West Coast Offense? What West Coast Offense?

[bulldog]

Supposedly the Redskins were running the West Coast offense in 2008, but it looked in large measure to be a re-hash of the Gibbs offense with an obligatory slant or wide receiver screen to Santana Moss.

From my perspective the entire enterprise of bringing 'this' offense to Washington in 2008 foundered on the first decision Zorn made, namely to leave the power rushing attack intact.

I am far from a football guru, but I distinctly remember having read a good deal about the classic WCO when the Bengals and then the 49ers started running it in the late 1970's and early 1980's under Bill Walsh.

The first tenet was that the passing game would become an 'extension of the running game', ie the quarterback would use passes to the running backs short zone strikes to the WRs to allow them to get RAC yardage with low risk of interceptions or turnovers.

In the 49er offenses the backs were often broken out in the slot or came out of the backfield one split to each side as options in the passing game. Fullbacks as well as the halfbacks were legitmate options and the reception totals reflected this.

This important component of the WCO was missing from the Redskins playbook. Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts were not significantly engaged in the passing game as a feature of the offense. We never saw the backs split out or the ball go to them to matchup one on one on slower linebackers and safeties.

This is one of the reasons the Eagles are able to move the ball through the air despite having pedestrian wide receivers - they engage Brian Westbrook, Correll Buckhalter and LJ Smith heavily in the passing game.

The component of the WCO the Redskins actually were attempting to install in 2008 was wrecked on the shoals of 'not enough size', 'not enough talent'.

The slants and crosses that are a staple of the WCO are not effective when you have smurf wide receivers like Moss and Randle El.

The inability of Thomas and Kelly to get on the field all but doomed this part of the 'plan'.

For those that disagree about Moss, go back and watch Sunday's game in the second half where on 2 or 3 occasions, Moss was the target in that key short/intermediate zone and lost the football due to contact with the defensive back or the defensive back's ability to get inside Moss due to his small stature and break up the pass.

That's not on Campbell, although I do agree after watching 16 games this season that it is hard to believe that Jason will ever develop the fluidity of motion and release that will allow him to be truly effective in a quick strike attack.

Jason was drafted by Gibbs because he reminded Gibbs of his previous quarterbacks, Doug Williams and Mark Rypien. Tall players with good size that could throw an accurate deep ball.

The problem for Zorn is that the classic Gibbs offense from the 1980's required skills of the quarterbacks that were almost 180 degrees different from what the 49ers and other teams installing the WCO were looking for.

So, my point here is that the 'experiment' with the WCO in 2008 was doomed from the start because it was never fully implemented to begin with.

What Zorn did was try and get an offensive unit to learn a new language without having them learn any of the verbs, only nouns and pronouns.

Part of it was Zorn's own lack of preparation for this role. He admitted in the offseason that he was scrambling to complete his playbook as the minicamps rolled around.

The other part of it was the talent on hand.

Zorn didn't get the opportunity to add ONE veteran free agent that was familiar with his system. Instead, the team counted on the POTENTIAL contribution of a pair of rookies at a position, WR, where the percentage of picks being busts is rather high.

Funny that the team was more than willing to add veterans at DE (Jason Taylor) and CB (DeAngelo Hall) when the opportunity presented itself, but during the entire offseason NOT ONE player was added on offense that could have helped Zorn with the transition he had underway.

The Redskins did talk to a couple of receivers in the offseason who had WCO experience, but played such hardball on the contracts (basically asking them to play for a bit above the veteran minimum) that it was clear they were not all that serious about adding them.

Ultimately, this isn't the WCO. With the current personnel it's hard to believe it will be any time soon. Which begs the question of what kind of hybrid Zorn can cobble together for 2009?

In any case Snyder and Cerrato failed Zorn. It's tough enough for a guy to come in and run a team for the first time, but to do so with no significant upgrades/additions in talent to help him install his system?

Nobody else in the NFL does that to its coaches

[BuryYourDuke]

Great post. You really grasp the inefficiencies of what we tried to do this season given the square peg round hole nature of the project. Hopefully we can start to put the right people in place soon.

[CommDownMan]

On passing downs, I feel like Portis and even Cooley were often in the backfield blocking. I personally feel like stronger pass protection would allow for a more WC type offense.

They do need to give Zorn another chance with pieces that fit his "style" more.

[Old Bay]

Good post.

Whenever the coach changes, the system changes, and there are people in place that may not fit that system. It seems like Zorn fit his scheme to the personnel we had, which is actually a good thing, IMO. It's hard to clean out a roster in one year. It's one of those situations where patience will have to prevail to get the players in place to fit the scheme.

[SlobberKnockinFootball]

Bulldog,

Great post man.. I couldn't say it any better myself. The WCO was doomed from the start because we don't have the talent to run it.

[richhilljr]

With respect, I don't think anyone truly runs an old-school WCO anymore. Everything is a hybrid. I think what we need is a system like the one Andy Reid-Brad Childress developed in Philly...WCO with power running, but using lots of strikes downfield. We aren't taking enough shots downfield and it allows defenses to stack the line. Until we start doing so, our offense will continue to founder in its current iteration. Just my armchair opinion.

On a related note...if anyone watched the SD-Denver game on Sunday night, you saw how the Air Coryell system is supposed to work. That is how our offense should have looked in 06-07 under Al Saunders.

We have a classic chicken-egg question and everyone has his or her own opinion--is it the system or the personnel?

[jtyler42]

This is a great post...No further comment is neccesary!

[bulldog]

just a sobering observation that the Redskins chose not to acquire any players with WCO experience in the offseason to help Zorn in his transition.

Wherever a new coach goes you usually see the front office go out and get at least 1-2 players who either were with the coach at his previous stop or have experience with his scheme (on offense OR defense).

The Redskins spent draft picks and dollars on Jason Taylor and DeAngelo Hall but decided not to add anyone with NFL experience to an offensive unit that was itself mediocre in 2007.

Ironically, the moves were for the defense which was ranked in the top 10.

I think Hall can be a real contributor here if he is resigned but we could have passed up on Jason Taylor and done just as well with Chris Wilson as the designated pass rush specialist.

[Skinsinparadise]

With respect, I don't think anyone truly runs an old-school WCO anymore. Everything is a hybrid. I think what we need is a system like the one Andy Reid-Brad Childress developed in Philly...WCO with power running, but using lots of strikes downfield. We aren't taking enough shots downfield and it allows defenses to stack the line. Until we start doing so, our offense will continue to founder in its current iteration. Just my armchair opinion.

On a related note...if anyone watched the SD-Denver game on Sunday night, you saw how the Air Coryell system is supposed to work. That is how our offense should have looked in 06-07 under Al Saunders.

We have a classic chicken-egg question and everyone has his or her own opinion--is it the system or the personnel?

I agree. It more or less echoed what Brian Mitchell has been saying who as we know played for the Eagles. Mitchell said in the West Coast you do take chances and throw the ball down field, and cited the Eagles as an example.

As to whether this is on Zorn or the talent. I do think its a mixture of both and agree with Mitchell that its more on Zorn. If Devin Thomas and Malcomb Kelly can't figure out how to run 5 yard slants and the 8 yard hitches that are part of the playbook -- as Doc Walker says some of the blame should be on Zorn to get these players up to speed.

[flexxskins]

Great read Bulldog. And I agree with everything that you had to say about the deficiencies of our offense and some of the reasons that cause them.

The only part that I kind of disagree with is "Funny that the team was more than willing to add veterans at DE (Jason Taylor) and CB (DeAngelo Hall) when the opportunity presented itself, but during the entire offseason NOT ONE player was added on offense that could have helped Zorn with the transition he had underway." IMO both defensive players were added because of necessity/injuries. It was made quite clear that we would be heading into the regular season with the players that we had originally.

[bulldog]

we didn't need Jason Taylor. As it turned out Demetric Evans played the season at LDE and Taylor was a spot performer at best.

but to address the point directly - how does a front office decide to go into a season with a new coach and not change ANY of the personnel on that side of the ball?

I just don't understand the mentality.

The wide receiver corps here was hollow.

Thomas and Kelly were untested rookies who both came to camp out of shape. Thrash was 33 years old and Randle El is a limited player.

Simple logic would have told most GMs that they needed to add a veteran WR with some size who could be COUNTED ON to be a solid if not spectacular performer.

[Redskins Diehard]

West coast offense...in my opinion one of the most overused terms in football today(I also like "cover corner"...what other kind of corners are there?). Especially now that everyone runs a "version" of the West Coast offense. Zorn runs his "version" of the West Coast Offense, which is probably a variation of Holmgren's "version" of the West Coast Offense. So now we are about 3 degrees of of separation from the true "west coast" offense.

[TheLongshot]

we didn't need Jason Taylor. As it turned out Demetric Evans played the season at LDE and Taylor was a spot performer at best.

but to address the point directly - how does a front office decide to go into a season with a new coach and not change ANY of the personnel on that side of the ball?

I just don't understand the mentality.

The wide receiver corps here was hollow.

Thomas and Kelly were untested rookies who both came to camp out of shape. Thrash was 33 years old and Randle El is a limited player.

Simple logic would have told most GMs that they needed to add a veteran WR with some size who could be COUNTED ON to be a solid if not spectacular performer.

Hackett was potentially one of those guys, but the team was (wisely as it turned out) reluctant to spend a lot of money on him because of his injury history. The team also tried to pry away Chad Johnson, who probably would have done well in the WCO. (that is, if he was able to stay healthy.)

One thing you did forget is that Thrash does have some experience with the WCO from his time in Philly. It is probably why he did get a lot of playing time early on.

You are right that there are a lot of non-WCO things in this offense right now, but Zorn knew that the passing game was going to take time and that he was going to have to lean a lot on the running game while the passing game got its legs. I will expect that there will be some adjustments in the offseason to this, but as others have pointed out, there isn't such a thing as a "pure" WCO anymore.

[SirClintonPortis]

Maybe Zorn should consider suggesting Bobby Engram to the FO. He was moaning about his contract in Seattle last year, but that shouldn't be an issue since he did not have a great year this year. That's a vet WR who should know all the little things in the playbook since the Holmgren playbook is probably the same stuff that is run in Washington.

[Chump Bailey]

I think what we need is a system like the one Andy Reid-Brad Childress developed in Philly...WCO with power running, but using lots of strikes downfield.

Makes sense and I hope Zorn does just that...

[The Sisko]

Great post as usual Bulldog. I think Zorn's reasoning was mostly sound in trying to decrease the information overload by keeping the same running game. However now that we've aptly demonstrated the need to overhaul the OL, there really isn't a downside to just going whole hog (pun fully intended) on the OL in the draft and playing the young guys with the scheme as Zorn would like it to be. After all, it should be readily apparent to even Danny and Vinny that this team is NOT going to compete for the SB next season. Therefore there's no impetus to try for the quick fix.

[Warpath11]

That's not on Campbell, although I do agree after watching 16 games this season that it is hard to believe that Jason will ever develop the fluidity of motion and release that will allow him to be truly effective in a quick strike attack.

Jason was drafted by Gibbs because he reminded Gibbs of his previous quarterbacks, Doug Williams and Mark Rypien. Tall players with good size that could throw an accurate deep ball.

This right here...great post but I point out this as one of the main culprits behind our inability to pass the ball with any efficiency. I think this is where Zorn has to come in and cater the offense to JC, if indeed JC, is the QB for the future. The offense cannot be a complete WC due to the JCs shortcomings you pointed out in your post. It will be on Zorn to mold an offense around the strengths of JC if JC is the answer at the QB postion.

[Oldfan]

bulldog: Supposedly the Redskins were running the West Coast offense in 2008, but it looked in large measure to be a re-hash of the Gibbs offense with an obligatory slant or wide receiver screen to Santana Moss.

You are exaggerating. The scheme for the passing game was pure WCO.

Jim Zorn stated that his intent was to have a 60/40 pass to run ratio. He never achieved that because the passing game never got up to speed.

Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts were not significantly engaged in the passing game as a feature of the offense.

Having to depend on the run meant Portis got a heavier workload. Would it make sense to use him even more as a receiver, especially since he isn't good at it? Ladell was used on passing downs.

The slants and crosses that are a staple of the WCO are not effective when you have smurf wide receivers like Moss and Randle El. ..The inability of Thomas and Kelly to get on the field all but doomed this part of the 'plan'.

We'll have to wait until next year.

... although I do agree after watching 16 games this season that it is hard to believe that Jason will ever develop the fluidity of motion and release that will allow him to be truly effective in a quick strike attack.

I didn't think so either, but I was surprised by what Jason and Jim Zorn accomplished this year. He wasn't born for the WCO, but I think jason can handle it fairly well. I gave him a C this year -- not bad for his first year in the system.

Funny that the team was more than willing to add veterans at DE (Jason Taylor) and CB (DeAngelo Hall) when the opportunity presented itself, but during the entire offseason NOT ONE player was added on offense that could have helped Zorn with the transition he had underway.

You used the words "when the opportunity presented itself." Was there a player available who could have helped Jason in the new scheme?

The Redskins did talk to a couple of receivers in the offseason who had WCO experience, but played such hardball on the contracts (basically asking them to play for a bit above the veteran minimum) that it was clear they were not all that serious about adding them.

Who were they?

Ultimately, this isn't the WCO. With the current personnel it's hard to believe it will be any time soon. Which begs the question of what kind of hybrid Zorn can cobble together for 2009?

Do you know of a pure WCO in existence today? They're all hybrids.

In any case Snyder and Cerrato failed Zorn. It's tough enough for a guy to come in and run a team for the first time, but to do so with no significant upgrades/additions in talent to help him install his system?

I gave the offense a "C." It played the ball control, field position game fairly well overall. They sagged a bit when Samuels went down, but not bad for year one.

[Oldfan]

I think what we need is a system like the one Andy Reid-Brad Childress developed in Philly...WCO with power running, but using lots of strikes downfield. We aren't taking enough shots downfield and it allows defenses to stack the line. Until we start doing so, our offense will continue to founder in its current iteration. Just my armchair opinion.

I doubt that Jim Zorn's WCO will end up looking like Andy Reid's. Zorn is obviously aimed at ball control. Those big play offenses are too inconsistent.

[The Sisko]

Having to depend on the run meant Portis got a heavier workload. Would it make sense to use him even more as a receiver, especially since he isn't good at it? Ladell was used on passing downs.

If you think of the short passing game as a run substitute it makes very good sense, especially with our crappy OL. If you substitute say six or seven runs per game for the plays where we'd ordinarily plow Portis up the middle to get three yards on his own, I'd say it would actually prevent him from wearing down as much. Doing this would also play more to Betts' skills since it's becoming obvious that Gibbs was right that he's more of a third down receiving option out of the backfield than an every down RB.

[Oldfan]

If you think of the short passing game as a run substitute it makes very good sense, especially with our crappy OL. If you substitute say six or seven runs per game for the plays where we'd ordinarily plow Portis up the middle to get three yards on his own, I'd say it would actually prevent him from wearing down as much.

I see your point, but I'm trying to put myself into Zorn's head. Portis is a good runner, not that great as a receiver. My O line is better at run blocking than in protection. Passing more is not adding up.

Doing this would also play more to Betts' skills since it's becoming obvious that Gibbs was right that he's more of a third down receiving option out of the backfield than an every down RB.

If Zorn was of a mind to pass, say 60 to 65% of the time, Betts would be your prime back. He'd be used on screens and swings like Westbrook.

[NavyDave]

West coast offense...in my opinion one of the most overused terms in football today(I also like "cover corner"...what other kind of corners are there?). Especially now that everyone runs a "version" of the West Coast offense. Zorn runs his "version" of the West Coast Offense, which is probably a variation of Holmgren's "version" of the West Coast Offense. So now we are about 3 degrees of of separation from the true "west coast" offense.

Yeah it orginated with the Cincy Bengals but took a team with a Jerry Rice and Joe Montanna to give it a catchy overused name.

I can only think of a handful of teams in the playoffs that use it.

Vikings and iggles come to mind in the NFC and in both instances its a premiere running back than the passing game that the teams offense can point to as being the major threat as well as the defense.

Favored teams in the AFC Colts Steelers aren't running the cincy offense cough WCO.

[bulldog]

the problem with the 'we achieved some things in 2008 and will continue to work on them and more in 2009' on offense is that we are not talking about a young unit that is going to be the core here for the next 3-5 years.

we are looking at a unit that is going to undergo major changes whether the front office and coaching staff like it or not based on the graying of the roster.

Moss (30), Randle El (30), Portis (28), Betts (29) plus an injured Malcolm Kelly and underprepared Devin Thomas.

Those are the 'major skill performers' that surrounded Jason Campbell in 2008.

Who is going to stay and who is going to go?

And did I mention for the umpteenth time the age of the offensive line where you could make the case that two starters, Jansen and Kendall need to be replaced for 2009 with understudies for Thomas (33) and Rabach (32) on the horizon as well.

[mi6]

Frankly, for me there are two types of offenses ...

1. Run first offense

2. Pass first offense

[MustangSteve]

How the hail does this look like Gibbs offense when the 05 Skins "Gibbs Offense" scored over 50 points in a game, then scored over 30 points 3 weeks in a row against the NFC East? Gibbs offense was not Saunders either, it was much more productive and only needed 1 or 2 more good recievers without Al Saunders.