zoony Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 I could see lots of people going for the lease. With a lease, you're certain that you're not going to get stuck with a betamax. GM takes that risk. Not only that- you get to dump the battery before its usable life expires. Which I'm guessing is right around 5 years. I'm told the reason the lease is so attractive is because the leasing company gets to pocket the gov't tax credit. They are going to lease a ton of these Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Always A Commander Never A Captain Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 I like how people are focusing on if this is actually a real car or something to make the treehuggers sleep better at night and feel smug. If I were to buy (let's be real...lease, I can't afford to ) this car, it would be to save money on gas and reduce dependency on foreign oil. The environment is a side effect that'll happen decades later, and it's not something that would influence my spending money. The major plus to a car like this, is a power/energy revolution. There was the industrial revolution which sparked a new age. For all intents and purposes there was a gasoline age. And now I hope that with a car that can run without gasoline being the primary source for power, I hope that our mindsets can change. Cause right now we're stubborn about what we have, we've been using the same fuel sources for a century and longer. Coal, gasoline, whatever. With a change of use from gasoline to something new in our everyday lives, I hope this spurs a new age of thinking as we accept and cherish this type of change with all forms of power. Is that idealistic? Yes. But I also realize that this type of change wouldn't happen for a long time, yet it will make the world a more interesting place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 We need some more of you Greens to step up to lower the subsidy costs per unit http://reason.com/blog/2011/12/21/congratulations-taxpayers-chevy-volt-is Congratulations Taxpayers, Chevy Volt is the Most Government-Supported Car at Up To $250k in Subsidies Per Vehicle Sold James Hohman of the Mackinac Center for Public Policy has calculated that the total subsidies—direct and indirect, federal and state—poured into this white elephant could add up to $3 billion or $250,000 for every Volt sold to date. And this is not counting the 26 percent ownership that Uncle Sam still has in the company. http://www.motortrend.com/cars/2012/chevrolet/volt/leasing/ Step right up ladies and gents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 We need some more of you Greens to step up to lower the subsidy costs per unithttp://reason.com/blog/2011/12/21/congratulations-taxpayers-chevy-volt-is Congratulations Taxpayers, Chevy Volt is the Most Government-Supported Car at Up To $250k in Subsidies Per Vehicle Sold James Hohman of the Mackinac Center for Public Policy has calculated that the total subsidies—direct and indirect, federal and state—poured into this white elephant could add up to $3 billion or $250,000 for every Volt sold to date. And this is not counting the 26 percent ownership that Uncle Sam still has in the company. http://www.motortrend.com/cars/2012/chevrolet/volt/leasing/ Step right up ladies and gents To think I once owned a Chevy Sprint. http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/news/fuel-economy/epa-fuel-efficient-cars-chevy-sprint And people buying these cars think they are doing something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IONTOP Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 ^ So you're saying I can get a $300,000 car for $31k? That's a deal right there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 I'm very happy with the government backing that project. In fact I think they should increase it by switching government vehicles that I never fail to see idling to electric or hybrid tech where possible. I have no problem with the US backing innovation. The majority of oil is spent in transportation and the volt is a scalable platform to bridge the gap between where we are now on battery tech and where it needs to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 I'm very happy with the government backing that project. In fact I think they should increase it by switching government vehicles that I never fail to see idling to electric or hybrid tech where possible. I have no problem with e US backing innovation. The majority of oil is spent in transportation and the volt is a scalable platform to bridge the gap between where we are now on battery tech and where it needs to be. See my previous post. What a joke. The technology has been there for years. It's not just about a 3 cylinder engine. Y'all driving those smart cars with SMART on your license plate, you know who you are. Not to mention the VW diesel from the 70's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Wow, look. Twa hs found a study, where someone totaled up every single thing hat they can possibly call a subsidy, ("direct and indirect", to me, sounds like "everything I can possibly create a linkage to"), every "subsidy" that I can find or that I think might someday happen, and if you then divide all of that among just the minuscule numbers of cars that have been sold, even though it's just barely on the market, so far, then you get A REALLY BIG NUMBER. That really makes me think that the rest of his analysis is trustworthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twa Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Shut up and buy one...we need the stimulus jr it's a steal at this price Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 See my previous post.What a joke. The technology has been there for years. It's not just about a 3 cylinder engine. Y'all driving those smart cars with SMART on your license plate, you know who you are. Not to mention the VW diesel from the 70's Am I supposed to take someone talking about 3 cylinder engines seriously? How far did any of those cars drive s day without using gas at all and who is talking out a smart car? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stophovr6 Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Here in Seattle i see a leaf a day on the roads. I've only seen one Volt. Also the city gov bought about 20 leafs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Wow, look. Twa hs found a study, where someone totaled up every single thing hat they can possibly call a subsidy, ("direct and indirect", to me, sounds like "everything I can possibly create a linkage to"), every "subsidy" that I can find or that I think might someday happen, and if you then divide all of that among just the minuscule numbers of cars that have been sold, even though it's just barely on the market, so far, then you get A REALLY BIG NUMBER. That really makes me think that the rest of his analysis is trustworthy. Yep, history proves otherwise ---------- Post added December-22nd-2011 at 12:40 AM ---------- Am I supposed to take someone talking about 3 cylinder engines seriously? How far did any of those cars drive s day without using gas at all and who is talking out a smart car? They used less gas than a volt Please. And I gave the Volkswagen Rabbit as an example. Our "smart cars" aren't so smart. Gas mileage/fuel consumption is a joke perpetrated by lobbyists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 They used less gas than a volt Please. And I gave the Volkswagen Rabbit as an example. Our "smart cars" aren't so smart. Gas mileage/fuel consumption is a joke perpetrated by lobbyists. the volt platform can drive a certain distance with no gas per day. It can also drive any distance by making use of a generator that powers the electric motor if needed. None of those old ton cans could do that. As battery tech improves the volt design can scale with it. But yeah other than that it's like totally the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 the volt platform can drive a certain distance with no gas per day. It can also drive any distance by making use of a generator that powers the electric motor if needed. None of those old ton cans could do that. As battery tech improves the volt design can scale with it. But yeah other than that it's like totally the same thing. Yeah and battery power is free You can defend the nonsense, but don't believe it in your heart. Our MPG has decreased significantly since the 70's...but OK. I guess oil is the bad guy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slateman Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Yep, history proves otherwise ---------- Post added December-22nd-2011 at 12:40 AM ---------- They used less gas than a volt Please. And I gave the Volkswagen Rabbit as an example. Our "smart cars" aren't so smart. Gas mileage/fuel consumption is a joke perpetrated by lobbyists. You wanna show something to back that up? My brother in law has filled his.car up twice since buying a Volt in May. And it gets driven every day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 You wanna show something to back that up? My brother in law has filled his.car up twice since buying a Volt in May. And it gets driven every day. You mean that the average volt owner can survive only on electric power Or that lobbyists are a problem and we could have better MPG in cars today that in the late 70's Why doesn't your brother in law buy a golf cart since his trips are so short Regardless, what is his cost per mile as compared to a 70's VW rabbit? Got something to back that up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Yeah and battery power is free You can defend the nonsense, but don't believe it in your heart. Our MPG has decreased significantly since the 70's...but OK. I guess oil is the bad guy Has anyone claimed battery power is free? The differences have already been explained to you but maybe you just love the 70s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Has anyone claimed battery power is free? The differences have already been explained to you but maybe you just love the 70s. No but explain to me your cost per mile and not just try to make cheap shots, thanks.... The real issue is (in my mind) is whether todays electric cars are advancing us. If lobbyists cause our fuel consumption to rise, and our MPG to decrease...well then maybe electric cars are advancing us But if you are spending more money for a car and electric, well maybe it's a bad move Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 No but explain to me your cost per mile and not just try to make cheap shots, thanks....The real issue is (in my mind) is whether todays electric cars are advancing us. If lobbyists cause our fuel consumption to rise, and our MPG to decrease...well then maybe electric cars are advancing us But if you are spending more money for a car and electric, well maybe it's a bad move So your position is that lobbyist are making oil consumption to rise... To sell us electric cars. Ok then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 So your position is that lobbyist are making oil consumption to rise... To sell us electric cars. Ok then... Nice that you have no response. Truth is we had better MPG in the 70's, now you are pimpin an electric gas car with government backing that gets 1/3rd less mileage than a car in 78. OK. Argue to win, not just admit the obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slateman Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 You mean that the average volt owner can survive only on electric power Or that lobbyists are a problem and we could have better MPG in cars today that in the late 70's Why doesn't your brother in law buy a golf cart since his trips are so short Regardless, what is his cost per mile as compared to a 70's VW rabbit? Got something to back that up? Yes, theoretically, you can survive on just battery power in the Volt. I have no idea what conspiracy theory you're spouting about lobbyists. However, cars have changed a lot since the 70s. For one, they're a lot cleaner. But more importantly, they're heavier than a 58 mpg Diesel Rabbit. Mainly due to safety innovations, but also because people decided they wanted to be able to.drive with more than one other person in the car. Also, the Rabbit's engine left much to be desired. The trips aren't short. It.goes.from Fairfax to Maryland every school day. No idea what cost per mile is. Maintenance is free. Rest assured, it would not be free on a 78 Rabbit. He hasn't noticed any real increase in his.power bill, but the man has a theater in his home and.runs his.own business out of it as well. The bottom line is that this is a huge technological improvement. It's only a matter of.time before quick.charging stations pop up all over the country. Before the technology is improved and you will recharge once a week instead of every day. And it will do it by itself in your garage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Yes, theoretically, you can survive on just battery power in the Volt. Yes theoretically. You should have bought one already since it is so perfect. I have no idea what conspiracy theory you're spouting about lobbyists. However, cars have changed a lot since the 70s. For one, they're a lot cleaner. But more importantly, they're heavier than a 58 mpg Diesel Rabbit. Mainly due to safety innovations, but also because people decided they wanted to be able to.drive with more than one other person in the car. Also, the Rabbit's engine left much to be desired. The Rabbit could run with more than one person in the car. You think the "smart" car is safer than a rabbit The trips aren't short. It.goes.from Fairfax to Maryland every school day. The mileage it can drive is documented. Don't toss out nonsense. No idea what cost per mile is. Maintenance is free. Rest assured, it would not be free on a 78 Rabbit. He hasn't noticed any real increase in his.power bill, but the man has a theater in his home and.runs his.own business out of it as well. Maintenance is free???? Seriously, lets be honest. What's a home theater have to do with Adam? Really??? You are just making laughable statements. The bottom line is that this is a huge technological improvement. It's only a matter of.time before quick.charging stations pop up all over the country. Before the technology is improved and you will recharge once a week instead of every day. And it will do it by itself in your garage. OK, let me know when this happens. This is laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slateman Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 It's proven safer. Nice try though It's.not nonsense. His wife is the driver. The school she teaches at is in Maryland. Maintenance is free for my BiL. What I'm saying is that he hasn't noticed an appreciable increase in his electric bill. I'm sure if he actually broke them down he would, but there would be so many variables it would be extremely difficult to.figure out. How is.it laughable. The technology is in the works. Not too long ago a purely electric car was laughable. Flight used to be laughable. Technology is.constantly evolving and improving. You say I sound laughable, but do you listen to yourself? If you want the gas mileage, go find yourself a 78 Rabbit/Golf and enjoy. They're still around and the engines at least, are fairly reliable. If you're going to use it as a commuter car, I recommend the 4 speed. It has a little more.pick up, but it.tops out at around 60. Avoid the automatically like the plague. European cars from before the 90s and auto.transmissions do not mix well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosher Ham Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 This is a good one to watch for all types of reasons. Hmm... Some interesting points made, and some really silly ones at this point. I will wait it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 Yeah and battery power is free But apparently straw is. (Or do you get yours subsidized?) What's that, the fourth post in a row where you've opened by refuting something that wasn't said in the first place, and then a smiley? ---------- Slate, I think a lot of people would really enjoy getting some real world data from a real world user of this technology. (I suspect that some are beyond getting help from the real world, but they're a minority.) Any chance of getting some more actual data from your BiL? How far is the commute, one way? Does she recharge the car at school, so the batteries only have to get the car one way? Or does she use batteries for the round trip? Maybe a "long term gas mileage" would help. Total miles driven since the car was bought, and total amount of gas used. I suspect that there's a large audience that would love to hear real world information about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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