The Official QB Thread- JD5 taken #2. Randall 2.0 or Bayou Bob? Mariotta and Hartman forever. Fromm cut

[Jds0912]

2 minutes ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

Four Pick 6 INTs in one season.  Yes, I believe Heinicke is better.  He makes fewer disastrous mistakes.

 

Stafford would be 4 - 13 at best if he played on the WFT.  And the Rams would be better with Heinicke.

There’s no way you’re not trolling dude

[Theismann to HOF]

49 minutes ago, Jds0912 said:

Sean Mcvay, great guy. Very handsome. Got his autograph after a game years back. He might be 5’7 tops. Wish he was our coach though. I guarantee he would’ve found us a franchise qb by now. 

 

Yeah?  McVay hasn't found one for the Rams yet.

3 minutes ago, Jds0912 said:

There’s no way you’re not trolling dude

 

You're too in love with stats.  Stafford makes too many costly mistakes to be considered an elite QB.

[seantaylor=god]

Whether he’s trolling or just has an absolutely ludicrous opinion he needs to go away, it’s completely hijacking this thread.

 

I think my favorite option is trading a first and a player for Wilson. At least that makes the team fun to watch. If they feel really strongly about a QB in this draft that’s fine but I don’t really see it.

 

 

[Jds0912]

1 minute ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

Yeah?  McVay hasn't found one for the Rams yet.

I’m with you man, I love TH. I Think he’s better than most people in this thread do. But you have to snap out of it. He is not better than Stafford. It’s just not true. I’m your friend, I’m not your enemy. 

[Theismann to HOF]

33 minutes ago, Jericho said:

Derek Carr is okay, though I think overrated by many on this board. He's in that Kirk Cousins tier of guys that put up numbers, but don't seem to win very much. Those teams always seem to be looking for an upgrade, which is what the Raiders did for years. But it's hard to find a good QB and Carr just keeps chugging along. That said, I'm hard pressed to believe the next Raiders GM/coach will voluntarily trade away the one player that keeps the Raiders semi-decent. It's not a good look for the franchise to take a huge step back when you get hired. I'd also says its very questionable to trade significant assets for a QB that will be 31 next year. Historically, QBs take their first step back at age 31, with the second big drop off at 34. Brunell, McNabb, and Alex Smith were all 34 when acquired, so I suppose getting a 31 year old is a small step forward. But trading a first (or more) for Carr is basically selling out for mediocrity for a few years.

 

Jimmy G is okay. Another player overrated by many some of this board. But super injury prone and actually fairly turnover prone. There's a reason SF runs and runs and runs. He's an okay fill in, but given all his limitations I wouldn't want to give up that much for him. Shouldn't be more than a 2nd rounder, and even that might be too rich.

 

Rodgers is a future HOFer still playing at a high level. I really see no reason for him to leave GB. If he somehow forces his way out, Washington has to be way down the list of destinations. Some place like Pittsburgh would make more sense.

 

Wilson turns 34 next year, which is somewhat concerning given the Brunell/McNabb/Smith moves. I also wonder if his small stature will catch up with him in terms of taking all those hits. As a comparison, Roethlisberger's last good year was at age 36. But Wilson is clearly several tiers above a Jimmy G type. The question is for how long? I'd be hesitant to give up a ton if I wasn't on the cusp on winning. Also, with Wilson, it's a two way street. With a no trade clause, he can basically pick his destination. I'm guessing it's not here.

 

There's plausibly Cousins. For obvious reasons, I doubt this comes to pass. Minnesota also has the same issues as the Raiders. What does the next coach/GM want to do with Cousins? The fact Minnesota did not make the playoffs this year (while Vegas did) and Cousins' crazy cap hit do make moving him more likely something happens. But again, I  don't see it happening here.

 

Matt Ryan will be 37 next year. If Washington somehow got him, I'd expect him to show up washed up and be a complete disappointment.

 

Watson. A wild card in terms of legal issues. Some write him off on moral grounds. And he also has a no trade clause. But he's the one guy still young enough that you'd easily get 5-6 years out of him (and plausibly a lot more). He's also a clear tier above most of the other options except Rodgers and Wilson. But he's really the only option of a real answer that isn't just settling for mediocrity or trying to squeeze one more year out of a future HOFer.

 

If you don't like any of those, they you hope and pray someone you like is available in the draft.

 

Cousins is definitely NOT better than Heinicke.  Cousins is not capable of leading 5 game-winning drives the way that Heinicke did this season.  I watched Cousins play for 5 years in Washington, he usually doesn't play well when the game is on the line.

 

And Heinicke is already better than Ryan.  Heinicke thoroughly outplayed Ryan in the Falcons game earlier this year.

[mistertim]

6 minutes ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

Four Pick 6 INTs in one season.  Yes, I believe Heinicke is better.  He makes fewer disastrous mistakes.

 

Stafford would be 4 - 13 at best if he played on the WFT.  And the Rams would be better with Heinicke.

 

Carr is on about the same level as Heinicke, but a lot more expensive.  Jimmy G is definitely not an upgrade over Heinicke.

 

And Wilson is not the same player.  He looked very ordinary against the WFT.  It would be a huge mistake to spend a lot on him.  At this point in Wilson's career, Heinicke is better.

 

Oh cool, so now Heinicke is also better than a future HoFer as well in Wilson. 

 

So Stafford with his 41 TDs and 17 INTs would have gone 4-13 vs Heinicke's 20 TDs and 15 INTs?

[Jds0912]

3 minutes ago, seantaylor=god said:

Whether he’s trolling or just has an absolutely ludicrous opinion he needs to go away, it’s completely hijacking this thread.

 

I think my favorite option is trading a first and a player for Wilson. At least that makes the team fun to watch. If they feel really strongly about a QB in this draft that’s fine but I don’t really see it.

 

 

I’d give a first and a player for Wilson any day. 

[Theismann to HOF]

1 hour ago, daveakl said:

TH doesn't have the arm strength to make NFL throws. He does fine on unscripted stuff and can make an incredible escape from time to time.

 

You can't build a NFL offense around unscripted plays. And you can't build a NFL offense around a guy that can't make NFL throws. 

 

Vegas fired their GM. Go get Carr.

 

He doesn't have the "arm strength", yet he led 5 game-winning drives and completed 65% of his passes.

 

Heinicke is obviously doing something right.

[Jds0912]

2 minutes ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

Cousins is definitely NOT better than Heinicke.  Cousins is not capable of leading 5 game-winning drives the way that Heinicke did this season.  I watched Cousins play for 5 years in Washington, he usually doesn't play well when the game is on the line.

 

And Heinicke is already better than Ryan.  Heinicke thoroughly outplayed Ryan in the Falcons game earlier this year.

Do you follow Qanon? 

[mistertim]

4 minutes ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

Cousins is definitely NOT better than Heinicke.  Cousins is not capable of leading 5 game-winning drives the way that Heinicke did this season.  I watched Cousins play for 5 years in Washington, he usually doesn't play well when the game is on the line.

 

And Heinicke is already better than Ryan.  Heinicke thoroughly outplayed Ryan in the Falcons game earlier this year.

 

Cousins had 4 game winning drives this past season. Same exact number as Heinicke.

 

And this is coming from someone who's far from a Kirk Cousins homer.

[Theismann to HOF]

9 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

Oh cool, so now Heinicke is also better than a future HoFer as well in Wilson. 

 

So Stafford with his 41 TDs and 17 INTs would have gone 4-13 vs Heinicke's 20 TDs and 15 INTs?

 

Yes, Stafford with his zero mobility would have gone out on a stretcher against Dallas.  He is not a better athlete than Heinicke and he is not a better QB than Heinicke.

 

Here is the stat that matters most -- Stafford giving 24 points to the other team in one season via four Pick 6 INTs.

 

Two of Heinicke's INTs were on Hail Mary passes against Denver.  Two more were in garbage time in the 4th quarter against the Packers and Chiefs, when the games were already over.  Heinicke has done a good job protecting the ball this season, especially for his first season as a starter and with a lot of offensive weapons missing.

8 minutes ago, Jds0912 said:

I’d give a first and a player for Wilson any day. 

 

Did you see how horrible Wilson looked when they played the WFT earlier this year?

 

Yeah, Wilson supposedly played with a bad finger, but he is on the decline.

Edited January 18, 2022 by Theismann to HOF

[mistertim]

1 minute ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

Yes, Stafford with his zero mobility would have gone out on a stretcher against Dallas.  He is not a better athlete than Heinicke and he is not a better QB than Heinicke.

 

Here is the stat that matters most -- Stafford giving 24 points to the other team in one season via four Pick 6 INTs.

 

Two of Heinicke's INTs were on Hail Mary passes against Denver.  Two more were in garbage time in the 4th quarter against the Packers and Chiefs, when the games were already over.  Heinicke has done a good job protecting the ball this season, especially for his first season as a starter and with a lot of offensive weapons missing.

 

If you really want to get into the weeds, Heinicke also had at least 10 passes that literally hit defenders in the hands and they dropped. So he had quite a bit of luck on that front as well.

 

But I'm still waiting for you to tell me which FOs and/or coaches would take Heinicke over Stafford.

 

Again, nobody agrees with you on this one so you're basically on an island here. I'd be floored if any team would give up more than a 5th rounder for Heinike, but Stafford cost a 1st plus more. But what do all these FOs and coaches know? They clearly are just not versed in the magical creature that is Taylor Heinicke.

[Rufus T Firefly]

24 minutes ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

Four Pick 6 INTs in one season.  Yes, I believe Heinicke is better.  He makes fewer disastrous mistakes.

 

Stafford would be 4 - 13 at best if he played on the WFT.  And the Rams would be better with Heinicke.

 

Carr is on about the same level as Heinicke, but a lot more expensive.  Jimmy G is definitely not an upgrade over Heinicke.

 

And Wilson is not the same player.  He looked very ordinary against the WFT.  It would be a huge mistake to spend a lot on him.  At this point in Wilson's career, Heinicke is better.

[Jds0912]

7 minutes ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

Yes, Stafford with his zero mobility would have gone out on a stretcher against Dallas.  He is not a better athlete than Heinicke and he is not a better QB than Heinicke.

 

Here is the stat that matters most -- Stafford giving 24 points to the other team in one season via four Pick 6 INTs.

 

Two of Heinicke's INTs were on Hail Mary passes against Denver.  Two more were in garbage time in the 4th quarter against the Packers and Chiefs, when the games were already over.  Heinicke has done a good job protecting the ball this season, especially for his first season as a starter and with a lot of offensive weapons missing.

 

Did you see how horrible Wilson looked when they played the WFT earlier this year?

 

Yeah, Wilson supposedly played with a bad finger, but he is on the decline.

In a down year he still threw 25 tds and 6 ints in 14 games. He would instantly become the best qb we’ve had in franchise history. 

[Conn]

This is getting boring folks. He’s responding to 15 different people by repeating the same 4 talking points over and over. We could create a bot to do that. Just stop quoting him, he’s not even making it fun. People catching up on this thread are already gonna be necro-quoting his earlier posts for days reigniting the fire. Let’s exercise some self control and do something more productive with our posts, like hating ourselves and cursing our timeline. 

[Theismann to HOF]

10 minutes ago, mistertim said:

 

If you really want to get into the weeds, Heinicke also had at least 10 passes that literally hit defenders in the hands and they dropped. So he had quite a bit of luck on that front as well.

 

But I'm still waiting for you to tell me which FOs and/or coaches would take Heinicke over Stafford.

 

Again, nobody agrees with you on this one so you're basically on an island here. I'd be floored if any team would give up more than a 5th rounder for Heinike, but Stafford cost a 1st plus more. But what do all these FOs and coaches know? They clearly are just not versed in the magical creature that is Taylor Heinicke.

 

I believe Tampa's GM would take Heinicke over Stafford.  After what Heinicke has done to Tampa twice in the past year.  Stafford couldn't do that.  Neither could Cousins.

 

If you're so in love with Stafford's stats, then you must be in love with Cousins as well.  Because his stats are better.  They are both very ordinary QBs that play on pass-happy teams with good offensive talent.  There is nothing special about either one of them.

Edited January 18, 2022 by Theismann to HOF

[Jds0912]

2 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

This is getting boring folks. He’s responding to 15 different people by repeating the same 4 talking points over and over. We could create a bot to do that. Just stop quoting him, he’s not even making it fun. People catching up on this thread are already gonna be necro-quoting his earlier posts for days reigniting the fire. Let’s exercise some self control and do something more productive with our posts, like hating ourselves and cursing our timeline. 

You’re right. It’s going to ruin the thread if we keep on. I’m finished starting now. 

[Theismann to HOF]

14 minutes ago, Jds0912 said:

In a down year he still threw 25 tds and 6 ints in 14 games. He would instantly become the best qb we’ve had in franchise history. 

 

If you say so.  Wilson definitely wasn't impressive against the WFT.  It would be a bad gamble for the WFT to spend a fortune on him.  

[Ball Security]

37 minutes ago, seantaylor=god said:

Whether he’s trolling or just has an absolutely ludicrous opinion he needs to go away, it’s completely hijacking this thread.

 

I think my favorite option is trading a first and a player for Wilson. At least that makes the team fun to watch. If they feel really strongly about a QB in this draft that’s fine but I don’t really see it.

 

 

What if that player is Terry.  Do you do it?

[Theismann to HOF]

It's completely ridiculous how so many of you having giving up on Heinicke after only one season as a starter.  What great QB plays their best football during their first season as a starter?  

 

The guy could be special if given the opportunity.  And no free agent QB is going to come here and play significantly better than Heinicke.

[Ball Security]

9 minutes ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

If you say so.  Wilson definitely wasn't impressive against the WFT.  It would be a bad gamble for the WFT to spend a fortune on him.  

If Wilson is on the decline, how did he put up 89 points in two games?  Heinicke couldn’t put up 89 points in his final five starts.

9 minutes ago, Theismann to HOF said:

It's completely ridiculous how so many of you having giving up on Heinicke after only one season as a starter.  What great QB plays their best football during their first season as a starter?  

 

The guy could be special if given the opportunity.  And no free agent QB is going to come here and play significantly better than Heinicke.

What great QB this century doesn’t get a chance to start until they are 28?

[Theismann to HOF]

5 minutes ago, Ball Security said:

 

 

5 minutes ago, Ball Security said:

If Wilson is on the decline, how did he put up 89 points in two games?  Heinicke couldn’t put up 89 points in his final five starts.

 

Josh Allen only put up 6 points against the lowly Jaguars.  I guess you're saying he sucks, too.

Edited January 18, 2022 by Theismann to HOF

[Ball Security]

1 minute ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

 

Josh Allen only put up 6 points against the lowly Jaguars.  I guess you're saying he sucks, too.

No, I’m not saying Allen sucks.  We’re talking about the same Allen that has put up over 30 points 10 times this season.  That Allen?   But let’s hear about how Heinicke is better than him and if he was on Buffalo they’d win 15 games and if Allen was on Washington they’d only win 5 or 6.

[Theismann to HOF]

1 minute ago, Ball Security said:

No, I’m not saying Allen sucks.  We’re talking about the same Allen that has put up over 30 points 10 times this season.  That Allen?   But let’s hear about how Heinicke is better than him and if he was on Buffalo they’d win 15 games and if Allen was on Washington they’d only win 5 or 6.

 

It's a team game.  Allen isn't doing anything by himself.

 

Maybe one day you'll understand that.

[Ball Security]

2 minutes ago, Theismann to HOF said:

 

It's a team game.  Allen isn't doing anything by himself.

 

Maybe one day you'll understand that.

Is Heinicke better than Allen?

Is Heinicke better than Herbert?

Is Heinicke better than Burrow?