GSF Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 that I think will be looked at a great deal by Gibbs is at kicker. Hall has been decent on FGs, but something we've seen a from him quite a bit is short kickoffs. He's also done the unthinkable, kicking it off out of bounds at crucial times in the game. If memory serves, he's kicked it off out of bound 3 or 4 times this year, including in the last 2 games. Giving the other team good field position off poor kick offs is something that makes Gibbs nuts, and really a problem with Gibbs style of ball control offense. Kicker is a position that Gibbs considers extremely important, and with Hall's problems on kickoffs plus his health issues, I don't see Gibbs sticking with him. What is the status with Hall's contract, and will any good FA kickers be available? Thanks for any comments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grego Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 what did novak do after the skins cut him? gotta like the local kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commbrkdwn Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 I think he's in Arizona now :-( I liked him too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrfriedm Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 I agree that Hall's KOs have been really bad this season. However, he is one of the more reliable place kickers in the league. I don't think that we will be able to replace him in that department. Also, I think that Hall is still nursing that quad, and HOPEFULLY after another offseason of rest he will be much better on KOs. Remember Kicking the ball like that puts a lot of pressure on your quad, and he's probably trying to take it easy to make sure he's there when it comes time for the FGs. Unfortantly, I don't think that we will have the roster space to have a third kicker for KOs, so I think that we may just have to take the great with the bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macnoke03 Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 that I think will be looked at a great deal by Gibbs is at kicker. Hall has been decent on FGs, but something we've seen a from him quite a bit is short kickoffs. He's also done the unthinkable, kicking it off out of bounds at crucial times in the game. If memory serves, he's kicked it off out of bound 3 or 4 times this year, including in the last 2 games.Giving the other team good field position off poor kick offs is something that makes Gibbs nuts, and really a problem with Gibbs style of ball control offense. Kicker is a position that Gibbs considers extremely important, and with Hall's problems on kickoffs plus his health issues, I don't see Gibbs sticking with him. What is the status with Hall's contract, and will any good FA kickers be available? Thanks for any comments. I couldn't agree more. Our kicking game has been bad but our punting from Frost has been even worse. Correct me if I'm wrong (and I'm sure someone will ) there were only 2 or 3 punters who had worse averages than Frost. I think we mad a big mistake letting Groom go for Frost. Every time we are back in our end of the field and we need a nice punt Frost gets off one of his classic 30 yarders . Hall has definetely been struggling with kick offs and he just doesnt have the leg to make the longer field goals. I think we should be looking at upgrading both positions next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 I agree. Both kicker and punter need to be seriously evaluated and I wouldn't be surprised if both had hard competitions to keep their jobs. Hall's good, but he's been injured a lot the last two years. I just don't trust Frost to kick us out of trouble. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kappaluvacee Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Hall will be on our roster. Hall has been less than stunning on his kickoffs, but he is accurate and has good range. That is the most important aspect of a kicker. I think his shorties are the result of his leg strength. He should get healthy in the offseason. For those thinking we should make a change a Kicker, think back to the 2000 season to see what inconsistency at kicker can do to a season. I'd rather deal with Hall other short-comings as long as he is still accurate than to go through the kicking carousel of 2000 again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrfriedm Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Hall will be on our roster. Hall has been less than stunning on his kickoffs, but he is accurate and has good range. That is the most important aspect of a kicker. I think his shorties are the result of his leg strength. He should get healthy in the offseason. For those thinking we should make a change a Kicker, think back to the 2000 season to see what inconsistency at kicker can do to a season. I'd rather deal with Hall other short-comings as long as he is still accurate than to go through the kicking carousel of 2000 again. Thank you, My thoughts exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsniper1 Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Frost wont be our punter next year, the guy on IR should be.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 I remember when we got Hall, one qualification of his that was mentioned was "experience kicking at the Meadowlands". I think that still counts for something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMalcolmConnection Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Yeah, Tupa SHOULD be back next year. He was money for us in 2004. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrisbob74 Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 I agree with Hall's struggles on kick-offs, he looks like his technigue has gone to pot although he seems fine on field goals. Frost has done ok from an accuracy standpoint but he does seem to get a lot of good bounces (although getting the ball to bounce the right way is a technique in itself). My solution would be for the Sins to find a Punter who could also handle KO duty and then keep Hall purely for FG's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrepDC Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 I remember during the Kansas City game the announcers said that we were kicking the ball short on purpose on kickoffs. So that the return man wouldn't have much room to make moves before our coverage came down. It worked great on Donte Hall, maybe we are still doing this strategy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TODD Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 A punter who can kickoff would be optimal for our roster. That'll take care of two problems at once. Teams are typically holding on to their kickers these days so finding an upgrade for Hall may not be possible this offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fight_on_til_you_have_won Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Yeah, Tupa SHOULD be back next year. He was money for us in 2004. Considering he used to be a quarterback, I wonder how often Tupa lobbies for a fake punt. That would be awesome to see him throw a pass on fourth down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartinC Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 what did novak do after the skins cut him? gotta like the local kid. Signed with Arizona then cut and then (drum roll please) signed with Dallas for the last coupl eof games after they cut Cundlif. He played against us in that wonderful game at Fed Ex ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kounter Trey Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Wasn't Steve Cox the guy who used to punt, boom kickoffs, and boot our 50+ yard FG attempts? Would love to have someone like that again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrisbob74 Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 Signed with Arizona then cut and then (drum roll please) signed with Dallas for the last coupl eof games after they cut Cundlif. He played against us in that wonderful game at Fed Ex ! Novak isn't with Dallas is he? http://www.nfl.com/teams/depthcharts/ARI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Prime Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 that I think will be looked at a great deal by Gibbs is at kicker. Hall has been decent on FGs, but something we've seen a from him quite a bit is short kickoffs. He's also done the unthinkable, kicking it off out of bounds at crucial times in the game. If memory serves, he's kicked it off out of bound 3 or 4 times this year, including in the last 2 games.Giving the other team good field position off poor kick offs is something that makes Gibbs nuts, and really a problem with Gibbs style of ball control offense. Kicker is a position that Gibbs considers extremely important, and with Hall's problems on kickoffs plus his health issues, I don't see Gibbs sticking with him. What is the status with Hall's contract, and will any good FA kickers be available? Thanks for any comments. Novak had 2 or 3 blocked kicks.. What's your point? Hall has kicked it out of bounds twice this year. He's consistant and often times short kick offs are by design, I have seen him kick the ball out of the back of the endzone, he has leg so not sure where your going with this. Yeah if there is a better kicker in FA get him, if you can do it for a reasonable price Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slm2856 Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 I like Hall. His kicks need some improvement, but overall he is a tough guy. He is not afraid of tackeling someone. I even heard that since he used to play linebacker in HS or something that he wears the Def color shirt when in practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrisbob74 Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 But how do you explain the kicks he has sent OFB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
misery Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 good post We need better field position on KO's and some leg strength on FG's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins24 Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 I remember during the Kansas City game the announcers said that we were kicking the ball short on purpose on kickoffs. So that the return man wouldn't have much room to make moves before our coverage came down. It worked great on Donte Hall, maybe we are still doing this strategy. Problem is the strategy if it is one isn't working too well. Seems opponents are constantly starting at the 30-40. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostofAlvinWalton Posted January 5, 2006 Share Posted January 5, 2006 A punter who can kickoff would be optimal for our roster. That'll take care of two problems at once.Teams are typically holding on to their kickers these days so finding an upgrade for Hall may not be possible this offseason. We do have a punter that can kickoff (FROST). That was one of the reasons I heard stated as why the Skins went with him over Groom. Yet he has not kicked off once even with Hall's problems. ?????? . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSF Posted January 5, 2006 Author Share Posted January 5, 2006 Novak had 2 or 3 blocked kicks.. What's your point? Hall has kicked it out of bounds twice this year. He's consistant and often times short kick offs are by design, I have seen him kick the ball out of the back of the endzone, he has leg so not sure where your going with this. Yeah if there is a better kicker in FA get him, if you can do it for a reasonable price What's my point? I thought that was pretty obvious. My point was that Hall is giving the other team great field position with his short kickoffs, or even worse kick offs out of bounds. I don't know what year you remember Hall kicking off out of the back of the endzone since he's only had 1 touchback this year as well as 1 touchback last year. Hall's average on kickoffs for the last 2 years has been right at 60.5 yards, compared to the 65 to 67 yards for his first 5 years. His return average this year is 21.9 yards, which means on average Redskin's opponents are starting on their own 32 yard line after returning kickoffs. That is not good, especially with the way Gibbs likes to play ball. These are averages keep in mind, but from my memory Hall has been significantly worse over the last few weeks. As far as field goals go, yes you are right that he hasn't missed , many. He's actually had his highest field goal percentage in his career at 85.7%, but he's only had 14 attempts all year(10 games), and his longest has been from 45 yards. In case you haven't noticed, Gibbs hasn't been going for long field goals with Hall. Actually I don't think Gibbs likes long FG tries anyways, but he's been especially conservative this year. The only thing consistents about Hall these last 2 seasons has been his short field goal tries, where he's money, he gives the other team good field position with his short kick offs, and the fact that he hasn't been able to stay healty. This post wasn't meant to bash Hall, just point out that he has really struggled with short kick offs these last 2 years, and field position is the name of the game with Joe Gibbs. Perhaps Hall is still healing from injuries, I don't know. Maybe he can get healthy this season and regain his old form, but I'd be willing to bet good money that Gibbs will bring in some good competition for Hall this offseason. If their are any good kickers available through free agency or through trade(sounds crazy I know, but don't rule it out with Gibbs) I think Gibbs will look to upgrade. Hopefully Hall gets healthy and that will not be neccessary, but a look at Hall's numbers suggest otherwise. Hall's career stats: KICKING Year Team G 1-19 20-29 30-39 40-49 50+ Tot Lg Blk Pct XP XPG Pct 1997 New York Jets 16 1-1 10-11 11-17 2-6 4-6 28-41 55 1 68.3 36-36 36 100.0 1998 New York Jets 16 0-0 9-9 9-13 6-10 1-3 25-35 54 3 71.4 45-46 45 97.8 1999 New York Jets 16 0-0 3-4 17-17 7-12 0-0 27-33 48 0 81.8 27-29 27 93.1 2000 New York Jets 15 0-0 8-9 6-8 6-12 1-3 21-32 51 1 65.6 30-30 30 100.0 2001 New York Jets 16 1-1 8-8 5-7 7-9 3-6 24-31 53 1 77.4 32-32 32 100.0 2002 New York Jets 16 0-0 9-9 9-11 6-10 0-1 24-31 46 4 77.4 35-37 35 94.6 2003 Washington Redskins 16 0-0 8-8 7-9 6-9 4-7 25-33 54 1 75.8 26-27 26 96.3 2004 Washington Redskins 8 1-1 3-3 3-3 1-3 0-1 8-11 46 0 72.7 13-13 13 100.0 2005 Washington Redskins 10 1-1 3-3 3-3 5-6 0-1 12-14 45 0 85.7 27-27 27 100.0 TOTAL 129 4-4 61-64 70-88 46-77 13-28 194-261 55 11 74.3 271-277 271 97.8 KICKOFFS Year Team G KO Avg TB Ret Ret Avg TD Onside Recov 1997 New York Jets 16 85 66.6 29 54 21.0 0 2 0 1998 New York Jets 16 84 67.8 24 60 22.8 0 0 0 1999 New York Jets 16 77 66.0 12 63 25.2 0 1 0 2000 New York Jets 15 67 64.6 9 56 23.1 0 0 0 2001 New York Jets 16 74 63.3 9 62 21.6 0 2 0 2002 New York Jets 16 79 62.4 5 74 21.3 1 0 0 2003 Washington Redskins 16 72 61.5 11 60 20.6 0 2 1 2004 Washington Redskins 8 30 60.8 1 29 23.0 1 0 0 2005 Washington Redskins 10 51 60.5 1 47 21.9 0 0 0 TOTAL 129 619 64.1 101 505 22.2 2 7 1 It's a lot easier to read the stats if you go to the link: http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/1705 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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