SkinsFTW Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 A new head coach or someone who will call a pass play on first and goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cahones01 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 How about spreading the defense out a little? Instead of a 2 tight end set where we run left EVERY SINGLE TIME, how about going 3 or 4 WR sets with our big guys out there. Then you've got the defense opened up and you can either look for one of those targets or do a designed QB draw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 5 Receiver set. Do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackBush Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Throw the fade! Throw the fade!!! It repeats... +1 /There is only one answer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buenosdiaz Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 fade! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavarisgone Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 How about Devin Thomas and Mike Sellers just catch two touchdown passes today, problem solved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schizlor Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Two Words: FADE ROUTE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annonymous Source Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 I think that so far this thread nobody has really answered your question. The first step as to improving Red Zone Efficency is to eliminate the things that are being done wrong. In my opinion they are as follows. 1) Calling trick plays- The occasional trick play is a great way to keep the other team guessing, but when you are in a first and goal situation you need to think that the offense is good enough to get the score without gimmicks. The gimmicks reduce the confidence of the offense in the overall gameplan and thus actually make it less likely to score. 2) Mix personnel packages. When they were running the ball they had 2 TE a FB and a HB on the field. This leaves less options for the defense to account for outside. On the flip side, when we were passing it was always out of 3 and 4 WR sets. This leads to obvious predictability. Predictability gets you destroyed. 3) Mix up playcalling. This is somewhat related to the post above. In goalline scenarios the defense is almost always expecting Run-Run-Pass. The simple fact of the matter is that it is just as easy to score a TD by passing as it is by running (if not easier). I would love to see Pass-Pass-Pass just one time. 4) Eliminate pass plays that are not throws to the Endzone. Everyone always talks about throwing passes short of the first down marker, but in the Red Zone this is even more pronounced. If it is first and goal from the 7 and you throw a 5 yard pass then you still need to make another good play at some point to get the TD. If you throw it to the End Zone 3 times then all you need is a 33% success rate in order to get the TD. This means eliminating plays like the screen to Moss from the Red Zone Playbook. 5) Do not waste plays. This again correlates to the post above. From the start of the set of downs the coaching staff needs to know how they are planning to score. If it is first and goal from the 2 the plan may be to run the ball in whereas if it is first and goal from the 8 the plan should probably be to pass the ball in. If the goal is to pass the ball for a TD then dont waste downs running the ball for 2 yards, If the goal is to run the ball then dont waste downs on trick plays. Those are the things that need to be fixed right now in my opinion. I wanted to start my own thread on this, but then I saw your post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Springfield Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 I wanted to start my own thread on this, but then I saw your post. Great points and I agree 100%. Makes every bit of sense in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoskins Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Everyone's talking about the fade, but I'm not sure our QB can throw that pass. In the preseason, Zorn DID call a few fades. And it worked with our other quarterbacks. But it just looked ugly as hell with #17 trying to throw it. Watch the Patriots preseason game again for instance. I've never seen Jason have the touch that it requires to make that throw. But, having said that, there are lots of other passes he can throw and has thrown in the endzone before. We just seem to prefer to take our shots down there with our RB throwing it or our punter rushing it. It's cuter that way I suppose. I mean, come on, you line up with 1 wideout on a 3rd and 5 and you expect to fool an NFL defensive coordinator with that? Zorn sometimes seems to forget he's going up against people who have actual NFL coordinator experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RIPSean Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 I'd throw more on every down and get guys like Mitchell, Kelly, and Cooley on the field. Today the running game was very predictable in the red zone and everyone knew we were going to try to ride the strength of the left side of the line and avoid the weakness created by Randy Thomas going down. Instead of pounding to the left, I'd take a shot at some point to one of the big receivers I mentioned. Mitchell has not been properly utilized. Why not throw him a fade route and at least put the ball in play in the endzone? Something like Trips right with Kelly, Mitchell, and Cooley could be effective. The playcalling was a weakness today. Dropped passes or not, Zorn was more predictable and conservative than Gibbs ever got. If it continues, he's gone. Plain and simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AceSkinsFan Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Want to know how to fix it? How about we catch the ball? If Devin Thomas and Mike Sellers catch those balls, we probably wouldn't even be having this conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 We all have pretty much seen that we can apparently get the ball down the field and into the Red Zone. The problem of course is getting into the end zone. If you have seen a particular play that you think would work here, what is it? What about you guys? 1st Zorn has to call more passes in the RZ especially inside the 10 yard line with goal to go. Zorn just needs to go back to the successful RZ and goalline calls from last year. Week 1:13 yard line Formatinon Singleback 3 Wide Moss TD on a drag route from the slot http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d80aa2433/Santana-Moss-Highlight-WK-01-vs-Giants-2008 Week 3: 3 yard line I-Form Big Double TE(no WRs) PA back shoulder to Yoder TD http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d80b06aab/Jason-Campbell-Highlight-WK-03-vs-Cardinals-2008 Week 4: 5 yard line Singleback Double TE stack right, Twin WRs left Z(Thrash) motions from the slot across the formation from L-->R runs a shallow out/drag Campbell does a sprint out to the right and hits Thrash on the quick out http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d80b38e7f/Jason-Campbell-Highlight-WK-04-vs-Cowboys-2008 Week 4: 3 yard line Singleback 3 Wide All Slants; TE Cooley stay in to block; Campbell hits ARE on a semi- scramble for a TD http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d80b38d55/Jason-Campbell-Highlight-WK-04-vs-Cowboys-2008 Week 7: 19 yard line Singleback Same plays as the 1st one Moss slot drag TD http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d80bc988d/Jason-Campbell-Highlight-WK-07-vs-Browns-2008 Week 11: 4 yard line Singleback Double TE stacks both side(Sellars motioned from FB to TE) PA to Portis Sellars on the flare out/drag route TD http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d80c90874/Jason-Campbell-Highlight-WK-11-vs-Cowboys-2008 Week 12: 9 yard line Shotgun 4 wide+TE ARE slant/10 yard dig or in route http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d80cc2abf/Antwaan-Randle-El-Highlight-WK-12-vs-Seahawks-2008 Week 14: Singleback/brunch 3 WRs tight left, TE lines up like a WR Kelly goes in motion and Campbell hits ARE on quick hitch http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d80d2527f/Jason-Campbell-Highlight-WK-14-vs-Ravens-2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoskins Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Want to know how to fix it? How about we catch the ball? If Devin Thomas and Mike Sellers catch those balls, we probably wouldn't even be having this conversation. Have you ever watched an NFL game where there weren't a couple of drops here and there? That's part of the game that every team has to deal with. We're the only team saying "hey, if we had absolutely 100% perfection from our receivers, zero drops we might have scored double digit points!" Meanwhile other teams are hanging 30+ even with their drops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead36 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 I was watching highlights of the Steelers-Bears game, and the Bears did something that I always thought highly of in the red zone. Instead of stacking 9 guys and going jumbo, they spread the Steelers out with 4-5 receivers. Yeah the Steelers blitzed and it always resulted in an open defender taking a shot at Cutler but it also created 1 on 1 matchups that resulted in a TD because Cutler was able to get it out quick. I think we need to try something similar and utilize the speed and depth we have at receiver. Obviously the key is JC getting the ball out QUICK as thats not his strong suit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoskins Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 ...but it also created 1 on 1 matchups that resulted in a TD because Cutler was able to get it out quick. Yeah, any plan that requires a quick release from our QB probably isn't going to work too often. Or anything that requires loft and touch from our QB. Or anything that requires our O-line to get a big push off the LoS. So as much as we criticize Zorn, I guess we also have to realize he's working with some serious limitations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
txkid Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Bring in Bob Schnelker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WorldBFree76 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Everyone's talking about the fade, but I'm not sure our QB can throw that pass.In the preseason, Zorn DID call a few fades. And it worked with our other quarterbacks. But it just looked ugly as hell with #17 trying to throw it. Watch the Patriots preseason game again for instance. I've never seen Jason have the touch that it requires to make that throw. But, having said that, there are lots of other passes he can throw and has thrown in the endzone before. We just seem to prefer to take our shots down there with our RB throwing it or our punter rushing it. It's cuter that way I suppose. I mean, come on, you line up with 1 wideout on a 3rd and 5 and you expect to fool an NFL defensive coordinator with that? Zorn sometimes seems to forget he's going up against people who have actual NFL coordinator experience. If an NFL QB cannot throw a 5 yard fade, something is terribly wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoskins Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 If an NFL QB cannot throw a 5 yard fade, something is terribly wrong. Well, we all saw him try it twice against the Patriots this year. We saw a couple really ugly tries last year, too, in games. And I've seen him try several in training camp over the past few years. He looks very awkward doing it and usually gets no height on it and doesn't seem to know how to time the thing. Todd, Colt, and Chase all seemed to have a much easier time with it in both camp practices I went to this year. Even Devine last year, too. I agree most NFL QBs can make that throw. Bulger threw one today that looked effortless. I'm just not convinced our QB can do that. And I think that's why we don't see Zorn calling it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AzSkinsFan63 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 If you suck scoring inside the red zone how about trying to score the TD once ina while when your outside the red zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkinsFTW Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 How about Devin Thomas and Mike Sellers just catch two touchdown passes today, problem solved. Or how about benching these guys when they **** up? Try again next week. Marko Mitchell can play, Fred Davis can get some practice at FB against a crapola defense. Keep doing that and maybe we get people who deserve to be in the game. Kinda Parcells like, I know, but it works, works for Belichick as well, Schottenheimer, Cowher, Gruden, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedevilhimself Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 I really think we do need to start making some of these Gibbs players accountable . Mixing it up with Davis at FB could be a good idea the RZ offense should have tall receivers in the game ... Mitchell and Kelly can play ... of course for that to work you have to have your QB throw the ball. I really hate the idea of the Portis option down there ... ARE has some skills at QB but even then I think the Redzone if you are going to throw make sure it is the QB who has the ball in his hands . We have seen it going wrong in Miami and in Philly and hopefully the Wildcat is dead ... On the other hand if you really want to run it inside the 5 and be that obvious switch to a heavy set on the OL . Hell put Mike Williams out there throw Haynesworth or Montgomery on the line or as a lead blocker .Practice that very situation with a specialist group . If Mike Sellars is your bruising FB then use him as such, if Mason made the team beacause he can make those hard yards put him in there ...seriously get creative ... don't modify an offense that seems to have few problems between the 20's ...run an entirlty specialist unit or units in the redzone ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
str8jacket Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 Mix it up more. Don't do what they expect us to do. Maybe a shotgun with a big wr set, Mitchell, Kelly, Davis all out there at the same time. Qb bootlegs, I saw Roethlisberger do one today. They do work if u sell it correctly. 2 tight ends, just mix it up. Keep them guessing, bring in a linebacker or a d lineman as a elgible receiver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuddyLeeGhostHunter Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 The first thing one should do to fix the redzone problems is to stop being so damn predictable. I swear we must have run left 20 times in the redzone. All were a failed attempt as duly noted by no touchdowns scored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wyndorf25 Posted September 21, 2009 Share Posted September 21, 2009 A little bit of trust in the players we have and the imagination to put them in place to make plays. Call a fade route to Kelly or *gulp* put trust in Marko Mitchell to make a play in the red-zone just as he has shown he can do in preseason. Or how about this: when Zorn decided to go for it on 4th and 1 at the end of the game--instead of running Portis to the left, something everyone including the Rams KNEW was coming, why not fake the hand off and let JC bootleg around the other way so he has the option to either dump it off to a trailing receiver or run it in himself? I'm confident JC could have pulled that one off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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