Recession or Depression: Everything on the table:

[Thiebear]

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I'm not an economist and I haven't played one on t.v., there are hundreds of people just on ES more qualified.

So thats why i started this as I 'Feel' like things are going where i thought they were going.

Mickalino posted in 2008: Will we ever get back?

Social Security is solvent till 2050, 2040, 2030, Social Secuirty is in the black till 2017, 2016, 2010 but only because of a down economy it'll come back by 2015. "Huffington Post" Medicare, Social Security Finances Worsen In Bad Economy May 14, 2011 ... WASHINGTON -- The bad economy is worsening the already-shaky finances of Medicare and Social Security, draining the trust funds supporting ....

Housing: Is at a low amongst lows. And the fuel of the economy just got rained on 'Again'.

'Huffington Post" Housing Market's Prospects Bleak As Foreclosed Property ...

May 23, 2011 ... The ailing housing market remains hampered by the backlog of distressed properties, which is growing larger as banks repossess more homes

Banks: No change and probably worse now than when we started? The Movie Too big to fail just depresses you by the ending. "Huffington Post" Marshall Auerback: The Myth That Banks Are Solvent May 12, 2011 ... Many financial institutions are hopelessly insolvent, holding mountains of toxic waste that will never be worth anything.

Schools: See housing, How can you cut anything else in 2012. And you know they have to.

(This and Fireman should be the new charity). I'll triple up on supplies for my daughters classes.

Teachers should not have to fund their own class at their salary. "Huffington Post" Schools Struggle To Recover Amid Years Of Education Budget Cuts May 25, 2011 ... STOCKTON, Calif. — The financial crisis hitting many of the nation's public schools is taking a heavy toll in cities such as Stockton, ...

Tarp - I railed against this like an 13yr old girl not allowed to go to the mall with her friends. Then i came around a bit while reading things from those of you that know better.

My biggest complaint in 2007-2008 was Congress took off from October though Jan 8th in the Worst fianancial crisis in American History. I know they do this every year, but i've worked a 40hour shift. When emergencies happen you have to be ready.

Shovel Ready:

"Huffington Post" Infrastructure Improvements 'Key To Recovery,' Report Says.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/12/us-infrastructure_n_848013.html

And then we flushed that money into 'easy' stuff and our Bridges are worse now than Ever.

We build roads that will have a toll to get more money while ingoring roads that need repair just for repairs sake.

Jobs: "Huffington Post" Black Unemployment At Depression Level Highs In Some Cities Apr 27, 2011 ... CHARLOTTE, N.C. -- In the decade leading up to the Great Recession, Wanda Nolan grew accustomed to steady progress

"Huffington Post"

U.S. Private Employers Only Added 38000 Jobs Last Month, ADP ...

Jun 1, 2011 ... Private-sector payroll growth slowed sharply in May, coming in far below expectations and falling to the lowest level in eight months

___________________________

I thought we needed 400,000 a month for at least a year to get back even?

I've given President Obama a B+ throughout the time based on what he was given and how he has handled himself. (I'm libertarian lite) I like how he waits 72hours and then wades in, if at all. But this year could undo all previous.

[Thiebear]

posted today: May 2011:

Employers added 54K jobs, rate ticks up to 9.1 pct

Employers added 54,000 jobs in May, fewest in 8 months; unemployment rate rose to 9.1 pct.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Employers-added-54K-jobs-rate-apf-3059717337.html?x=0&.v=5

Were sliding backwards.. quite a few people are saying its because we are having a "Failure to communicate".

also gotta love: Local governments cut 28,000 jobs last month, the most since November. Nearly 18,000 of those jobs were in education.

How is it that Education and Fireman and Police are the only jobs to cut to save money.... Lazy Lazy councils.

[twa]

The labor participation rate and under-employed numbers are really,really bad

I hope for change,meanwhile the number of federal limousines is booming

[ABQCOWBOY]

posted today: May 2011:

Employers added 54K jobs, rate ticks up to 9.1 pct

Employers added 54,000 jobs in May, fewest in 8 months; unemployment rate rose to 9.1 pct.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Employers-added-54K-jobs-rate-apf-3059717337.html?x=0&.v=5

Were sliding backwards.. quite a few people are saying its because we are having a "Failure to communicate".

also gotta love: Local governments cut 28,000 jobs last month, the most since November. Nearly 18,000 of those jobs were in education.

How is it that Education and Fireman and Police are the only jobs to cut to save money.... Lazy Lazy councils.

I don't know if it's accurate or fair for me to paint a scenario that suggest only teachers and Fire Fighters are losing their jobs but I will make a comment and say that I think it's sad, if these figures are true, that all we heard was that the right is trying to put teachers and Fireman out of work yet here we are and who's feeling the axe? We gotta figure out a way to change this thing up and quick. We got no time for anybody who is not willing to work on a solution. We've run all out of that kind of time.

[CrypticVillain]

What kind of recovery are we talking? I ask because I think we will never make a full recovery. I just can't see a way that we do.

[NoVaO]

I guess it's not too surprising. Stimulus has essentially run out. Tax cuts have been off set by high gas prices.

And we're basically heading into austerity mode when the economy needs more, not less stimulus.

States have been firing public workers -- 840,000 in total (or something around that) within the last year. You think the firing of 446,000 people doesn't have an impact on the economy?

That is 840,000 workers now on unemployment.

That is 840,000 workers no longer receiving a pay check.

That is 840,000 customers lost by private sector businesses. And you may be looking at more than 1.5+ million people if you consider the families of these now unemployed workers.

And that is 840,000 more unemployed workers, most of whom are highly educated, now looking for jobs and crowding who people who may be less qualified but unemployed for a much longer period.

There are many more public sector cuts coming as well.

This is not to mention how many public sector employees are getting a pay cut as well, meaning less spending in the private sector.

I advise people to check out what's going on with the U.K.'s economy and how their austerity measures are working out for them. I advise people to read up on history and what happened when FDR cut back on the New Deal programs in 1936-37, which ended up lengthening the Depression. It feels like we're falling into that very same pattern.

The bottom line is people need more money in their pockets. This economy is made up of 70% consumer spending. And wages are being slashed and they're not keeping up with inflation. Compounding the problem is that states are taking away tax credits for the working poor and giving them to big corporations without strings attached. Money is being taken out pockets of people and as a result they are going to spend less money.

I'm not suggesting just giving people money, but the least we could do is come up with a jobs program that will rebuild our crumbling infrastructure.

Rather than ending on such a gloomy note, I still don't feel we are headed for a double dip recession. My hope is that gas prices will eventually lower like they have been recently, we won't have too many more natural disasters the rest of the year, and Japan will stabilize and automakers can pick up production.

[SnyderShrugged]

I voted that we are not, but that is based on an assumption that the establishment pols always remain in power, if the right people were to take key roles in government at all levels, then I think we still have the chance to undo the damage the establishment hacks have done.

It still blows my mind that the sheep in our country continue to vote for people with known histories of following policies that have already proven failed and led us into this mess. Most of our people are pretty dumb.

[deejaydana]

I voted that we are not, but that is based on an assumption that the establishment pols always remain in power, if the right people were to take key roles in government at all levels, then I think we still have the chance to undo the damage the establishment hacks have done.

It still blows my mind that the sheep in our country continue to vote for people with known histories of following policies that have already proven failed and led us into this mess. Most of our people are pretty dumb.

Well, this is a great post and I'm completely in agreement with what you're saying here. I would just love the media (or much of it) to begin to acknowlege that all the crazy money we've printed has a direct correlation to inflated commodity prices and a stifled private sector. I'm not holding my breath on that happening. We simply can't keep printing money.

[RVAbrendan]

If I may be so bold, **** just plain sucks.

I've gotta say though, it's what I'm used and accustomed too. Graduated College in '09 and entered the 'professional' workforce. I've never known anything different. That's the one silver lining in this I suppose!

[War Paint]

http://www.newser.com/story/120144/only-mcdonalds-saved-us-from-losing-jobs.html

Only McDonald's Saved Us From Losing Jobs

(Newser) – Just how lousy were today's unemployment numbers? Employers created a meager 54,000 jobs, way under expectations. Alex Goldmark at Good points out that if not for McDonald's one-day hiring binge of 62,000 jobs, the nation would have had a net loss. "That's what makes today's numbers all the more depressing," he writes. "If it weren't for the country's largest restaurant chain going on a burger flipper binge, the reports wouldn't say 'sharp slowdown' they'd say 'reversal' or 'devastating.'"

So basically if it wasn't for McDonalds, we would have lost jobs completely. McDonalds......

I guess McDonalds went on the hiring spree due to the waivers from Obama care being granted.

[twa]

Rather than ending on such a gloomy note, I still don't feel we are headed for a double dip recession. My hope is that gas prices will eventually lower like they have been recently, we won't have too many more natural disasters the rest of the year, and Japan will stabilize and automakers can pick up production.

I hope you are right,but with QE3 starting up it ain't looking good

I would rant on the foolish stimulus choices,but it's too late now.

[Burgold]

The danger of the stimulus plan was that the stim was supposed to stabilize us and give the economy a shot of adrenaline, a short term boost... it kind of did that. After that, the market was supposed to do its part of the lifting, but that hasn't happened. Despite the low taxes and continuation of the tax cuts record profits aren't trickling down. What's worse, partly because of things out of our control like natural disasters, BP, and gas prices, we're seeing a real inflationary effect on spending. That won't induce businesses to expand their payrolls. More, all the small government types who are getting their wishes with the paring down of state and county governments are suddenly seeing less income because believe it or not government workers actually bought stuff and were consumers. Unemployed government workers won't buy at the same rate.

In other words, we're in a mess. One that will be really difficult to climb out of esp. since no one is really lifting their load... not the government buy creating a realistic budget or economic plan which includes spending cuts, tax increases, and business incentives with strings attached. Not the free market who's been screwing everyone except their shareholders. Not the citizens.

[Thiebear]

I don't think its really that hard to fix this for the 80%.

We just can't shut the 10% on both sides from drowning out the adult conversations.

but it seems like the administration is repeating Japan: Small bump in the roads, nothing to see here.

[Hubbs]

but it seems like the administration is repeating Japan: Small bump in the roads, nothing to see here.

Oh, it's repeating Japan, all right. Just not in the way you're describing.

[twa]

Depressing

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/us-has-create-250k-jobs-month-66-months-return-december-2007-unemployment-end-obamas-second-

It was difficult rerunning this chart with a straight face, make that near impossible, but here are the results. Following the most recent NFP disappointment, the simple math indicates that for the US to return to its December 2007 unemployment, when factoring in the natural growth of the labor force of 90k people a month, the economy will need to add 250k jobs a month for the next 66 months or until the end of Obama's now very implausible second term. Then again, considering what the alternatives are, we can guarantee that the 2012-2016 period in terms of job creation will definitely not look like what is presented on the chart below.

[twa]

Thread needs some humor

qBiZi2WQhZg

ok,enough of that

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/china-has-divested-97-percent-its-holdin

China Has Divested 97 Percent of Its Holdings in U.S. Treasury Bills

[sportjunkie07]

dont think we will get it back anytime soon. probably not at all.

a mixture of bad economics and the culture of the people in this country, bad parenting leading to undisciplined children that are lazy.

the bailout was horrible in my opinion. you just taught our next work force that the govt will take care of you if you run into trouble. there had to have been a better way.

President Obama's work stoppage in the gulf. from a merchant shipping/drilling point of view, that was an absolutely horrible idea and will continue to cost our economy greatly.

we still have a large workforce compared to most countries and we have a lot of niche markets, so we should do better than most countries.

[twa]

we still have a large workforce compared to most countries and we have a lot of niche markets, so we should do better than most countries.

We are blessed here....even in the hard times:cheers:

[Hubbs]

Funny video, twa. And all too true. The European situation is one giant cluster****.

[PeterMP]

I don't think we are headed for a depression. Maybe another recession.

I don't think things are really going to better until we get another big jump in technology that improves effeciency/saves people money like the tech boom did.

And that assumes that the technology starts in the US and not another country.

[twa]

We had a big jump in technology that will enable near energy self sufficiency while adding jobs and taxable infrastructure and keeping more energy dollars in country

[Hubbs]

We had a big jump in technology that will enable near energy self sufficiency while adding jobs and taxable infrastructure and keeping more energy dollars in country

Um... we did? What magical new technology is this?

[mardi gras skin]

Um... we did? What magical new technology is this?

BP chief hails American breakthrough in gas supplies from shale rocks

BP's Tony Hayward tells World Economic Forum of 'game changer' technique to serve world's energy needs

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/jan/28/bp-tony-hayward-gas-shale-rocks

[twa]

Um... we did? What magical new technology is this?

http://www.salon.com/news/env/energy/?story=/politics/war_room/2011/05/31/linbd_fossil_fuels

Everything you've heard about fossil fuels may be wrong

[Thiebear]

This might make us a little better:

A controversial method of extracting gas from shale rocks and coal seams pioneered in the US has been described by the head of BP as a "complete game changer" that would transform the future of energy in that country over the next 100 years.

Excitement in the industry over "unconventional" gas supplies has led to a wave of investment in America which Tony Hayward, BP's chief executive, believes could eventually spread around the world.

"[unconventional gas is a] complete game changer in the US," he said in answer to a question at an energy summit which was part of the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland. "It probably transforms the US energy outlook for the next 100 years. It's yet to seen if it can be applied globally."