Art Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 I'm just coming off from a heavy work week and haven't been able to read all the posts here. I have seen some, mostly from some of our friendly opposition fans, that seem to speak to a mindset that is somewhat troubling. Gosh and golly, they say, every team has bad calls against them, so, why are we acting like it hurts us more than other teams. The clear stupidity of this sentiment is not lost on anyone who actually is paying attention to what types of calls are being made that ARE bad and when they are being made. When a questionable officials call DIRECTLY takes away points that would have put one team ahead of another, this is not your standard bad call that everyone has to live with. It's not a questionable holding call on a third and 3 on a play that nets 2 yards. It's not inconsequentially bad. It's bad to the degree it removes the game from the players and puts it in the pockets of the officials. The touchdown to Portis should have stood. Just as earlier in the year the officials gifted a touchdown to Dallas and removed some points from us in a close game. Bad calls that give or remove points, effect the game like turnovers. They change games. It's not a simple first down being removed. In our last drive, Portis caught the ball over the middle, made a move, and was tripped. His knees never hit the ground. His elbow, hip, anything, never hit the ground. He got up to keep running. The officials blew him down. Another bad call. But, no one is talking about it because it didn't really impact the outcome. Maybe Portis scoots out of bounds for another 10 yards. But, it's irrelevant to the outcome of the game. You see those bad calls and wonder what the officials are looking at. But, you don't complain about it because it doesn't matter. But, when you have the go ahead touchdown being taken away because an official incorrectly calls a penalty that takes points away, you have reason to be concerned about the officiating. And, no, no team can say they've had multiple points given or taken away by the officials DIRECTLY on those plays like the Redskins can right now. I suspect even the dullards trying to claim all teams go through this know this, and yet, can't get themselves to say so, because, well, I'll let you figure that out . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktball74 Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Amen Art! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fifty Gut Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 I just have a feeling the officials don't respect a losing team. If you haven't proved yourself in the league the officials got no respect for a team that is trying to win a close one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chokingdogs Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 my thought on the bad call, and it was a bad call, is that had the offense managed to score a td, or at least a fg, in the first four drives of the game that all ended in punts or an int, that may have been just another bad call. in essence, that call didnt cost them the game, the play of the offense for 55 minutes prior, did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walking Deadman Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 I think that the Refs should be penalized by the NFL for big mistakes (Sadly, this game wouldn't count- but the Dallas game would!) including suspensions, fines and or being taken off of big games. I get tired at the NFL's letter of apology: " Dear Redskins, we are sad to inform you that there were clear errors in our officiating in the last game- we aplolgize for the error but will do nothing about it, have a nice day- THE NFL". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Diggler Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 I feel ya brotha. :mad: And it's also worth noting that there has been no time in NFL History where the teams have ever been so closely bunched together in terms of talent and coaching ability. This isn't the 1991 Skins against the Cardinals or Browns where you can say we have no business even being that close with a team. This is the age of parity. Officiating is more important today than it has ever been. Bad calls can determine the outcomes of games. If you have to have more officials on the field to prevent this than it should be done. If you have to fire the officials who are obviously too old to be out there and hire younger ones than do it. Spend more money. If you have to review penalties than do it. Notice I did not say increase the number of opportunities for reviewing plays - the games would take 5 hours. But why can't you review penalties? And why blow a play dead if you think a play MIGHT be down - preventing a possible recovery of a fumble. Why can't they just let the play go until it's obvious a player is down? These mistakes are not reviewable and they should be. Sheesh. :cuss: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulldog Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 the fact remains that the Redskins had 10-0 leads on Baltimore and Cleveland and failed to come out of the locker room after the half with the offense doing even minimal damage. THAT and not officiating cost us TWO games. against the Giants, 7 turnovers cost us a game that was less than a touchdown even with all the gifts. so, while I agree there have been some bad calls, the Skins could chalk up the Dallas and Green Bay games as being lost due to these unfortunate circumstances but still have a 5-2 record if we had only taken care of business in the other contests. THAT is the bottom line. Baltimore was the most egregious loss as the Ravens offense didn't even score the winning points, instead the Redskins offense gave them 7 points and the special teams surrendered the other 7. Where is the special teams? We have had no big returns this season, no game changing plays in terms of blocked kicks, we have had spotty coverage at best, etc. You add that to an often comatose offense and you aren't going to win very many games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pr11fan Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 I agree Art that it was a horrible and at the least cost us the opportunity to win the game, but I look at that game and think if we had any kind of passing game that game shouldn't have ever come down to something like that. JMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdsknbill Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 I heard that this officiating crew had been suspended for suspect calls in the past. Anyone else hear this??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fred Jones Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 The biggest thing that bothers me about officiating is consistency. I still play competitive sports and get tired of many refs inability to call plays consistently. Thrash has been going in motion all season, including in that game, and the Refs have not flagged him. I don't have a problem if the Refs decide to start flagging a particular penalty as long as they consistently call the penalty against both teams. You just adapt your play to the way the refs are officiating the game. If you get flagged, it is your fault for not adapting. I also agree, that the Refs should not make a call that decides the outcome of a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f_dallas Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Art, I'm not surprised you feel that way- you are a Redskins fan and you're not happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neophyte Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Originally posted by f_dallas Art, I'm not surprised you feel that way- you are a Redskins fan and you're not happy. You say that like we don't have a real beef... I watch a lot of football, not just Skins games. At least 2 on Sundays but often it more like all of the Skins game and then parts of all the ones in the other afternoon time slot, plus a good bit of the MNF game. I can honestly say I have not seen any other bad calls this year that have removed points from a teams score or given the other team points. The Skins have had at least 3. I say this as a football fan, not a Skins fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f_dallas Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 You say that like we don't have a real beef... I'm not sure whether or not the call was bogus- I haven't even seen it yet. I just never use penalties as an excuse for anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonkeySkin Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Players get penalized and fined for endzone dances, but nothing ever happens to these dam refs :doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monte51Coleman Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Last night the Jets ran a man in motion exactly like Thrash did, on almost every other play, and there never was a penalty called. Their man in motion never came to a stop at the end of the line and squared himself to the los. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f_dallas Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Players get penalized and fined for endzone dances, but nothing ever happens to these dam refs I agree 100%. I don't know what the answer is because it's really not fair to fine them for missed calls, but maybe a grading system that determines whether or not they get a pay raise or whether or not they are hired back the next year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morning Wood Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Originally posted by f_dallas I'm not sure whether or not the call was bogus- I haven't even seen it yet. I just never use penalties as an excuse for anything. If you haven't seen the play in question, then howsabout keeping your trap closed on the subject? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjinhan Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 for those that say well its a bad call but we lost because we played bad until that point, if we played better then we should have won regardless. well thats so stupid, why dont you also say if GB continued to play like how they played in the first half... that bad call by the ref wouldnt have matter... how we played until or after that bad call is irrelavent... it was just a bad call... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clubisyohankovic Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Why wouldn't they just make EVERY single play reviewable? It wouldn't lengthen the game, because the teams would still only be allowed 2 or 3 reviews per game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f_dallas Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 If you haven't seen the play in question, then howsabout keeping your trap closed on the subject? I dunno...I'll stop commenting on the subject. I just don't think games are decided by penalties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntotoro Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Originally posted by sjinhan for those that say well its a bad call but we lost because we played bad until that point, if we played better then we should have won regardless. well thats so stupid, why dont you also say if GB continued to play like how they played in the first half... that bad call by the ref wouldnt have matter... how we played until or after that bad call is irrelavent... it was just a bad call... The team did step it up, though. They ultimately played well enough to win, then had it taken away from them. That's what is so hard to take. You could tell afterward how demoralized they were. They made great halftime adjustments and got a lot of things done that they didn't in the first half. You can't make adjustmenst for a bad call, though. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bulldog Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 why couldn't the Redskins overcome the adversity and go on to score the go ahead touchdown anyway, despite the call on the Portis catch? it's called heart folks. this offense is playing too scared to face even the slightest adversity and bounce back positively, and that is from Brunell on down to the younger players. obviously with Favre the Packers feel they are never really out of games. I don't think the players on this offense truly believe in Brunell and have confidence he will lead them to a win. It may be the lack of talent they see in the arm or in a combination of that declining skill and Brunell's lack of self-confidence and willingness to stand in and take some shots in the pocket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Om Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Originally posted by bulldog why couldn't the Redskins overcome the adversity and go on to score the go ahead touchdown anyway, despite the call on the Portis catch? it's called heart folks ... I think you're right, bulldog ... did you see that heartless Rod Gardner stop his route on that last INT play and yank his shoulder pad out of his jersey instead of show up where the ball was thrown? What a puss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrfriedm Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 Originally posted by Mittens I just have a feeling the officials don't respect a losing team. If you haven't proved yourself in the league the officials got no respect when your trying to close to winning one. How can we be a winning team with Burnell as the QB?:doh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobzmuda Posted November 2, 2004 Share Posted November 2, 2004 It's obvious those are terrible calls, Art, that cost the Redskins' points, and likely a game or two. But the point remains there is nothing the coaches can do to change the past. That is for the message board crowd to grouse over. The coaches would be better served just getting on with the business of coaching as there is a great deal of that to do on the offensive side of the ball. Speculating about potential scenarios that would have resulted if those bad calls had not been made is about as worthless as speculating what would have happened if Jansen hadn't gotten hurt. There's no way to tell what would have happened. And for many, including myself, the bickering about a non-controllable variable, like terrible calls, only serves to mask the terrible performance regarding a controllable variable: the performance of the offense as coached by Joe Gibbs. As head coach, and true offensive coordinatory, he is ultimately responsible for the offensive output of this team. And he has failed so far. How much of that failure is attributable to injuries, adjustment to the "new" NFL, terrible calls, etc. is irrelevant. The buck stops with him. Unfortunately, so has the offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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