LeesburgSkinFan Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 As Audi's prez said "No one is going to pay a $15,000 premium for a car that competes with a Corolla." No wonder these things aren't selling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 How is.it laughable. The technology is in the works. Not too long ago a purely electric car was laughable. Flight used to be laughable. Technology is.constantly evolving and improving. I believe the first purely electric car was made in the 1800's history repeats itself :pfft: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_car#1890s_to_1900s:_Early_history Electric cars found popularity among well-heeled customers who used them as city cars, where their limited range was less of a disadvantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Again: First time in 62 years the United States has become an SELLER of Oil to other countries. I bought a Ford Escape Hybrid due to all the 9yrold and 12yr old stops and waits for 30+minutes (no gas used for that crap now). I'd bet there will be a million of these volts sold in 5 years when they are 20k and you can put 4 people in them. Theres no stopping this now: Every year we are going to improve and every year we are going to gain: Shale/Oil sales to other countries: 700billion (see repeat from last years post). Less import foreign oil: 400 billion Gas cars/Gas export: 400 billion = pays for free healthcare Cities will not look like Seoul Korea and parks will be green. win/win So put out that tire fire in the backyard and do something.. (This is where the President was supposed to say this every month in big letters). We just have to stop all this collusion and theft during the startup (this is where the Justice Dept puts people in jail). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Again: First time in 62 years the United States has become an SELLER of Oil to other countries.I bought a Ford Escape Hybrid due to all the 9yrold and 12yr old stops and waits for 30+minutes (no gas used for that crap now). I'd bet thered be a million of these sold in 5 years when they are 20k and you can put 4 people in them. Every year we are going to improve and every year we are going to gain: Shale/Oil sales to other countries: 700billion (see repeat from last years post). Less import foreign oil: 400 billion Gas cars/Gas export: 400 billion Cities will not look like Seoul Korea and parks will be green. win/win So put out that tire fire in the backyard and do something.. (This is where the President was supposed to say this every month in big letters). You got one of the last Escape Hybrids. The next generation Escape looks nice but will not be a hybrid, Ford is giving the hybrid to some other vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 But apparently straw is. (Or do you get yours subsidized?) What's that, the fourth post in a row where you've opened by refuting something that wasn't said in the first place, and then a smiley? No but in my lifetime I know MPG should be better than what I could buy in the 70's. But if you think we are progressing, then I guys I'll keep bailing straw. ---------- Post added December-22nd-2011 at 09:21 AM ---------- You got one of the last Escape Hybrids. The next generation Escape looks nice but will not be a hybrid, Ford is giving the hybrid to some other vehicle. Not only that, but price out an escape hybrid versus a comparable escape. You need a lot of gas savings.... Now if your sole purpose of buying is just to feel like you are reducing need for foreign oil....most people actually want to save money. Paying a premium for a hybrid will take you years to recoup in gas $$$ ---------- Post added December-22nd-2011 at 09:24 AM ---------- You got one of the last Escape Hybrids. The next generation Escape looks nice but will not be a hybrid, Ford is giving the hybrid to some other vehicle. Not only that, but price out an escape hybrid versus a comparable escape. You need a lot of gas savings.... Now if your sole purpose of buying is just to feel like you are reducing need for foreign oil....most people actually want to save money. Paying a premium for a hybrid will take you years to recoup in gas $$$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 I just want to point out the average fuel effeicency of cars HAS INCREASED since the 1970s: http://www.wri.org/publication/content/10333 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 I just want to point out the average fuel effeicency of cars HAS INCREASED since the 1970s:http://www.wri.org/publication/content/10333 True, point being if I could get 50 MPG in the late 70's, why don't we have a superior vehicle today. Of course across the board, the MPG has improved. All we drove was gas guzzlers. (Of course we still have the soccer mom SUV revolution). In any event. I could get 50 mpg in 78. Technology should have brought us much further along than we are 30+ years later. But you know why we havent advanced? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frostyj Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 You got one of the last Escape Hybrids. The next generation Escape looks nice but will not be a hybrid, Ford is giving the hybrid to some other vehicle. Ford's eco-boost engines will be giving the Escape better milage than the hybrid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 T-bear IF you can get the price down on the Volt ect to 20k w/o massive subsidies it certainly would be a game changer Of course so would cost effective solar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenspandan Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 True, point being if I could get 50 MPG in the late 70's, why don't we have a superior vehicle today.Of course across the board, the MPG has improved. All we drove was gas guzzlers. (Of course we still have the soccer mom SUV revolution). cars today are inarguably cleaner, safer, and more fuel efficient than they were back then, and for every Buick LeBehemoth we drove back then, there is at least one soccer mom in an SUV today, so the fact that we drove big sedans is not a factor. In any event. I could get 50 mpg in 78. Technology should have brought us much further along than we are 30+ years later. But you know why we havent advanced? we've advanced tremendously. it takes a disingenuously narrow filter to pretend we haven't. you know perfectly well whatever 70s car you're talking about wouldn't have a chance in hell of meeting modern standards for safety or emissions, or meet consumer expectations for horsepower, reliability, or "luxuries" such as, say, air conditioning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 True, point being if I could get 50 MPG in the late 70's, why don't we have a superior vehicle today.Of course across the board, the MPG has improved. All we drove was gas guzzlers. (Of course we still have the soccer mom SUV revolution). In any event. I could get 50 mpg in 78. Technology should have brought us much further along than we are 30+ years later. But you know why we havent advanced? 1. The calculations have changed so the numbers you see today are more realistic of real driving and so a comparable car does not look as good as it did in 1978. A car that the EPA told you was getting 50 MPG in 78 would not give you 50 MPG on the tests today. With that real world driving conditions have also decreased. Our infrastructure hasn't really kept up with increases in the numbers of people on the roads. 2. Savings in terms of fuel effeciency have been offset with environmental and safety regulations that put more material in the car and negatively affect fuel effeciency. (There are some diesels in Euproe that will get 80 MPG, but they don't meet our environomental standards.) 3. People simply don't pay for fuel effecient cars. People will pay more for a high performance car then they will a high fuel effecient car so the high fuel effecient cars don't get the cutting edge technology. 4. People want bigger more powerful cars. http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/news/fuel-economy/3374271 The corrected gas mileage on a 1978 Honda Civic would be about ~40 MPG highway, it was 147 inches long, and 60 HP. The 2012 Honda Civic gets you about 40 MPG highway, but it is 177.3 inches long and 140 HP. http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/bymodel/2012_Honda_Civic.shtml http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_Civic_(first_generation) Today you are getting a bigger, more powerful, safer, and lower emissions vehicle w/o really losing a single bit on the gas mileage. That's technology. There isn't a lot of demand out there for a 60 HP and 147 inch long car, and given the low demand, there is no demand at the costs of actually making a 60 HP 147 inch long car. **EDIT** 63 MPG from a car in Japan, and that's through the whole test cycle not just highway: http://www.autoevolution.com/news/daihatsu-move-is-japan-s-fuel-economy-leader-28193.html http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2010/12/daihatsu-launches-new-move-claims-title.html It is 133.6 inches long and 52 HP. They actually exported the first generation to Europe, but it sold poorly and didn't bother to export other generations, much less send it to the US at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 http://www.mpgomatic.com/2007/10/08/super-cheap-high-mpg-cars-1978-1981/ . Super Cheap High MPG Cars: 1978-1981 cheap, diesel, dodge, ford, gas mileage, gm, honda, mazda, nissan, toyota, vw Looking for a car that gets crazy great gas mileage but don’t want to spend a lot of cash? This list of knucklebusting (can we call them classic?) small cars from 1978 through 1981 haul down some impressive gas mileage figures and can be had for chump change … if you’re handy. It’s not just that they’re cheap … these cars are past the magic 25 year point that may actually make them qualify as antique cars, dependent on state regulations. While the thought of a rusty old Dodge Omni or Plymouth Horizon with historic plates might lead to hysterics, the owner can take solace in those remarkably high gas mileage figures. The possibilities run from wannabe exotics to the work-a-day. Imagine finding a Dodge De Tomaso, under a tarp in a barn … only to realize that it’s not only "the Italian sports car from Detroit," it’s worthy of a 50 mile per gallon highway rating. Need to haul around some stuff? How about a 1980 Chevy Luv pickup truck that pulls down 53 miles per gallon on the highway? Fuel Efficient 1978-1981 Cars Year Manufacturer Model Engine Disp Trans City Highway 1981 DODGE OMNI 4 M4 30 50 1981 PLYMOUTH HORIZON 4 M4 30 50 1981 DODGE 024/DE TOMASO 4 M4 30 50 1981 PLYMOUTH TC3/TURISMO 4 M4 30 50 1981 FORD ESCORT 4 1.6 M4 28 44 1981 LINCOLN-MERCURY LYNX 4 1.6 M4 28 44 1981 FORD ESCORT WAGON 4 1.6 M4 27 42 1981 LINCOLN-MERCURY LYNX WAGON 4 1.6 M4 27 42 1981 HONDA CIVIC 4 1.3 M4 32 40 1981 HONDA CIVIC 4 1.3 M5 31 41 1981 HONDA CIVIC 4 1.5 M5 32 42 1981 HONDA CIVIC WAGON 4 1.5 M5 30 40 1981 ISUZU I-MARK 4 M5 27 40 1981 ISUZU I-MARK 4 M4 41 51 1981 ISUZU I-MARK 4 M5 37 49 1981 DATSUN 210 4 M5 31 44 1981 DATSUN 210 WAGON 4 M5 31 44 1981 B11 WAGON 310 4 M4 30 41 1981 B11 WAGON 310 4 M5 28 40 1981 B11 WAGON 510 4 M5 29 40 1981 RENAULT LE CAR 4 1.4 M4 29 40 1981 DODGE COLT 4 M4 34 45 1981 DODGE COLT 4 D4 32 41 1981 PLYMOUTH CHAMP 4 M4 34 45 1981 PLYMOUTH CHAMP 4 D4 32 41 1981 DODGE COLT 4 D4 31 41 1981 PLYMOUTH CHAMP 4 D4 31 41 1981 MAZDA GLC 4 1.5 M4 35 43 1981 MAZDA GLC 4 1.5 M5 35 45 1981 MAZDA GLC WAGON 4 1.5 M4 31 41 1981 MAZDA GLC WAGON 4 1.5 M5 31 43 1981 TOYOTA STARLET 4 M5 36 50 1981 TOYOTA COROLLA TERCEL 4 M4 36 48 1981 TOYOTA COROLLA TERCEL 4 M5 33 45 1981 VOLKSWAGEN RABBIT 4 M4 28 42 1981 VOLKSWAGEN RABBIT 4 M5 25 40 1981 VOLKSWAGEN SCIROCCO 4 M5 25 40 1981 VOLKSWAGEN JETTA 4 M5 25 40 1981 VOLKSWAGEN RABBIT 4 M4 40 54 1981 VOLKSWAGEN RABBIT 4 M5 38 56 1981 VOLKSWAGEN JETTA 4 M5 41 57 1981 VOLKSWAGEN DASHER 4 M4 36 48 1981 VOLKSWAGEN DASHER WAGON 4 M4 36 48 1981 DATSUN PICKUP 2WD 4 M4 37 47 1981 DATSUN PICKUP 2WD 4 M5 38 51 1981 AUDI 4000 4 M5 26 41 1981 SUBARU SUBARU 4 1.6 M4 32 43 1981 SUBARU SUBARU 4 1.6 M5 32 44 1981 SUBARU SUBARU 4 1.8 M5 28 40 1980 HONDA CIVIC 4 1.5 M4 32 41 1980 HONDA CIVIC 4 1.5 M5 32 45 1980 HONDA CIVIC 4 1.5 M4 32 41 1980 HONDA CIVIC 4 1.5 M5 32 45 1980 DATSUN 210 4 M5 29 41 1980 DATSUN 210 WAGON 4 M5 29 41 1980 DATSUN 310 4 M5 29 41 1980 DATSUN 510 4 M5 30 42 1980 DODGE COLT 4 D4 31 43 1980 PLYMOUTH CHAMP 4 D4 31 43 1980 DODGE COLT 4 D4 31 41 1980 PLYMOUTH ARROW 4 M5 27 40 1980 PLYMOUTH CHAMP 4 D4 31 41 1980 MAZDA GLC 4 1.4 M5 30 42 1980 MAZDA GLC WAGON 4 1.4 M5 30 42 1980 TOYOTA COROLLA TERCEL 4 M4 30 41 1980 TOYOTA COROLLA TERCEL 4 M5 30 42 1980 VOLKSWAGEN RABBIT 4 M4 40 52 1980 VOLKSWAGEN RABBIT 4 M5 42 56 1980 VOLKSWAGEN DASHER 4 M4 36 49 1980 VOLKSWAGEN DASHER WAGON 4 M4 36 49 1980 VOLKSWAGEN RABBIT 4 M5 26 40 1980 VOLKSWAGEN SCIROCCO 4 M5 26 40 1980 VOLKSWAGEN JETTA 4 M5 26 40 1980 DATSUN PICKUP 2WD 4 M4 39 48 1980 CHEVROLET LUV PICKUP 2WD 4 M5 40 53 1979 FORD FIESTA 4 1.6 M4 26 40 1979 HONDA CIVIC 4 1.5 M5 28 41 1979 DATSUN 210 4 M5 27 41 1979 DATSUN 310 4 M5 27 40 1979 DODGE COLT HATCH 4 D4 32 43 1979 DODGE COLT HATCH 4 M4 32 42 1979 MIRADA CHAMP 4 D4 32 43 1979 MIRADA CHAMP 4 M4 32 42 1979 DODGE COLT HATCH 4 D4 30 42 1979 MIRADA CHAMP 4 D4 30 42 1979 MAZDA GLC 4 M4 30 40 1979 MAZDA GLC 4 M5 30 42 1979 MAZDA GLC WAGON 4 M5 29 41 1979 VOLKSWAGEN RABBIT 4 M4 40 50 1979 VOLKSWAGEN RABBIT 4 M5 41 55 1979 VOLKSWAGEN DASHER 4 M4 36 46 1979 VOLKSWAGEN DASHER WAGON 4 M4 36 46 1979 VOLKSWAGEN RABBIT 4 M5 24 42 1979 VOLKSWAGEN SCIROCCO 4 M5 25 41 1978 FORD FIESTA 4 1.6 30 43 1978 CIVIC CIVIC 4 34 43 1978 ACCORD ACCORD 4 35 45 1978 CIVIC CIVIC 4 33 41 1978 ACCORD ACCORD 4 31 42 1978 DATSUN B-210 4 1.4 29 40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oisn1 Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 The Rabbit could run with more than one person in the car. You think the "smart" car is safer than a rabbit Sorry but when I read that a car build in 1978 is safer than a car build in 2011, it makes me think that the poster doesn't have a clue about what he's talking about. That's just stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Sorry but when I read that a car build in 1978 is safer than a car build in 2011, it makes me think that the poster doesn't have a clue about what he's talking about. That's just stupid. It was obviously safer for a carseat in the front seat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NavyDave Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Sorry but when I read that a car build in 1978 is safer than a car build in 2011, it makes me think that the poster doesn't have a clue about what he's talking about. That's just stupid. In 1978 There was not any sexting or texting while driving back then, so car safety issues were due to big hair or jerri-curl juice getting in the eyes of the driver, and moms having to reach back further in the rear to smack mouthy kids upside the head while driving because cars had more space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiebear Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 They hybrids are 30%? safer due to the batteries adding weight. In 78 we hung out the back of a pickup truck and sat on leather bench seats with no belts in sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 In any event. I could get 50 mpg in 78. Actually, no, you couldn't. You see, back then, the EPA estimates were notoriously inflated. (That's where we get the phrase "Your mileage may vary", as a slogan for "the claims that I'm making will not show up in the real world".) The EPA estimates were a pretty good way for a customer to compare one 70s car, against another 70s car. But over the decades, the way the EPA calculates those ratings has been changed, several times. And it's been changed for the specific purpose of making the ratings lower. (Because people were complaining that the ratings didn't match reality.) Technology should have brought us much further along than we are 30+ years later. Agreed. But you know why we havent advanced? Because every time we try to advance, people who don't want us to advance show up with a bunch of made up claims and bombastic cries of the end of society, and try to prevent advances? Just a theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 You got one of the last Escape Hybrids. The next generation Escape looks nice but will not be a hybrid, Ford is giving the hybrid to some other vehicle. You like the new one? Looks like an inflated Focus to me. 2012 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 I think that goofball rear window looks like my brother's goofball-looking Pontiac Vibe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.