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ESPN: RG3 Developing Faster Than Luck

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Ghost of

Ghost of

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http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/44481/rg3-developing-faster-than-andrew-luck

The stats show Luck takes longer to get rid of the ball than Griffin and throws the ball down the field a lot more than Griffin. This suggests Luck is pressing too much and not recognizing when to check down as quickly as Griffin is. Griffin, in part, is doing a better job of quickly recognizing when he has a good opportunity to go deep and when he needs to get rid of the ball. This gives Griffin the current edge as both players strive to fulfill the promise of the draft slots.

Still, both rookies are performing at an extremely high level, and all signs point to both of them continuing to progress toward the levels of the Mannings and Bradys of the league. Griffin is the early leader out of the gate, but both will get there eventually. And when they do, we'll be comparing which elite QB is better.

Click the link to read the rest.

I keep hearing that both are playing at a high level but you've got to think that such a low completion percentage in this era is indicative of some issues, right?

In any case, I know Luck will become quite good, maybe great, but I am very happy with our selection thus far. I am surprised at just how Robert has distinguished himself in his performance and how IMPORTANT he is, whereas Luck seems to get the absolution from "his cast sucks" but I don't hear or see where he is making the difference for them.

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PCS

PCS

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Psssst. ESPN: Title. :)

I like this part myself.

Still, both rookies are performing at an extremely high level, and all signs point to both of them continuing to progress toward the levels of the Mannings and Bradys of the league. Griffin is the early leader out of the gate, but both will get there eventually. And when they do, we'll be comparing which elite QB is better.

:D

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Ghost of

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not so fast according to this link. This one suggests RG3 has a tell before the play and goes to that particular read before the snap

http://mattwaldmanrsp.com/2012/10/15/robert-griffin-iii-first-ballot-inductee-not-so-fast/

That guy got wrecked on FO, dude. For one, he goes into the tired tripe about hits. Secondly, he actually got one of the snaps wrong in the fact that there was more than one dude on that side of the field. And the "tells" he talks about aren't legitimate since we don't know who is actually the primary receiver and whether he's instead looking at defense, not the receiver. His INTs would be higher and his COMP PCT lower if after several weeks he had tells that some douche on the internet can discern with his access to the playbook and primary receivers, initial reads. Oh wait, he doesn't have that. Besides, it's funny he talks about Atlanta but there's nothing in there about how he dissected MInnesota. Guys keep getting open and he keeps getting them the ball. I DO expect some hiccups and I expect that on some plays they give him half the field to read. But that article is lame.

Check the comment by Sam Hobarth on that post.

PCS, thanks man. It's been forever since I posted a thread, so I needed the tip :)

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PCS

PCS

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No problem Ghost. Figured you might be rusty. ;)

not so fast according to this link. This one suggests RG3 has a tell before the play and goes to that particular read before the snap

http://mattwaldmanrsp.com/2012/10/15/robert-griffin-iii-first-ballot-inductee-not-so-fast/

You're kidding right? Guy already has been blasted,however that doesn't mean we can't do it some more. Ladies and Gentlemen. To the film rooms. :D

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Ghost of

Ghost of

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Here is a comment from the FO link to it.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/extra-points/2012/robert-griffin-iii-%E2%80%93-first-ballot-inductee-not-so-fast%E2%80%A6

The Vikings, the 9th rank defence in DVOA, had 5 games of tape on Griffin and he shredded them to the tune of 7.7/pass attempt and 10.1 yards per rush.

Either the author is a lot smarter than the Viking coaching staff, or stopping Robert Griffin is harder than the author thinks.

More important, the dude must own a farm because he built a massive straw man so that he could argue against something no one has said. Did anyone you ever meet say, "RG3 IS a first ballot HoFer?" Maybe he's on the road, that's up for discussion but it's always a bad start when you make an inflammatory title to get web hits and to create a false impression in the minds of readers. That way, if RG3 hits a rookie wall or simply goes through growing pains as they open up more of the offense or experiment, then some yahoo can beat his chest about how right he was in telling us that a guy with six games under his belt wasn't quite a HoFer yet.

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Rabsuz

Rabsuz

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It's obvious that RG3 is outplaying Luck at the moment. I really think Luck is being subjected to a terrible scheme with Bruce Arians, he throws like 55 times a game and usually throws short outs and such. RG3 benefits from a better run offense and I don't think Luck will look anywhere great until they get a real scheme and of course some better players, Manning can do it with nobodies on the roster but I doubt Luck is the greatest QB of all time and can replicate that. He is mortal like the rest of the QBs in the league. They should both be good down the line though, but RG3 I think is already playing at an elite level and there are stats to back that claim up...

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TSO

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not so fast according to this link. This one suggests RG3 has a tell before the play and goes to that particular read before the snap

http://mattwaldmanrsp.com/2012/10/15/robert-griffin-iii-first-ballot-inductee-not-so-fast/

Wow... that was awful. There was honestly so much wrong with that article I don't know where you would start. The guy seems like he went into this article with one intention and it wasn't really to analyze anything, it was to simply present a contrary view point, period.

Good for him, though, he got hits.

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Morneblade

Morneblade

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http://espn.go.com/blog/nfceast/post/_/id/44481/rg3-developing-faster-than-andrew-luck

Click the link to read the rest.

I keep hearing that both are playing at a high level but you've got to think that such a low completion percentage in this era is indicative of some issues, right?

In any case, I know Luck will become quite good, maybe great, but I am very happy with our selection thus far. I am surprised at just how Robert has distinguished himself in his performance and how IMPORTANT he is, whereas Luck seems to get the absolution from "his cast sucks" but I don't hear or see where he is making the difference for them.

I'm very happy that the Colts did not select RGIII, but Luck I think is working with less. He might have a better WR corp than we do (and that is debateable) but he has zero running game and a OL that is worse. And Luck did put the team on his back against Greenbay. We's played well and I think will be a very good QB in this league and is a much better althete than given credit for. But I"m still glad we have RGIII and think he could be a once in a lifetime player.

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Crestor

Crestor

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Let me tel you something. I like Luck but Rg3 is way better. Still, as a giants fan, you couldn't force me to trade Eli for Rg3 and 2 First Rounders like y'all did to get him. Rg3 reminds me of a faster Mcnabb. Doubt he wins the big game anytime soon. No running qb has ever won the big game.

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terpskins10

terpskins10

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yup! Do it man!

Ask and ye shall receive...

Why RG3 is currently ahead of Luck

Griffin is making better decisions, getting the ball out faster

Originally Published: October 17, 2012

By Ben Alamar | ESPN Insider

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Ricky Carioti/The Washington Post

Robert Griffin III and Andrew Luck have both played well this season as rookie quarterbacks.

Andrew Luck and Robert Griffin III will be linked and compared throughout their careers -- that's what going first and second, respectively, in the draft will do. And while their playing styles certainly differ, their results -- at least to this point in their careers -- have only invited more comparison.

Griffin and Luck currently are sixth and seventh in season-long Total QBR, ahead of bothAaron Rodgers and Drew Brees. Griffin's 74.4 rating and Luck's 73.6 are practically indistinguishable. But looking more closely at their performances, we can see how their contributions have differed and why Griffin might be on a faster track to quarterback dominance than Luck.

Both QBs have contributed similarly with their legs, which is against popular belief that Griffin is a vastly better runner. Griffin has added 11.2 points by running, and Luck has added 10.9 points. The real differences are from the points created through passing (29.3 for Griffin and 22.3 for Luck) and in points lost through sacks (minus-9 points for Griffin and minus-4.4 points for Luck). The touchdown difference in points created through passing favors Griffin, but since he gives most of it back by taking sacks, we might be tempted to think Luck is doing a better job of reading and reacting to defenses, and just getting rid of the ball when needed. This, however, is not the case and is why Griffin's development is ahead of Luck's.

There currently is a large difference between how these two throw the ball. For Griffin, 52 percent of his passes go for 3 yards or less in the air, while only 36 percent of Luck's are that short (league average is 42 percent). Again, this points to Griffin just making short, quick passes that artificially pad his passing totals, while Luck is actually airing the ball out -- but this might be part of Luck's problem and something he needs to adjust in his game.

Only 26 percent of Griffin's passes are 10 yards or longer in the air while 40 percent of Luck's are that long (league average is 30 percent), but that might be because Griffin is reading the defense and picking his spots more effectively than Luck. On those long passes, Luck has performed at the league average, completing 49 percent, while Griffin has completed 57 percent. Only Eli Manning (59 percent) and Alex Smith (59 percent) currently complete a higher rate of long passes than Griffin, while Luck's completion rate is comparable to Tony Romo sits to pee (49 percent) and Philip Rivers (49 percent). In each category, Griffin is completing passes at or above the league average, which indicates he really is finding the right receiver at the right time.

Additionally, when looking at the sacks the two take, we get further evidence that it is Griffin who is doing a superior job of reading and reacting to the defense. Both QBs have been sacked 13 times, but the length of time a QB has before he gets sacked is an indicator of when he is getting sacked: Is he taking too long to get rid of the ball, or has the defense just overwhelmed the blocking scheme? Generally, if a QB holds the ball for more than 3 seconds, he is taking too long and significantly increasing his chances of being sacked.

Throughout the league, 70 percent of all sacks happen after the 3-second mark, and Griffin is right there with 69 percent of his sacks occurring at 3 seconds or more. Luck, however, has a higher rate with 77 percent of his sacks occurring after 3 seconds. Griffin's metric puts him in the same neighborhood as Peyton Manning (70 percent) and Matt Ryan (69 percent), while Luck's puts him closer to Mark Sanchez (79 percent) and Brandon Weeden (74 percent).

The stats show Luck takes longer to get rid of the ball than Griffin and throws the ball down the field a lot more than Griffin. This suggests Luck is pressing too much and not recognizing when to check down as quickly as Griffin is. Griffin, in part, is doing a better job of quickly recognizing when he has a good opportunity to go deep and when he needs to get rid of the ball. This gives Griffin the current edge as both players strive to fulfill the promise of the draft slots.

Still, both rookies are performing at an extremely high level, and all signs point to both of them continuing to progress toward the levels of the Mannings and Bradys of the league. Griffin is the early leader out of the gate, but both will get there eventually. And when they do, we'll be comparing which elite QB is better.

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Crestor

Crestor

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Someone post the whole insider piece please!!! I know some of our members here have it!

You're welcome

Ricky Carioti/The Washington Post

Robert Griffin III and Andrew Luck have both played well this season as rookie quarterbacks.

Andrew Luck and Robert Griffin III will be linked and compared throughout their careers -- that's what going first and second, respectively, in the draft will do. And while their playing styles certainly differ, their results -- at least to this point in their careers -- have only invited more comparison.

Griffin and Luck currently are sixth and seventh in season-long Total QBR, ahead of bothAaron Rodgers and Drew Brees. Griffin's 74.4 rating and Luck's 73.6 are practically indistinguishable. But looking more closely at their performances, we can see how their contributions have differed and why Griffin might be on a faster track to quarterback dominance than Luck.

Both QBs have contributed similarly with their legs, which is against popular belief that Griffin is a vastly better runner. Griffin has added 11.2 points by running, and Luck has added 10.9 points. The real differences are from the points created through passing (29.3 for Griffin and 22.3 for Luck) and in points lost through sacks (minus-9 points for Griffin and minus-4.4 points for Luck). The touchdown difference in points created through passing favors Griffin, but since he gives most of it back by taking sacks, we might be tempted to think Luck is doing a better job of reading and reacting to defenses, and just getting rid of the ball when needed. This, however, is not the case and is why Griffin's development is ahead of Luck's.

There currently is a large difference between how these two throw the ball. For Griffin, 52 percent of his passes go for 3 yards or less in the air, while only 36 percent of Luck's are that short (league average is 42 percent). Again, this points to Griffin just making short, quick passes that artificially pad his passing totals, while Luck is actually airing the ball out -- but this might be part of Luck's problem and something he needs to adjust in his game.

Only 26 percent of Griffin's passes are 10 yards or longer in the air while 40 percent of Luck's are that long (league average is 30 percent), but that might be because Griffin is reading the defense and picking his spots more effectively than Luck. On those long passes, Luck has performed at the league average, completing 49 percent, while Griffin has completed 57 percent. Only Eli Manning (59 percent) and Alex Smith (59 percent) currently complete a higher rate of long passes than Griffin, while Luck's completion rate is comparable to Tony Romo sits to pee (49 percent) and Philip Rivers (49 percent). In each category, Griffin is completing passes at or above the league average, which indicates he really is finding the right receiver at the right time.

Additionally, when looking at the sacks the two take, we get further evidence that it is Griffin who is doing a superior job of reading and reacting to the defense. Both QBs have been sacked 13 times, but the length of time a QB has before he gets sacked is an indicator of when he is getting sacked: Is he taking too long to get rid of the ball, or has the defense just overwhelmed the blocking scheme? Generally, if a QB holds the ball for more than 3 seconds, he is taking too long and significantly increasing his chances of being sacked.

Throughout the league, 70 percent of all sacks happen after the 3-second mark, and Griffin is right there with 69 percent of his sacks occurring at 3 seconds or more. Luck, however, has a higher rate with 77 percent of his sacks occurring after 3 seconds. Griffin's metric puts him in the same neighborhood as Peyton Manning (70 percent) and Matt Ryan (69 percent), while Luck's puts him closer to Mark Sanchez (79 percent) and Brandon Weeden (74 percent).

The stats show Luck takes longer to get rid of the ball than Griffin and throws the ball down the field a lot more than Griffin. This suggests Luck is pressing too much and not recognizing when to check down as quickly as Griffin is. Griffin, in part, is doing a better job of quickly recognizing when he has a good opportunity to go deep and when he needs to get rid of the ball. This gives Griffin the current edge as both players strive to fulfill the promise of the draft slots.

Still, both rookies are performing at an extremely high level, and all signs point to both of them continuing to progress toward the levels of the Mannings and Bradys of the league. Griffin is the early leader out of the gate, but both will get there eventually. And when they do, we'll be comparing which elite QB is better.

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darrelgreenie

darrelgreenie

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You're welcome

Ricky Carioti/The Washington Post.

Some of the 'suggestions' are off base in my opinion.
Both QBs have contributed similarly with their legs, which is against popular belief that Griffin is a vastly better runner. Griffin has added 11.2 points by running, and Luck has added 10.9

Griffin is vastly superior runner to Luck that it was hard for me to take the article seriously. Griffin has more rushing 1st downs, rushing 3rd down conversions, rushing yards and TD.

Also, their is the real but unquantifiable effect Griffin has on the backside contain/pursuit which creates more cutback lanes for Morris and the fact that defenses are forced to acount for Griffin in the read-option/zone-read portion of the offense which creates an 'extra' blocker for the OL vs defensive front.

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