Reaper 21: Trying to define the Mike Shannahan system.

[Reaper 21]

I know new threads are annoying, and I personally have tried to stay away from them. But was thinking of this and couldn't find a real home to put this breakdown.

I noticed a few things after final cuts this year, that didn't occur to me last year. He has a formula like a math problem and he is just plugging in different numbers yet expecting the same results. But the funny thing is he gets them. I believe MS has a exact formula for building teams and we all know it as his "system". This is what I think the "system is" by pos.

3 things to take note of. 1 most positions have a rookie and a vet, and the vet is here until the rook gets comfortable enough not to need vet.

other thing last year team has similarities to this team but the team had lots of spending already in trying to make cap room for the future, so take it with a grain of salt. And finally guys will make the team if they are swing men( can play mutlitple pos, efficiently allows for more depth.)

QB The Game Manager(Plummer, Griese)- not going to dwell on this too much, been discussed before. But smart qbs that get the ball out of their hands quickly and into the playmakers. not asked to be saviors but more like game managers,(hint the problem with McNabb). Usually veteran been around the league and understands defenses.

RB- I think this is a major part of his system. The production is more due to the oline( will explain later) but the players are similar. THE BACK (TD) You need a Balance back that has speed vision and break tackle ability. (Hightower, Portis). POWER BACK(Mike Anderson) Second you need a power back for short yards and need to be physical situations( ATV, L. Johnson, Peyton Hillis). SCAT BACK (Tatum Bell) Finally you need a scat back with game breaking speed, (Helu, W. Parker,).

WR- Poss WR (Gaffney, Hankerson). Slot WR( Moss, Austin) Flanker WR( Armstrong, Paul) ST speedster WR ( Stallworth, Banks).

TE /FB pretty similar to rest of league.(two receving te, 1 special blocker.)/Hard hitting FB

Swing

Sellars.

Oline

This is the key of the offense, and it doesnt mean its the best players in the league but the ones who fit the system. We saw this last year with dockery and corey. Dockery was a known commodity and corey was a joke. We all saw how corey outplayed dock all year round. The smaller zone blocking is key. Its about getting to the sidelines and creating bigger running lanes.

LT Run Specialist (Ryan Clady)- The Left tackle is the most important player and the offense is based around him. Trent is the perfect guy for this with his run blocking ability. (Locklear good vet depth).

LG Smaller Guard( Mark Schelerth) Corey is a good zone blocking guard, but I think he is a nice compliment to Trent for his good pass protection ability.

C- The Mean One (Tom Nalen) Will is the lineman we need at center after a decade of Rabach hugging his opponents. Also Cook gives us versatilty at the other interior positions.

RG Smaller Guard (Dan Neil) Chris Chester is a huge addition because by the season end he will be a leader on this younger line.

RT- Pass Specialist (Matt Lepsis) This is the opposite of LT in the regards of strengths, and J. Brown will be everything we were hoping for this year now healthy. Also rookie W. Smith will be a nice youth project

So with a strong running game, and playmaking wr, the value of the qb has diminished in our offense. I expect good things from this offense next year. should be middle of the pack and with a tough hitting playmaking defense are team will be much more competitive this year then what we are all expecting.

---------- Post added September-4th-2011 at 11:38 AM ----------

The defense resembles more of the defensive coordinator Jim Haslett. And his studies of the Dick LeBeau defense from Pittsburgh. Notice the comparisons in parenthesis at the end of the assessment.

The defensive line starting with the NT. Cofeild is doing everything we were asking of Al but is delivering. He is getting penetration and still going to allow our lbs to make the plays(Hampton but not so similar). Neild will be a solid backup and will keep cofeild fresh. At DE the strong run stuffing side of Adam Carriker, and his backup Golston(Brett Kiesel). At the other DE the pass rushing 3-4 End in Bowen, and his backup Scott(Aaron Smith/Iggy Hood).

At linebacker, I think the need to keep WR and LBs deep is because these backups will be playing ST creating a very athletic ST. Starting with ILB Fletcher a smart leader who knows the defense very well and is a leader, is backup Fox is that but 6 years younger and will take over in the future and I do not think the drop off is as bad as we are all fearing(James Farrior). At other ILB Rocky and Riley, the more athletic playmaking ILB more used on blitzes then the other ILB but hard hitting toughness(Timmons). At OLB pass rushing specials our DE we basically run a 5-2 flex d. We know what Orakpo gives us but expect a nice compliment from Kerrigan.(Harrison, Woodley) At backups White and Jackson are projects but are capable of coming in.

Swing

Lorenzo Alexander self explanatory.

(Larry Foote).

CB

Playmaking ball hawk D. Hall. More physical corner with better coverage Josh Wilson. Barnes, Westbrook Buchannon Thompson all give us good depth with vets and rooks. (Ike Taylor/Bryant McFadden).

FS/SS

Playmaking ball hawk. OJ. his backup Gomes.(Ryan Clark) Hard physical presence Landry, and his backup Doughty.(Troy P)

K/P Gano excellent leg strength and looks to be more accurate. Sav has been punting excellent and our coverage team will be better than last year.

KR Banks Austin/PR IE around the league.

[TK]

Without fine tuning it, that's a pretty good spot on analysis. Nice post.

That being said, had Cooley been healthy & not questionable for the opener, I think Sellers woulda been gone. I also pretty sure that we're not going to keep 8 WRs. Austin could get traded to Houston, who only kept something like 4 WRs. He's got some value, so I don't think he gets cut outright.

But if you want to see something sick, watch this clip. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfaNbw1yzfg

Pay attention to not Banks but to Paul. You may not catch it the first time, but watch the overhead replay. If wasn't for the guy making the downfield block getting in Pauls' way, he woulda passed Banks who had a 20 yard head start with a head of steam. Oh & Paul had to turn around as well. Speed kills.

[Reaper 21]

yeah I remember seeing that Paul will be a nice addition, and I agree as rooks show their understanding I expect some of the Veteran presence to be let go. But I like the way MS has the players show the rooks exactly what he is expecting of them.

[LetThePointsSoar]

Pay attention to not Banks but to Paul. You may not catch it the first time, but watch the overhead replay. If wasn't for the guy making the downfield block getting in Pauls' way, he woulda passed Banks who had a 20 yard head start with a head of steam. Oh & Paul had to turn around as well. Speed kills.

That's nuts. Looks like Niles is jogging - reminds me of Walter Payton's running style, looked like he was barely moving until he flew right past you.

Was bittersweet to see Chris Horton hold the block from :08 until he pancaked his guy @ :11...knew it needed to happen, but was always a Predator fan...

[Mania]

I saw this in live mode the other day. Then I saw the replay and realized it was Paul. I had no idea Niles Paul was as fast as he is. That being said, when Banks is 100% is quickness is 2nd to no one on this team. However Armstrong is faster than he is by 1/100 of a second. :-). Quickness is everything in the PR/KR game.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Austin could get traded to Houston, who only kept something like 4 WRs. He's got some value, so I don't think he gets cut outright.

WAIT! Their shopping Austin? WTH? That would make ZERO sense to me in a rebuild. Why build up a position with your own, quality young depth; then knock it down at the expense of career average vets? Please tell me you still haven't had your morning coffee boss man and you meant to say Stalllworth. Please .....

And Reaper, NEVER apologize for a new thread when it's a fresh take on things. Nice summation Sir of a Shanahan roster.

Hail.

[DavidGQ]

Wow..can't believe Paul is that fast. Nice eyes TK.

OP - you 're absolutely right. I believe with better running plays, that will take a lot of pressures of our QB. I wouldn't be shocked if we make playoff this year. I WILL be shocked if we don't next year with better draft and FA.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Darn 'puter freeze.

Double post, sorry.

Continue on.

Hail.

[DavidGQ]

WAIT! Their shopping Austin? WTH? That would make ZERO sense to me in a rebuild. Why build up a position with your own, quality young depth; then knock it down at the expense of career average vets? Please tell me you still haven't had your morning coffee boss man and you meant to say Stalllworth. Please .....

And Reaper, NEVER apologize for a new thread when it's a fresh take on things. Nice summation Sir of a Shanahan roster.

Hail.

I have read from multiple sources yesterday that Austin is up for trade. Could happen today.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

I have read from multiple sources yesterday that Austin is up for trade. Could happen today.

Madness. Complete and utter nonsensical madness,

Nothing else to add.

Hail.

[Manny555]

I hope we don't trade Austin. I really like him. Reminds me alot of Moss. Sure handed, quick receiver. This whole preseason, when the ball would come his way, I knew it was gonna be good.

[JaxJoe]

I think this is a great OP. And there's another factor into the team building effort that I think MS is implementing: And that is youth. But not youth for youth sake. Youth for competition sake. Many, if not most, successful organizations always employ youth to compete with the existing personnel. But after some time, say two or three years, the youth doesn't advance, you lay him off and promote the one who has shown improvement.

I don't know, but I wouldn't be surprised if every year we sign eight or ten rookies to push the existing players. Whether we retain all rookies is another story. But, obviously, we did this year. The other benefit in this is the elimination of nepotism and hubris. Even the star players have to know that their job isn't secure. In management, this technique is called Continuous Improvement. Whether it involves new, brighter, harder working employees, or new faster cheaper technology.

[TK]

WAIT! Their shopping Austin? WTH? That would make ZERO sense to me in a rebuild. Why build up a position with your own, quality young depth; then knock it down at the expense of career average vets? Please tell me you still haven't had your morning coffee boss man and you meant to say Stalllworth. Please .....

You cut Stallwoth, you get nothing. No one will really trade much for him either, but he has shown he can still produce as an older vet. So he'd still get scooped up by a team & it wouldn't cost them anything.

You can trade Austin because his body of work during the last 4 weeks has elevated his worth in a trade.

With our other six WRs, you trade the guy that will get you the most value. Shanny did this RBs all the time in Denver. He'd build a guy up & trade him for picks that In turn he would use to inject youth into his Defense.

[Big Will]

Trading Stallworth makes much more sense than trading Austin. Stallworth has less value I'd imagine though. Austin is going to be a good one AND he has special teams value.

But, keeping this many WRs doesn't make sense. There will be a receiver hungry team out there to trade with. I just hope it is not Austin.

Good eye on Niles Paul, TK. I had not noticed his super human speed!

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

So your weakening a position you've built up going forward with hopefully quality youth at it's core in Austin, Hankerson, Paul and maybe Robinson down the line. I understand the trade value aspect being on Austin and not a guy like Stallworth; but it just seem's to totally defeat the object to build up one area, only to start removing pieces within a year at the expense of somewhere else.

Honestly, and this won't happen as their still obviously balancing the long term against the here and now; but I'd offer up Moss, Gaffney, Stallworth or even Armstrong before a guy who could play a big part for many years to come.

That's not conducive to rebuilding a team to me TK. Not that it matters much, but as a fan I'd be more than a little pissed with a move like that.

Hail.

[Oldfan]

...With our other six WRs, you trade the guy that will get you the most value. Shanny did this RBs all the time in Denver. He'd build a guy up & trade him for picks that In turn he would use to inject youth into his Defense.

Dunno, Amigo. I don't see that much talented youth in our receiving corps yet. Trading Austin doesn't add up.

[whatmeworry]

I have read from multiple sources yesterday that Austin is up for trade. Could happen today.

If someone has to be traded I'd rather it be Gaffney. Austin I think is going to be a player.

[Reaper 21]

i think the production of wr and rb are usually going to be high becasue MS understands that their are lots of great athletes in college and the NFL that can run routes well enough and make plays, just like rbs that run north and south with enough speed and balance. You guys are too worried about losing prospects trust him, none of his moves have gone without insurance and getting a better acquisition. Beck, Gaffney, Hightower, when he does trade for devalued guys they usually will succeed here becasue they have similar skill sets, and meet the requirements of the position that is laid out in front of them. Back to the original point of Different numbers same formula gives you the a similar result.

[LetThePointsSoar]

If someone has to be traded I'd rather it be Gaffney. Austin I think is going to be a player.

No way, I see Gaffney having a monster year this year as a possession receiver. I like TA, but he does seem to be expendable with our newly found depth @ WR...if he is traded, would love to see us pick up interior OL depth. Just my $.02.

[Morneblade]

I agree with this, if we could get something for him, but I see TK's point. Teams would rather have young and looking good that older and looking good. So I see the reasoning behind shopping Austin, but its also the reason I dont wanna shop Austin. Long term value. Stallworth also doesnt have as much mileage as most players his age, so he might have a 2-3 years left as a threat if (and it is a "if") he can stay healthy. But I'm pretty partial to Donte' being he is a Vol and all, but I think he's been as good as Gaffney with the added plus of being able to stretch the field.

[Jumbo]

Ladies & Gentlemen, this is another great example of how to craft a superior OP. WTG Reaper. Rick usually has pretty good takes on personnel shifts, and I don't know if Shanny is shopping Austin, but I do agree it is line with how he has done things previously (the build and trade angle as has been noted frequently).

I realy like Austin, and both traditional wisdom (the unproven in the regular season aspect of the wr corps) and my own acquired trepidation from this last decade in Redskins Land leave me apprehensive about the idea, only because I see a lot of future in Austin and outside of Moss there are few wr's we've had to feel confident about.

But on this matter, I also saw Stallworth perform well enough to earn a place, which is something that many other posters seem to have missed given all the disagreement I see about having kept him. While our past decade advises aganst optimism for the unproven, I swallow the kool-aid that we likely have a potentially strong and deep receiving corps now, however young & and in early development. If such an Austin trade happens, I imagine many of us will want to see what we get before flailing spasmodically across the room.

Back to the OP; while we live in times of "tl; dr" and the detail of his analysis may be skipped over, I was given to thinking of the much-reviled (on ES) methodology of consistent winner Bill Belichick and his formula/equation like approaches to the game that have been documented elsewhere in the past.

The key positive to me is the FO actually has a real plan these days beyond a knee-jerk fly-by-the-pants or soup-of-the-day approach, and while we still await the proof of it's potency, just knowing it's there and seeing the changes and positives to date seem to have resuscitated hope in many of us. That's a good thing.

[rebornempowered]

Without fine tuning it, that's a pretty good spot on analysis. Nice post.

That being said, had Cooley been healthy & not questionable for the opener, I think Sellers woulda been gone. I also pretty sure that we're not going to keep 8 WRs. Austin could get traded to Houston, who only kept something like 4 WRs. He's got some value, so I don't think he gets cut outright.

But if you want to see something sick, watch this clip. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfaNbw1yzfg

Pay attention to not Banks but to Paul. You may not catch it the first time, but watch the overhead replay. If wasn't for the guy making the downfield block getting in Pauls' way, he woulda passed Banks who had a 20 yard head start with a head of steam. Oh & Paul had to turn around as well. Speed kills.

As a Nebraska fan I have watched Niles Paul play a lot of football. I was always amazed at the returns he had for touchdowns because he wasn't making a ton of elusive moves he was just getting by the blocks at the right times because he was so fast. As soon as he saw a little daylight he would turn on the afterburners.

[Win4us]

I'm with the keep Austin crowd on this one. If it does happen though I'd like it to be for a higher round pick....say a 3rd.

[Jumbo]

As a Nebraska fan I have watched Niles Paul play a lot of football. I was always amazed at the returns he had for touchdowns because he wasn't making a ton of elusive moves he was just getting by the blocks at the right times because he was so fast. As soon as he saw a little daylight he would turn on the afterburners.

Wasn't Niles the guy who caught up easily to Banks during Banks' return for the TD? Or is my approaching senility at work again?

[Reaper 21]

i added a little more to the op, now some retuning tell me what you think.