NYDN: NY Giants should realize Robert Griffin III and Washington now their top rival in NFC East, not Philadelphia Eagles or Dallas Cowboys

[redskins4ever28]

sigh....what do you want me to say?

I think what the Giants fan was trying to say was that the owners all agreed on something and then Snyder did it anyway. Now, even though this does make Snyder and Jerry (and Al Davis and the owner of the Saints) seem like A-holes, the truth of the matter is, that it was not against the law and/or rules. Secondly, the NFL approved them both, so, if this were say a regular incident in the world; it would be someone going to a judge and having him sign off on an agreement, then arresting and charging said person a few months later because even though he signed the agreement, he told the person who requested it not to do it "that way." Giants fans probably dont read into it too much because it didnt happen to them, so I dont blame them for it. However, I do see their argument, I can see why they probably think Mara is innocent and Snyders a tool. But, in all honesty, thats not the case. Mara really was trying extra hard to hurt the Skins and Boys. I wont defend Snyder in the many things hes done, because hes done some awful things as an owner, including trying to take away signs at a game that were attacking him. But, Mara really is guilty jp. I would be more than happy to explain the case to you in private message, even though Im not nearly as knowledgeable as about half the people on this board are about it. But my point is, your owner is guilty. Theres no doubt, what he did really did hurt our year, and we honestly didnt do anything wrong. We asked the NFL to approve the contracts and they did. If they didnt want to approve them, they could have just said no.

[burgundyrush]

I say just change the damn name. We willl still be fans of Washington's football team and this is only sports entertainment so I don't think anyone would really care about the Redskins becoming say the Washington Braves. So what if a poll says most Native Americans are against it and they sell merchandise with the Redskins logo on it. Fact of the matter is there is still a percentage of Native Americans offended by it. It's the same argument ignorant people make when they hear the n-word in rap music and think its ok to say it.

[jp03]

the National Football League approved all of those contracts. Same as they approved Kwantrell Bishop's contract. We did everything the "CORRECT" way.

Bottom line is the owners were obviously told to do things a certain way and Mr. Snyder chose to ignore it. Mara wasn't the only owner pissed off apparently. Restructuring salaries to all be toploaded in an uncapped yearwhen he KNEW a salary cap was coming was certainly not illegal...but it sure is a little sneaky. All in all the though the punishment was a knee jerk reaction and way excessive in my opinion. A compromise should have been reached since nothing "illegal' was done.

There thats my opinion.

Edit.... just saw your post Redskins4ever...that was pretty well put...sorry I missed it before I posted.

[Skinsfan In NM]

To Burgold and others who are in the discussion with the midgets fan. Really guys that poster is doing nothing more than following the team bylaws to downplay the b.s. move their owner made. Trying to get him/her to truly understand what mara did was wrong will never happen. In fact I could be mistaken but I think they replaced free hat night at their place with free

keeps their fans from seeing things in reality.

Just sayin. But bottom line just so we all remember is

**** mara and his organization

Oh and one last thought. Really cruz you call what you went through on our first game as double coverage?? Looked more like blown coverage, but again guess even the players have those blinders on.

[SnyderShrugged]

Bottom line is the owners were obviously told to do things a certain way and Mr. Snyder chose to ignore it. Mara wasn't the only owner pissed off apparently. Restructuring salaries to all be toploaded in an uncapped yearwhen he KNEW a salary cap was coming was certainly not illegal...but it sure is a little sneaky. All in all the though the punishment was a knee jerk reaction and way excessive in my opinion. A compromise should have been reached since nothing "illegal' was done.

There thats my opinion.

Edit.... just saw your post Redskins4ever...that was pretty well put...sorry I missed it before I posted.

The very first sentence you posted needs an answer before touching on anything else.

Under what right or power did anyone have to tell them how to manage those contracts at that time?

[Henry]

Bottom line is the owners were obviously told to do things a certain way and Mr. Snyder chose to ignore it. Mara wasn't the only owner pissed off apparently. Restructuring salaries to all be toploaded in an uncapped yearwhen he KNEW a salary cap was coming was certainly not illegal...but it sure is a little sneaky. All in all the though the punishment was a knee jerk reaction and way excessive in my opinion. A compromise should have been reached since nothing "illegal' was done.

You know, this almost fairly reasonable. I could almost see where you are coming from in this post.

Even if I could buy what you're selling, however, here is one small issue I would still have. The big reason no compromise could be reached was due to the fact that Mara and Goodell waited until the day before free agency to announce the punishment. They engineered this whole thing so that no compromise COULD be reached. So that cooler heads such as yours would not be able to prevail.

So, even if everything you said up there made total sense, Mara's still a manipulative little slime. He crafted a situation that would make it impossible to reach a solution that even you, a Giants fan, would find reasonable.

And that's ignoring the fact that no one is able to provide a shred of evidence against the Redskins.

[redskins4ever28]

I say just change the damn name. We willl still be fans of Washington's football team and this is only sports entertainment so I don't think anyone would really care about the Redskins becoming say the Washington Braves. So what if a poll says most Native Americans are against it and they sell merchandise with the Redskins logo on it. Fact of the matter is there is still a percentage of Native Americans offended by it. It's the same argument ignorant people make when they hear the n-word in rap music and think its ok to say it.

If the Supreme Court threw out the case, then I think the arguments over, right? Or do I still have to worry about getting my Redskin tattoo on my forearm removed if the names are changed? Lol.

In all honesty though, they can rip us any way they want, the fact of the matter is, the past decade I never heard columnist say a word about our team name, but this year all of a sudden Ive seen a couple. Probably because we are becoming relevant again, heck, we even have a player that is #1 in jersey sales(RG3)! So, I can see the writers start to pull the racist cards out again. Danny boy wont let our name be changed, he will pay every dollar he has to keep it the same, so its staying and theres not much the world can do about it. I just wish americans werent so sensitive anymore. Honestly, I dont care if it was the whiteskins, blackskins, redskins, blueskins. Who cares? They arent saying the skin color is a bad thing, its simply the color of ones skin. If they were the "whiteskins" I bet no one would say a word. When are people going to realize one of the reasons racism still exist is because people refuse to let it go and when people call everything "racist" it just brings it back in?

[jp03]

To Burgold and others who are in the discussion with the midgets fan. Really guys that poster is doing nothing more than following the team bylaws to downplay the b.s. move their owner made. Trying to get him/her to truly understand what mara did was wrong will never happen. In fact I could be mistaken but I think they replaced free hat night at their place with free

http://thespincycleblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/blinders.jpg

keeps their fans from seeing things in reality.

Just sayin. But bottom line just so we all remember is

**** mara and his organization

Oh and one last thought. Really cruz you call what you went through on our first game as double coverage?? Looked more like blown coverage, but again guess even the players have those blinders on.

Outside of D.C. its a non story. I know this seems terrible to you guys, but if the shoe was on the other foot ...what would you guys be thinking about it?

[SkinsGuy]

I say just change the damn name. We willl still be fans of Washington's football team and this is only sports entertainment so I don't think anyone would really care about the Redskins becoming say the Washington Braves. So what if a poll says most Native Americans are against it and they sell merchandise with the Redskins logo on it. Fact of the matter is there is still a percentage of Native Americans offended by it. It's the same argument ignorant people make when they hear the n-word in rap music and think its ok to say it.

So if the entire Native American population has no problem with it, but just one does, we should abandon our 80 year old name for that one person?

Silly.

And your comparison makes no sense, since the folks using the "...n-word in rap music..." is the offended party themselves.

Go ask the black rappers why they are using a word that is offensive to their race.

[Henry]

They can call us whatever they want. I no longer have any respect for anything associated with the New York Giants. So their media hacks can shout all day about our name. Means nothing.

[DC9]

Bottom line is the owners were obviously told to do things a certain way and Mr. Snyder chose to ignore it. Mara wasn't the only owner pissed off apparently. Restructuring salaries to all be toploaded in an uncapped yearwhen he KNEW a salary cap was coming was certainly not illegal...but it sure is a little sneaky. All in all the though the punishment was a knee jerk reaction and way excessive in my opinion. A compromise should have been reached since nothing "illegal' was done.

There thats my opinion.

Edit.... just saw your post Redskins4ever...that was pretty well put...sorry I missed it before I posted.

No, I think the bottom lines were... the NFL approved the contracts and there was no salary cap.

Obviously not all of the owners agreed to do things a certain way or participate in illegal collusion. Nothing sneaky about that. But there is something sneaky about collusion.

It'll hit you eventually, I'm sure.

[Skinsfan In NM]

Here is my issue jp03. You yourself said that the Redskins and cowpukes broke No rule. How can you be punished for breaking a rule that, not only doesn't exsist but CAN'T legally exsist? And yes I understand this isn't being talked about outside of Redskins fans, but that is only because there were only two teams hit with this. And reguardless of what folks want to tell themselves 36 million is a HUGE hit the day before free agency starts. Although only 18 million the first year.

An agreement that is not in writing is just words thrown into the wind. Plain and simple. The NFL knew this when they approved the contracts that later came back to bit us in the rump. So if anything the NFL should have been fined for thier approval of contracts that didn't fit under the "spirit of a capped season". Wouldn't you agree?

[redskins4ever28]

Oh by the way, for the whole "redskins racist name" argument.

The Redskins used to be called the Braves, then, our old owner, George Preston Marshall, changed the name to the Redskins IN HONOR OF our former head coach, William "Lone Star" Dietz, who himself was a native american.

It was meant to be in honor of native americans, not dishonor.

Also, yes I know George PReston Marshall was an extreme racist, but this was not the case.

[Riggo#44]

Whatever you say...let me know if you want to talk about the game.

When the Giants cut $18 million in salaries to ensure "Competitive Balance" let me know. Otherwise, the Redskins are hot on the Giants heels, even after getting knee-capped. Tired of hearing about it? Tough. YOUR owner did this. YOUR owner is responsible for this. Ignore it, minimize it, whatever you want. This is a fact. Get used to it.

[Henry]

Outside of D.C. its a non story. I know this seems terrible to you guys, but if the shoe was on the other foot ...what would you guys be thinking about it?

Outside of DC, almost every other owner was rewarded for shutting up with $3 million in extra cap space. Of course they are trying to make this go away.

[Ghost of]

If they were the "whiteskins" I bet no one would say a word. When are people going to realize one of the reasons racism still exist is because people refuse to let it go and when people call everything "racist" it just brings it back in?

The silly part when people try to analogize it to "whiteskins" and the like is that they ignore the historical rooting of a word to score a rhetorical point. Like that idiot Plaschke on Around the Horn who made a huge deal of the name and said the show should no longer use the name either. He cited the "history" of the word but he failed to conduct a simple google search. An Algonquin scholar did research on the name and the first recorded incidents of its use were in translations of what NATIVE AMERICAN TRIBES USED TO DESCRIBE THEMSELVES. Eventually, it became used by whites as well, though the historical record does not show that any of its use was derogatory until maybe much later. A lot of words that are an appropriate name for a people can still be derogatory in the way some people spit out "Jew" or "gay" or "homosexual" or "liberal arts major" with venom. That doesn't mean a team name that is CLEARLY meant to honor the subject is "racist."

The "theory" (by which I mean lie designed to maximize political advantage) that it has anything to do with scalps is absurd and there is absolutely no evidence for it.

The Redskins should never change their name.

[Skinsfan In NM]

And on the idea of changing our name. With respect to the board mods **** THAT! In fact if I feel this is going to happen I will run out and buy as much gear as I possibly can with the name Redskins on it just to insure that they are around for the rest of my time on this Earth. If anything the cowboys should have to change their name, I mean after all thats sexist against women correct? And the giants should have to change their name, or it could lead to hurt feelings of people with dwarfism.

Actually redskins4ever28, I think if the name was changed to "whiteskins" there would be more outcry than you are seeing now.

[Riggo#44]

Oh by the way, for the whole "redskins racist name" argument.

The Redskins used to be called the Braves, then, our old owner, George Preston Marshall, changed the name to the Redskins IN HONOR OF our former head coach, William "Lone Star" Dietz, who himself was a native american.

It was meant to be in honor of native americans, not dishonor.

Also, yes I know George PReston Marshall was an extreme racist, but this was not the case.

Marshall hated Blacks, not Indians.

Anyone that still perpetuates the whole "Racist Name" needs to research the Red Mesa Redskins. A predominantly Native American high school in Arizona that changed their name TO Redskins b/c it felt it honored them. Not to mention only about 10% of Native Americans find the name offensive. This is how Prohibition started: a vocal minority that did not speak for the masses.

[Bacon]

sigh....what do you want me to say?

You're diving into a tank of sharks by posting about this here. It's not worth it.

Julius Peppers and Matt Schaub may not be on their respective teams today had their contracts not been radically front-loaded in the uncapped year. The Bucs were also in severe violation. 20 of the 32 NFL teams spent beyond the previous year's prescribed cap in the uncapped year.

And yet the Redskins and Cowboys were the only teams that suffered penalties, mere days before free agency began...two division rivals of the Giants. Huh.

[rick7423]

I say just change the damn name. We willl still be fans of Washington's football team and this is only sports entertainment so I don't think anyone would really care about the Redskins becoming say the Washington Braves. So what if a poll says most Native Americans are against it and they sell merchandise with the Redskins logo on it. Fact of the matter is there is still a percentage of Native Americans offended by it. It's the same argument ignorant people make when they hear the n-word in rap music and think its ok to say it.

NO NO and NO! Holy crap. Do you even now the history of the name? Do you know where it came from, who came up with it, or know where the Indian chief logo came from? Hint: check my sig links...

[jp03]

Here is my issue jp03. You yourself said that the Redskins and cowpukes broke No rule. How can you be punished for breaking a rule that, not only doesn't exsist but CAN'T legally exsist? And yes I understand this isn't being talked about outside of Redskins fans, but that is only because there were only two teams hit with this. And reguardless of what folks want to tell themselves 36 million is a HUGE hit the day before free agency starts. Although only 18 million the first year.

An agreement that is not in writing is just words thrown into the wind. Plain and simple. The NFL knew this when they approved the contracts that later came back to bit us in the rump. So if anything the NFL should have been fined for thier approval of contracts that didn't fit under the "spirit of a capped season". Wouldn't you agree?

The approval of the contracts is one hell of a mystery to me. That part I'd have to research further to understand because it makes no sense.

Heh..I picture your guys bringing the salaries in to get them approved. The approver is out to lunch so there is some intern standing there and

Snyder: I need these approved!

Intern: but but sir I don't have authority to approve these. S

Snyder: Look do you like your job? If you do you'll appove these!

Intern: Ok sir

Snyder: Thats more like it!!!

hahha...sorry I am not trying to make light of this I just don't have an answer.

[SnyderShrugged]

The approval of the contracts is one hell of a mystery to me. That part I'd have to research further to understand because it makes no sense.

Heh..I picture your guys bringing the salaries in to get them approved. The approver is out to lunch so there is some intern standing there and

Snyder: I need these approved!

Intern: but but sir I don't have authority to approve these. S

Snyder: Look do you like your job? If you do you'll appove these!

Intern: Ok sir

Snyder: Thats more like it!!!

hahha...sorry I am not trying to make light of this I just don't have an answer.

JP, You seem like a good guy and intelligent to boot.

If you honestly dont understand some of the background information, why would you post defense of Mara's actions in this thread? It riles everyone up who knows the facts and you still kept up the debate throughout.

[rick7423]

Outside of D.C. its a non story. I know this seems terrible to you guys, but if the shoe was on the other foot ...what would you guys be thinking about it?

But the shoe is on OUR foot! The team you follow did this to 2 teams in his division, and only the 2 teams in HIS division. Then, Mr Mara and Mr Goodell bribed/strong armed the other owners to make it go through. Remember that the first vote they had failed. Only after more collusive activity was it ratified.

[Redskin-All-In]

post deleted

[SkinsGuy]

The approval of the contracts is one hell of a mystery to me. That part I'd have to research further to understand because it makes no sense.

Heh..I picture your guys bringing the salaries in to get them approved. The approver is out to lunch so there is some intern standing there and

Snyder: I need these approved!

Intern: but but sir I don't have authority to approve these. S

Snyder: Look do you like your job? If you do you'll appove these!

Intern: Ok sir

Snyder: Thats more like it!!!

hahha...sorry I am not trying to make light of this I just don't have an answer.

That's because you know what the answer is, and the answer doesn't make Mara look good.