Fred Jones Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 I have a question for everyone concerning what should be viewed at public libraries. Do you think you should be allowed to view adult porn from computer terminals at public libraries? I am talking any type of adult porn site, not child porn. My local public libraries allow adult men, haven’t heard of any women doing this, to view adult porn on computer terminals owned by the library. From your standard porn sites to full bondage sites. The library also lets these people print pictures using library paper and take these pictures with them when they leave. The library says that they are protecting the First Amendment rights of these people. If I had children, especially daughters, that visit the library I would not want them exposed to this. It is my understanding that this act does not violate any local or state laws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 Originally posted by Fred Jones My local public libraries allow adult men, haven’t heard of any women doing this, to view adult porn on computer terminals owned by the library. From your standard porn sites to full bondage sites. The library also lets these people print pictures using library paper and take these pictures with them when they leave. The library says that they are protecting the First Amendment rights of these people. If I had children, especially daughters, that visit the library I would not want them exposed to this. It is my understanding that this act does not violate any local or state laws. Is this in fairfax??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 Do you think you should be allowed to view adult porn from computer terminals at public libraries? Well, not adult porn. But other kinds of porn, sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chiefhogskin48 Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 I think it's absolutely ridiculous that such things occur. Whic district do you live in, because in Montgomery County, this would never be allowed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenmdixon Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 I don't see a problem with it *IF* they are in some way keeping the kids away from that terminal(s). There was a real creepy guy in the Bull Run library in Manassas a few weeks ago who sat his skeevy butt next to me at one of the computer terminals and proceeded to find some seriously weird stuff in full view of another woman's brood of 5 kids (all under the age of 12). Woman complained. Librarians asked him to move, he said no, they did nothing else, I left (and so did the family). edited to say that the library has terminals set up all over the library - this guy chose a terminal that was right near the check out desk where most people are using the terminals to print out stuff or look in the library catalog online Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Nostril Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 It violates first amedment rights to make porn illegal, and it violates first amendment rights to completely disallow someone from viewing porn. However, it certainly doesn't violate these to disallow someone from viewing porn on a computer that doesn't belong to them in a public place like a library. If I ran a library I wouldn't allow it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 The problem with this issue is "what is porn" and how do you identify it. One could easily say nudity = porn, but you'd be wrong. Nudity, even graphic nudity, often is the subject of art and much of that is photgraphic so we aren't just talking about painting. The reason that matter is that the constitution prohibits the passing of laws that are not clearly defined. So in order to solve this issue one needs to shelve the "porn is bad!" debate, and look into the problem caused by internet porn from a technological perspective. In other words we have no means of indentifying what is and what isn't porn without using stupid buzzwords that in the past have blocked sites like "Dick" Cheney's. The key in my eyes is a law creating a ".xxx" address for all things deemed to be porn. That wouldn't solve the problem completely because you'd still have international sites that don't follow our laws but it would go a long way in creating a situation where laws making certain material illegal could be clearly defined and capable of surviving a legal challenge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 porn is bad on the internet where do you think all of these hackers pratice thier new viruses, on porn sites :doh: they know the audience that will click on anything without thinking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 Actually, jbooma raises an interesting point. Couldn't the library say they reserve the right to refuse access to certain sites, based on the fact that they might send a virus to the terminal? Perhaps a loophole to prohibit porn sites from being veiwed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 Originally posted by Henry Actually, jbooma raises an interesting point. Couldn't the library say they reserve the right to refuse access to certain sites, based on the fact that they might send a virus to the terminal? Perhaps a loophole to prohibit porn sites from being veiwed? And I believe this is fairfax's rule regarding the internet in libraries, I know because I work in the county. That is why I am curious if this branch is in fairfax or not. I know for certain they don't allow chatrooms so porn has to be not allowed as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma And I believe this is fairfax's rule regarding the internet in libraries, I know because I work in the county. That is why I am curious if this branch is in fairfax or not. I know for certain they don't allow chatrooms so porn has to be not allowed as well. You would have to clearly define what constitutes the threat of infection (like chatrooms for example which open a port). That would be hard because while porn sites are more likely to blast you with spyware, they aren't alone in that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Jones Posted May 27, 2004 Author Share Posted May 27, 2004 Sorry I didn’t get back to you Jb, but yes this is in Fairfax County. Also, the Library does not block access to porn sites like they do at public schools. Also, these are clearly porn sites. Jenmdixon your story about childing viewing it is exactly what is happening here in Fairfax. Give me a couple minutes and I will post the Library’s response. Hypothetical situation, what if these same people, after viewing the pictures inside the library, than go out to their vehicles and take care of business. No intention to display anything, but in the open if you walk by their car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 Originally posted by Fred Jones Sorry I didn’t get back to you Jb, but yes this is in Fairfax County. Also, the Library does not block access to porn sites like they do at public schools. Also, these are clearly porn sites. Jenmdixon your story about childing viewing it is exactly what is happening here in Fairfax. Give me a couple minutes and I will post the Library’s response. Hypothetical situation, what if these same people, after viewing the pictures inside the library, than go out to their vehicles and take care of business. No intention to display anything, but in the open if you walk by their car. That is funny they don't want people on the internet talking to long to family in other countries but they allow others to surf porn, at a public place, where kids are around :doh: I need to talk to some other employees here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WM_Marylander Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 The issue comes down to whether or not the Library should allow pictures of say, nude paintings in. They sometimes get picked up by the possible Adult Filters, and prove to be un-helpful in preventing other sites at times. Though... I do think that's a little much. To each his own, but to each his own in private. Not the public library. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Jones Posted May 27, 2004 Author Share Posted May 27, 2004 It is my understanding that the Library’s response was they cannot block the porn sites and they cannot block anyone from viewing adult porn sites. They of course can’t view any type of child pornography. These people also cannot print out pictures and hand them out or ask a child to view the site. This is true in Fairfax County only, and I suspect other counties in VA. I don’t know what other states do. Henry, from what I understand of the Library's response, they propabably went up to their boses for a county wide policy. From my other dealings with the library, they probably consulted a lawyer to develop their policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 My opinion. (I know you've all been waiting for it, so you'll have The Authoratitive Answer). No, libraries should not be in the position of deciding what things you're allowed to read. However, consider a hypothetical: Suppose I want to donate a subsrciption to Hustler to the library. Posession of that material also carries the responsibility to keep it away from children. If the library accepts the subscription, then they have to take precautions with the magazines. It may literally require them to construct a special room to house them, and to assign a staff member to function as Wanker Room Door Guard. So, to me, while it's wrong for the libraby to say "We don't allow that stuff in our pristine chambers!", it's perfectly acceptable to say "Gee, I just don't have the space to construct a Wanker Room, and I don't have the staff to assign a Door Guard, so I guess I'll just have to decline your gift, because I don't want responsibility for it". Or, back to the internet-porn thing: If the library wants to allow porn in, they have that right, but they have to take precautions to prevent access by minors. This will require staff checking IDs, and unlocking the filters on selected computers, and may require a seperate room (to keep people from looking over people's shoulders). If the library doesn't feel like committing those kinds of resources, then that is the function of the librarian. (To allocate limited resourses for the most good.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
halter91 Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 I would definatly say NO. That's why I have a home PC. lol. It should be in a public place. It offends people(not me) and plus how can they keep a good monitor on it, keeping it away from kids etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Symbol Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 Being a father of two children, and a son that goes online, with the filters on, I say you don't allow it in a public place, period. No making a new room, no nothing. If I were the parents of the kids who were able to view the contents on the strange man's screen, I'd sue the library, city, county, and state. The moment the children saw the images on the screen, it became immoral if not even illigal. I know it's illigal in the state of California, and I'm sure it is throughout the U.S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 All I have to say if this made the evening news, (attention fox 5 ) It would be changed in a second :laugh: The issue I see is if you provide them the ability to look at certain pics, then the person might get all worked up and attack someone when the leave. Now I am not saying that is possible, but you never know. How would the county feel if they were the cause of some crime, not too good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. S Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 I dont have a problem with allowing it at a library, but my question is, usually males are doing something when looking at porn, and personally, I wouldnt wanna do that when a buncha people are walking around. Youd have to be pretty deprived to have to resort to the library. Most libraries charge for anything you print, so printing the material is fine I suppose. However, I think if the library had a seperate 'research' section, thatd be better. Ususally the noticable computers at my library just have the book catalog on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TankRizzo Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 Originally posted by Henry Actually, jbooma raises an interesting point. Couldn't the library say they reserve the right to refuse access to certain sites, based on the fact that they might send a virus to the terminal? Perhaps a loophole to prohibit porn sites from being veiwed? That's a can o' worms right there...next thing you know you can't look at this type of site or that type of site because of viruses. It just goes downhill from there...and we don't want the ACLU involved! :paranoid: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrangeSkin Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 Wow...how big of a loser do you have to be to look at porn in a public library? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chosen Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 There are a couple of legal arguments I can see in favor of stopping people from viewing internet porn in public libraries. First, there is some legal precedent in the legal position taken on strip clubs and other adult stores being restricted to certain zones. The argument is that the type of people that are attracted to adult entertainment establishments will make the area more unsafe. In a similar vein, maybe it can be argued that people who are depraved enough to go into a public library in full view of children and others and look at pornography are the types of people who may make the library an unsafe place for minors to be around. A second, and I believe stronger argument is that precisely for the reason that it is a public place, the viewing of pornographic material in the library can be akin to indecent exposure in public. Libraries may not be able to block the websites themselves because the opposition says that even the most sophisticated filter will block educational websites about sexuality (a strong arguing point for the ACLU, saying that it restricts the rights of many websites about homosexuality, especially). Libraries may even not be able to stop people from reading sex stories online.. however, if they view a pornographic picture in full view of others, I think it can be argued that they should be charged with an offense under indecency laws. I think this is a reasonable legal standpoint. comments? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Slammer Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 When I volunteered at a Fairfax County public library, I did internet sign up. One of the guys I signed up didn't close all his windows after he left. So I went and closed them. Porn, all of them. I guess now I know why he wanted to wait for a computer that was facing the other way. I thought it was really strange at the time, but I guess it isn't that uncommon.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 27, 2004 Share Posted May 27, 2004 That's pretty sad commentary to be looking at porn in a public library of all places. Its a refuge for learning, that's coming from experience. If you're looking at porn in a public library then what you need is to learn a lil maturity. That's not the dumbest thing I've ever heard, but it's right up there with throwing a rock at the ground and missing. :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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