Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 That's right, Shanahan had nothing to do with the success he has had. He had nothing to do with us winning the division for the first time in how many years.... somehow we managed that in spite of him. And the number of great QB's he has coached.... coincidence and luck. Those back to back superbowls in denver?.... that was everyone else.... and pure dumb luck. And you call me misguided? You aren't misguided. You just don't know what you are talking about. (See the Portis articles above). A. Shanahan never coached Montana. (Well, he technically coached him for one game in 1992). I don't know what the hell you are doing crediting Shanahan there. B. Steve Young was 32 when Shanahan started coaching him and had already beaten out the aging Montana. Yes, he had great years with Shanahan...but he had great years without him as well. C. Elway was already a Hall of Famer when Shanahan coached him. Elway was just everything Elway ever wanted in a QB. It was the perfect match of player and Coach's vision. D. The one good Plummer year is probably Shanahan's greatest coaching job. He also immediately looked to get someone better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted December 13, 2013 Author Share Posted December 13, 2013 Oh really, they were an embarrassment to the point people joined in with him? They were highlighted with people laughing about them on NFL network, etc because they were all just mocking him? You got the Mad part down, but there's nothing centrist about your posting style or your views. "What happened to you, Dillon? You used to be someone I could trust." WTF is it with you and my Mad Centrist sig. Do you want to go to the tailgate and talk politics or something? I'll be happy too discuss my centrist views there. Do you have a point other than to personally attack me? And while I will admit the fist characters did start in that playoff year, he took it and ran it into the ground while we were losing. Yes, People were mocking him. And yes... I still consider him a loser who got too cozy with the owner, refused to practice the way he needed to, and couldn't run ten yards without tripping and falling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 And while I will admit the fist characters did start in that playoff year, he took it and ran it into the ground while we were losing. Yes, People were mocking him. And yes... I still consider him a loser who got too cozy with the owner, refused to practice the way he needed to, and couldn't run ten yards without tripping and falling. In other words, you were wrong. Why can no one here ever admit being wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epochalypse Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 "Both" or "all" sides are doing that, not exactly a new phenomenon, just look at politics and social issues reporting. As for more issues on the team: Well, considering how we had a good defense for all but one year under Gibbs, and how it was even adequate under Blache's non-innovative behind, and now we have not only a horrific defense for all but one year of Shanahan (arguably even last year, otherwise we don't have to "make a run" to the playoffs) and we have, perhaps, the worst special teams in the history of the modern NFL---and these were all Shanahan decisions.... who would you really point the finger at? I don't doubt Griffin has played poorly and made poor decisions but if you're a real man as a coach, maybe you go with Cousins and ease Griffin in on certain possessions until he's healthy? When Petrino walked away from Atlanta and the team had a bad year, was it really "everyone else" that was at fault or was it really Petrino, since the team righted the ship in ONE OFFSEASON? I recognize that everyone does it. I just feel the need to point it out to certain people who don't believe they do. As far the defense and the special teams, I also blame Shanahan for that. Which is why I've said that I would probably fire him. Yeah the cap penalty hurt us, but they shouldn't be this bad. I bring them up in other threads to show that there are widespread issues. A lot are on Shanahan. But all I am asking is that we identify all of them accurately. Is it scheme or players? One is more on the coaching, another is on personnel, or the players themselves. Would Haslett do better with better players or would the players do bette with a different coach. That's what I think we need to do more effectively. I don't agree with timesharing QBs, QBs need rhythm. I would have preferred RG3 not be so insistent on Week 1. I would have preferred he be all in on coming back when he was actually ready. As for Petrino, it quite possibly could be that he was the only thing wrong with the team; I haven't watched enough Falcons football from that time to notice any of their issues. I have watched the Skins and I can tell you, Shanahan is only one of the problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93 Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 I'm actually sick of hearing about our franchise QB...this coming from a fan who has been starving to have one for 30 years. Here's what I hope he does (and I realize all of this has no impact on anything other than my annoyance): 1) Go by Robert Griffin (drop RG3, as much as he can control) 2) Cut the braids 3) Move into Redskins Park (figuratively) and spend the entire off-season with the new offensive staff 4) No books, features, marketing campaigns...re-dedicate to football That's it. what in four ****s does his hair have to do with anything? Is that a joke? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted December 13, 2013 Author Share Posted December 13, 2013 Hell, name me one season that he's had that's gone anywhere NEAR a SB without Kubiak as his QB coach/ OC? San Fran. When he was OC. Or is Kubiac the only one who gets credit for a Super Bowl win as OC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 No one wanted to draft RG3 more than me. No one wants him to succeed more than me. So don't give me any bull **** about jealousy or being a "hater". The only ******* thing I care about is how well he plays. He played like **** this year. Chill Winston...lol....me thinks he doth protest to much? Did I strike a nerve there bro? Because I wasn't even talking about you but if the shoe fits wear it, don't strart crying about it and i don't appreciate the profanity either, lets not do that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 You aren't misguided. You just don't know what you are talking about. (See the Portis articles above). A. Shanahan never coached Montana. (Well, he technically coached him for one game in 1992). I don't know what the hell you are doing crediting Shanahan there. B. Steve Young was 32 when Shanahan started coaching him and had already beaten out the aging Montana. Yes, he had great years with Shanahan...but he had great years without him as well. C. Elway was already a Hall of Famer when Shanahan coached him. Elway was just everything Elway ever wanted in a QB. It was the perfect match of player and Coach's vision. D. The one good Plummer year is probably Shanahan's greatest coaching job. He also immediately looked to get someone better. And the connect the dots recurring name between B through D as both QB coach and OC ...... GARY KUBIAK! San Fran. When he was OC. Or is Kubiac the only one who gets credit for a Super Bowl win as OC Did you just scrape the barrel for an all time NFL great in his last year in San Francisco winning his 4th Lombardi there? Yeah, I believe you did being as that's just about all you could of done to vainly credit Shanahan with QB success/ development WITHOUT the name you don't want mentioned. Hail. *Edit* Shoot, in all this excitement, I'm even giving you credit for something Shanahan was never involved in. My bad. And your ridiculousness for even attempting to link him with Joe who had played for ONE part game in relief of Young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epochalypse Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 SERIOUSLY Epoch? I've waited from going to the store for that spin and lie? How about telling the truth that the posed question was actually: I was happy about the trade when it happened, but can anyone argue that Griffin alone is better than Wilson + all the picks we shipped to St. Louis And my response that you quoted was me saying I'm not sure I'd still make the trade? Man, WTG you. Two lies for one in an attempted slur. Well done you! Hail. I never said you responded to MY question, I said you responded to A question. Again, if you were sure you'd make the trade, why would you say not here, not now and have to get back to us after a coaching change? What I quoted from you says nothing about certainty. Where am I lying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Kubiak was the 49ers QB coach in 1994. I don't know if I buy the fact that Kubiak is Shanahan's secret weapon, it does make some sense. It's like Belichik and Parcells. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted December 13, 2013 Author Share Posted December 13, 2013 In other words, you were wrong. Why can no one here ever admit being wrong? Did I not just "admit" I was wrong about that part? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 By the way, is no one impressed that I totally called this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted December 13, 2013 Author Share Posted December 13, 2013 Chill Winston...lol....me thinks he doth protest to much? Did I strike a nerve there bro? Because I wasn't even talking about you but if the shoe fits wear it, don't strart crying about it and i don't appreciate the profanity either, lets not do that Sorry if you are offended by dots on a screen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Did I not just "admit" I was wrong about that part? No. You tried to direct the argument to the next year when we weren't good. I need you to say "I was wrong about Portis" and "I was wrong about Shanahan coaching Montana." You'll feel better when you say it. (I'm also pretty sure you didn't realized that Kubiak was the QB coach in San Francisco. But I won't ask you to admit anything there. Just know this: I will fact check you. I will!!!!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted December 13, 2013 Author Share Posted December 13, 2013 Kubiak was the 49ers QB coach in 1994. I don't know if I buy the fact that Kubiak is Shanahan's secret weapon, it does make some sense. It's like Belichik and Parcells. That would be a valid argument if he did anything great of note on his own. Or if he didn't have a worse record than us this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 I never said you responded to MY question, I said you responded to A question. Again, if you were sure you'd make the trade, why would you say not here, not now and have to get back to us after a coaching change? What I quoted from you says nothing about certainty. Where am I lying? For Pete's sake man your quoting, repeating, and STILL lying/ spinning/ however you want the B/S termed. TD_w asked if Griffin is better than Wilson and all the picks we gave up. (As in, right here, right now.). To which I replied not right here, right now. (Given he's coming off a far worse season than Wilson's sophomore year); but I believe that would change with better coaching that actually gave a damn about the QB. Unless I'm talking double Dutch to you, or this is getting lost in translation on your screen alone, that is not me questioning the darn trade or whether I'd make it again. That's me just valuing the situation right now as was posed in the question. Man it's like trying to knit fog at times on here. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 That would be a valid argument if he did anything great of note on his own. Or if he didn't have a worse record than us this year. I don't think he is a great head coach. But he did a credible job with the Texans until everything went to hell in a handbasket this year. First winning seasons in franchise history. First playoff wins. Not terrible stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted December 13, 2013 Author Share Posted December 13, 2013 No. You tried to direct the argument to the next year when we weren't good. I need you to say "I was wrong about Portis" and "I was wrong about Shanahan coaching Montana." You'll feel better when you say it. I just admitted it twice. Quit being an ass and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lombardi's_kid_brother Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 I just admitted it twice. Quit being an ass and move on. How about Montana? Did you ever address that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epochalypse Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 For Pete's sake man your quoting, repeating, and STILL lying/ spinning/ however you want the B/S termed. TD_w asked if Griffin is better than Wilson and all the picks we gave up. (As in, right here, right now.). To which I replied not right here, right now. (Given he's coming off a far worse season than Wilson's sophomore year); but I believe that would change with better coaching that actually gave a damn about the QB. Unless I'm talking double Dutch to you, or this is getting lost in translation on your screen alone, that is not me questioning the darn trade or whether I'd make it again. That's me just valuing the situation right now as was posed in the question. Man it's like trying to knit fog at times on here. Hail. I guess I'll use your pot and kettle analogy here. The scenario he presented that you quoted is technically a trade. He is asking which is better, Griffin alone or Wilson with all the picks we gave up. It's not a stretch to interpret that into the form of a trade. We drafted RG3 and gave up the picks. The only difference is he is throwing the addition of Wilson in on the other side, which at the time we drafted RG3 was a viable option; we could have conceivably drafted Wilson with our 6th pick and kept all our remaining picks. So based on that you stated you were unsure that you would trade Wilson and our picks for RG3. Again, how am I lying? I said you weren't sure you'd make the trade. How can you be sure you'd make the trade when you aren't sure that RG3 is better than Wilson and all of our picks. If we didn't make the trade we could have had Wilson and the picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Mike Posted December 13, 2013 Author Share Posted December 13, 2013 How about Montana? Did you ever address that Did you address my point that you are dismissing Shanahans contribution in SF as OC while insisting that Kubiak is more responsible for the superbowls as OC in Denver? How about this one... C. Elway was already a Hall of Famer when Shanahan coached him. Elway was just everything Elway ever wanted in a QB. It was the perfect match of player and Coach's vision. Mike Shanahan: A Quarterback History - Hogs Haven Shanahan got his start as an NFL offensive coordinator in 1984 with the Denver Broncos, where he was instrumental in developing the great John Elway, who had been drafted the year before out of Stanford. He led the Broncos offense for four years before leaving to become the head coach of the Raiders. I'm done with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Epoch, I don't know whether your now being obtuse for the Hell of it or whether that whole exchange is going completely over your head; but as there's no other way of going through it with you and I'll be kind and say you misunderstood being as what you attempted doesn't sit well with you and we'll move on. Hail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 As far as the critiquing of Robert's play on the field. I have debated that enough in other threads. Yes, Robert could have played better in certain situations and plays, but to act like he is the major cause of the team's 10 losses is the result of major tunnel vision. Really? 327/507 (64.5%) 3,618yards 7.14avg 20TD 15int 9fumbles 44.3QBR 86.4Rating 274/456 (60.1%) 3,203yards 7.02avg 16TD 12int 6fumbles 40.1QBR 82.2Rating Which one is 4 win Jason Campbell and which one is 3 win RG3? The defense and special teams are horrible, there is no denying that, and frankly I think the entire coaching staff should be fired. I said earlier in the season that the only way Shanahan wouldn't see year 5 is if he won less than 4 games and lost the locker room. He's managed both and is now trolling the franchise and it's fans. None of that makes RG3's bad year anything other than what it is, a bad year where he absolutely contributed to losses. This probably means he shouldn't have played most of this season, not that he's a bad QB. I want to blame Shanahan for that because frankly he's big dog on this team and he could have squashed operation patience's goal of week one early in the offseason. He didn't, he let RG3 have his way, and things went south. RG3 is guilty of having extremely self destructive judgement, something we all learned in the Seattle playoff game and is on full display virtually every time he runs the ball. Shanahan has essentially made the same damn mistake twice in letting his insane QB convince him that he's good and letting him onto the football field. And yes RG3 is full of himself and in dire need of some humility. Why pretend he's a nice humble guy? I'm surprised he hasn't hired a personal DJ yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zazzaro703 Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Remember when Clinton Portis was dressing up as characters after wins for press conferences and interviews? Eventually he got Cooley and some others involved? Remember how well that was received when the team was winning. It was part of the "fun, family atmosphere that the team had become" Then the following season the team was losing and all of the sudden the characters were "immature, attention-seeking, annoying" etc etc.... Why was Robert attempting to come back and be ready for Week 1 about arrogance? Maybe it was a QB that simply wanted to be ready to go out and help the team try to win? If he gave it his best shot and still wasn't 100% that is on the COACHES to sit him down. I never heard of before that a player coming back was about arrogance. Was AP arrogant when he did the same thing, should he have been benched because the first month or so he wasn't his normal self? I am not a Whitlock hater, I like some of his stuff, but he is off here. Sorry. As far as the critiquing of Robert's play on the field. I have debated that enough in other threads. Yes, Robert could have played better in certain situations and plays, but to act like he is the major cause of the team's 10 losses is the result of major tunnel vision. Thank you for saying it, had a little to do with arrogance but only because he didn't want to let the team, the fans, himself down and thinks he gives the redskins the best chance to win. That's just the way he carries himself I too hope he doesn't change a damn thing. We all know he will put in the work during the offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted December 13, 2013 Share Posted December 13, 2013 Really? 327/507 (64.5%) 3,618yards 7.14avg 20TD 15int 9fumbles 44.3QBR 86.4Rating 274/456 (60.1%) 3,203yards 7.02avg 16TD 12int 6fumbles 40.1QBR 82.2Rating Which one is 4 win Jason Campbell and which one is 3 win RG3? ..... You know man, you'd be best served looking at the (VERY few) parts of games when the OC has actually HELPED the struggling QB and lead to 10 looking pretty darn good. Like the first three series of the Giants game for example. And comparing it to when he hasn't. That will give you a bigger insight into the QB's overall play in 2013. Hail. *Edit* And that's not to say he hasn't played poorly. He has. But he's had most EVERYTHING working against him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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