Significant lack of talent

[texasthunder]

Name any of our WR's that will put the fear in any defense? Not one, AA and Smoss are 2nd or 3rd stringers at best!!

Sorry, only Fred Davis is a threat and he is a TE.

Till we get that big. physical receiver that can run the correct routes and actually catch the ball with

a defensive player hanging on him, our offense is going to be anemic.

All this talk about selling the farm, or trading up to grab Luck.

I am at the point where if we trade up I hope its for Blackmon.

[ciacbw]

Lockout? or am I mistaken?

[MumboSauce]

Well...I think the team and personnel is improved to a degree..got younger, got the bad attitude, bad fit guys out..but yeah the talent/team speed is still lacking. Furthermore, this is a team that needed to stay completely healthy to stay on the course they were on, and that's a rare feat in the NFL. I don't think they are good enough to overcome the injuries they have now sustained over the course of the past two weeks to those positions. Granted Fred Davis is good, and there are other running backs, but two starting Olineman, Atogwe out, Fletcher possibly, Moss, Cooley. We need real receivers badly...Armstrong, Stallworth, Paul, Austin, Gafney scare no one.

[benskins26]

Watching the vikes game- ponder shows more than any qb we've had in 20 years. He's exciting and fun to watch. 1st start. Against the Packers.

[REDALERT]

YEP!

The redskins arre still suffering from years of trading off draft picks and not developing depth. Compound that with a lack of stability in coaching and constant scheme changes.

Every few years we change coaches and coaches need players to fit their schemes. With the depth we never had and constantly changing coaches and schemes, we are now seing the blunt of our dysfunctions.

Now! by the time Shanny gets the players he needs to make us consistenty competitive, his time will be up after several failed seasons.

Then, it's back to the vicious cycle again by hiring a new coach, getting new schemes, getting players to fit that scheme and we still don't have a franchise QB.

Stop drinking the d@mn kool aid every year thinking were a few parts away from being constantly competitive.

That's why it was highly important to come away this year with one of the QB's in the draft. Especially when your years away and picking high.

But what we do is add players and hope the QB we have will get the job done, or trade for other teams QB flunkies. This strategy only sets us back several more years after years of dysfunction at the Qb position.

People! no matter what other parts you have on the team. This league is now a QB driven league and if you dont have a franchise QB your doomed.

Sure! we still need to work on other areas. But we've been in the middle of the pack for several years now or close to some of the worse. When you have the opportunity to pick high and still in need of a over due franchise QB, you chance one. Ponder, Gabbert, Newton etc...you take one of the QB's and you groom him d@mmit.

Beck better be the answer! If not, it's back to the vicious cycle and constatntly spinning our wheels wishing for a miracle in the QB dept.

See Panthers!

They didn't have much to offer Newton regarding talent and many said Newton wasn't NFL QB material. But the Panthers didn't care, you take him any way and you take your chances.

Draft a d@mn franchise QB to groom people, how long has it been since we had one? SIGH..

[pilsburypgh]

YEP!

The redskins arre still suffering from years of trading off draft picks and not developing depth. Compound that with a lack of stability in coaching and constant scheme changes.

Every few years we change coaches and coaches need players to fit their schemes. With the depth we never had and constantly changing coaches and schemes, we are now seing the blunt of our dysfunctions.

Now! by the time Shanny gets the players he needs to make us consistenty competitive, his time will be up after several failed seasons.

Then, it's back to the vicious cycle again by hiring a new coach, getting new schemes, getting players to fit that scheme and we still don't have a franchise QB.

Stop drinking the d@mn kool aid every year thinking were a few parts away from being constantly competitive.

That's why it was highly important to come away this year with one of the QB's in the draft. Especially when your years away and picking high.

But what we do is add players and hope the QB we have will get the job done, or trade for other teams QB flunkies. This strategy only sets us back several more years after years of dysfunction at the Qb position.

People! no matter what other parts you have on the team. This league is now a QB driven league and if you dont have a franchise QB your doomed.

Sure! we still need to work on other areas. But we've been in the middle of the pack for several years now or close to some of the worse. When you have the opportunity to pick high and still in need of a over due franchise QB, you chance one. Ponder, Gabbert, Newton etc...you take one of the QB's and you groom him d@mmit.

Beck better be the answer! If not, it's back to the vicious cycle and constatntly spinning our wheels wishing for a miracle in the QB dept.

See Panthers!

They didn't have much to offer Newton regarding talent and many said Newton wasn't NFL QB material. But the Panthers didn't care, you take him any way and you take your chances.

Draft a d@mn franchise QB to groom people, how long has it been since we had one? SIGH..

I totally agree. Cam Newtons presence makes the team a lot better. Its amazing how much a good QB can upgrade a team. Look at the teams in this league that win consistently, they all have one thing in common and thats good QB play. We need to get a big time QB. We are long over due.

---------- Post added October-23rd-2011 at 11:20 PM ----------

I mean look at our QBs? John Beck and Rex Grossman? Who are we kidding thinkin we could win with that. Our RBs? Torain, Helu, and Tim Hightower? Really? What a joke. WRs, I bet moss would be only a slot if he made the team on the browns. lol.

[Brotherz]

We will have a franchise young QB drafted in the first round this off-season. Its a guarantee. It'll be a good one too. I am thinking along the lines of Landry Jones. Absolute worst case scenario is Kellen Moore. Regardless, we will have a serious franchise QB on our roster next year. We will probably add a corner, another big WR and I wouldn't be shocked by a Chris Cooley trade. The team will be better and better. Its slow. We were an absolute disaster area guys. From our financial/cap situation, age of roster, culture, - heck even our franchises relationship with alumni. We were an absolute train wreck. They fixed the finances, got younger, found hungrier, younger, players. We have the punter, their faith in Gano seems well placed. The D line is significantly better. The Oline is deeper than it was (remember the Levi/Heyer days?).

We'll continue to improve. Its going the right direction. We all just didn't want to admit how bad it was.

---------- Post added October-24th-2011 at 08:33 AM ----------

Redalert - Its coming. There's no doubt about it. Its next year. The crop is WAY better next year. He had to choose what to fix first. You throw Gabbert onto the team we had last year, you weren't any better than you are right now. He chose to work ont he defense first. No he isn't done obviously and the secondary needs some attention but they are better. The QB is coming. Its a five year plan. They have said it all along and that is what it is. We are bad this year (again). I get it. It sucks. We will get the QB. We will get anther corner and we will get a WR. Its all coming. You can look closely and see what they are doing.

Do you really disagree with these moves?:

1) Cofield?

2) Carriker? (5 sacks by the way)

3) Bowen?

4) Kerrigan?

5) Trent Williams?

6) Brown?

7) Josh Wilson?

8) Otogwe?

9) Hightower?

10) Armstrong?

11) Banks?

12) Rocca?

13) Gano?

What do you find incompetent about this? When you literally have to overhaul every position in all three phases of the game, its a tough assignment. Some people seem to think that if we got a QB we'd be fixed. It just doesn't work that way when the team is an absolute disaster area. That works when everything else is pretty good and the QB is what is lacking. That is carolina. That is GOING TO BE US next year. He can only do so much so fast. Again, I honestly think our dissappointment is a function of self imposed delusion about how bad we really were.

[justice98]

Um the best players on our team are from the Vin dog? The question here is what the hell is Mike doing to change that. Helu? Hank? Gaffeny?

That's a very good point. They overhauled 3/4 of the roster, and most of the best players are still leftover Vinny boys. Maybe it's too early to judge this year's class, but it's something to note.

[Skins Wingman]

just wanted to add my thoughts on a couple things..

i agree that orakpo is lacking in a few areas. hes good about getting to the qb in the pocket, other than that, he struggles.

our secondary is horrible. this is becoming a passing league, and without a solid secondary, were gonna be toast.

qb and wr.. im putting these together because they go hand in hand. beck seems to chose a wr before the snap and throw to him no matter what. grossman is too careless. and when the qb makes a throw, the wr drops it.

we need a franchise qb. he will make all the players around him a little better. beef up the line, add a big receiver, our offense should start flowing. on defense, we need a shutdown corner, free safety, and depth at lb. we need speed on both sides of the ball as well.

[justice98]

just wanted to add my thoughts on a couple things..

i agree that orakpo is lacking in a few areas. hes good about getting to the qb in the pocket, other than that, he struggles.

our secondary is horrible. this is becoming a passing league, and without a solid secondary, were gonna be toast.

qb and wr.. im putting these together because they go hand in hand. beck seems to chose a wr before the snap and throw to him no matter what. grossman is too careless. and when the qb makes a throw, the wr drops it.

we need a franchise qb. he will make all the players around him a little better. beef up the line, add a big receiver, our offense should start flowing. on defense, we need a shutdown corner, free safety, and depth at lb. we need speed on both sides of the ball as well.

He's probably miscast as a 3-4 LB to begin with.

[tkatz]

Finally, the truth is aired cleanly and simply. Three points....

OL is athletic and fast???? You cant be talking about jamal Brown, whose pass protection ( and I use that term in its broadest possible sense) consists of ponderously jamming his giant right foot behind him and then moving the rest of his body backwards.....

CBS Josh Wilson and Kevin Barnes.....all pro- in giving up huge chunks of yardage in the second half of games.....

LBs...sadly so true. ARGHHH!

2013 a long, and painful, time away.

[FlaSk1nsfan]

Lets be honest folks, we just aren't talented enough to win in this league. You can only grind out games and scrape by teams for so long before the cream rises to the crop.QUOTE]

I knew that the cream can rise to the TOP and I have heard that one can be the cream of the CROP, but I had no idea that the cream can rise to the CROP. LOL Just messing with ya bro. :-)

---------- Post added October-24th-2011 at 11:28 AM ----------

I'd take Moss off that list. He plods like Paulsen anymore.

What I dont get is how Moss never seems to be able to catch a ball in stride or stay on his feel when he makes a catch. I mean its like he has to fall down to catch the ball regardless where all the other teams I watch seem to be able to catch a pass and get YAK all the time. When is the last time you saw us do that? CC used to do it but now he is hurt all the time I guess.

[Mahons21]

What I don't understand is that our coach had all off season to find a QB and decided to stick with back up QBs?

Got to be patient. With the amount of holes this team had there was no way to fix them all in one off-season. Therefore there was no need to reach for any one player because we had holes across the board we could let talent fall to us.

[Goingforburgundy]

I dont get how people think QB can just be plucked off the street. Teams dont let GOOD QBs walk. The last one was Drew Brees and he was coming off a complete shoulder reconstruction with the Chargers having Phillip Rivers in their laps. That was, what, 5 years ago? One QB in 5 years is an anomoly not a regularity. Use your head people.

[Botched]

Everyone looks more talented when they have a legitimate QB running the offense.

[RonArtest15]

Everyone looks more talented when they have a legitimate QB running the offense.

QFE.

However, I think if Beck can prove to be servicable, they should roll w. him for this year and next. The draft plan should be to get a PLAYMAKER at WR in the 1st round and look to draft a QB in the 2nd round (that we can groom).

This team is so inept on offense...outside of Fred Davis & Trent Williams, there isn't much there.

[Mahons21]

Everyone looks more talented when they have a legitimate QB running the offense.

And every QB looks more talented when they have legitimate weapons in their offense.

[Skinsinparadise]

And every QB looks more talented when they have legitimate weapons in their offense.

Was thinking when was the last time we had an elite WR? 1992, Gary Clark?

[Bobbyst21]

QFE.

However, I think if Beck can prove to be servicable, they should roll w. him for this year and next. The draft plan should be to get a PLAYMAKER at WR in the 1st round and look to draft a QB in the 2nd round (that we can groom).

This team is so inept on offense...outside of Fred Davis & Trent Williams, there isn't much there.

We just drafted 2 WR's. I agree that we need a playmaker there but given this last draft i think the plan should be the opposite. QB in the first.OL in 2nd. From there....BPA?

[Mahons21]

Was thinking when was the last time we had an elite WR? 1992, Gary Clark?

Too long ago for me to remember unfortunately, since I was all of 7 y/o in 92. I pushed this idea in another thread though, I think the Skins need a dominant WR. I was pretty happy with Paul's 2 grabs this week, that fade route was pretty. It'd be great if he could turn into that player for us, because it seems Hankerson is having his fair share of bumps in the road to development.

[RonArtest15]

We just drafted 2 WR's. I agree that we need a playmaker there but given this last draft i think the plan should be the opposite. QB in the first.OL in 2nd. From there....BPA?

Justin Blackmon/Michael Floyd are NOT cut from the same cloth of any of the WRs we've drafted over the past 15-20 years. Doesn't matter who we have on the depth chart as a WR, either one of those guys would be a SIGNIFICANT upgrade and a true playmaker...which is what we're lacking.

[Mahons21]

Justin Blackmon/Michael Floyd are NOT cut from the same cloth of any of the WRs we've drafted over the past 15-20 years. Doesn't matter who we have on the depth chart as a WR, either one of those guys would be a SIGNIFICANT upgrade and a true playmaker...which is what we're lacking.

I suggested Blackmon in another thread, where's he currently projected to be drafted at?

[Skinsinparadise]

Too long ago for me to remember unfortunately, since I was all of 7 y/o in 92. I pushed this idea in another thread though, I think the Skins need a dominant WR. I was pretty happy with Paul's 2 grabs this week, that fade route was pretty. It'd be great if he could turn into that player for us, because it seems Hankerson is having his fair share of bumps in the road to development.

I think there is a sliver lining to Moss getting hurt. Lets get Paul and Hankerson some reps, see what we got.

[skinsmania123]

Lets be honest folks, we just aren't talented enough to win in this league. You can only grind out games and scrape by teams for so long before the cream rises to the crop.

On offense we have maybe one legitimate TALENT in Fred Davis, and even then he isn't elite(but he is good). Our RBs are a bunch of guys who are okay but none of them really strike fear. The receivers are servicable with Moss, without him they are probably among the worst in the league. The OL is quick and athletic but also small and easily overpowered. Then of course there is the QB situation, where we are easily the worst in the league(maybe tied with Miami).

The defense has been getting exposed the last couple of weeks. There is some talent there but a lot of it is undisciplined and lacks IQ. We get beat constantly by misdirection and delay plays because there is so much emphasis on making the big play that we fail at making the little ones. Up front our DL isn't shedding blocks and that's causing our LBs to get overwhelmed. Speaking of which, our LBs can't cover at all. Orakpo is a one trick pony and has been fairly inconsistent at pass rushing. Fletcher is old now and Mcintosh is mediocre. The secondary can't cover at all and the CBs need to be overhauled.

Looking at our roster, there just isn't a lot there. How many of our starters would legitimately start on a playoff team? Three, maybe four tops?

I don't expect this team to really contend until 2013 at the earliest. We need another offseason or two like last year to continue overhauling and getting rid of the garbage from the Vinny era.

Very good points. One of the most sensible posts I have read today. Still want to see what Helu has before deciding all our RB's are just serviceable. Our D could not shed blocks yesterday or against the Iggles. And they are back to the poor tackling, lackluster play we witnessed last year and the past few years. Groundhog Day started for me officially yesterday. What I do not get is how people think that a franchise QB is going to change the fortunes of the Skins when we have so many average players. Our entire secondary needs an overhaul. Our LB's and CB's cannot cover, cannot shed blocks and cannot tackle. You really nailed the issue at OL. Quick but not big enough so they cannot protect and are inconsistent. They get worn down as the game progresses. These are Hogs-NOT.

It is going to be painful watching them play the Eagles, Patriots, Bills, Iggles, and the Giants. I think you are very optimistic about a 2013 competition year but that is up to Bruce Allen and Shanny to make the right decisions. Kerrigan was the best addition this year IMO.

[Mahons21]

I think there is a sliver lining to Moss getting hurt. Lets get Paul and Hankerson some reps, see what we got.

I'd like to see that. Hankerson unfortunately might not be who we thought he was last May.