Riggo#44 Posted May 18, 2022 Author Share Posted May 18, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Renegade7 said: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10036174-juan-soto-trade-rumors-execs-think-nationals-could-move-star-amid-contract-talks Oh "rival exec," eh? Well isn't that nice. They always tell the truth, don't they? I wouldn't be surprised if they ended up moving Soto--but I wouldn't expect it either. I generally dislike these click-baity articles that are full of contingent words "may," "could," "if," "possibly." Just about every one of Jon Heyman, Mark Feinsand, and the other useless mouths' tweets are full of them. Edited May 18, 2022 by Riggo#44 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said: Oh "rival exec," eh? Well isn't that nice. They always tell the truth, don't they? I wouldn't be surprised if they ended up moving Soto--but I wouldn't expect it either. I generally dislike these click-baity articles that are full of contingent words "may," "could," "if," "possibly." Just about every one of Jon Heyman, Mark Feinsand, and the other useless mouths' tweets are full of them. Fair, then articles saying the opposite with similar terms and context should also be equally ignored. I'm beyond Susan Collins level concerned right now, and this doesn't help, to say the least. Edited May 18, 2022 by Renegade7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted May 18, 2022 Author Share Posted May 18, 2022 45 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: Fair, then articles saying the opposite with similar terms and context should also be equally ignored. I'm beyond Susan Collins level concerned right now, and this doesn't help, to say the least. I'm definitely leaning towards he’ll be traded. But, yes, I generally ignore all noise regarding trades, contracts, what teams might possibly be thinking about, yadda, yadda, yadda in May. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 25 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said: I'm definitely leaning towards he’ll be traded. But, yes, I generally ignore all noise regarding trades, contracts, what teams might possibly be thinking about, yadda, yadda, yadda in May. For all the talk on Rizzo standing up to the "cheap ass" Lerners, he has to own trading Turner for extra money to sign Soto then trading Soto too if that happens like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted May 18, 2022 Author Share Posted May 18, 2022 17 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: For all the talk on Rizzo standing up to the "cheap ass" Lerners, he has to own trading Turner for extra money to sign Soto then trading Soto too if that happens like that. Except that's not what happened. They traded Turner because signing him to a $300m deal when we're going into a rebuild didn't make sense. That's what doomed the Phillies into an 11 year rebuild. It was about rebuilding the talent pipeline, which has become bereft of talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 3 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said: Except that's not what happened. They traded Turner because signing him to a $300m deal when we're going into a rebuild didn't make sense. That's what doomed the Phillies into an 11 year rebuild. It was about rebuilding the talent pipeline, which has become bereft of talent. He was 28 when we traded him, it's not like he was getting ready to be old and declining. Where are you getting $300 million and what point can we have the conversation of these numbers maybe being worth it?: Quote Turner finished the 2021 season leading the majors with a .328 batting average and 195 base hits, his second consecutive season leading the major leagues in hits https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trea_Turner Is there some unwritten rule that says we ca t have more then one player that's damn good and actually paid like it? What does this conversation look like if we could've actually gotten out of the Stras and Corbin contracts instead? Who's bright idea was it to give them those contracts in the first place? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGoodBits Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 You know if I’m the Lerners and I’m trying to sell the team, it’s pretty appealing to a prospective buyer to have a superstar like Soto signed longterm. But it might be *more* appealing to have a sub $100m payroll, next to nothing on the books after 2025, and a farm system that is flush with talent. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted May 18, 2022 Author Share Posted May 18, 2022 24 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: He was 28 when we traded him, it's not like he was getting ready to be old and declining. Where are you getting $300 million and what point can we have the conversation of these numbers maybe being worth it?: He's a free agent after this year. He openly stated he wanted to be paid like a top SS. Lindor inked his massive extension the offseason before they traded him, so a $300m extension was very much in the neighborhood. Also, is he going to resign here? Maybe, maybe not, but we weren't a winning team with him at the time. Trading him and getting a combined 12 years of Ruiz and Gray, plus a couple of wild cards made the most sense. 29 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trea_Turner Is there some unwritten rule that says we ca t have more then one player that's damn good and actually paid like it? What does this conversation look like if we could've actually gotten out of the Stras and Corbin contracts instead? Who's bright idea was it to give them those contracts in the first place? Oh wikipedia. Well then... Well, Corbin helped win us a World Series. And Strasbourg was coming of a WS MVP. So you're complaining about those contracts, in retrospect, meanwhile griping about not paying Turner, who could end up in same situation. Did I get that right? Is it an unwritten rule that people who scream about the Lerners being cheap have to discount any evidence to the contrary? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted May 18, 2022 Author Share Posted May 18, 2022 27 minutes ago, TheGoodBits said: You know if I’m the Lerners and I’m trying to sell the team, it’s pretty appealing to a prospective buyer to have a superstar like Soto signed longterm. But it might be *more* appealing to have a sub $100m payroll, next to nothing on the books after 2025, and a farm system that is flush with talent. I really think this is where we're heading. But we’ll see. Ross and Strasbourg are on a 5 day throwing program, so they're getting closer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 Yeah. With a crystal ball you pay Turner and let both Stras and Rendon hit FA knowing they would miss a ton of time. But oh well. Hopefully the Lerners either get their minority owner buy-in or they move on. Still need the MASN thing ended. Still wouldn't trade Soto this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@DCGoldPants Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 8 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said: I really think this is where we're heading. But we’ll see. Ross and Strasbourg are on a 5 day throwing program, so they're getting closer. With the one glorious exception. I feel like Charlie Brown trying to kick the football here on both these guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 9 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said: He's a free agent after this year. He openly stated he wanted to be paid like a top SS. Lindor inked his massive extension the offseason before they traded him, so a $300m extension was very much in the neighborhood. Also, is he going to resign here? Maybe, maybe not, but we weren't a winning team with him at the time. Trading him and getting a combined 12 years of Ruiz and Gray, plus a couple of wild cards made the most sense. This is entirely your opinion, stop convincing yourself it's the only one that's right because it makes sense to you at least. 9 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said: Oh wikipedia. Well then... Does Pro-Baseball Reference dispute those stats? https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/t/turnetr01.shtml 9 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said: Well, Corbin helped win us a World Series. And Strasbourg was coming of a WS MVP. So you're complaining about those contracts, in retrospect, meanwhile griping about not paying Turner, who could end up in same situation. Did I get that right? Yes, we are allowed to look at those contracts now and feel buyers remorse given our returns on those investments since 2019. We do this with other teams in other sports, questioning if someone is worth the money they are being paid after multiple subpar seasons in a row should be fair game. And he's not in the same situation, he's straight Ballin since 2019 and continues to do so for the Dodgers. Is your hypothetical of him "being similar situation" based on him not doing as well simply for still being in Washington? 9 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said: Is it an unwritten rule that people who scream about the Lerners being cheap have to discount any evidence to the contrary? Can we stop pretending the WS team being oldest in baseball, being quickly dismantled, and Lerners talking about selling the team are merely coincidences? We're now 21st in payroll, this feels more like getting the team in position for a sale then an attempt at sustained success following a WS win. Yes, i feel like I'm being messed with as a fan, badly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ball Security Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: This is entirely your opinion, stop convincing yourself it's the only one that's right because it makes sense to you at least. Does Pro-Baseball Reference dispute those stats? https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/t/turnetr01.shtml Yes, we are allowed to look at those contracts now and feel buyers remorse given our returns on those investments since 2019. We do this with other teams in other sports, questioning if someone is worth the money they are being paid after multiple subpar seasons in a row should be fair game. And he's not in the same situation, he's straight Ballin since 2019 and continues to do so for the Dodgers. Is your hypothetical of him "being similar situation" based on him not doing as well simply for still being in Washington? Can we stop pretending the WS team being oldest in baseball, being quickly dismantled, and Lerners talking about selling the team are merely coincidences? We're now 21st in payroll, this feels more like getting the team in position for a sale then an attempt at sustained success following a WS win. Yes, i feel like I'm being messed with as a fan, badly. Turner is slugging 130 points lower than he did last year. Getting on base 30-50 points lower than 20 and 21. Love Turner, but his type of game is not the kind that ages well. Getting Gray and Ruiz for him is a solid move. Edited May 18, 2022 by Ball Security 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted May 18, 2022 Author Share Posted May 18, 2022 18 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: This is entirely your opinion, stop convincing yourself it's the only one that's right because it makes sense to you at least. Whatever man. You want to make this all about money and bash the keyboard about how the Lerners are Cheap, you go right ahead. I'll continue to correctly look at it like it is--the correct, albeit unpopular choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ball Security Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 Need this to translate to the majors. https://twitter.com/RocRedWings/status/1526221875113865219?s=20&t=iI0QMXcYa-X6n5kOcf_Hzw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted May 18, 2022 Author Share Posted May 18, 2022 7 minutes ago, Ball Security said: Turner is slugging 130 points lower than he did last year. Getting on base 30-50 points lower than 20 and 21. Love Turner, but his type of game is not the kind that ages well. Getting Gray and Ruiz for him is a solid move. No one is complaining about Rendon right now either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 11 minutes ago, Ball Security said: Turner is slugging 130 points lower than he did last year. Getting on base 30-50 points lower than 20 and 21. Love Turner, but his type of game is not the kind that ages well. Getting Gray and Ruiz for him is a solid move. You feel the same way about his stolen base skills? 6 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said: Whatever man. You want to make this all about money and bash the keyboard about how the Lerners are Cheap, you go right ahead. I'll continue to correctly look at it like it is--the correct, albeit unpopular choice. One day I hope to be where you are, no promises, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted May 18, 2022 Author Share Posted May 18, 2022 1 minute ago, Renegade7 said: One day I hope to be where you are, no promises, though. It's a high bar, take baby steps. Another interesting wrinkle. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ball Security Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 8 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: You feel the same way about his stolen base skills? One day I hope to be where you are, no promises, though. Well, I don’t put too much into SBs. They are nice to have, but OBP is way more important. But if you want to look at SBs, Trea had 46 in 17, 43 in 18, 35 in 19. Let’s skip 2020, but his pace was less in the shortened season. Had 32 last year. He’s on pace for 27 this year. Would you expect that to improve as he moves into his 30s? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 1 minute ago, Ball Security said: Well, I don’t put too much into SBs. They are nice to have, but OBP is way more important. But if you want to look at SBs, Trea had 46 in 17, 43 in 18, 35 in 19. Let’s skip 2020, but his pace was less in the shortened season. Had 32 last year. He’s on pace for 27 this year. Would you expect that to improve as he moves into his 30s? I expect him to stay one of the best base stealers even as he ages because of the speed and skill he already has even as it declines. Baseball adds up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ball Security Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 3 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: I expect him to stay one of the best base stealers even as he ages because of the speed and skill he already has even as it declines. Baseball adds up. He was the leader last season, but tied for 10th with 8 other guys (including Manny Machado) this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riggo#44 Posted May 18, 2022 Author Share Posted May 18, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ball Security Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 A win tonight with 6 Gray K’s will give me some good walking around money this weekend. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renegade7 Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 5 minutes ago, Ball Security said: He was the leader last season, but tied for 10th with 8 other guys (including Manny Machado) this year. It's May, dude...and to put that in the same sentence as him leading the majors last year is fascinating to say the least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ball Security Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 3 minutes ago, Renegade7 said: It's May, dude...and to put that in the same sentence as him leading the majors last year is fascinating to say the least. Yes, it’s May. He’s on pace for a career low in steals - the aspect of his game that you’re hanging your hat on. But he could turn it around. Maybe he does hit 20+ HRs in the next 4.5 months after sitting on 2 for about a quarter of the season in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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