WallyG3 Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Are you going to het pissed at Yoda too? Be careful, that little dude can brawl. I'm Yoda, I'm a soldier,I mold ya, then fold ya, I thought I told ya, Don't be unwise, judge me not by my size, You won't believe your eyes, Watch the X-Wing rise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3DaysLatr Posted March 23, 2004 Author Share Posted March 23, 2004 Well, this has been tons of fun.......;-) But I've got to get to work. Since I'm in the overwhelming minority here I'll agree to disagree with most of you and hope that our F.O. has the sense to realize you don't go after a smallish TE that is really a tweener Wide-out at #5. Especially when Gibb's history is to use a tweener Tackle, FB, TE at the position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsNation Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by 3DaysLatr No, I don't. I think he loses congnitive thought under pressure and that won't get him into the pro-bowl or deem him worthy of the #5 pick in the draft, let someone else blow their first rounder on him. He was caught up in the heat of the moment, post-game interview...Big deal he's a 20yr old for cryin-out loud gimme a break - if thats the knock on him than i'd take that "baggage" vs. just about any other players "baggage" in a heartbeat. Ever heard of ESPNClassic? How about John Facenda's classic narration on the NFL? He uses "gladiator" "battle" "war" all of the time...these words have become part of the football vernacular and are accepted as commonplace by most. These words are not copyrighted by anyone to be used ONLY in Middle east conflict talks... These words are adjectives describing the regular competition of Football. In no way was he disrespecting the US Armed Forces, his use was "football slang" and anyone thinking otherwise has nothing else to do but nitpick on something minor. His passion is unquestioned and I completely respect that and would be fine w/him wearing the Burgundy and Gold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
feeshta Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Speaking as a member of the armed forces I can say that i was not offended by what KW2 said. He was speaking metaphorically(even if he didn't neccessarily know that. LOL) It is a pervasive concept in football to call your players soldiers and the coaches are their officers. KW2 was simply regurgitating what he had been force-fed for years. Any way you look at it, there is no questioning the kids fire and competetiveness. He reminds me a lot of Shockey. I hate Shockey, but that would change in a hurry if he played for the Skins. The main reason I hate Shockey is the medias convoluted love affair with the guy. I mean he is a great player, but when he makes an ass of himself like he is prone to do, you have to call it like it is. The same can be said for KW2. He does occasionally make an ass out of himself, but he usually does it for what I would consider the right reasons. With the right couches that temper could be controlled. Miami is notorious for things like this and I think that is a function of their coaching and the general attitude of the team. Somew of the greatest players ever had nasty attitudes. He can be worked with, you just need to hraness that fire into productive efforts, and he could be one of the greats. The fact that he respects Joe, would go a long way towards keeping him in line I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samuels Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 I tell any of you thier is 0% chance he becomes a bust i'd bet my life. Is it possible he could be like TO maybe but I don't think so. Ray Lewis last year said he was a captain leading his troops to war but did he get flamed hell no. Its slang and I say it all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbooma Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by 3DaysLatr Especially when Gibb's history is to use a tweener Tackle, FB, TE at the position. I guess you don't know who Gibb's first H-back was, Mr. Kellen Winslow Sr, oh and he did have 91 catches his first year :drool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedskinsNation Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by feeshta Speaking as a member of the armed forces I can say that i was not offended by what KW2 said. He was speaking metaphorically(even if he didn't neccessarily know that. LOL) It is a pervasive concept in football to call your players soldiers and the coaches are their officers. KW2 was simply regurgitating what he had been force-fed for years. Any way you look at it, there is no questioning the kids fire and competetiveness. He reminds me a lot of Shockey. I hate Shockey, but that would change in a hurry if he played for the Skins. The main reason I hate Shockey is the medias convoluted love affair with the guy. I mean he is a great player, but when he makes an ass of himself like he is prone to do, you have to call it like it is. The same can be said for KW2. He does occasionally make an ass out of himself, but he usually does it for what I would consider the right reasons. With the right couches that temper could be controlled. Miami is notorious for things like this and I think that is a function of their coaching and the general attitude of the team. Somew of the greatest players ever had nasty attitudes. He can be worked with, you just need to hraness that fire into productive efforts, and he could be one of the greats. The fact that he respects Joe, would go a long way towards keeping him in line I think. Excellent Post my friend:applause: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galentjm Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by 3DaysLatr Why not address the position of most need with our pick? Even if we stayed at #5 we should pick whatever Lineman the F.O. has identified as the top player along the Line. I couldn't disagree with this statement more. A number #5 pick in any draft (not to mention this year's top heavy draft) typically gets a team a dynamic player that should be a perennial pro-bowler. Yes, there are going to be Heath Shulers and Ryan Leafs, but there are many more examples of player's selected in the top five that proceeded to have excellent careers. You don't draft a player at #5 based solely on team need, you have to take into account the best player available factor. Perhaps if our pick were lower we might consider drafting solely on need. Regardless of what you think of KWII and his personality, his profound talent level is unquestionable. Do player personalities affect on-field performance, yes. Do players often have their draft status affected by foolish statements or errors of their youth, yes. Its called being human. Should all things be considered before taking a "character" such as Winslow in the draft, undeniably. Should the Redskins not take this player because he's made a few dumb comments to the media, absolutely not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galentjm Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 They are all "possible pro-bowlers". Winslow has proven nothing and with our primary need being the D-Line he's a wasted pick. For every Moss there is a Demetrius Underwood, Ryan Leaf, Tony Mandarich or Todd Marinovich out there. No scouts thought that Ryan Leaf, or Demetrius Underwood had the chance to become the best EVER at his position. Do some homework, thats what they're saying about Winslow. Let's play a hypothetical. Pretend you're the GM of an NFL team that holds a very high draft pick. The draft is approaching and you've been scouting various players that play various positions. Your own scouts as well as the scouts of numerous other teams are all talking about this kid who they think is better than any player CURRENTLY in the NFL at his position. You've seen the kid play and you're uttlerly amazed by his physical gifts, and playmaking ability. The only problem is this kid doesn't play a "position of need." The best prospect at the "position of need" is a very talented player, and by all rights would be a solid pickup. However, the buzz around this player is no where near that of the previously mentioned player. Scouts around the league project the player at the "position of need" to be a solid pro, that one day could be a top ten player at his position. So you're telling me that we should take a guy who could be a solid pro and in time perhaps one of the better players at his position, over a player who is widely considered to be one of the best players at his position if not THE best player at his position ALREADY. Man, I'd love to have you running the FO of my team. :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubba9497 Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma I guess you don't know who Gibb's first H-back was, Mr. Kellen Winslow Sr, oh and he did have 91 catches his first year :drool: sorry the H-bak didn't come about until he came to coach the Skin's. Mainly to combat LT. Gibbs uses the h-back mostly as a blocker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansince62 Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 we're not gonna draft a potential HOFer cuz he said "I'm a soldier"? you have got to be kidding me. I didn't realize that footbal was such a gentleman's sport!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Streater101 Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 I can't say I'm surprised with some of the replies I'm reading here. After all, the nation practically stood still over Janet Jackson's nipple. Annoys me that people are so quick to villianize anyone the media tells them too. If you don't feel he can cut it as player in the National Football League, then fine. but don't paint some picture of a "hothead" or "crybaby" cuz some reporter shoved a mic in his face after a big loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horseman Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 sol·dier n. 1. One who serves in an army. 2. An enlisted person or a noncommissioned officer. 3. a. An active, loyal, and militant follower: a soldier in the environmental coalition. b. A trusted follower of an organized crime leader. 4. A sexually undeveloped form of certain ants and termites, having large heads and powerful jaws specialized to serve as fighting weapons. v. –intr. sol·diered, sol·dier·ing, sol·diers. 1. To be or serve as a soldier. 2. To make a show of working in order to escape punishment. WORD HISTORY: Why do soldiers fight? One answer is hidden away in the word soldier itself. Its first recorded occurrence is found in a work composed around 1300, the word having come into Middle English (as soudier) from Old French soudoior and Anglo-Norman soudeour. The Old French word, first recorded in the 12th century, is derived from sol or soud, Old French forms of Modern French sou. There is no longer a French coin named sou, but the meaning of the word sou alerts us to the fact that money is involved. Indeed, Old French sol referred to a coin and also meant "pay," and a soudoior was a man who fought for pay. This was a concept worth expressing in an era when many men were not paid for fighting but did it in service to a feudal superior. Thus soldier is parallel to the word mercenary, which goes back to Latin mercennarius, derived from merces, "pay," and meaning "working for pay." The word could also be used as a noun, one of whose senses was "a soldier of fortune." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henry Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 I'm curious. What was Dr. J's field? What about Doc Walker? Were those guys DOCTOR doctors, or just PHds? Or maybe they were dentists? Either that or they were lying and dishonoring an entire profession. I can't imagine that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJWatson3 Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 he's a soldier on the field. in the heat of battle he lays it out for his teammates, comes through with the game-saving (not life-saving) catch. he attacks (catch & run) and defends (blocks) with his body, not a weapon. every game is an all-or-nothing situation. you win or you die trying. but you don't die. most times. that's the kind of guy i want on my team. hell, when i played i considered myself a "soldier" too. i never died, but i got a broken leg, broken arm, ****ed up back and knees, countless concussions, and a lifetime of pain to look forward because i gave all i had on the field. for my teammates and my pride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaRock Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma The only problem is their is no one good at #5 to take as a DL and we don't draft that high to often. The other thing is if we lost McCants I think K2 is a no brainer with Gardner leaving next year. Where do you get Gardner is leaving....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citigent Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by bubba9497 sorry the H-bak didn't come about until he came to coach the Skin's. Mainly to combat LT. Gibbs uses the h-back mostly as a blocker can someone clarify this i thought i read countless time that winslow sr. was the first hb, at san diego, i just dont want to go on using that if i'm wrong? and as far as the soldier thing ,let it go. coaches do say their about to go to battle all the time. its just talk taht is in no way meant to be direspectful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins26 Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 He was very very upset after a loss. I dont think you should really hang on those words he said, he said them in anger. And some people are looking into it way too much. I would be happy to have a guy with that much fire and passion to win on my team. If a loss gets him that upset that he has a meltdown in the locker room like that, then obviously he is going to do everything he can do to win the game. He is one of the most competitive players ive ever seen. He cant take losing, which is a good thing. and BTW, he is a hell of a run blocker! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
citigent Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by Skins26 BTW, he is a hell of a run blocker! why do so , many say he cant block, is it his size or you just dont want him, because if you hvae watch him and the canes play you would know he can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrazyZeb Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by AJWatson3 hell, when i played i considered myself a "soldier" too. i never died, but i got a broken leg, broken arm, ****ed up back and knees, countless concussions, and a lifetime of pain to look forward because i gave all i had on the field. for my teammates and my pride. That's both inspiring and depressing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosher Ham Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 This is one of the Saddest threads i have read here in some time. Who really gives a crap that K2 called himself a soldier ?? My Dad is a "Nam Vet and My G'Father a WW2 vet and neither of them where offended. A soldier is someone willing to die for a cause in which THEY believe in. A player making millions who is already rich, ready to play til his hearts stops for the game he loves.... I will take him any day of the week to be a Skin. Regardless of all of that the Skins are going to Draft the Best player available @ 5 otherwise move down and pick up an extra pick. Joe Gibbs is one of the Greatest Coaches of all time and if some of you believe that a TRUE football fan (which Gibbs is) can just ignore the game for years then you should just go cheer for the Cardinals or the Eagles; because thats what they have always done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awesome Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 There's no doubt the guy's a first class ass in the mold of Shockey and Mike Irvin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OURYEAR#56 Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Somebody needs a hug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Tater Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by ccableguy can someone clarify this i thought i read countless time that winslow sr. was the first hb, at san diego, i just dont want to go on using that if i'm wrong? and as far as the soldier thing ,let it go. coaches do say their about to go to battle all the time. its just talk taht is in no way meant to be direspectful. Yes, Winslow SR played most of his games from an H-Back position. The H-Back position has been around since the 60s (though I don't think it was called that) and I've even seen it envisioned all the way back to the 30s (slide the TB to what we call the QB and move the FB to the TB and move the BB to outside the TE's shoulder). It is also a standard formation in the WCO. I played some H-Back in HS in the late 70s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by jbooma You all need to chill. This is what EVERYONE says now a days. It is cool again to be called a soldier. You are all overeacting :doh: :applause: Its an all an act, the whole soldier thing. I don't think he's trying to compare himself to a real soldier, he's stupid if he does. Either way, if he can play, bring him. The way a player acts only matter if its goin to HARM the team. If we drafted Winslow, our offense would be arguably the best in the leauge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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