known prejudice and hate all my 33 years on this planet and when i read some of your views and ideas on these topics in the tailgate forum it only reinforces my belief that much of society is and has the same ignorant, insensitive, racist and insecure views as our fore fathers. I truely wish some of you could step out of the box and hear what you are saying and above all i wish some of you could spend 1 month in the shoes of a black person and trust me the idiotic threads like "Are Whites held to a higher standard" would be thrown in the trash. The sad part of all of this is that many of you hide behind your keyboards and feel safe, knowing that in public amongst black, whites, hispanics ect....you would not be spitting this venomous and ignorant B.S that you spit here. Even more than that some of you will actually be raising children. :mad:

Note that I haven't defended Imus. I'm just saying he's the surface of the underlying problem.

Nice stats. I do listen to rap. I like the Roots, a lot, for starters so I'll concede the point about real hip hop.

However the fact remains that acts like The Roots don't get much airplay on the radio, MTV or BET. You can't quantify how many people watch the videos, hear it on the radio or hear it elsewhere.

I've heard bad stuff in rock n roll, but I also don't hear rock musicians calling women "hoes". I can't find one rock song on my computer where thats a lyric.

IMO, what I said wasn't racist. It was truthful. And I'm sorry if you're uncomfortable with the fact that rap culture has purveyed this attitude. However, to ignore it would be a sign of ignorance too.

And sometime the truth hurts.

I'll ask again. Where'd Imus get the vernacular?

To further illustrate my point: http://www.nydailynews.com/opinions/2007/04/10/2007-04-10_a_dangerous_detour.html

[Dan T.]

Actually you are an idiot and stop being so ****ing ignorant grab a dictionary and understand the word racist, and state where I said white blue eyed jezeebels and blacks are a superior race to whites and made any remarks with negative conotations towards ANY race. I believe most whites are racists even if they don't know it. So you need to take a chill pill and calm the heck down. You sound like an idiot.

Nobody called out Killerbo on the highlighted statement, and I feel compelled to do so. To me, that statement is in itself a racist statement.

In another post, he defined racism as the belief that members of a race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races; and prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on such a belief.

Why is Killerbo's statement racist? He ascribes to whites the characteristic that they are racists, making them by definition morally inferior to others. I resent being labeled in such a way. By the same token, I have empathy for others who have been stereotyped and discriminated against in much harsher fashion.

And it seems in his heart of hearts he believes it. And I wonder how many others agree with him. If his belief is commonly held by others, we as a society have a long way to go toward improving racial harmony.

And if he's right, we as a society have a long way to go toward improving racial harmony.

[ironmic]

I don't agree with Whitlock at all. I would honestly like to know what telling rap musicians not to curse is going to do. Imus wasn't listening to Jeezy one day and making those remarks as a member/participant of the culture, or someone even trying to understand. It was a messed up statement that mocked a specific group of people, and their culture. 95% of the artists in rap don't have control over what their image is, the content of their album, or even the direction of their career.

Whitlock is a respected columnist that didn't even bother to check his facts...it's been mentioned ad nauseum that Jesse Jackson & Al Sharpton have challenged artists & label companies to do better...

We aren't screaming for Imus to be censored, personally my thoughts are that it is a shame such a reprehensible statement can freely roll off someone's tongue in 2007.

Thank you! Since one Black Man has one opinion "Well hell then all us Blacks should feel the same way" GTFOH. One man does not speak for us, thats his opinion and his opinion alone, "But hey i guess us Black folk needs ta fall in line cus Mr. Whitlock said somethin that masta agrees with". :doh:

[ironmic]

I'm blaming the rap culture. Imus, like I said, is a byproduct. Pay attention.

Note that I haven't defended Imus. I'm just saying he's the surface of the underlying problem.

Nice stats. I do listen to rap. I like the Roots, a lot, for starters so I'll concede the point about real hip hop.

However the fact remains that acts like The Roots don't get much airplay on the radio, MTV or BET. You can't quantify how many people watch the videos, hear it on the radio or hear it elsewhere.

I've heard bad stuff in rock n roll, but I also don't hear rock musicians calling women "hoes". I can't find one rock song on my computer where thats a lyric.

IMO, what I said wasn't racist. It was truthful. And I'm sorry if you're uncomfortable with the fact that rap culture has purveyed this attitude. However, to ignore it would be a sign of ignorance too.

And sometime the truth hurts.

I'll ask again. Where'd Imus get the vernacular?

To further illustrate my point: http://www.nydailynews.com/opinions/2007/04/10/2007-04-10_a_dangerous_detour.html

I would assume that he got it from the decades of the words being thrown about. Like i said..N***er, Ho and whatever else was not born with Rap. Also i can find many songs country, Rock, Rap, Hip Hop, Techno, Stet ect..that speak of women in derogatory ways, that glorify the use of drugs and being a bad ass. Also the reason The Roots, Nas, Common, Talib ect dont get AIRPLAY is because the company Execs that happen to be white(not lumping OK) want to sell an image and portray some of the sterotypes to line their own pockets and reinforce their beliefs. There was a time when Hip Hop ruled and Rap was a joke, you do understand this right? The fact of the matter is alot ofthese artist have said publicly that they cant make the music they want because the record companies will not promote them so they are forced into an image. Alot of the Emcee's are not "Gangsta's" they are just like Arnold, Stallone, Peschi ect...Entertainers making a living doing what they do...Since when did Hip Hop or Rap become a lynchpin for "See YOU PEOPLE" hell just because Marylin Manson goes Bi, chops off a rib and ozzy bites bats does that mean "Hey thats all of them see they do that they allow me to say ignorant things WTF no! when it's not music from BLACKS it's just that Music

[ccsl2]

I'm blaming the rap culture. Imus, like I said, is a byproduct. Pay attention.

Note that I haven't defended Imus. I'm just saying he's the surface of the underlying problem.

Nice stats. I do listen to rap. I like the Roots, a lot, for starters so I'll concede the point about real hip hop.

However the fact remains that acts like The Roots don't get much airplay on the radio, MTV or BET. You can't quantify how many people watch the videos, hear it on the radio or hear it elsewhere.

I've heard bad stuff in rock n roll, but I also don't hear rock musicians calling women "hoes". I can't find one rock song on my computer where thats a lyric.

IMO, what I said wasn't racist. It was truthful. And I'm sorry if you're uncomfortable with the fact that rap culture has purveyed this attitude. However, to ignore it would be a sign of ignorance too.

And sometime the truth hurts.

I'll ask again. Where'd Imus get the vernacular?

To further illustrate my point: http://www.nydailynews.com/opinions/2007/04/10/2007-04-10_a_dangerous_detour.html

For all of those blaming ONLY hip hop for what Imus said see below. It is like blaming Barry Bonds for the steroids era in baseball.

http://www.allhiphop.com/editorial/?ID=353

"Add to this reality the present-day fact that mainstream corporate conglomerates have signed off on a popular culture—namely the hiphop industry—which has, for at least the past decade and a half, and without fail, portrayed Black and other women of color as vixens, strippers, and, yes, “hos.” Where do we think Mr. Imus got the term, if not from the vernacular of our times, put forth via record labels, radio stations, and video networks, and, yes, from far too many ignorant Black male hiphoppers, to describe women? Thus what we have is the crash collision of racism and sexism in the person of Don Imus. "

"Now, is Don Imus the problem by himself? Of course not, which is why I think calls for his dismissal are rooted purely in emotionalism and miss the larger issues here. Bigger problem number one is a federal government and a corporate hierarchy that have allowed destructive and despicable images and words regarding women to be transmitted, without any real regulation, for far too long, to the point where someone like Don Imus believes it okay to refer to women as “hos” on a nationally syndicated radio show heard by millions. Bigger problem number two is the American society we’ve become where, for the sake of profit and audience size, personalities, commentators, and pundits are allowed to spew all manner of hateful rhetoric, even as such language unwittingly reinforces negative stereotypes, perpetuates individual and mass bigotry, and wounds the self-esteem of the targeted recipients."

[Henry]

I'm blaming the rap culture. Imus, like I said, is a byproduct. Pay attention.

Note that I haven't defended Imus. I'm just saying he's the surface of the underlying problem.

Nice stats. I do listen to rap. I like the Roots, a lot, for starters so I'll concede the point about real hip hop.

However the fact remains that acts like The Roots don't get much airplay on the radio, MTV or BET. You can't quantify how many people watch the videos, hear it on the radio or hear it elsewhere.

I've heard bad stuff in rock n roll, but I also don't hear rock musicians calling women "hoes". I can't find one rock song on my computer where thats a lyric.

IMO, what I said wasn't racist. It was truthful. And I'm sorry if you're uncomfortable with the fact that rap culture has purveyed this attitude. However, to ignore it would be a sign of ignorance too.

And sometime the truth hurts.

I'll ask again. Where'd Imus get the vernacular?

To further illustrate my point: http://www.nydailynews.com/opinions/2007/04/10/2007-04-10_a_dangerous_detour.html

I'm a huge Van Halen fan. Off the top of my head:

"Slip and slide, push it in

the ***** sure got the rythem."

I'm a huge AC/DC fan. Off the top of my head:

"Reflections on the bedroom wall

And girl you thought you'd seen it all

We're rising, falling like the sea

You're looking so good under me

I'm gonna walk all over you

I'm gonna walk all over you

Do anything you want me to do to you

I'm gonna walk all over you"

Those are two pretty huge white rock bands, who made decades of music objectifying women. Just because the word 'ho' isn't prevelant, that doesn't mean that same attitude isn't. It also doesn't give me license to start telling *****es I'm gonna walk all over 'em.

Unless you are suddenly a big fan of Tipper Gore, blaming popular music for what people do and say is a dangerous road to travel.

[rincewind]

I'm a huge Van Halen fan. Off the top of my head:

"Slip and slide, push it in

the ***** sure got the rythem."

I'm a huge AC/DC fan. Off the top of my head:

"Reflections on the bedroom wall

And girl you thought you'd seen it all

We're rising, falling like the sea

You're looking so good under me

I'm gonna walk all over you

I'm gonna walk all over you

Do anything you want me to do to you

I'm gonna walk all over you"

Those are two pretty huge white rock bands, who made decades of music objectifying women. Just because the word 'ho' isn't prevelant, that doesn't mean that same attitude isn't. It also doesn't give me license to start telling *****es I'm gonna walk all over 'em.

Unless you are suddenly a big fan of Tipper Gore, blaming popular music for what people do and say is a dangerous road to travel.

:laugh:

I think we should list all of the musicians listed in this thread.

Also - **** Tipper. LONG LIVE ZAPPA!!

[Major Harris]

Nobody called out Killerbo on the highlighted statement.

might want to go back over the thread. i stayed up way too late last night because of that ignorance.

[Killerbo]

might want to go back over the thread. i stayed up way too late last night because of that ignorance.

Yeah Me too staying up late because of the ignorance in this forum as well.

[Killerbo]

Nobody called out Killerbo on the highlighted statement, and I feel compelled to do so. To me, that statement is in itself a racist statement.

In another post, he defined racism as the belief that members of a race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races; and prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on such a belief.

Why is Killerbo's statement racist? He ascribes to whites the characteristic that they are racists, making them by definition morally inferior to others. I resent being labeled in such a way. By the same token, I have empathy for others who have been stereotyped and discriminated against in much harsher fashion.

And it seems in his heart of hearts he believes it. And I wonder how many others agree with him. If his belief is commonly held by others, we as a society have a long way to go toward improving racial harmony.

And if he's right, we as a society have a long way to go toward improving racial harmony.

Ok, I will slow down for you since you just jumped in a freaking conversation looking for holes and ways to call me racist and deflect attention from what the heck I am trying to express here. I never SAID explicitly that most whites are RACIST, I said I BELIEVE most whites are racists subconciously if they know it or not.

Also making one MORALLY inferior?:doh: what the ****, people reaching for straws everywhere here. Imus call a bunch of black girls "nappy headed hos" a demeaning derogatory comment about BLACK women, but calling him and the possibilities of some white people being racists makes me a racist because I am supposedly saying they are morally inferior to other races:doh: (like 300 years of history doesn't say they where a whole lot of racists who were WHITE) while I am actually condenming his words and using the right description for Imus and some white people who actually support this guy and don't feel it was a racist remark bcos they hear the same words being said on some rap cd's and thus that makes it ok. WTF!!!

You know what I am done with this crap, Imus ****ed up and is a racist prick. No matter how hard you try to deflect, spin, place blame elsewhere, he said those offensive words about those girls who didn't deserve it at all.

Also the funny thing is my wife is white, thinks the remark is ****ed upn and was RACIST and I love her to death. If I hated white people in general, why the heck will I marry a white chick (my hot smoking wife)? SHe is my wife first I don't apply her skin color to her and she is the best thing to ever happen to me. SO till later peace out, should have never strayed in here and just stuck to the stadium and tal about football. Bcos the race relations btw whites and blacks will always be polarizing till there is no distinction between whites and blacks anymore, or any other race. Peace out!!!

[Spaceman Spiff]

I'm a huge Van Halen fan. Off the top of my head:

"Slip and slide, push it in

the ***** sure got the rythem."

I'm a huge AC/DC fan. Off the top of my head:

"Reflections on the bedroom wall

And girl you thought you'd seen it all

We're rising, falling like the sea

You're looking so good under me

I'm gonna walk all over you

I'm gonna walk all over you

Do anything you want me to do to you

I'm gonna walk all over you"

Those are two pretty huge white rock bands, who made decades of music objectifying women. Just because the word 'ho' isn't prevelant, that doesn't mean that same attitude isn't. It also doesn't give me license to start telling *****es I'm gonna walk all over 'em.

Unless you are suddenly a big fan of Tipper Gore, blaming popular music for what people do and say is a dangerous road to travel.

Degrading to women, yes. Degrading to black women, no.

It is a dangerous road to travel. I'm not saying rap music MADE Imus say what he did...I'm saying it certainly influenced it. C'mon Henry the connection to make isn't a hard one.

[Dan T.]

Ok, I will slow down for you since you just jumped in a freaking conversation looking for holes and ways to call me racist and deflect attention from what the heck I am trying to express here. I never SAID explicitly that most whites are RACIST, I said I BELIEVE most whites are racists subconciously if they know it or not.

Also making one MORALLY inferior?:doh: what the ****, people reaching for straws everywhere here. Imus call a bunch of black girls "nappy headed hos" a demeaning derogatory comment about BLACK women, but calling him and the possibilities of some white people being racists makes me a racist because I am supposedly saying they are morally inferior to other races:doh: (like 300 years of history doesn't say they where a whole lot of racists who were WHITE) while I am actually condenming his words and using the right description for Imus and some white people who actually support this guy and don't feel it was a racist remark bcos they hear the same words being said on some rap cd's and thus that makes it ok. WTF!!!

You know what I am done with this crap, Imus ****ed up and is a racist prick. No matter how hard you try to deflect, spin, place blame elsewhere, he said those offensive words about those girls who didn't deserve it at all.

Also the funny thing is my wife is white, thinks the remark is ****ed upn and was RACIST and I love her to death. If I hated white people in general, why the heck will I marry a white chick (my hot smoking wife)? SHe is my wife first I don't apply her skin color to her and she is the best thing to ever happen to me. SO till later peace out, should have never strayed in here and just stuck to the stadium and tal about football. Bcos the race relations btw whites and blacks will always be polarizing till there is no distinction between whites and blacks anymore, or any other race. Peace out!!!

You don't need to slow down for me Killerbo. No matter how slow you go, you wind up typing vitriol and nonsense anyway. I quoted you directly. You said you believe that most white people are racist. I assume you view racism as a bad thing. So in your mind, most white people have this bad attribute. I assume that people who are racist are morally inferior to others who aren't. Perhaps you don't.

And note that I didn't call you a racist. I called your statement a racist statement. I wouldn't presume to make such a sweeping judgement of you based only on one comment. I don't know you enough to judge you.

[rincewind]

Also the funny thing is my wife is white, thinks the remark is ****ed upn and was RACIST and I love her to death. If I hated white people in general, why the heck will I marry a white chick (my hot smoking wife)?

Strom Thurmmond had a black daughter.

[Johnny Punani]

Strom Thurmmond had a black daughter.

'

Strom Thurmmond: "How can I be a racist?" "I have a black daughter!"

What a messed up country we live in.

We have racists married to people of other races and racists having children with other races. :laugh:

Love is color blind....and hypocrisy is too!

[Jumbo]

I agree with Punani.

I'm gonna start keeping count. :laugh:

[Spaceman Spiff]

Strom Thurmmond had a black daughter.

:rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

[#98QBKiller]

Strom Thurmmond had a black daughter.

Dick Cheney has a lesbian daughter.

[LeesburgSkinFan]

I ordered a t shirt on Ebay yesterday. It says, in Rutgers scarlet, University of Nappy Headed Hos. I am going to wear it over the next 3 weeks before it becomes passe.

[Henry]

It is a dangerous road to travel. I'm not saying rap music MADE Imus say what he did...I'm saying it certainly influenced it. C'mon Henry the connection to make isn't a hard one.

So ... you think the people who sued Judas Preist because their kid killed himself after listening to their music had a case?

[Guest sith lord]

Degrading to women, yes. Degrading to black women, no.

It is a dangerous road to travel. I'm not saying rap music MADE Imus say what he did...I'm saying it certainly influenced it. C'mon Henry the connection to make isn't a hard one.

I'm so sick and tired of the old copout "rap made him do it" excuse. This man is a 60 something year old man, he's not some 5 year old who was listening to the radio one day and repeated what he heard. If Don Imus is that simple minded, he should have never been on the radio in the first place.

[Dan T.]

I'm so sick and tired of the old copout "rap made him do it" excuse. This man is a 60 something year old man, he's not some 5 year old who was listening to the radio one day and repeated what he heard. If Don Imus is that simple minded, he should have never been on the radio in the first place.

I think the point being made is that the word is used so often now in music and videos, specifically in hip-hop or rap-style music, that it has become commonplace in popular culture. Hell, the ACADEMY AWARD-winning song last year was "It's Tough Out Here as a Pimp." I don't know if the term "ho" is used in that movie or in that song, but it's another example of how the pimp lifestyle has been brought into mainstream media.

So the point people are making is not blaming rap per se, but noting that the use of the term in current music and videos is so pervasive that the term has become routinized in popular culture - so routinzed that a 60-year old white man would think he could say it out offhandedly on air and then be surprised by the firestorm its use creates. The point doesn't apologize for Imus just as it doesn't blame rap.

[ironmic]

im just so glad to see so many people's true colors coming out.