SI: Offseason Report Cards

[Art McDonough]

How come they say we overpaid Archuleta and Randle El? We won't know that until after the season.

[dfannyc]

Now you are reaching... Don Coryell is used far more than anything Bill Parcells has come up with on his own (Norv Turner, Gibbs, Saunders, Vermiel, Ernie Zampese, Mike Martz, etc). The guys who were discipled by Coryell and his disciples have displayed relatively the same style with few modifications. Can you honestly say that Belichik uses the same offense as Parcells? I don't even believe Parcell's has been consistent with his approach from team to team, so when you say a "Parcell's System"... You are merely stating the success that his coordinators who coached under him have had, not really relying on a system that he developed and is primarily responsible for. It's apples to oranges, but I'm sure someone out there disagrees with me.

Umm, I see (2) active head coaches in your list. Joe Gibbs and Mike Martz. I'm still trying to figure out when Mike Martz actually gained tutelage under Don Coryell...

So..

Don Caryell trained assistants current active head-coaches: Joe Gibbs (Redskins)

Bill Walsh trained assistants current active head-coaches: Mike Holmgren (Seahawks), Mike Shanahan (Broncos), and Dennis Green (Cardinals).

Bill Parcells trained assistants current active head-coaches: Tom Coughlin (Giants), Bill Belichick (Patriots), Sean Payton (Saints), Romeo Crennel (Browns), and Eric Mangini (Jets)

[Riggo#44]

sure looks like they are ahead to me...on top means ahead of.

Dallasfanforlife - Idiotbychoice

Are you so desperate for any measure of success in the last 10 years that you are debating 6-10 records from 3 years ago?

Save the Five Rings, save the playoff appearnces, save this that and the other. Win a playoff game, which Dallas hasn;t done since 1996 and Parcells hasn't done since 1998.

The truth of the matter is Pettiti was villianized for his performace last year - and word has it from minicamps that he was better than Fabini. Kosier is on his 3rd team in 3 years. Even half-way decent O-linemen aren't allowed to leave one team in that time frame let alone work on their third! So it looks to me the line is STILL questionable at best. How's Rivera's back? How's Flo's knee - better hope it holds up!

I guess when you have back-ups starting, the back-up back-ups must look pretty good in comparison.

And if you want to talk about messing up in FA so badly - name 3 busts in Gibbs tenure. I'll even give you 2: Barrow and Patten. Name a third. I have a long list of successes.

[dallasfanforlife]

Dallasfanforlife - Idiotbychoice

Are you so desperate for any measure of success in the last 10 years that you are debating 6-10 records from 3 years ago?

Save the Five Rings, save the playoff appearnces, save this that and the other. Win a playoff game, which Dallas hasn;t done since 1996 and Parcells hasn't done since 1998.

The truth of the matter is Pettiti was villianized for his performace last year - and word has it from minicamps that he was better than Fabini. Kosier is on his 3rd team in 3 years. Even half-way decent O-linemen aren't allowed to leave one team in that time frame let alone work on their third! So it looks to me the line is STILL questionable at best. How's Rivera's back? How's Flo's knee - better hope it holds up!

I guess when you have back-ups starting, the back-up back-ups must look pretty good in comparison.

And if you want to talk about messing up in FA so badly - name 3 busts in Gibbs tenure. I'll even give you 2: Barrow and Patten. Name a third. I have a long list of successes.

Gibbs is entering year three...dont brag so much on his "FA success"......I hope Pettiti does win the job. What a kid cant improve from hius rookie season.....as i pointed out once already most lineman, especially 6th round picks.....dont play that much, and he started 16 games. Your darn right he is going to improve!!! Dockery was horrible his rookie year, yet you guys think for sure he is solid lineman...right?

Rivera's back is ok i guess, i dont have is cell number or id call him and ask....and your right i do hope Flozell is ok. By the way how's Randy Thomas's leg? Will he be 100% by camp? How about Raubacks leg? Or Brunells finger? and most of all hows your nose? After being jammed up Bubba's butt....i have to think it kinda hurts a little.

[ouvan59]

http://www.nfl.com/standings/2004/regular

ok smart ass, if in fact they were all tied, then why is Dallas ahead of Washington....regardless of record, the Boys are on top, why? Cause they finished ahead of them thats why.

my goodness......

:doh:

How many people on here wish this guy had been O.J.'s attorney instead of Johnnie Cochran. He would have gotten what he deserved and fried years ago.

[wbar3383]

Originally Posted by dallasfanforlife

I love how you go back to 7 years.....how about 2 of the last 3 years, the Cowboys have finished ahead of Washington.

Originally Posted by Eternal_Cowboy

Not much of it ever. Dallas leads the All-time series by nearly 20 games. That's dominance in the NF

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Which way do you brokeback boys want it?

First one says you go back too far, then the next one comes and and spouts off 10 years of stats.

Not getting any smarter in cowgirl land.

[pjfootballer]

If the standings don't fit, you must acquit!!!

[dallasfanforlife]

Originally Posted by dallasfanforlife

I love how you go back to 7 years.....how about 2 of the last 3 years, the Cowboys have finished ahead of Washington.

Originally Posted by Eternal_Cowboy

Not much of it ever. Dallas leads the All-time series by nearly 20 games. That's dominance in the NF

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Which way do you brokeback boys want it?

First one says you go back too far, then the next one comes and and spouts off 10 years of stats.

Not getting any smarter in cowgirl land.

lay your head back down on your desk and stay there.

you have nothing to share!

[Califan007 The Constipated]

sure looks like they are ahead to me...on top means ahead of.

Oh good lord... :doh:

Ok, we'll be generous and "give" you the technicality and allow Dallas to have done better than the Skins in 2004...lol ...so that gives the Cowboys a 2-1 edge in the last three years. But what about the last four years?

Skins would be tied with the Cowboys, 2-2.

But what about the last five years?

Skins would be ahead of the Cowboys, 3-2.

Last six years?...Skins ahead 4-2.

Seven years?...Skins ahead 5-2.

Playoff wins over the last seven years? Skins ahead there as well, 2-0

Damn...no wonder you're holding on to that meaningless technicality like it's a freakin' life preserver...you were riding the Titanic! :laugh:

[dallasfanforlife]

Oh good lord... :doh:

Ok, we'll be generous and "give" you the technicality and allow Dallas to have done better than the Skins in 2004...lol ...so that gives the Cowboys a 2-1 edge in the last three years. But what about the last four years?

Skins would be tied with the Cowboys, 2-2.

But what about the last five years?

Skins would be ahead of the Cowboys, 3-2.

Last six years?...Skins ahead 4-2.

Seven years?...Skins ahead 5-2.

Playoff wins over the last seven years? Skins ahead there as well, 2-0

Damn...no wonder you're holding on to that meaningless technicality like it's a freakin' life preserver...you were riding the Titanic! :laugh:

No i just like being right, in which i was.....

[pjfootballer]

You know, I see a lot of twisting of words and arguments on this site. Facts are facts and Dallass has beaten us more in the entire history of the series. They have 5 Superbowl wins and we have 3 Superbowl wins and 2 NLF championships. I for one enjoyed beating them twice last year. it doesn't matter if you go back 2 yrs, 10 yrs or 75 yrs. Facts are facts and we just need to look forward to a great season. Sometimes I get frustrated because I don't quote every stat in the book or come up with insider news. I do know that I have watched the Redskins for 30 years and I always have high hopes for every season.

We all have some good and interesting things to contribute here, and I don't know why we have to debate something that happened 3 years ago. we were both 6-10 and sucked. the Eagles spanked the whole division during that time.

The Eagles and Giants had the 60's, the Cowboys and Redskins in the 70's, Redskins and Giants in the 80's, Cowboys in the 90's and the Eagles in the 2000's. (Notice I didn't mention the Cardinals during this whole time.) That is what makes this division one of the best overall.

I don't really know at this point where I'm going with this, but Can't we all just get along? :laugh:

[Smoot Point Really]

I am good with JJ over the rest considering we picked up a fourth and a 1st (Spears) so yes i am!

as for the skins draft do you really need to see this to know how bad the skins drafts have been?

02-Ramsey 1st round....:laugh:

03-Taylor Jacobs, Dockery and Hambden (3 picks total and 2 of them sucked)

04 4 picks total and 2 of them were Mark Wilson and Jim mirano????

05- Manuael White and McCune...thats my fav, cause skin fans just fell in love with his biceps:laugh::laugh:

so in closing Skins dont just screw up fa's they screw up drafts...BAD:laugh:

Oh, my god... Here we go... I only picked out Cowboy's areas of need and what they drafted. I didn't pick out every damned pick, and most of those picks you mention weren't "bad". I see why you didn't want to go back to 2001 (Quincy Carter)...

Let's analyze this:

2002 - Ramsey is a potential starter and wasn't a bad pick for the bottom of the first round. We had a different coach at the time, so we can't blame this on Gibbs. That year we also got Ladell Betts in the 2nd round. The first two rounds weren't bad. Dallas had a decent draft that year, too... How many games did Gurode start last year? Of course, when you pick with the 8th pick in the draft, you should get a pretty decent player.

2003 - Redskins had 3 picks... Derrick Dockery is a stud. Taylor Jacobs is a bust. Still, not a Gibbs guy. Dallas? Had the 5th pick in the draft (they suck or what?) Terence Newman (25 year old rookie), Jason Witten, Al Johnson, then a bunch of crap... Still, a decent year.

2004 - Here is when my Dallas friends go nuts... All four drafted players for the Redskins made the roster and have contributed to the team (albeit Wilson less than Molinaro). Dallas on the other hand absolutely needed a RB and there were RBs falling on the draft board all day. They chose to trade down for "future considerations" and got stuck with Julius Jones (who is a decent back), but he's nowhere near as talented as the Kevin Jones and Steven Jackson. The rest of the draft was a complete failure and their other 2nd round pick was a guy who isn't even in the NFL anymore.

2005 - The Redskins lost Smoot and needed a CB, so they picked up Carlos Rogers. We'll see how that pans out. They also traded up to take Jason Campbell, and I admit I think it was a bad move. The only reason we're having this discussion is because I agree with you the 'skins suck at drafting. It's your notion that the Cowboys are great at it that needs to be corrected. Dallas did fine getting DeMarcus Ware and Marcus Spears, but those were only areas of need because they wanted to go to a 3-4 scheme. It was basically an area of need that was manufactured by the coach, and they chose two guys who play relatively the same position and Merriman was the highest rated guy on the board at that position when they chose Ware. Then they chose another OLB in the 2nd round, Kevin Burnett who they were so happy with they picked up Akin Ayodele in the offseason. Marion Barber has played well, but basically wouldn't be a factor if Steven Jackson were on this team.

2006 - I won't comment any further on this other than to see the Cowboys again didn't address their primary area of weakness. *yawns* bored of this topic.

[ArmchairRedskin]

No i just like being right, in which i was.....

Man, you should really pick your battles better. What a crappy thing to argue about. "My team's 6-10 record was better than your team's"? Come on man! :laugh:

[Califan007 The Constipated]

No i just like being right, in which i was.....

No, you weren't "right"...the meaning of the original post was about records, nothing more. You turned it into something else by delving into tie-breaking systems (I'm surprised you didn't mention whether Dallas scored more points against common teams on the road, an obvious indicator of who came out "ahead" in division foes ). The argument wasn't even about which team was better--so sweeping the Skins would have meant jack **** to the debate. 6-10 is NOT better than 6-10, no matter whether NFL.com decided to use divisional records to determine the order to list each team that has the exact same record, or if they determined the listing alphabetically.

[LoudMouth12thMan]

And Dallas has won more postseason game and SBs

Congrats on the moral victory

Wrong again...dude you're consistant in making b.s. posts. We have 5 championships. Call 'um what you want. And post season appearances don't matter, do they? Or do you think a team like the Iggles are satisfied with their "post season" appearances? We have the same championship victories. 5 my friend. Nice try Cowpie :dallasuck

HTTR!

[bubba9497]

sure looks like they are ahead to me...on top means ahead of.

:laugh:

and some times they are listed alphabetically.... so since D comes before W...

Dude, refusing to accept being wrong is not being right Cal.007 is absolutely right, you are trying to change the parameters of the original point made.

When you say a team finished X number wins..... you are talking about overall record. Period. The Skins had a better NFC Record, so by that parameter did they "finish" better than the Cowboys?

How many times has Dallas finished ahead of the Skins in the last 7 years again? Oh, that's right, once. What time of year is Dallas' time to shine? I know, when Manzier's go on sale at J.C. Penney. Parcells is all over that.

I don't see anything specific about NFC East record, head to head match ups, W/L record against the AFC, or even using a tie breaker... etc....

6-10 vs 6-10... Regardless of who you beat and who you lost to, or by how much, or where... or any other qualifier you try to add, it doesn't change the fact both teams finished 6-10.

I know you have dug yourself into a huge hole, but sometimes it's better to admit defeat, and move on... than keep digging a deeper and deeper hole.

[LoudMouth12thMan]

why do you guys get stuck on TO. So you all can't understand how philly can benifit from losing TO and Dallas can improve with TO? Is there something that skin fans as a whole drink that makes you stupid or is it just a natural progression of life as a Skin fan?

Some players do leave teams to go to other teams...those players can help the teams they goto, and the teams that get rid of them can benifit.......its not that hard to understand really.

It's called behavioral characteristics, history of poor behavior, total disregard for others, pyschological indifference with regard to himself and his teammates. He has displayed this overall selfism on EVERY TEAM HE'S BEEN ON. Have fun...oh, and tell Bill Parcells I can't babysit for him next week, I'll be in VA watching a team with real "team" players.

HTTR!

P.S. Yer' welcome for the "Psych" lesson. Easy on the name calling pal...Yer' gonna have a tough time around these here parts...hyuk hyuk hyuk...Friggin' Cowpies :doh:

[XxSpearheadxX]

I guess it was either "They are in trouble if both of their starting CBs go down" or "They overpaid"

How do we seem to have the reputation of signing everyone and anyone we want but still "overpay". You would think these guys would have at least played Madden or something... even then you would have a better idea of salary structure in the NFL than some guys seem to have - let alone that they should actually learn how these things go and not just bob their heads like chickens.

I like the A though :laugh:

[bubba9497]

Easy on the name calling pal...Yer' gonna have a tough time around these here parts...hyuk hyuk hyuk...Friggin' Cowpies :doh:

exactly, it's against board rules as well

[natsfan3]

Lets see, He drafted the following players:

Terrence Newman, DeMarcus Ware, Jason Witten, Bradie James, Julies Jones, Marcus Spears, Bobby Carpenter, Chris Canty, Patrick Crayton, and Rob Pettiti.

Hmmm, Those look like pretty damn good draft choices. I see 3+ possible pro-bowlers in there. (Witten already twice)

Yeah, Parcells is dumb as a stump.

I guess your color blind!!!!!

[Eternal_Cowboy]

Wrong again...dude you're consistant in making b.s. posts. We have 5 championships. Call 'um what you want. And post season appearances don't matter, do they? Or do you think a team like the Iggles are satisfied with their "post season" appearances? We have the same championship victories. 5 my friend. Nice try Cowpie :dallasuck

HTTR!

Apparently, you cannot read. I said playoff wins, not playoff appearences, and i said SBs, not championships

Nice job kicking your own ass

[dallasfanforlife]

:laugh:

and some times they are listed alphabetically.... so since D comes before W...

Dude, refusing to accept being wrong is not being right Cal.007 is absolutely right, you are trying to change the parameters of the original point made.

When you say a team finished X number wins..... you are talking about overall record. Period. The Skins had a better NFC Record, so by that parameter did they "finish" better than the Cowboys?

guys you need to read back and see...the original friggin argument was "dallas has finished ahead of Washington 2 of the last 3 seasons"....your both wrong and i am right. it had nothing to do with records...i knew that when i started the stupid argument...you really think i didnt know that they were both 6-10? Come on guys, imma Dallas fan, which by definition makes me smarter then you.......

Bubba, does N come before D? Then why is NY ahead of Dallas? duh! because the Giants finished ahead of Dallas.....

[TheMalcolmConnection]

Just as I said pages ago, this thread is turning into "Death by a Thousand Qualifications". Look up that term. You can go back this far and say the Skins were better, you can go back further and say the Cowboys were better. You can debate single years versus playoff years. You can debate conference wins versus conference losses. Do you notice the circular argument?

All that matters to me is 2-0 against the Cowboys last year.

Just like I mentioned above the FA and draft arguments can go MANY, MANY different directions. Quincy Carter, Taylor Jacobs, Drew Henson, Patrick Ramsey. How quickly we forget the moves that actually panned out. It's interesting to note that most Skin's fans quickly give credit to the Cowboys for their draft moves or FA moves, but when Snyder opens up the vaults and signs and up-and-comer all we can remember is 2000?

Selective memory much?

If you're going to go with facts, go with ALL the facts.

[XxSpearheadxX]

Just as I said pages ago, this thread is turning into "Death by a Thousand Qualifications". Look up that term. You can go back this far and say the Skins were better, you can go back further and say the Cowboys were better. You can debate single years versus playoff years. You can debate conference wins versus conference losses. Do you notice the circular argument?

All that matters to me is 2-0 against the Cowboys last year.

If you're going to go with facts, go with ALL the facts..

I know for a fact this isn't the first time you've heard this, nor is this necessarily the thread to say it in, but I love your sig and it makes me laugh outloud almost every time I see it.

Sean's face is priceless. :rotflmao: :jump: :rotflmao:

Like Madden always says, "The Champ is the Champ until the next Championship" I believe that applies to rivalries as well. It is why colleges sometimes hold a trophy of sorts for their rivalries - so there is no sour grapes back talk, all they have to do is wave said trophy - until next season.

I am very excited for the Cowboy fans who are not aware to see how Sean T. is able to cover prototype large WRs one on one man 2 man like stink on :pooh:

There is no other team I would rather have TO on, even with the risk of him having an all-decade type year, it is so exciting to see those two matched up against each other.

[TheHumanHitstick#21]

good post at least he didn't says ones of our bad things was letting arrington go