Dealing with (problem) visiting fans in your section (MET)

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

..... I think the other big problem would be with the Redskins season ticket holders. Say a Skins STH can't attend a night kickoff because of work or family responsibilities. The STH puts his or her tix on Stubhub/Craiglist. The few times I have listed tickets on resale websites, it is always the away fans that are willing to pay face value or higher while the Redskins fans beg for a "hometown" discount. How do the Redskins prevent STH's from selling to away fans, especially when it is often only the away fans who are willing to pay a reasonable price? Why should I be forced to subsidize my season tickets for someone just because that person is a Skins fan? Trying to regulate the secondary ticket market in that way goes against almost every economic principle that America was founded on.

This man get's it, but he does raise a pertinent point that I think L_k_B was kind of alluding to with the secondary market. Obviously that would need some thought as to how you tackled that to stop the sale of home tickets to visiting fans.

But it's not an gigantic insurmountable problem.

Hail.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

I think it's up to the home team fans to be responsible for each other when one of your own is being a complete, blithering idiot. You wouldn't want that kind of person acting that way at your home game.

Self policing is where it should start in sorting out our own fan-base. But I get why people wouldn't want to intervene if there's a group of guys acting like complete and utter dicks. That's where better, monitored security from the team should come into play, in conjunction with the relevant authorities on duty at the game. Better stewarding, policing and monitoring of all sections would go a long way to clearing this crap up within NFL stadiums.

Hail.

[renaissance]

This addresses the secondary ticket market: http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2012/04/02/Leagues-and-Governing-Bodies/NFL-Ticketmaster.aspx

[E33Green]

This man get's it, but he does raise a pertinent point that I think L_k_B was kind of alluding to with the secondary market. Obviously that would need some thought as to how you tackled that to stop the sale of home tickets to visiting fans.

But it's not an gigantic insurmountable problem.

Hail.

They seem to be able to handle it in England. If I am a United supporter I can buy a ticket in the heart of the most raucous home section at the Etihad with the understanding that I can wear no red whatsoever and must remain quiet as a mouse if United scores. Violating these understandings would result in my immediate ejection and a permanent ban from all EPL stadiums.

Unfortunately this would be undone by the disgusting sense of entitlement in American society. Good luck telling a Cowboys fan he can't wear his Romo sits to pee jersey in FedEx or cheer when the Cowboys make a good play (unless seated in a segregated Cowboys section).

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

We own FedEx Field right? So what's to stop us improving things within our own stadium? Why couldn't we at the very least, say next off-season, set aside a designated adult-child/ family area? Why couldn't we CCTV the whole arena so every seat in every section can be viewed at the touch of a button from a control room, and anyone causing trouble can be identified, their actions recorded, and security sent to the trouble spot in seconds? Why couldn't we upgrade the depth of our security with better training and more personnel all around the stadium? And why. at the very least, couldn't we propose to every other club that we're going to create a visitors section for the safety of both home and away fans due to the growing incidents that we'll be selling to the visiting team. They tell us how much they want to take within the capacity of the section, and we can adjust the segregation accordingly. They take less, we can move the segregation inward and sell the overflow to Redskins fans.

It's not a gigantic leap to implement basic safety improvements which should be a right. Not an after thought. And if you did, and it improved things, you'd slowly start to see other teams follow suit and a culture change for the better in many aspects begin to take shape.

Because the way it's going, these problems are only going to escalate with each passing year.

Hail.

[Laxpunk2006]

What I'm saying is that most fans around the NFL aren't this happy-go-lucky bunch that's welcoming of everyone in their stadium. I really do feel that the impression of Redskins fans is that we're on the soft side. Someone from Pittsburgh, NY, Philly, Chicago, etc might read this thread and wonder what's wrong with people in DC...they want to be polite and welcoming to visiting fans?

You asked about the Giants; what someone else described in their post about going to Heinz Field is pretty much the kind of stuff that I do. (They were mocking Riggo; I might say something about Lawrence Taylor hooking up with minors or something like that.) It's not insulting someone's mother or anything along those lines, but it gets the message across. It also sounds like in that case he expected to get ribbed, which is something that most visiting fans coming into FedEx can't seem to understand. The fact is that I don't want visitors in our stadium, and if we could all band together and make them somewhat miserable perhaps they'll go away. Instead we have people that actually defend them coming! C'mon people get with the program!

As for the women and children, my Dad used to take me to Maryland football/basketball and Orioles games at Memorial Stadium as a kid. (We'd go to Skins games from time to time also but he was a Colts fan growing up and back then Skins tickets were hard to come by.) As we drove up to the stadium we'd always have a conversation about "you're going to hear some bad words at the game today and I don't want you repeating them in front of your mother...and so forth." Back then the concept was "if you go out in public you deal with public language." I still believe that today. I'm not saying that every word out of my mouth is a profanity, however occasionally I drop the F-bomb during games and I make no apologies about it if some kid happens to be in earshot. The onus is on their parents to tell them not to repeat those words, not on me to cater my language to what the parents want. And as I said, I do try to curtail it a bit if kids are around but ultimately it happens, especially in stadiums.

As for the section I bolded, most people are stupid. I don't know about you but "everyone else is doing it" didn't get me off the hook when I was a child and it doesn't now that I'm an adult. Let's not try to apply that to football. Right? Right.

This whole "fans are soft" attitude is juvenile. The only competition between you and any other fan in that stadium is who can cheer louder. It's not about who can intimidate who. You don't have to welcome opposing fans and buy them a beer but you don't have to attempt to ruin their day either. All you have to do is be a civilized human being. How difficult is that?

If a fan from another team is being a jerk then ignore them or text security if they persist. If not relax and enjoy the game. You aren't on this team and you don't own Fed Ex, it's not your business who they cheer for.

If you don't want visiting fans attending our stadium then buy tickets to every game. Convince your friends to do the same.

There's nothing wrong with ribbing opposing fans. A few years ago I went to the game against Chicago at home. I think it was the second game after Sean passed. While tailgating the couple next to us were a Chicago fan and his Redskins fan girlfriend. We had a good time calling him "Nancy Urlacher" as we cooked them food on our grill and shared a few beers. You can give opposing fans a hard time without being hostile.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

So when the Skins play the Jags, Chargers, and Bucs at Fedex, the teams are supposes to just eat all of those extra away tix right?

The teams I mentioned will never have a enough fans willing to travel.

So then, a big ass chunk of the stadium is empty....taking away seats from Skins fans possibly

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

So when the Skins play the Jags, Chargers, and Bucs at Fedex, the teams are supposes to just eat all of those extra away tix right?

The teams I mentioned will never have a enough fans willing to travel.

So then, a big ass chunk of the stadium is empty....taking away seats from Skins fans possibly

You just alternate the size of the visiting enclosure accordingly by what a visiting team will take upto the maximum you've set aside by moving your segregation. Then you sell more home tickets.

Hail.

[BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93]

You just alternate the size of the visiting enclosure accordingly by what a visiting team will take upto the maximum you've set aside by moving your segregation. Then you sell more home tickets.

Hail.

I guess that could work but I know for a fact that owners will never give that second thought.

Plus...can you segregate bathrooms, concessions, and parking lots?

I personally believe that FedEx should have extra security in each section (something the Phillies do as told to me from their head of security) for potential "trouble" games such as Iggles, Dall-ASS, Ravens etc and security CONSTANTLY making rounds during games.

The bigger issue is that Fedex's security blows...it seems like they all lack basic training or sense

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

You'd have to wall off the back off whatever section you give over to keep opposing fans under the stands apart I guess.

And I'd go further on just extra security constantly 'making the rounds.' There should be security available in every section of the stadium constantly. Along with those sections monitored by camera to capture any incident. With police on hand ready to back-up the security staff at a moments notice.

Hail.

[renaissance]

Plus...can you segregate bathrooms, concessions, and parking lots?

Yes. I have seen this done at college football games (and I went to a DIII school) and at MLS games.

[NattyBo]

OT, but it baffles me why people feel the need to bash DC United on here so much. We get it, you don't like soccer. I don't much care for pro basketball, but I'd never slam a hometown team like the Wizards for no reason. Especially a team that's won 12 titles in the time we've won 1 NFC East title.

Football and futbol are both great.

[fasttimes]

OT, but it baffles me why people feel the need to bash DC United on here so much. We get it, you don't like soccer. I don't much care for pro basketball, but I'd never slam a hometown team like the Wizards for no reason. Especially a team that's won 12 titles in the time we've won 1 NFC East title.

Football and futbol are both great.

Seriously. The real joke is UMD Football & basketball

[tibbidoe]

I've only been to three games so far, but I have to admit that I was a jackass the first game. The other two were fine, but that first one... wow. I'm embarrassed.

I was drunk (I'm not a drinker), overly excited to be there and was seated in a large group of Redskins' fans. No reason for anything bad to happen. But, Mr. Pottymouth came out every time something went wrong (we lost), and I very likely ruined the game for the 2 older couples right in front of us. It didn't hit me until the next morning, but I felt like an ass. I still wish I could apologize to them for my behavior. Just terrible.

But, I corrected it for the second game, just to see our fans messing with visiting fans (after a win) in the parking lot. I know I'll never be a jerk at a game again. I learned and I wish other people would do so as well.

Maturity.

~Bang

Isn't that an old, old wooden ship?

[Dallsux]

It's usually one sided stories told from the minds of supposed victims, then passed around via online forums and local media.

Sorry, but if an official feels the need to remove a patron from the building, that person is most likely guilty of something. I don't care what team they're rooting for.

Well, that's not always the case. I was ejected from a game once for fighting because of the guy in front of me. He was an "everyone but the Redskins" fan & had sat in front of me all season (when I had season tickets). During an Eagles game, when we had gotten up to cheer a TD, I accidentally hit him in the back of the head with my knee & the next thing I know, I'm being hauled out of the stadium by police. Now, there are some details I'm leaving out, because it's a bit of a drawn out story, but that is the jist of what happened. There were no words exchanged, there was no reason for him to believe that a fight was coming, there was no "fight" at all. A misunderstanding, a sensitive opposing team fan, & the police. That's all it takes. And the cops/security doesn't always get it right.

[Popeman38]

It is called perspective. When I was stationed at Meade, and I first became a STH in 2002, I would show up to tailgate and get ripped. Then walk in and pound more alcohol. I was an ******* to ANYONE wearing colors other than burgundy and gold. Then my son was born in Nov 2003, with Tetrology of Fallot with Absent Pulmonary Valve Syndrome. He went from delivery room to NICU. Had open heart surgery at 6 days old. Got a trach at a month. Spent 5 1/2 months in the PICU, where he eventually passed. Never went home. Never got to go outside. You know what those months taught me? Football is just a game. It is a nice distraction from REAL life. It was and is therapy for me. I can scream and release any anger I have. I get to socialize with fellow Redskins fans, and even fans of the opposing team.

Anyone attempting to justify acting like a horses ass to opposing fans needs to STFU. Gain some perspective. Football is just a ****ing game. I love that game, and the Redskins. I now take my daughter with me to Redskins game.

It's a game. Treat it as such.

[Godfather151981]

If they get by-pass your security, then it goes one of two ways. They either sit on their hands, and don't let their allegiance be known. Or they do, and they get ejected. The same way CCTV in all sections of the stadium could identify in seconds Redskin trouble makers, and afford you the option of banning them if need be for the most persistent trouble causers.

Excuse my ignorance again L_k_B, but how is the team hit by 'secondary market' sales? If they've already sold the ticket, surely the secondary market only then effects whom ever is trying to sell it on? Unless your meaning the possibility of those tickets not being sold on, and empty seats costing an organization in game day revenue from concessions etc.

And thanks ren.

The only thing to say to that is the more incidents that keep occurring of trouble, and if these here boards are anything to go by, FedEx to name but one NFL stadium is seeing this becoming more and more a prevalent issue; the more this issue will hopefully be pushed to the forefront and things will eventually change.

Hail.

The team won't get hit by the secondary market going away per se, however eventually if the secondary market ended up being null and void I think that a lot of people would probably cancel their tickets. Many people only have season tickets because if they can't make a game they can sell them easily and in many cases turn a profit. I'm not sure they could enforce a "visitors section" the way they do in soccer apparently, however if you read the back of the ticket it says that they have the right to deny you admission for any reason for the most part. I don't see why they can't just not let opposing fans in by invoking that policy. I get the fact that it would cause a huge scene and so forth, but if they stop allowing other people into our stadium maybe they'll get the message and go away.

[Godfather151981]

As for the section I bolded, most people are stupid. I don't know about you but "everyone else is doing it" didn't get me off the hook when I was a child and it doesn't now that I'm an adult. Let's not try to apply that to football. Right? Right.

This whole "fans are soft" attitude is juvenile. The only competition between you and any other fan in that stadium is who can cheer louder. It's not about who can intimidate who. You don't have to welcome opposing fans and buy them a beer but you don't have to attempt to ruin their day either. All you have to do is be a civilized human being. How difficult is that?

If a fan from another team is being a jerk then ignore them or text security if they persist. If not relax and enjoy the game. You aren't on this team and you don't own Fed Ex, it's not your business who they cheer for.

If you don't want visiting fans attending our stadium then buy tickets to every game. Convince your friends to do the same.

There's nothing wrong with ribbing opposing fans. A few years ago I went to the game against Chicago at home. I think it was the second game after Sean passed. While tailgating the couple next to us were a Chicago fan and his Redskins fan girlfriend. We had a good time calling him "Nancy Urlacher" as we cooked them food on our grill and shared a few beers. You can give opposing fans a hard time without being hostile.

I'm not suggesting that people be hostile. But...you cooked them food on your grill? I would have told him that if he was wearing burgundy and gold I'd be happy to help but since not, he's SOL with me. And I do buy tickets to every game; I have season tickets. Here's the thing; if everyone else is doing it there comes a point where you're the odd guy out. I'm not talking about peer pressure in the sense of smoking or drinking (although while I'm not a smoker per se I do light up a cigar while tailgating) but if every other fan base does things one way and we do things another they're sitting there laughing at us. The last thing I want to be is the butt-end of a joke for someone else's pleasure. When I see how welcoming we can be to other fans and then they treat our fans like garbage and the net result is 10-15K away fans at our games, who's coming out ahead in that scenario? Again, I'm not saying that people should feel threatened, but I just do my part to ensure that they don't have a good time.

---------- Post added November-2nd-2012 at 05:44 AM ----------

OT, but it baffles me why people feel the need to bash DC United on here so much. We get it, you don't like soccer. I don't much care for pro basketball, but I'd never slam a hometown team like the Wizards for no reason. Especially a team that's won 12 titles in the time we've won 1 NFC East title.

Football and futbol are both great.

My issue with soccer is the "establishment." The game itself COULD even be SOMEWHAT enjoyable to watch, however to me it's the people that are the problem. If you go to Europe that's the only sport they really have so nobody gets snarky about it. However in my experience a true soccer person over here seems to feel that soccer is the only sport...period. The impression I get from a lot of soccer people is that if you're not into soccer and thus prefer football and baseball you're just an uneducated fool. That may sound harsh, but I've had people treat me as such. If there wasn't such an arrogance among some of the supporters I MIGHT not have a problem with it. However the fact is that it's never going to take hold in America like the other sports.

[E33Green]

It is called perspective. When I was stationed at Meade, and I first became a STH in 2002, I would show up to tailgate and get ripped. Then walk in and pound more alcohol. I was an ******* to ANYONE wearing colors other than burgundy and gold. Then my son was born in Nov 2003, with Tetrology of Fallot with Absent Pulmonary Valve Syndrome. He went from delivery room to NICU. Had open heart surgery at 6 days old. Got a trach at a month. Spent 5 1/2 months in the PICU, where he eventually passed. Never went home. Never got to go outside. You know what those months taught me? Football is just a game. It is a nice distraction from REAL life. It was and is therapy for me. I can scream and release any anger I have. I get to socialize with fellow Redskins fans, and even fans of the opposing team.

Anyone attempting to justify acting like a horses ass to opposing fans needs to STFU. Gain some perspective. Football is just a ****ing game. I love that game, and the Redskins. I now take my daughter with me to Redskins game.

It's a game. Treat it as such.

Great Post, Popeman.

I can also say I at much differently at games now than when I was 18-21. One thing is for sure, more W's at home will cure all. When the Skins are getting smoked at FedEx, it is just a terrible atmosphere in the stadium no matter how you cut it. Opposing fans chanting together, provoking fights with already irritated Skins fans, worst case scenario. However, I have yet to ever see any type of confrontation between ANY fans at the (admittedly few) games where the Skins have a laugher and win comfortably.at home. When the W's come aand we walk into the stadium expecting to win (take current day Foxborough, Heinz Field, and RFK in the glory days) no one has any reason to start a fight; 99.9% of the fans are there to enjoy the experience and the game.

[Godfather151981]

Great Post, Popeman.

I can also say I at much differently at games now than when I was 18-21. One thing is for sure, more W's at home will cure all. When the Skins are getting smoked at FedEx, it is just a terrible atmosphere in the stadium no matter how you cut it. Opposing fans chanting together, provoking fights with already irritated Skins fans, worst case scenario. However, I have yet to ever see any type of confrontation between ANY fans at the (admittedly few) games where the Skins have a laugher and win comfortably.at home. When the W's come aand we walk into the stadium expecting to win (take current day Foxborough, Heinz Field, and RFK in the glory days) no one has any reason to start a fight; 99.9% of the fans are there to enjoy the experience and the game.

For the most part you're right. However I was at the 2002 season opener (a Thursday night game) when John Hall kicked the game winning FG as time expired. A bunch of us were walking through the concourse of the club level yelling J-E-T-S SUCK! SUCK! SUCK! This kid that couldn't have been more than 18 (drunk out of his mind) and a Jets fan started pushing and punching everyone in sight because we were calling out his team. Eventually he knocked down an old man and his wife which was when security stepped in.

As I've said, these visiting fans come here expecting to be served and they can't seem to understand that we're not as thrilled with their team as they are.

[pjfootballer]

I was at the Cincinnati game this year. Not alot of Bengals fans and they were clearly out numbered so what was stupid and weird all at the same time is, I saw more Redskin on Redskin fan fights. That's what's so bizarre.

I was also at the Atlanta game. There was one falcons fan, singing "so sorry to have to have beat you, but we did," or something like that. But you know what the Redskin fans did? Ignored him. By the time we got down to the 3rd ramp, he had shut up, because no one was giving him the time of day.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Fighting between your own fans is the most asinine thing going pj. Fighting of ANY kind is ridiculous in the extreme over a game, however passionate and important to people that game and their own team is. But fighting with your fellow fan ..... I'd ban you right there on the spot for being a total ridiculous dumbass.

We might not all disagree on certain things with this organization. And as pertains to this, certain things that happen during a game. But the very last thing you do is turn on your own. Either on the field or in the stands.

Absolute braindead stupidity on both counts.

Hail.

[pjfootballer]

Fighting between your own fans is the most asinine thing going pj. Fighting of ANY kind is ridiculous in the extreme over a game, however passionate and important to people that game and their own team is. But fighting with your fellow fan ..... I'd ban you right there on the spot for being a total ridiculous dumbass.

We might not all disagree on certain things with this organization. And as pertains to this, certain things that happen during a game. But the very last thing you do is turn on your own. Either on the field or in the stands.

Absolute braindead stupidity on both counts.

Hail.

2 Redskin fans by a port a john and another couple of fans in the parking lot that day. I've seen it in the stands in years past. I tell you, the older I get, the less I want to go to professional games. I'd rather go see a minor league baseball or hockey game any day. Much more relaxed and more of a family atmosphere.

[NattyBo]

My issue with soccer is the "establishment." The game itself COULD even be SOMEWHAT enjoyable to watch, however to me it's the people that are the problem. If you go to Europe that's the only sport they really have so nobody gets snarky about it. However in my experience a true soccer person over here seems to feel that soccer is the only sport...period. The impression I get from a lot of soccer people is that if you're not into soccer and thus prefer football and baseball you're just an uneducated fool. That may sound harsh, but I've had people treat me as such. If there wasn't such an arrogance among some of the supporters I MIGHT not have a problem with it. However the fact is that it's never going to take hold in America like the other sports.

I totally agree with you. I have DCU season tickets and I regularly make fun of people who put down American football as "throwball" or "pointyball" or whatever. But I won't lie, it sucks just as much to be a HUGE, LIFELONG 'Skins/DC Sports fan and a HUGE soccer fan (been to World Cup, club games in Europe, DCU season ticket holder) and have people be so down on the sport/local team here any time it comes up ("soccer sucks" "grass fairies", etc). Thicker skin, I know.

I just wish fanbases of both sports were a little more open minded, because both sports are clearly superior to pretty much everything else out there.

[steve09ru]

My issue with soccer is the "establishment." The game itself COULD even be SOMEWHAT enjoyable to watch, however to me it's the people that are the problem. If you go to Europe that's the only sport they really have so nobody gets snarky about it. However in my experience a true soccer person over here seems to feel that soccer is the only sport...period. The impression I get from a lot of soccer people is that if you're not into soccer and thus prefer football and baseball you're just an uneducated fool. That may sound harsh, but I've had people treat me as such. If there wasn't such an arrogance among some of the supporters I MIGHT not have a problem with it. However the fact is that it's never going to take hold in America like the other sports.

^^This plus...

The biggest joke of the term "athlete" and "tough" can be found in soccer