Why do so many illegal immigrants believe....

[luckydevil]

Remember that humans aren't like other resources

Julian Simon said it best, the ultimate resource is people

[Ancalagon the Black]

It's easier for immigrants to reap the benefits of our govt. than it is for life long citizens.

How do you figure that?

[Mass_SkinsFan]

Your a hard man

How about any able body person must do community service to qualify for any aid? IF I am paying them they can at least pickup trash or pull weeds.

Yes I am a hard man. It come with the territory when one actually has convictions and beliefs that guide one's life.

The problem with your "community service" idea is that it continues the problem. It enforces the idea that it's alright to be stealing money from those of us who are working for a living. Oh yeah, they're doing community service. BIG, FAT, HAIRY DEAL. There's another class of people (called prison inmates) who can be doing that sort of stuff FOR FREE, and they're in pretty good supply in this country currently.

[luckydevil]

Mass SkinsFan

Curious, what is your position on free trade?

[Tarhog]

In other words, blame yourselves, morons.

I've read three posts of yours today that were extremely close to the line. Take it down several notches or you'll lose your Tailgate privileges.

[twa]

Yes I am a hard man. It come with the territory when one actually has convictions and beliefs that guide one's life.

The problem with your "community service" idea is that it continues the problem. It enforces the idea that it's alright to be stealing money from those of us who are working for a living. Oh yeah, they're doing community service. BIG, FAT, HAIRY DEAL. There's another class of people (called prison inmates) who can be doing that sort of stuff FOR FREE, and they're in pretty good supply in this country currently.

Yeah, but if they pull weeds or pickup trash down here in Texas very long they WILL develop a desire to work at a decent job. :laugh:

Even a McDonalds fry cook is a upgrade , and there are enough weeds and trash to share with the prisoners too.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

Mass SkinsFan

Curious, what is your position on free trade?

I'm an ISOLATIONIST, Pure and simple. If a company wishes to do business with foreign companies and countries they can set up a completely SEPARATE (legally, financially and physically) business, based overseas to do so.

[luckydevil]

I'm an ISOLATIONIST, Pure and simple. If a company wishes to do business with foreign companies and countries they can set up a completely SEPARATE (legally, financially and physically) business, based overseas to do so.

Did you support the Iraq war?

[Sticksboi05]

I was in Hecht's and these hispanics were waiting to steal stuff. I saw it coming. I was so pissed. But what can you do. Illegals do need to shutup but they do come in handy.

***This is not aimed to say all hispanics steal or that all illegals are hispanics***

[ZoEd]

How do you figure that?

I grew up a poor hillbilly from WV. I wasn't offered any scholarships or special treatment for being less fortunate. There are so many opportunites for immigrants to get grants for business and education. Where could I go to get the handouts? I couldn't, I've had to work for everything I've gotten. There are plenty of CITIZENS in the same boat with no help from the govt. You can say food stamps if you want by my Dad was too proud, instead he worked his ass of to give my family a chance at a good life.

[DjTj]

I've been to 26 different countries and as far as I know we are the only ones that make concessions for other nationalities. ie: spanish driving tests. Every other country you go to expects you to learn their language. Why should we be any different? Speaking the language of your host nation should be required to become a citizen.

Also, shouldn't legal immigration require that you bring something to the table? Not just come here for a free ride and sponge off of our govt. It's easier for immigrants to reap the benefits of our govt. than it is for life long citizens.

In Canada, especially in Quebec, aren't things in both English and French?

...I was in a National Park in Taiwan in January, and they had tour guides speaking both Mandarin and Taiwanese. A lot of TV stations there are bilingual, but it's a bit easier because the writing is just about the same. Most tourist attractions also had English (and sometimes Japanese).

Actually when I've traveled abroad I've found a lot of English in non-English-speaking countries - I don't know where you're going that you haven't seen that.

I grew up a poor hillbilly from WV. I wasn't offered any scholarships or special treatment for being less fortunate. There are so many opportunites for immigrants to get grants for business and education. Where could I go to get the handouts? I couldn't, I've had to work for everything I've gotten. There are plenty of CITIZENS in the same boat with no help from the govt. You can say food stamps if you want by my Dad was too proud, instead he worked his ass of to give my family a chance at a good life.

I think you are confusing immigrants with minorities in general. I am the child of immigrants, and as an Asian-American, I didn't get a lot of special treatment when I wanted to study science in college. If anything, I had to work harder to get where I wanted because of my race.

If you can tell me where I can get handouts for immigrants, I would greatly appreciate it.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

Did you support the Iraq war?

I did, and do. Not because I like the idea, but because it is what the POTUS and his advisors determined was necessary. So far as I'm concerned the moment the first American serviceman gets shot at or has to shoot at someone, the idea of not supporting the War and the Soldier fighting it is TREASON. That's a belief I inherited from my late father, a Vietnam Veteran who was spit on in San Francisco Airport upon returning from doing the duty his country asked of him.

[ZoEd]

You see English in tourist areas because a big percentage of tourists are English. They're not making it easier for English speaking people to be nice but to make more money.

So most immigrants aren't minorities?

Quebec? Didn't Quebec used to be a territory of France? Doesn't most of Candad speak english/french? Come on dude, terrible analogy.

[Ancalagon the Black]

That's a belief I inherited from my late father, a Vietnam Veteran who was spit on in San Francisco Airport upon returning from doing the duty his country asked of him.

I am truly sorry that your father was so ill treated by the countrymen he was defending.

You see English in tourist areas because a big percentage of tourists are English. They're not making it easier for English speaking people to be nice but to make more money.

Hate to tell you this, but most businesses on the East Coast and West Coast are bilingual in order to make more money, not to be nice.

So most immigrants aren't minorities?

I think you're misinterpreting DjTj's point. The immigrants are not given special status because they're immigrants, as you imply, it's because they are minorities that have been historically discriminated against. Native Americans, who have been here longer than your family, are given such entitlements. I'm an immigrant, and I've been offered no such entitlements.

Quebec? Didn't Quebec used to be a territory of France? Doesn't most of Candad speak english/french? Come on dude, terrible analogy.

Didn't California used to be part of Mexico? Doesn't most of California speak English/Spanish?

[DjTj]

You see English in tourist areas because a big percentage of tourists are English. They're not making it easier for English speaking people to be nice but to make more money.

I also don't think we're putting things in Spanish just to be nice. We're doing it either to make money or to get votes.

The point though is that there are other bilingual countries e.g. Canada (French and English), Hong Kong (Cantonese, Mandarin, and English), Taiwan (Taiwanese and Mandarin), Belgium (Dutch and French). We're not exactly the only country in the world with this issue.

So most immigrants aren't minorities?

Most immigrants are minorities, but most minorities aren't immigrants. I don't think the United Negro College Fund is giving out a whole lot of scholarships to immigrants.

I really think your problem is with minorities and not with immigrants.

[Mass_SkinsFan]

I am truly sorry that your father was so ill treated by the countrymen he was defending.

Thank you. I find it especially ironic since he had turned down both a medical and an educational dispensation to accept his draft notice. When I asked him about it, he responded... "I wasn't going to send some other kid to go and possibly die in my place because I was lucky enough to have a college acceptance letter and a bad finger." I wonder how those protestors would have reacted if they'd known he might have saved the life of someone they knew or were related to? Especially since it was his time in Southeast Asia that probable added to the complications of the skin cancer that killed him.

[ZoEd]

Never said I had a problem. I was simply asking questions. We live in America and we're an English speaking country. We shouldn't have driving tests in different languages. It's not easier for immigrants to get scholarships? Just asking because I'm under the impression that it is. Bilingual countries are that way because they are occupied by people from those countries. America is an english speaking country that is getting overrun by spanish speaking people. Does that mean that we should all of a sudden become bilingual or should they learn to speak english?

You see I'm not a narrow minded redneck waving a rebel flag. I'm simply asking questions and just because I don't agree with the answers given doesn't mean I'm anti anything. My brother in-law is Mexican, my Aunt is Korean, by no means am I against immigration. I'm just wondering when enough is enough.

By the way both my brother in-law and my Aunt have learned the english language. Neither of them have ever expected any concessions be made to them. They've worked their asses off to become american citizens.

[rtbasye]

How did your supply sergeant join the army without legal status?

hmm good question- I'd have to ask him to be honest, but what better way to earn your citizenship than volunteering to serve in your new homeland.

The us military is full of good people trying to earn their way into the US. I think I have at least two of the 158 guys and gals in my company that in this category.

[rtbasye]

I've read three posts of yours today that were extremely close to the line. Take it down several notches or you'll lose your Tailgate privileges.

tarhog even lurks in the tailgate :notworthy .... beware bad posters!!! :cool:

[ZoEd]

How did your supply sergeant join the army without legal status?

hmm good question- I'd have to ask him to be honest, but what better way to earn your citizenship than volunteering to serve in your new homeland.

The us military is full of good people trying to earn their way into the US. I think I have at least two of the 158 guys and gals in my company that in this category.

I work with two young Airman that are working on earning their citizenship.

[DjTj]

Never said I had a problem. I was simply asking questions. We live in America and we're an English speaking country. We shouldn't have driving tests in different languages.

I think that's a reasonable position, and you should vote that way.

It's not easier for immigrants to get scholarships? Just asking because I'm under the impression that it is.

Just tell me where I can check the box "child of immigrants" on my application forms. I've see a box that says "underrepresented minority" and I see the box that says "child of alumni," but I've never seen a box that said "immigrant." :whoknows:

Bilingual countries are that way because they are occupied by people from those countries. America is an english speaking country that is getting overrun by spanish speaking people. Does that mean that we should all of a sudden become bilingual or should they learn to speak english?

Nobody's going to do it all of a sudden, but if people are voting for officials that make those changes, it will certainly happen over time. You can solve this problem at the ballot box.

You see I'm not a narrow minded redneck waving a rebel flag. I'm simply asking questions and just because I don't agree with the answers given doesn't mean I'm anti anything. My brother in-law is Mexican, my Aunt is Korean, by no means am I against immigration. I'm just wondering when enough is enough.

By the way both my brother in-law and my Aunt have learned the english language. Neither of them have ever expected any concessions be made to them. They've worked their asses off to become american citizens.

My parents did the same thing, and they've been very happy being American citizens for nearly two decades now. I still haven't gotten any scholarships out of it though...

[ZoEd]

That's why I'm here to learn through cordial discourse. See your family didn't expect anything to be given to them. They worked for everything they have, just like mine. That should be the norm. If you want to be an American than you should become an American. Not saying you should forget your roots but the least you can do is learn the language and do whatever it takes to be a contributer to our society. Sad thing is, most immigrants do a better job of contributing than most American citizens do.

[Symbol]

people who are not citizens of this country do not have any legal rights other than legal alien status laws, and illegals have NO rights, therefore they probably shouldnt be protesting, if i were mayor of LA i would send the border patrol right there and say, "guess what guys? yall just admited to being ilegals, time to go home..."

Unfortunately, as was found out here in California, illegal aliens do have rights. There was a vote in California about 8-10 years ago on deciding whether or not illegal aliens should or not have the right to health care or education. The voting was overwhelming to not give them the rights. However, when the people for illegals when to the Supreme Court, they voted that the law that was voted by the people was unconstitutional.

So, what the Supreme Court said, in my opinion is that illegal aliens have some rights that we as legal citizens or legal aliens do not have.

[FlyinO]

So weak and juvenile in fact, that the Supreme Court of the United States agreed with me in 1982, 1953, 1896, and 1886.

And the politics of the time had nothing to do with these rulings 2 were over a century ago.

I think everybody agrees that people should help one another and let them explain themselves, but this is the 21st century. America can't always stay the same and expect to survive. Adaptability is key to thrive as a nation. Allowing millions of undocumented persons into our country can have dire consequences. Question-How would you respond if a majority of the persons in South America made a mad dash for America? It would obviously lead to a domestic crisis. I am not against giving citizenship to those already here, but then we have to put some sort of controls in place to stop this massive flux of undocumented persons.

Can the immigrant protesters be deported? Yes, if you know for a fact they are illegal immigrants (according to the Supreme Court in 1999 - http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/97-1252.ZS.html), but you have to give them a hearing and you have to prove they are illegal.

The problem is this policy is barely put to use.

[DjTj]

Unfortunately, as was found out here in California, illegal aliens do have rights. There was a vote in California about 8-10 years ago on deciding whether or not illegal aliens should or not have the right to health care or education. The voting was overwhelming to not give them the rights. However, when the people for illegals when to the Supreme Court, they voted that the law that was voted by the people was unconstitutional.

So, what the Supreme Court said, in my opinion is that illegal aliens have some rights that we as legal citizens or legal aliens do not have.

:doh: The Supreme Court didn't say that you have to give the immigrants rights. The Supreme Court said that if you're going to give everyone else health care or education, you have to give it to the immigrants too.

There's this thing called discrimination that's apparently illegal in this country.

And the politics of the time had nothing to do with these rulings 2 were over a century ago.

I think everybody agrees that people should help one another and let them explain themselves, but this is the 21st century. America can't always stay the same and expect to survive. Adaptability is key to thrive as a nation. Allowing millions of undocumented persons into our country can have dire consequences. Question-How would you respond if a majority of the persons in South America made a mad dash for America? It would obviously lead to a domestic crisis. I am not against giving citizenship to those already here, but then we have to put some sort of controls in place to stop this massive flux of undocumented persons.

The problem is this policy is barely put to use.

When those Supreme Court rulings were made, the country was way more anti-immigrant than they are today. The 1800's cases involved Chinese immigrants in California, and around the time of those cases Congress actually completely banned all immigration from China. However, the Supreme Court held that as long as the immigrants were still in the United States, they were entitled to their rights under the Fourteenth Amendment.

Politics change but the Constitution remains the same. And, at least since the Civil War, we give equal rights to all people regardless of color or national origin.

Now how many immigrants we want in the country is a legitimate political question, but whether or not those immigrants have the right to protest is something that our forefathers set in stone. They don't have a right to come to America, but once they're here they definitely have the right to free speech.