The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Skinsinparadise]

52 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

I see it they need to let him think he has a shot at starting with intent on the rookie eventually taking over.

I want a rookie to be the future

 

I want a rookie or a really good veteran.  I am not a Trubisky guy but I wouldn't mind if its just another arrow thrown at the dart board in addition to the rookie. 

[Skinsinparadise]

Add Trey Wingo just now to the pile along with Mike Garafolo that Russell Wilson might not be out of reach for the WFT.  Forgetting which beat guy said it but one also thinks while Rodgers has zero chance to come here, there might be a small chance with Wilson.

 

My gut is there is a small chance too.   It would probably have to be Rivera somehow reaching out to his people.  I know Russell is tight with McKissic, not sure about anyone else.  I am not saying that I think they got a decent chance.  But I've gone from thinking zero chance to maybe 5% or so.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 7, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Redskins 2021]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Add Trey Wingo just now to the pile along with Mike Garafolo that Russell Wilson might not be out of reach for the WFT.  Forgetting which beat guy said it but one also thinks while Rodgers has zero chance to come here, there might be a small chance with Wilson.

 

My gut is there is a small chance too.   It would probably have to be Rivera somehow reaching out to his people.  I know Russell is tight with McKissic, not sure about anyone else.  I am not saying that I think they got a decent chance.  But I've gone from thinking zero chance to maybe 5% or so.

 

 

 

 

 

His wife will make the call. 

[Skinsinparadise]

4 minutes ago, Redskins 2021 said:

His wife will make the call. 

done

https://michiganchronicle.com/2015/06/15/ciara-and-russell-wilson-coupled-up-in-washington-d-c-again/

Ciara and Russell Wilson coupled up in Washington, D.C. again

 

[DWinzit]

23 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

done

https://michiganchronicle.com/2015/06/15/ciara-and-russell-wilson-coupled-up-in-washington-d-c-again/

Ciara and Russell Wilson coupled up in Washington, D.C. again

I am telling you...regardless of what Watson and Wilson say, I would still be constant with them and/or their agents constantly. 

Just keep reinforcing your interest showing the love.

Worst case is they never come and you would already have a backup plan like Trubisky and Corral/Howell/Willis/other

[mistertim]

2 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

I am telling you...regardless of what Watson and Wilson say, I would still be constant with them and/or their agents constantly. 

Just keep reinforcing your interest showing the love.

Worst case is they never come and you would already have a backup plan like Trubisky and Corral/Howell/Willis/other

 

The thing is...both Wilson and the Seahawks hold cards in this situation. Let's assume that, as you say here, Ron bugs Wilson and his agent so much that he relents and puts WFT on his list of teams (even if it's just to shut them up). That doesn't mean he's coming here. There would probably be another 4 teams at least on the list who may all end up bidding against each other. Seattle also doesn't have to trade a guy just because he says he wants a trade.

 

Either way, to me this is all just pie in the sky wishful thinking. There have been several reports that we're definitely not on Wilson's current list and I don't think WFT blowing up his and his agent's phones and telling them how much they love him is going to suddenly change his mind. I'm sure there are plenty of other teams calling and saying the exact same stuff.

 

@Skinsinparadisesaid he sees the chance going from zero to 5% but I think that's too generous. I'd say if it went anywhere it may have gone from zero to .0001% or so. 

[Skinsinparadise]

21 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

I am telling you...regardless of what Watson and Wilson say, I would still be constant with them and/or their agents constantly. 

Just keep reinforcing your interest showing the love.

Worst case is they never come and you would already have a backup plan like Trubisky and Corral/Howell/Willis/other

 

Rivera clearly wants a QB really bad.   It was mentioned that he considered Wilson last off season.  

 

I've been one of these people here saying no way in hell you are wasting your time dreaming of these guys for months.  But hearing Garafolo saying he wouldn't rule it out made me think some.  Garafolo is super plugged in, he's the dude who broke the Trent trade among other things.  Wingo isn't as plugged in but said the same a little while ago.  And a local reporter forgetting which one said count Rodgers out, Wilson is a long shot but maybe not impossible.   Then there was a recent Athletic article that said from what they knew about Wilson, they don't expect him to be overly stubborn as for where they trade him to if they trade him.

 

The combination of all of that doesn't make me optimistic but I don't think its totally impossible either.  

Edited January 8, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[DWinzit]

5 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

The thing is...both Wilson and the Seahawks hold cards in this situation. Let's assume that, as you say here, Ron bugs Wilson and his agent so much that he relents and puts WFT on his list of teams (even if it's just to shut them up). That doesn't mean he's coming here. There would probably be another 4 teams at least on the list who may all end up bidding against each other. Seattle also doesn't have to trade a guy just because he says he wants a trade.

 

Either way, to me this is all just pie in the sky wishful thinking. There have been several reports that we're definitely not on Wilson's current list and I don't think WFT blowing up his and his agent's phones and telling them how much they love him is going to suddenly change his mind. I'm sure there are plenty of other teams calling and saying the exact same stuff.

 

@Skinsinparadisesaid he sees the chance going from zero to 5% but I think that's too generous. I'd say if it went anywhere it may have gone from zero to .0001% or so. 

Whatever someone suggest around here it is always met with negativity.  Too much money, too much draft capital, trade clauses, wife doesn't want to go, they are allergic to Admirals

 

My suggestion of staying in touch with them chancing they change their minds for the top QB option available costs nothing but a little time/ Only positive could possibly come from it. Whats the big deal..yeah maybe a pipedream for the team but who cares... There's always the other vets and draft options waiting

[Skinsinparadise]

30 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

@Skinsinparadisesaid he sees the chance going from zero to 5% but I think that's too generous. I'd say if it went anywhere it may have gone from zero to .0001% or so. 

 

It's low but I don't think its as low as that.   Listening to plenty of talk about Rodgers and Wilson give me the impression that the two are totally different cats both as to personality and how they'd approach this.

 

Here's why I think no way with Rodgers

 

A.  He supposedly is fixated on winning and going to a winning organization

B.  He'd rather go out West

C.  He is the type who would be bothered by the off the field issues that exist with this club.

D.  Some of their local reporters think he's warmed up to staying in GB

E.  GB supposedly would rather trade with the AFC

F.  This is a crappy environment to play in -- stadium, facility, owner, etc.

 

I'd say zero chance with Rodgers

 

Here's why I think its unlikely with Wilson

 

A.  We aren't on the current top 4 team desires

B.  Some rumbling from Wilson's camp that he could stay in Seattle after all

C.  Another team with a QB would be a bettter trade partner ala the Raiders

D.  This is a crappy environment to play in -- stadium, facility, owner, etc.

 

 

Here's why i do think there is a small fighting chance

 

A.  The national reporters are plugged in with agents and if Garafalo thinks Wilson could be in play, I take it seriously.  He's an A level reporter.  He didn't say it in a way that suggested maybe there is a small outside chance, he sold it as a possibility and that's what he'd do if he were the WFT.  He thinks Wilson could budge on his request teams.  

 

B.  Multiple national reporters who worked for the Athletic don't think Wilson is going to be stubborn as for where he goes, they think he will relent

 

C.  I think WFT might be desperate enough to offer Seattle their best deal.  The key is for the Giants to stick with Daniel Jones and the Eagles with Hurts though

 

D.  Supposedly unlike Rodgers, Wilson isn't fixated on going to a plug and play potential SB winner.

 

 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

18 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

Whatever someone suggest around here it is always met with negativity.  Too much money, too much draft capital, trade clauses, wife doesn't want to go, they are allergic to Admirals

 

My suggestion of staying in touch with them chancing they change their minds for the top QB option available costs nothing but a little time/ Only positive could possibly come from it. Whats the big deal..yeah maybe a pipedream for the team but who cares... There's always the other vets and draft options waiting

 

Agree.  I've been on the no way Rodgers and Wilson train for a long time.  But i try to keep an open mind if more information creeps up that contradicts a prior thought.  The more I digest the more I indeed think Rodgers would be ridiculous -- no chance.  But the last 2 weeks or so give me the vibe that while I don't think Wilson is likely, I also don't think its totally ridiculous anymore.   

 

I've heard enough to think that they should put their hat in the ring and go for it.  But more on point if they end up the highest bidder to Seattle they might have a fighting chance.   Will they be the highest bidder, who knows.  But if they are the highest bidder and Wilson supposedly isn't hardcore about it has to be these teams or else -- they might indeed have a small chance here.

 

With something like this though, we will probably have a much better read on this after the season.  things tend to leak.  So will see what leaks positive or negative on this.  

Edited January 8, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[DWinzit]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Agree.  I've been on the no way Rodgers and Wilson train for a long time.  But i try to keep an open mind if more information creeps up that contradicts a prior thought.  The more I digest the more I indeed think Rodgers would be ridiculous -- no chance.  But the last 2 weeks or so give me the vibe that while I don't think Wilson is likely, I also don't think its totally ridiculous anymore.   

 

I've heard enough to think that they should put their hat in the ring and go for it.  But more on point if they end up the highest bidder to Seattle they have a fighting chance.   Will they be the highest bidder, who knows.  But if they are the highest bidder and Wilson supposedly isn't hardcore about it has to be these teams or else -- they might indeed have a small chance here.

To me Watson and Wilson are the top targets. If you you are going to make a big ass trade, I like them over the then 39 year old Rodgers. I have enough hope lost on the elderly QB options.

Pound on their door a lot and hope. We sure would be in better spot if Snyder would announce he is to sell the team or if they don't name the team the Presidents or Commodores 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

6 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

To me Watson and Wilson are the top targets. If you you are going to make a big ass trade, I like them over the then 39 year old Rodgers. I have enough hope lost on the elderly QB options.

Pound on their door a lot and hope. We sure would be in better spot if Snyder would announce he is to sell the team or if they don't name the team the Presidents or Commodores 

 

 

I think Watson is as big of a reach as Rodgers.  We got some decent intel on Watson.  Keim said he heard Watson will not waive his no trade clause to come here.  Multiple beat guys do not believe that Watson will be pursued by this team because of the nature of his issues and how it dovetails with this organziation's PR issues.

 

But it sounds like Wilson while is unlikely isn't completely a pipe dream. 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Skinsinparadise

[dunfer]

id take all of them. have a qb competition. also the have them outside the today show window on our name reveal...best sign goes a long way in the competition

[mistertim]

I'm really not trying to be "negative" about the Wilson thing, I think it's just being realistic.

 

It's certainly not impossible (my .0001% figure was more meant to be absurdist overstatement for effect, but I probably failed on that one), however I just don't want us to get into that incremental zone where we first convince ourselves that there's a tiny chance. Then we convince ourselves a there's a bit more and a bit more and then by the time trade deadlines come around there are people convinced that we're going to land Wilson and then we find out that it was never even close.

 

Just feels like torturing ourseleves and setting ourselves up for a letdown. I'd love to have Wilson here, but I think the chances are incredibly tiny that it happens. He'd have to not only add us to his short list for whatever reason but then we'd also have to make the best offer and seal the trade. And as I noted there's absolutely no way that we'd be the only team blowing up Wilson and his agent to try and squirm our way onto his list.

 

Now, maybe what @Skinsinparadiseread is true, and that Wilson really isn't all that inflexible when it comes to his short list. But that's also a double edge sword because if he's flexible enough to be ok with Seattle trading him to us, it stands to reason that he'd be flexible enough to be ok with plenty of other teams. So then that adds tons of brand new bidders into the arena and we'd probably end up having to make an absurd offer to land him. In that situation we all know by now (via words and actions) that Rivera will go for a guy he likes but that he's also pretty disciplined when it comes to his limit for the trade.

[88Comrade2000]

2 hours ago, DWinzit said:

You and everyone else if they roll with those two only!

I did say we would trade/sign for Mitch/Marcus for QB1.  They will only draft a qb if the one is there when they pick. I don’t see them trading multiple picks to move up, to draft a qb.  So, the qb that interests us ; will still have to be on the draft board.  If we don’t draft a qb; then qb 2&3 will be Taylor and Kyle.

 

We will have to get Mitch/Marcus before the draft.
 

I have said, I don’t trust Ron and his Gm crew to get that qb. Just look at how pathetic our offense has mostly been under Ron/Scott. You think any qb would want to come here. Even if we get Mitch/ Marcus; they will have a disappointing tenure here. If we draft a qb; it will be the next in the long line of qb busts.

 

Ron’s destiny is to be the next Washington coach fired and that will happen in the next year or two.

[Redskins 2021]

32 minutes ago, Rdskns2000 said:

I did say we would trade/sign for Mitch/Marcus for QB1.  They will only draft a qb if the one is there when they pick. I don’t see them trading multiple picks to move up, to draft a qb.  So, the qb that interests us ; will still have to be on the draft board.  If we don’t draft a qb; then qb 2&3 will be Taylor and Kyle.

 

We will have to get Mitch/Marcus before the draft.
 

I have said, I don’t trust Ron and his Gm crew to get that qb. Just look at how pathetic our offense has mostly been under Ron/Scott. You think any qb would want to come here. Even if we get Mitch/ Marcus; they will have a disappointing tenure here. If we draft a qb; it will be the next in the long line of qb busts.

 

Ron’s destiny is to be the next Washington coach fired and that will happen in the next year or two.

I think it's up to his wife. She probably will not want to go to same of the other options on the list we are a top 5 city national. I think alot of him wanting to move had to do with his family.

I guess I want to know what we have to give up to get him if he can be convinced. The t we o city he probably pick for his family would be Las Vegas, Miami, and New York. I think after those two teams we may have a shot. What did his list of team look like. Watch miami they have a QB to trade and draft picks 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[88Comrade2000]

You all are dreaming about Rodgers,Wilson.  My guess Aaron likely decides that There’s no place like home and signs a new deal with Green Bay.  Of course Green Bay could **** that up and if Aaron leaves it will be to Denver or Las Vegas or even New Orleans.

 

Russ wants to win more super bowls but while Ron Maybe a nice guy; he’s a losing coach. Ron Has had one of the lower ranked offenses. While he had a playoff season last year; he’s had 4 straight losing seasons. Hardly, enticing To someone who wants more rings.
 

As for Watson; any team that Trades for him until his status is settled; will regret it. I think his trial is in February right? Unless he somehow settles. Of course he still could face jail time. I don’t see this being resolved before the draft. Maybe by the time the season starts.  Whatever draft picks get traded will be 23 and beyond.

 

Ron maybe a nice guy but his losing record of the last 4 years; hardly will inspire those qbs to want to come here.

[Redskins 2021]

6 minutes ago, Rdskns2000 said:

You all are dreaming about Rodgers,Wilson.  My guess Aaron likely decides that There’s no place like home and signs a new deal with Green Bay.  Of course Green Bay could **** that up and if Aaron leaves it will be to Denver or Las Vegas or even New Orleans.

 

Russ wants to win more super bowls but while Ron Maybe a nice guy; he’s a losing coach. Ron Has had one of the lower ranked offenses. While he had a playoff season last year; he’s had 4 straight losing seasons. Hardly, enticing To someone who wants more rings.
 

As for Watson; any team that Trades for him until his status is settled; will regret it. I think his trial is in February right? Unless he somehow settles. Of course he still could face jail time. I don’t see this being resolved before the draft. Maybe by the time the season starts.  Whatever draft picks get traded will be 23 and beyond.

 

Ron maybe a nice guy but his losing record of the last 4 years; hardly will inspire those qbs to want to come here.

Most likely. I guess I know everyone is saying new orleans for a qb I think they may be in super cap hell.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[88Comrade2000]

You all are dreaming. You think a team owned by Dan Snyder is capable of luring the best qbs in the nfl to come here? You think he’s capable Of drafting a franchise qb? We have over 22 years of failure and I don’t expect that to change because Ron is running things now.

[Redskins 2021]

1 hour ago, Rdskns2000 said:

You all are dreaming. You think a team owned by Dan Snyder is capable of luring the best qbs in the nfl to come here? You think he’s capable Of drafting a franchise qb? We have over 22 years of failure and I don’t expect that to change because Ron is running things now.

probably not but we are due. We most likely get rookie and Trubisky or Marrota.

Edited January 8, 2022 by Redskins 2021

[Koolblue13]

I wonder if the eagles make a move and Hurts becomes available. 

[DWinzit]

15 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I wonder if the eagles make a move and Hurts becomes available. 

I wish we were in there position on that decision

Heck, I'd feel better if we had Minshew moving into next year to pair with a rookie and TH

[Koolblue13]

19 minutes ago, DWinzit said:

I wish we were in there position on that decision

Heck, I'd feel better if we had Minshew moving into next year to pair with a rookie and TH

I'm probably higher on Hurts here than most, but he's had a pretty good second half of a year. It would be very eagles to not use those 3 firsts to build the team and invest around Hurts.

[Redskins 2021]

1 minute ago, Koolblue13 said:

I'm probably higher on Hurts here than most, but he's had a pretty good second half of a year. It would be very eagles to not use those 3 firsts to build the team and invest around Hurts.

 

40 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

I wonder if the eagles make a move and Hurts becomes available. 

I don't think they send him to us.

[Skinsinparadise]

15 hours ago, mistertim said:

I'm really not trying to be "negative" about the Wilson thing, I think it's just being realistic.

 

It's certainly not impossible (my .0001% figure was more meant to be absurdist overstatement for effect, but I probably failed on that one), however I just don't want us to get into that incremental zone where we first convince ourselves that there's a tiny chance. Then we convince ourselves a there's a bit more and a bit more and then by the time trade deadlines come around there are people convinced that we're going to land Wilson and then we find out that it was never even close.

 

Just feels like torturing ourseleves and setting ourselves up for a letdown. I'd love to have Wilson here, but I think the chances are incredibly tiny that it happens. He'd have to not only add us to his short list for whatever reason but then we'd also have to make the best offer and seal the trade. And as I noted there's absolutely no way that we'd be the only team blowing up Wilson and his agent to try and squirm our way onto his list.

 

Now, maybe what @Skinsinparadiseread is true, and that Wilson really isn't all that inflexible when it comes to his short list. But that's also a double edge sword because if he's flexible enough to be ok with Seattle trading him to us, it stands to reason that he'd be flexible enough to be ok with plenty of other teams. So then that adds tons of brand new bidders into the arena and we'd probably end up having to make an absurd offer to land him. In that situation we all know by now (via words and actions) that Rivera will go for a guy he likes but that he's also pretty disciplined when it comes to his limit for the trade.

 

Where I am coming from is I think really ANY of the veteran QBs are long shots mainly because of the competition for the spot.  Lot of bidders. So many teams want QBs.   All these guys though have different stories and a different context behind their situations.  And I've tried to pay attention to that and not be stuck with my original preconception.  The stories haven't changed at all relating to Rodgers outside of he might stay in GB after all.  The stories haven't changed about Watson -- if anything its gotten worse as for him coming here -- I thought he was the longest of long shots anyway, so no surprise from me.  As for Wilson from my observation its changed a little.   

 

Garafolo to me was the kicker for me to change my perception about Wilson.  He was one in a series of things I've read/heard which I talked about in another post.  I find Garafolo the most plugged in reporter aside from Schefter.  His colleage Ian Rappoport pulls more gossip than Garafolo but Ian can be wrong too much for my taste, Garafolo like Schefter is rarely wrong.  It's not that he spilled much specifics about Wilson.  But I know from other takes of his, he's similar to Keim in that he talks to a lot of people and they steer him in a direction.  For example Keim asking around found out that Watson wouldn't waive his no trade clause to come here.

 

Anyway, add Garafolo to the pile who has heard good things about Turner (I know some here think he's a moron but with an exception or two, nationally he seems to be highly regarded) and adds that Rivera is also highly regard.  The team is considered talented.  He can see some players being turned off to the off field stuff here, his vibe is Russell Wilson wouldn't be one of those players.   He also said if he were Russell he would want to come here.  And vice versa.  He likes the fit both ways.   Now he could be dead wrong.  And that clearly wasn't a report.   But I can tell he's fishing around Wilson among the other potential QBs and clearly Wilson's people at a minimum hasn't steered him away from this place as a destination spot at least not just yet.  

 

As for Wilson my original take:

 

A.  The dude wants out of Seattle.  He's going to be traded, no doubt

B.  He wants like Rodgers to go to a SB potential winner

C.  He's a stickler to the top teams he wants to go to

 

My current take of Wilson

 

A.   Wilson might be willing to stay after all in Seattle

B.  It's not SB or bust with him.

C.  He might not be a stickler as for where he goes

 

While I agree that Wilson is a long shot.  I don't agree that Rivera isn't willing to be a really high bidder.  It's come out later that the first and third round offer for Stafford was an opening bid, not a take it or leave it offer.  Also and I said so last off season, Keim said he flat out heard Rivera (and Rivera later echoed the same) that he wasn't willing to bid really high for a QB.  He wanted that off season to build the roster.  But all bets would be off next off season (this one) if they didn't land a QB and he would be willing to be aggressive.  So I suspect the conservative 2021 version of Rivera will be supplanted by the more aggressive one.

 

You aren't saying otherwise but my thinking is Rivera isn't stupid.  It's year 3.   it's clear from his interviews that Rivera pays attention to what is said about him.  So if we know it he knows it.  And as much national love Rivera gets, he also has a loud disclaimer now attached to it which is that he has botching things via missed opportunities at QB and if he doesn't overcome that his regime will end up a dud.  Every interview where Rivera has talked about the QB spot he comes off acutely away that its a Code Red spot.  I think he's going to be VERY aggressive to chase down their top targets.

 

 

Edited January 8, 2022 by Skinsinparadise