Homer: Breaking down film of Luck, Griffin III and Tannehill

[Fight for ole DC]

Thanks for link to Waldman's write-up on Tannehill. Very informative read....loved it. Anyone who did not go to the page is missing a terrific read.

Loved your write up, as well. Nice work.

[Hunter_R]

It's funny, I basically think of Ryan Tannehill as Jason Campbell. He's solid, but unspectacular. I haven't ever been blown away by what I've seen of him either, so it was interesting to get Matt's take.

It is funny that you say that. I see him as Jason Campbell, too. Check downs and bad accuracy on the deep ball.

http://www.newerascouting.com/2012/01/11/ryan-tannehill-2012-nfl-draft-scouting-report/

[GaryGreenMonk]

argh, lets draft a QB who played WR because he couldn't beat out 2 other players ahead of him at QB but played well when given a chance...

no thanks

to be fair... both QB's he failed to beat out as a freshman are both in the NFL now.

He played QB in highschool. He's enough of an athlete that he switched to WR because he needed to wait his turn at QB and wanted to stay on the field and was able to break school records as a WR until he switched back and got his chance at QB.

rather than poo poo'ing him for failing to take the starting job, I find what he did rather impressive.

He's also a pre-med guy.. so he's just as smart as Griffin.

[Missouri_Skins_Fan]

I do NOT want Tannehill, unless we happen to MUST trade down outside of the top 15 and possibly even into the 20's.

That's the prototypical "Reaching" for a player because you MUST have one mentality.

...And that's how you bust. Doing exactly that.

Hell, I would rather take Riley Reiff or Claiborne at #6, than reach for RC.

And that...I do NOT want to do.

But at least, you're getting proper value for the pick.

Drafting Tannehill @#6, would be more stupid, than trading the farm for RG3 or Luck, imo.

What would you rather have...Trading 3 years worth of picks for a Pro Bowl QB of studliness, that routinely plants us in the playoffs annually including Division Titles?

Or sticking at #6 and drafting Jason Campbell 2.0?

If this was my option...truly my only option?

RG3 or Tannehill at #6?

Give me Peyton Manning with weekly neck surgeries, draft a NON-QB at #6, an target a QB in 2013.

Personally...I like Kellen Moore over Tannehill

I would draft Kellen Moore at #39 in the 2nd OVER Tannehill @#6.

...and I'm serious:mad:

[KCClybun]

Someone posted a video in the main RGIII thread of him working out pre draft and there were some shots of him dropping back. I posted some comments in that thread about his footwork doing 3 and 5 step drops still being very much a work in progress. Its interesting this an area the writer picks up as one of the main holes in RGIIIs game right now. Footowork is essential in a rhythm based passing offense and especially in one based on WCO principles. Having consistent footwork is the key to timing and also the fundation for good mechanics and accuracy.

When I watched that video, the one thing I found with RGIII was that, if anything, he was dropping too fast. That was something that Kyle Shanahan talked about on Brian Billick's Chalk Talk. Young quarterbacks (particularly guys coming out of the spread) drop so fast, trying to get back from center, that it screws up the timing and getting those guys on balance. It's a matter of getting those guys to slow down a little bit, almost like on your last couple steps in your drop you have to...not really hesitate, but take a moment to gather yourself to get in a good position to throw.

That being said, Cutler's footwork wasn't exactly perfect when he came out, and he came from a pro style offense in Vanderbilt. So Shanny and Jeremy Bates booted him out and had him work from the shotgun more than having Cutler do straight drops. Even if you look at Cutler now, his footwork isn't perfect. It was much better this season than it was last (that was one of the things Martz and Cutler kept getting in tiffs about), but still, he'll still do just wacky **** that you wouldn't expect a veteran to do.

The thing about the WCO is that, if you haven't been in it, it takes lots and lots and lots and LOTS of reps to get the timing down. The WCO, in it's entirety, is about a three year system to get down.

The thing with Tannehill...it's like, he does everything well, but he doesn't do anything great. Well, he has great anticipation on comeback routes. But really? He's just sort of "meh". Mechanically, he's fine. Accuracy is just good. Anticipation...okay. I think that's where the Jason Campbell comparisons come in. I don't think Campbell was a terrible prospect, or really a terrible quarterback. If he ever manages to land on the right team in the right situation with all the right pieces, he'll be more than solid. But the thing is...he's only solid. He's not great at anything, and not really terrible at anything either. You give him a solid running game and a big time #1 receiver and he might be able to win for you, but he's not a guy who will elevate the team around him.

Tannehill is raw. From a strict passing standpoint, I don't really think him and Griffin are close. And that's not RGIIII-fanboy-ism, but it's just watch him play. And I like Tannehill as a prospect for the most part, I just think anyone who says him and RGII are close from, like...a pure upside standpoint? It's not close.

And things like "lack of anticipation on the deep pass"...that's pretty much the reason Campbell isn't here. In an offense where you read deep to short, you have to have that anticipation and accuracy deep to take full advantage of the scheme. It's really not one that allows you to be timid.

[SilkyDiamonds]

The QBs he didnt beat out were Stephen McGee a 4th rounder and Jerrod Johnson an undrafted practice squad journeyman. In 3 separate spring competitions he failed to beat either of them out for the starting spot. But now after playing 19 gms (15 against awful Pass Defenses, and the 4 good Pass Defenses made him look unspectacular) he's a 1st round QB? Maybe Im missing something.

Its not like he was being coached by a guy who didnt know anything about what an NFL QB looks like. Considering Mike Sherman was running an NFL type system, has been the coah that selected Aaron Rodgers, and coached Brett Favre. Either Sherman had a huge brainfart or maybe Tannehill just wasnt better than a 4th rounder and an undrafted practice squad QB ya know.Sometimes its really that simple

[RFKFedEx]

Colin Cowherd just schooled us on RG3's injuries. Out in 09 w/ an ACL and concussion issues in '10. Combine that with his smaller NFL body at 6-1 and 220.

Wow man. Talk about a prisoner of the moment prospect. Any other year I think he's a mid to late first round prospect. This just happens to be an extraordinarily thin year at QB in the 1st round.

I'm affraid RG3 is going to face Vick like injuries from getting hit while running at full speed.

[grego]

Colin Cowherd just schooled us

well, theres your problem right there.

[SilkyDiamonds]

Colin Cowherd also said Kevin Kolb would lead the Cardinals to the playoffs & a DD win season. Just sayin

[SkinsHokieFan]

Colin Cowherd just schooled us on RG3's injuries. Out in 09 w/ an ACL and concussion issues in '10. Combine that with his smaller NFL body at 6-1 and 220.

Wow man. Talk about a prisoner of the moment prospect. Any other year I think he's a mid to late first round prospect. This just happens to be an extraordinarily thin year at QB in the 1st round.

I'm affraid RG3 is going to face Vick like injuries from getting hit while running at full speed.

I think any other year he goes number 1 overall.

Its very rare to find that skill set that he has, which also fits in perfect with the offense.

Terrific mobility plus excellent deep ball

[The Robert Griffin Experience]

I'm affraid RG3 is going to face Vick like injuries from getting hit while running at full speed.

He's an athletic black quarterback, obviously he's going to get injured!

Never mind that most QB injuries are INSIDE the pocket.

Also, he is not 6'1, and 220 is not small for a QB. The ACL is a minor concern, but that was 2009 - he's been perfectly fine ever since.

[KCClybun]

He's an athletic black quarterback, obviously he's going to get injured!

Never mind that most QB injuries are INSIDE the pocket.

Also, he is not 6'1, and 220 is not small for a QB. The ACL is a minor concern, but that was 2009 - he's been perfectly fine ever since.

I swear to God, if Robert Griffin was built the exact same way but looked like Matt Barkley we wouldn't even be having three quarters of the discussions we are now...

[Missouri_Skins_Fan]

RG3 will measure 6'2" 1/2 at the combine.

He's closer to 6'3" than 6'1"

I hate misconceptions.

[Mahons21]

I could swear there's been a poster that has echoed majority of these same sentiments... Or right that was me. TOOT TOOT

No surprise to see Clan RG3 has already arrived to reach their daily quota of hi-jacked threads, RG3 or bust!!!!

Glad to see you post this Murph, I know it is in contrast to your previously held beliefs. Has working with Waldman changed your point of view on the topic at all?

[Pick6]

Personnally I am on the bandwagon of, if we can't grab Luck/RG3 wait to the 2nd or 3rd to take Weeden. The only knock on him is age, but I think the 3rd best option outside of Luck and Griffin. Plus, you don't have to reach in the 1st for him.

[Truant]

I agree with many posters here. First, great article/interview. Very interesting and informative.

Having said that, my eyes don't see the same things when it comes to any of these prospects. I think Luck, at his size, for the QB position, is a terrific athlete. I think lumping him in with Matt Ryan is underrating him a bit. As for RGIII I think he hits this checklist far better than he was given credit for: pocket management skills, a strong arm, mobility, accuracy, and decision-making as a leader, a reader of defenses, a coach on the field, a ball handler and lastly a passer.

Tannehill, while I don't hate him, isn't someone that I'd be excited about. I'd rather have a QB that made plenty of starts in college and found a way to win. If he doesn't win, what good is he? I realize that a QB can't strap on some linebacker pads and stop the opposing team, but Griffin, for example, had that moxie to keep responding when his defense let him down. While Tannehill is a good athlete and a really good athlete for the QB position - my theory is that the WR Tannehill from a couple years ago would smoke the QB Tannehill. I'm not sure why so many think his body composition and speed wouldn't have changed while training for a different position. Plus he wasn't a slot WR that ran past guys.

Tannehill reminds me of a more athletic Flacco. He can make some plays, he can keep you in games. You don't put a lot on his shoulders and you look to the running game and defense to carry you home.

[Hunter_R]

This Tannehill talk makes me think about Matt Barkely. What the heck is wrong with him? He would have been one of the most coveted players in the draft. He could free-fall over the course of a year. Basically, he couldn't get much higher on the draft boards, but he can drop like a rock (just like the money).

[chaught76]

What kind of talent did Tannehill have around him in college? Based on the article, sounds like he had very little around him to work with and was forced to carry the team a lot.

Obviously, there are still things you can evaluate, but if the talent is poor around him, wouldn't it make it more challenging to see his skill set?

If the above is true, then wouldn't it be fair to say his skill set is close to that of Jake Locker (who Shannahan was supposedly high on)?

[KCClybun]

This Tannehill talk makes me think about Matt Barkely. What the heck is wrong with him? He would have been one of the most coveted players in the draft. He could free-fall over the course of a year. Basically, he couldn't get much higher on the draft boards, but he can drop like a rock (just like the money).

With the rookie salary cap, he wasn't staring down a whole lot of money anyway, and even though I really like Barkley, he probably would've still be the third quarterback off the board. Him and RGIII were in a virtual deadlock for second best QB, each guy's positives cancelling out the others negatives, but RGIII might've gone before him just on upside.

As of right now, he's pretty much a lock to be the first quarterback off the board next season. Tyler Wilson's only a junior and people got more and more lukewarm on Landry Jones as the 2011 season wore on. He's got a chance to win his team a Bowl game (if not a national championship if everything breaks his way) and to be the first overall pick. Can't say I'd blame him for wanting to do that.

[SilkyDiamonds]

Ever heard of Cyrus Gray, Christine Michael, Ryan Swope, Jeff Fuller, Uzoma Nwachukwu? Yeah umm ALL of them will play on Sundays, they just happen to be the skill positions on the aTm team. Not too shabby

[KCClybun]

What kind of talent did Tannehill have around him in college? Based on the article, sounds like he had very little around him to work with and was forced to carry the team a lot.

Obviously, there are still things you can evaluate, but if the talent is poor around him, wouldn't it make it more challenging to see his skill set?

If the above is true, then wouldn't it be fair to say his skill set is close to that of Jake Locker (who Shannahan was supposedly high on)?

I think the talent around him was pretty decent, all things considered. Ryan Swope is one HELL of a slot receiver, he had two big receivers on the outside (even though Jeff Fuller took a step back this season), a pretty solid offensive line, Cyrus Gray was great running the ball for them. I think the only real issue they had was defensively.

I wouldn't call him Jake Locker. They have different skillsets. Locker LEGIT didn't have a whole lot of talent around him outside of Chris Polk until he senior season. I don't think you can honestly say Tannehill didn't have anything around him.

[Hunter_R]

With the rookie salary cap, he wasn't staring down a whole lot of money anyway, and even though I really like Barkley, he probably would've still be the third quarterback off the board. Him and RGIII were in a virtual deadlock for second best QB, each guy's positives cancelling out the others negatives, but RGIII might've gone before him just on upside.

As of right now, he's pretty much a lock to be the first quarterback off the board next season. Tyler Wilson's only a junior and people got more and more lukewarm on Landry Jones as the 2011 season wore on. He's got a chance to win his team a Bowl game (if not a national championship if everything breaks his way) and to be the first overall pick. Can't say I'd blame him for wanting to do that.

3rd quarterback off the board is most likely a top 6 pick in this draft. Like you said, he's not going to make a lot of money (relatively speaking) due to the salary cap. However, if he slips to the 2nd or worse, that is a lot of money (Not to mention the year of money he's missing by going back). Even worse, he could get hurt. Remember Jake Locker. Everybody was hyping him up, then he went back to school. He still got picked relatively high, but, still, his stock dropped.

[chaught76]

Ever heard of Cyrus Gray, Christine Michael, Ryan Swope, Jeff Fuller, Uzoma Nwachukwu? Yeah umm ALL of them will play on Sundays, they just happen to be the skill positions on the aTm team. Not too shabby

I haven't heard of them because I didn't follow Texas AM. That is why I was asking the question and the article implies he didn't have good pieces around him (at least the way I read it).

[Mahons21]

Ever heard of Cyrus Gray, Christine Michael, Ryan Swope, Jeff Fuller, Uzoma Nwachukwu? Yeah umm ALL of them will play on Sundays, they just happen to be the skill positions on the aTm team. Not too shabby

None will come close to Kendall Wright's draft position.

[Pick6]

With the rookie salary cap, he wasn't staring down a whole lot of money anyway, and even though I really like Barkley, he probably would've still be the third quarterback off the board. Him and RGIII were in a virtual deadlock for second best QB, each guy's positives cancelling out the others negatives, but RGIII might've gone before him just on upside.

As of right now, he's pretty much a lock to be the first quarterback off the board next season. Tyler Wilson's only a junior and people got more and more lukewarm on Landry Jones as the 2011 season wore on. He's got a chance to win his team a Bowl game (if not a national championship if everything breaks his way) and to be the first overall pick. Can't say I'd blame him for wanting to do that.

My Grandfather is huge OU fan and knows a ton about the team. He doesn't have many positive things to say about Jones and doesn't think he will be a great pro player. When it comes to OU I take my grandfather's word.