Don't blame it on the Fans...

[DCsportsfan53]

Yes' date=' the commercial being played did attribute to quieting the crowd, but maybe the fact that it was an INJURY timeout had something to do with it too??

And blaming a commercial for the crowd not being loud is BS. It is the crowd's fault for letting that happen, not Snyder or the person he has in charge of what they do during breaks. I was one of the few in my section that was still being as loud as possible at that point.....but the overall crowd noise during the game was almost as depressing and pathetic as the Redskins performance. I know it's hard when the team isn't playing well, but come on! ZERO false start penalties for the Titans... :doh: :mad:[/quote']

They never tried, man, they never tried A large percentage of the crowd was there to observe and observe only yesterday. Quite shameful. I'm sorry but anyone who says we have the best or even a good fanbase hasn't been to games in a decade. We're pathetic.

[Die Hard]

- Saying that you live in Canada isn't going to win you points.

- Being here a long time doesn't make you a better fan and it doesn't make you important. You've been here longer than Om, Art, Henry, Pete, and Jumbo, too, but I'll take them all over you.

- You deal with the Redskins as an insider? They actually TALK to people like you and you help affect their lives and the course of the franchise? No wonder everyone hates the front office.

Snyder IS responsible for the commercials. You are wrong. Stop posting.

Seriously, you are falling under the category of a moronic 22-year old with a serious knowledge of the corporate world.

1. Telling you I lived in Canada isn't meant to win points silly... you called me a "patsy" for working for the Skins. I was explaining that it's geographically impossible.

2. Believe it or not, I'm the "founder" of ExtremeSkins. Member #1. The guy with the vision, the loyalty, the discipline and the commitment to make this all happen.

I'm the guy who found Blade, Art, Henry, Pete, Jumbo, TK. I'm the guy who brought all those guys aboard. I'm glad you trust them... that speaks volumes of my decisions

3. The Redskins don't unveil insider knowledge to me. Having dealt with the Redskins in the "merger" of ExtremeSkins... yeah, I was in the room with all the big-wigs that help run the franchise during negotiations... so I happen to have a pretty good idea of how things are run. Not to mention, I know people that know people.

I also was a founding member (of 5) that helped build a startup company that turned into a multi-million dollar venture (with over 50 employees) which was subsequently hired by RIAA (record industory), MPAA (motion pictures association), Universal Studios, Microsoft, IDSA (video game conglomerate)... and had trails with Rolex and Playboy. I have a pretty good understanding of the corporate structure works.

Am I bragging about it? No.

But I'm also not the one formulating hypothetical situations and misplacing blame with a complete lack of knowledge and understanding of just about everything and anything to do with business.

Geez, you'd think with all the micromanaging you people envision the CEO performing they work 80-hour work weeks and never see their family. Bzzzz. They are the cats who barely work... who only care about the "bottomline" of the business. They hire the "best of the best" to deal with the menial crap.

A lot of these hires are made public. You should see the resumes of some of the guys the Redskins hired. They are going to seek out the "best of the best" and then look over their shoulder on every decision... especially not the menial ones like playing what commerical when.

But that doesn't surprise me.... considering how many people here thought Dan Snyder was going to "censor" this board after the merger... despite the people who KNEW better who told them that was going to happen.

It's one thing not to know (ignorance)... it's quite another to be told the answer and to ignore it (stupidity).

[4thStBully]

i dont know about all the in fighting, but i do know that it WAS loud after we tied the game, very loud. the fans were in the game. the defense takes the fans out of the game...that defense and poor special teams play.

i'm just really, really frustrated.

[mnj1125]

I agree with the original post. I went to the Dallas game last year and the Giants game this year. Granted they had some commercials but they had them play at non-critical points. Whenever there was a critical drive coming up, during the TV break, those teams would play pumped up songs and/or motivational clips on their TVs that would get the fans and players pumped up. The difference is like night and day from FedEx. At FedEx, they "choose" to play commercials at the wrong times and it does silence some fans. Too corporate here. And Synder IS the CEO...he could make changes to the way the in stadium commericals are done, IF he wanted to. But it's all about the $$$$.

I wonder if anyone else who has been to an away game has noticed the difference in terms of in-stadium commercials...

[scruffylookin]

I wasn't there so I don't know but I believe Dockeryfan when he says that the stadium energy just disappeared during the commercial break.

Is it Snyder's fault?

Only to the degree that Snyder needs to sell every inch of space/time/air whatever in order to pay off the large debts he's got with the purchase of the Skins and the improvements he's made to the stadium over the years.

Does it suck and give FedEx too much of a "corporate" vibe to it?

Yeah, but this is the age we live in I guess.

I did have club seat tickets in the past so I've been to my fair share of Skins games at FedEx and I can tell you that it really is a letdown whenever they take a TV timeout. You just sit there in the stands waiting for the action to start up again. It really does disrupt the flow of the game.

All this said, like Dockeryfan mentioned, the Skins were going to be on offense anyway so the crowd should have been quiet. It was the awful Skins performance after finally forcing that 3 and out that probably caused the fans to stay quiet and not the commercials played during timeouts. :2cents:

Last thing Dock, what the hell is wrong with Quiet Riot?!! :mad: :redpunch: :kungfu:

[Die Hard]

I wasn't there so I don't know but I believe Dockeryfan when he says that the stadium energy just disappeared during the commercial break.

Is it Snyder's fault?

Only to the degree that Snyder needs to sell every inch of space/time/air whatever in order to pay off the large debts he's got with the purchase of the Skins and the improvements he's made to the stadium over the years.

Does it suck and give FedEx too much of a "corporate" vibe to it?

Yeah, but this is the age we live in I guess.

Look, fans are fans. Redskins fans aren't exactly the most voracious crowd out there... especially not in the FedEx Field venue.

And there are a lot of variables for it... beyond playing commercials.

Season opener, against the Vikings.. crowd is into it and going crazy. Pierson Prileou gets injured on the opening kickoff... and the crowd never recovers from the injury delay.

You going to blame that on Dan Snyder?

Nationally televised games... and the incredible amount of TV timeouts. I've been a few... that KILLS any kind of crowd momentum.

You going to blame that on Dan Snyder?

You don't like the corporate environment... but did the corporate environment kill the crowd in our playoff game against the Detroit Lions in 1999? Ask anybody there how insane it was. Did that corporate environment subdue the fans last year when we played the Cowboys in December (35-7)? Ask anybody that was there how insane it was (I was there... I was on the sidelines working that game).

Obviously, the corporate environment doesn't affect the crowd. The "football" environment does.... big game at the right time of year, big opponent, the outcome of the game, etc.

Wait until the Redskins become a dominant team.. particularly at home. Let's see how crazy FedEx Field will become... and how opposing team fans will stay away.

But right now... we have people who do the wave while we're on offense. We have fans who cheer when we're on offense. We have fans that tell other fans to sit down and shut up during the game. We have fans who leave the game late in the 3rd quarter with the game still to be decided.

Fans are fans... and the Redskins have enough crappy ones who can afford to go to games.

But the bottom line is... the team has to win. That will change everything.

Not allowing a team to score on their opening drive... that kills fan momentum.

[Skins n' Bones]

When people say "Snyder" needs to do something, I think they usually mean the business side of the Redskins, not necessarily Snyder himself....but since he is in charge of it, it's easier to put it that way. So when they blame a commercial played in the stadium on "Snyder", they don't necessarily mean Daniel M. Snyder the person, but the business organization he is in charge of. Just a thought....

[Die Hard]

When people say "Snyder" needs to do something' date=' I think they usually mean the business side of the Redskins, not necessarily Snyder himself....but since he is in charge of it, it's easier to put it that way. So when they blame a commercial played in the stadium on "Snyder", they don't necessarily mean Daniel M. Snyder the person, but the business organization he is in charge of. Just a thought....[/quote']

That would be accurate. And the business side of the organization would show dramatic profit margins and reduced expenses and debt. And the market is sustaining any increased costs. So Mr. Snyder should be happy.

Hey, I'm a consumer too. I wouldn't pay for beer in the stadium... and I couldn't afford more than UL seats for season tickets. I wouldn't pay for parking either.

But you know what... if I owned ExtremeSkins... and I could charge $25 per post and people would pay that expense and I could make $250k a year... even though people would complain they could post on another message board for free... I wouldn't change a thing

Now, on the "football" part of the organization... when it fails... Mr Snyder will intervene. That will be his call. And right now... despite the failing on the field... Mr Snyder still has all the confidence in the world in Joe Gibbs. Despite the fact that many fans would want Gibbs fired right now

Snyder will make changes when changes are necessary. And right now, a lot of changes aren't necessary... on the football side or the business side.

If the Redskins start losing money... or if the Redskins post 5 losing seasons in a row... then Snyder will step in.

But you cannot have a CEO stepping in and overstepping every decision in every division that doesn't work out perfectly. You aren't going to get very many people to work for you if you do that.

[NewCliche21]

Seriously, you are falling under the category of a moronic 22-year old with a serious knowledge of the corporate world.

1. Telling you I lived in Canada isn't meant to win points silly... you called me a "patsy" for working for the Skins. I was explaining that it's geographically impossible.

2. Believe it or not, I'm the "founder" of ExtremeSkins. Member #1. The guy with the vision, the loyalty, the discipline and the commitment to make this all happen.

I'm the guy who found Blade, Art, Henry, Pete, Jumbo, TK. I'm the guy who brought all those guys aboard. I'm glad you trust them... that speaks volumes of my decisions

3. The Redskins don't unveil insider knowledge to me. Having dealt with the Redskins in the "merger" of ExtremeSkins... yeah, I was in the room with all the big-wigs that help run the franchise during negotiations... so I happen to have a pretty good idea of how things are run. Not to mention, I know people that know people.

I also was a founding member (of 5) that helped build a startup company that turned into a multi-million dollar venture (with over 50 employees) which was subsequently hired by RIAA (record industory), MPAA (motion pictures association), Universal Studios, Microsoft, IDSA (video game conglomerate)... and had trails with Rolex and Playboy. I have a pretty good understanding of the corporate structure works.

Am I bragging about it? No.

But I'm also not the one formulating hypothetical situations and misplacing blame with a complete lack of knowledge and understanding of just about everything and anything to do with business.

Geez, you'd think with all the micromanaging you people envision the CEO performing they work 80-hour work weeks and never see their family. Bzzzz. They are the cats who barely work... who only care about the "bottomline" of the business. They hire the "best of the best" to deal with the menial crap.

A lot of these hires are made public. You should see the resumes of some of the guys the Redskins hired. They are going to seek out the "best of the best" and then look over their shoulder on every decision... especially not the menial ones like playing what commerical when.

But that doesn't surprise me.... considering how many people here thought Dan Snyder was going to "censor" this board after the merger... despite the people who KNEW better who told them that was going to happen.

It's one thing not to know (ignorance)... it's quite another to be told the answer and to ignore it (stupidity).

Thanks for ExtremeSkins, really.

You can go now.

Anyway. All that I'm saying is that Snyder is ultimately responsible for all decisions. I'm not saying that Snyder pressed the "Go to commercial" button. I'm saying that it's ultimately his responsibility. If you're still in charge of your start-up, and it tanks, then it's your fault. That's why the turnover rate of CEOs, CFOs, and COOs is so high. YOU are responsible because it is YOUR company. Are you denying that?

There is a difference between ignorance, stupidity, and simply being wrong.

Though, in your case, I guess that you can have a combination of the three.

Have fun with your sixteen-year age "advantage" that seems to be your sole point that I can't dispute. Good show!

[NewCliche21]

Snyder will make changes when changes are necessary. And right now, a lot of changes aren't necessary... on the football side or the business side.

If the Redskins start losing money... or if the Redskins post 5 losing seasons in a row... then Snyder will step in.

But you cannot have a CEO stepping in and overstepping every decision in every division that doesn't work out perfectly. You aren't going to get very many people to work for you if you do that.

I guess that we can actually agree here. I don't want Snyder stepping in because he DOES need to trust the people that he puts in there, just as you don't pull a quarterback after one pick, but each of those actions are a reflection on him. All things that a company and its employees do are the responsibility of its owner. Plain and simple

[Die Hard]

That's why the turnover rate of CEOs, CFOs, and COOs is so high.

Ah yes, the high turnover rate of CEOs, CFOs and COOs. How can I argue with that statistic?!

Perhaps one day you'll move beyond your entry-level position and get to sit in on some executive/committee meetings.

22-years old. God, you kids are so dense these days.

[dockeryfan]

I wasn't there so I don't know but I believe Dockeryfan when he says that the stadium energy just disappeared during the commercial break.

Is it Snyder's fault?

You have to say yes.

I'm a business owner, anything that goes wrong eventually is my responsibility.

If the business fails, it's my fault either directly, in the decisions I make, or indirectly, in hiring people who in turn make bad decisions.

Same if the business succeeds, that's why I get to reap the benefits.

When the Skins play commercials at poor times, and fan energy is diminished, it creates a poor product. Again, if you weren't there you have no idea how profound this quieting effect was. It was embarrassing.

I can't see how some people would

1) defend this

or

2) claim that Snyder is not ultimately responsible for the product.

[Die Hard]

All things that a company and its employees do are the responsibility of its owner. Plain and simple

Plain and simple. Perhaps that's the only type of explanation that you can comprehend. Obviously, someone, somewhere in your life really dumbed down everything for you and spoon-fed it for you.

Believe it or not... at one time, ExtremeSkins was a smaller, more intimate community populated with serious, intelligent posters capable of serious, indepth discussion. Then it became dumbed-down "Redskins for dummies" resource where anybody capable of turning on a TV can share their opinions.

Some of us have made good friends here over the years... and too many of you are just BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH.

[Die Hard]

I can't see how some people would

1) defend this

or

2) claim that Snyder is not ultimately responsible for the product.

The same things happened last year. When the Skins went to the playoffs. The product wasn't so bad then. Problems only arise when the Redskins lose.

Then it's the janitor's fault for not sweeping in the corners. It's the fans fault for eating their food too fast. The lighting is too dim. The paint on the parking lots spacing isn't bold enough. The pretzels aren't hot enough.

Some of you guys are just little whiny ********. Turn into your testicles at the door.

[Die Hard]

You have to say yes.

I'm a business owner, anything that goes wrong eventually is my responsibility.

If the business fails, it's my fault either directly, in the decisions I make, or indirectly, in hiring people who in turn make bad decisions.

Same if the business succeeds, that's why I get to reap the benefits.

When the Skins play commercials at poor times, and fan energy is diminished, it creates a poor product. Again, if you weren't there you have no idea how profound this quieting effect was. It was embarrassing.

I can't see how some people would

1) defend this

or

2) claim that Snyder is not ultimately responsible for the product.

Give me your company name and address. Let's hear it.

I guarantee you... I can have at least a dozen things to whine about and let you know what a crappy owner you are. I'll even complain about how crappy your customers are because I don't see them smiling when they're in your business.

[scruffylookin]

Look, fans are fans. Redskins fans aren't exactly the most voracious crowd out there... especially not in the FedEx Field venue.

And there are a lot of variables for it... beyond playing commercials.

Season opener, against the Vikings.. crowd is into it and going crazy. Pierson Prileou gets injured on the opening kickoff... and the crowd never recovers from the injury delay.

You going to blame that on Dan Snyder?

Nationally televised games... and the incredible amount of TV timeouts. I've been a few... that KILLS any kind of crowd momentum.

You going to blame that on Dan Snyder?

You don't like the corporate environment... but did the corporate environment kill the crowd in our playoff game against the Detroit Lions in 1999? Ask anybody there how insane it was. Did that corporate environment subdue the fans last year when we played the Cowboys in December (35-7)? Ask anybody that was there how insane it was (I was there... I was on the sidelines working that game).

Obviously, the corporate environment doesn't affect the crowd. The "football" environment does.... big game at the right time of year, big opponent, the outcome of the game, etc.

Wait until the Redskins become a dominant team.. particularly at home. Let's see how crazy FedEx Field will become... and how opposing team fans will stay away.

But right now... we have people who do the wave while we're on offense. We have fans who cheer when we're on offense. We have fans that tell other fans to sit down and shut up during the game. We have fans who leave the game late in the 3rd quarter with the game still to be decided.

Fans are fans... and the Redskins have enough crappy ones who can afford to go to games.

But the bottom line is... the team has to win. That will change everything.

Not allowing a team to score on their opening drive... that kills fan momentum.

I agree with you. I was one of the fans at that Lions playoff game and that place was nuts. Like I said, I had club seats and the fans there usually are the last to scream and stomp but our entire section was yelling nonstop the entire game. It was great. I'd put that atmosphere that day up against any from RFK.

I'm not blaming Snyder in the least, I think it's just the nature of the beast that all these TV timeouts that are taken during a football game sap the enthusiasm from the fans. I've felt it myself while at the stadium.

Skins score

TV timeout

KO

TV timeout

1st play from scrimmage

It just ruins the flow of the game. But like I said, it's the era we're living in and there's not much we can do about it.

I do agree that the whole "wave while the Skins are on offense" thing is just plain sad and embarrassing. Other than that, I think the good folks at FedEx Field proved how great they can be when the Skins give them a good team last December.

[NewCliche21]

Plain and simple. Perhaps that's the only type of explanation that you can comprehend. Obviously, someone, somewhere in your life really dumbed down everything for you and spoon-fed it for you.

Believe it or not... at one time, ExtremeSkins was a smaller, more intimate community populated with serious, intelligent posters capable of serious, indepth discussion. Then it became dumbed-down "Redskins for dummies" resource where anybody capable of turning on a TV can share their opinions.

Some of us have made good friends here over the years... and too many of you are just BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH.

I PMed you to try and end this in a civil manner, but forget it. You've the intellect, social understanding, and maturity of a twelve-year-old. Your elitist and narcissistic ideas of what a message board should be are absolutely disgusting. Stay away from this board. This is the Internet, where everyone who has a TV not only DOES have an opinion, but SHOULD have an opinion, and it SHOULD be shared with the world.

We are the real fans. Just because you're absolutely incapable of grasping any sort of concept unless it's in total and complete agreement with your understanding of it does NOT make someone else wrong.

You're literally the most idiotic person that I've ever seen on this board who pretends to be a Redskins fan. I feel dirty for being associated with such a terrible person.

[dockeryfan]

Die Hard, you are just wrong here.

1) You weren't there, so you don't even know what you are defending.

2) The CEO is ultimately responsible for the product created. If there is a problem, you hire the right people to fix it. Or the business model is just a bad one.

Well, every owner in the NFL makes money, so it's not the business model. But the Redskins fan experience is becoming watered down, and that is everything from the quality of the food, to the lack of a jumbotron, to the full volume commercials, to the support staff.

I go to the Stadium every game, and I'll be in Philly on 11/12 so I have a little more frame of reference than you do. If you compare the fan expereince at Fedex to other places, they really do not compare.

If as a fan, I can see particulars that would directly affect fan expereince, then Fedex employees should be able to identify them as well.

If there was a directive to detect and solve these problems, that would be coming from the top.

If it is not, then Snyder is ultimately responsible.

You have to realize this.

[Redskins Diehard]

I PMed you to try and end this in a civil manner, but forget it. You've the intellect, social understanding, and maturity of a twelve-year-old. Your elitist and narcissistic ideas of what a message board should be are absolutely disgusting. Stay away from this board. This is the Internet, where everyone who has a TV not only DOES have an opinion, but SHOULD have an opinion, and it SHOULD be shared with the world.

We are the real fans. Just because you're absolutely incapable of grasping any sort of concept unless it's in total and complete agreement with your understanding of it does NOT make someone else wrong.

You're literally the most idiotic person that I've ever seen on this board who pretends to be a Redskins fan. I feel dirty for being associated with such a terrible person.

You really should go and find somewhere else to post.:2cents:

How do you tell the guy that created this thing that he doesn't know what it is supposed to be about?

Real easy way to quit feeling dirty...get the f out.

[Redskins Diehard]

Die Hard, you are just wrong here.

1) You weren't there, so you don't even know what you are defending.

2) The CEO is ultimately responsible for the product created. If there is a problem, you hire the right people to fix it. Or the business model is just a bad one.

Well, every owner in the NFL makes money, so it's not the business model. But the Redskins fan experience is becoming watered down, and that is everything from the quality of the food, to the lack of a jumbotron, to the full volume commercials, to the support staff.

I go to the Stadium every game, and I'll be in Philly on 11/12 so I have a little more frame of reference than you do. If you compare the fan expereince at Fedex to other places, they really do not compare.

If as a fan, I can see particulars that would directly affect fan expereince, then Fedex employees should be able to identify them as well.

If there was a directive to detect and solve these problems, that would be coming from the top.

If it is not, then Snyder is ultimately responsible.

You have to realize this.

To make an argument that a in stadium commercial was the cause of the Redskins losing to the winless Titans at home is crazy, no matter who ordered it to be played.

[mnj1125]

Obviously in the Lions and Cowboys games that were mentioned, those were highly emotional games or a playoff game. When the team is doing well, what fan wouldn't be excited? It's a great feeling for a fan. But at the "low" points (i.e. Titans game), I think the fans and the players need some sort of "pick me up". That when the songs/clips would be useful instead of commercials in order to pick up some momentum. Commercials are a real buzz kill.

I see both sides of this debate. Just my :2cents: .

[NewCliche21]

You really should go and find somewhere else to post.:2cents:

How do you tell the guy that created this thing that he doesn't know what it is supposed to be about?

Real easy way to quit feeling dirty...get the f out.

Yeah, except, no. He says that this board has gone to hell because the majority of us are stupid. Yeah, that's what being an ExtremeSkin is about.

[Monte51Coleman]

I bet that if we won nobody would be discussing in-stadium commercials.

PS- This thread should be closed. This type of juvenile behavior, complete with name-calling and insults, is exactly what we supposedly take pride in NOT allowing here.

ALL of you need to take a breath and get over yourselves...for the betterment of the community.

[dockeryfan]

The same things happened last year. When the Skins went to the playoffs. The product wasn't so bad then. Problems only arise when the Redskins lose.

Then it's the janitor's fault for not sweeping in the corners. It's the fans fault for eating their food too fast. The lighting is too dim. The paint on the parking lots spacing isn't bold enough. The pretzels aren't hot enough.

Some of you guys are just little whiny ********. Turn into your testicles at the door.

Wrong.

Last year, a guy threw up in the stands on a hot day.

You know the janitorial staff didn't have any cleaning supplies?

That sand stuff you can put down on a vomit spill, then sweep it up? Not there.

They sent a guy up with a cardboard box and a plastic cup.

No joke. He scooped up the vomit into the cardboard box with the cup.

Of course, cardboard doesn't respond well to liquid, so the vomit leaked through the box onto the woman one row in front of him.

I watched it myself.

It leads to poor product.

And way to turn this into a pissing contest. You really want to know my business, you PM me.

I'm getting a pretty good idea of who you are from your responses on this thread. When you try to defend the indefensible, just turn it into a personal attack.

If full volume commercials create a poor product, and other stadiums don't do it, or at least not to such a degree that it destroys the energy, then it's a bad decision.

Eventually, it all falls on Snyder.

*Awaiting the personal attack from Die Hard*

[skinstzar]

Yeah, I don't think the guy was talking about the broadcast. But I really doubt that Snyder "made the decision" to go to commercial in the stadium. I bet he hired someone to run that type of stuff.

Of course Snyder didn't decide directly, he does however decide to sell ad space on the jumbotron. Karl Swanson is in charge of the game day experience and he sucks at it. The point of this thread is that they could have sold less commercial space. Do something to inspire the fans, let the teams go to break but hear the crowd the whole time. Don't drown them out. FEDEX holds 40k more people than RFK yet it is not as big a home field adavantage. It is because the stadium and event staff don't have a clue as to what they are doing.