2022 Comprehensive Draft Thread

[Skinsinparadise]

49 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

 

Payne and Roullier are both way too low.  Payne has been our best player on D and Roullier has been our second best on offense since Scherff went down.  I think Heinicke's grade is too low too.  He's only had two bad games against three good ones.

 

For some reason over the years they've graded other run stopping DTs especially the guys who play for the Giants really high like Tomlinson.   They also loved Snacks.  They don't seem to love Payne in their gradings over the years, its not that he gets bad grades but they seem to be stuck on good with him. They have been big typically on Jonathan Allen. 

[KDawg]

13 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

For some reason over the years they've graded other run stopping DTs especially the guys who play for the Giants really high like Tomlinson.   They also loved Snacks.  They don't seem to love Payne in their gradings over the years, its not that he gets bad grades but they seem to be stuck on good with him. They have been big typically on Jonathan Allen. 

My guess is it has to do with the percentage of snaps he 2-gaps vs. other DTs and they are assigning him as a "miss". Or they are grading him thinking he's 2-gapping when he isn't.

 

PFF doesn't know a lot about a lot. 75% of their grades are solid to get an idea though. But there are somethings that they just don't know enough about to grade.

[Koolblue13]

MLB&FS 1&2. Double down on a strength. Safeties usually go early in the second, because it's a devalued position. MLBs don't enter FA. It's a low price position and makes more sense to overpay your own, then let them go.

 

Double dip QB after that, but finish this defense off. Our offense isn't that far off. 

[philibusters]

I haven't really watched Corral yet other than a couple series when I flick on his game during the commercials of another game I am watching, but I am definitely intrigued.

 

That said I am totally fine trying to trade a third rounder for Tua or going after Trubisky in free agency and continuing to build the rest of the team.  

[Skinsinparadise]

14 minutes ago, KDawg said:

My guess is it has to do with the percentage of snaps he 2-gaps vs. other DTs and they are assigning him as a "miss". Or they are grading him thinking he's 2-gapping when he isn't.

 

PFF doesn't know a lot about a lot. 75% of their grades are solid to get an idea though. But there are somethings that they just don't know enough about to grade.

 

Could be.  I used to think that they just don't dig run stopping DTs, nose tackles, etc, but they grade plenty of other players like that highly so that threw me off.  They like Payne.  They don't love him.  They love Jonathan Allen.

 

Agree though you got to take PFF with a grain of salt.  I am not with the people who find it worthless crap.  I also don't see it as gospel.  I just find it interesting at times.  If you listen to some of their anaylists, they've talked about the position they have the most confidence in their grading is the O line.  I heard an ex-scout in an interview this summer say they like to use PFF but more for their subcategory breakdowns.  And the one position they don't take PFF too seriously is their grades of the secondary.

 

I get the subcategory breakdown idea.  When I do my draft takes and look up the PFF grades I find my takes match their subgrades pretty well.  Like contested catch grades.  Blocking grades, etc.  I watch Tremble for example and love his blocking.  I check PFF scores and they love his blocking, too.  Stuff like that. 

Edited October 12, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Going Commando]

1 hour ago, philibusters said:

I agree we are paying Fuller too much based on his production but I wouldn't let him go.  His salary will be 8 million next year (for a salary cap it of 11,125,000 as his signing counts as 3,125,000 per year).  If you cut him you have 6.25 million in dead cap (3,125,000 for two years).  If we use our first rounder on a corner and we want to get the rookie reps than it makes sense to cut Fuller, otherwise I think it doesn't make sense to cut him next year.

 

I agree with you again.

 

I love the intellectual energy you are putting into your posts @philibusters, and I'm here for it.  Most of us, myself included, are too burnt out by the disappointing course this season has taken to be thoughtful and rational right now, so it's nice reading a poster who is.

[Going Commando]

I was struck by how good the Ravens OL looked last night, and it got me thinking about if we are overrating the talent level of our OL.  Are they massively overachieving?  Could we realistically run a vertical passing offense against a good defense with a pocket-bound QB?

 

We seem to have done well with run-blocking, but would we still if we increased the frequency of runs due to actually having some leads and wanting to strangle some clock?  Could we actually run the ball against a front playing up?

 

This might be one of those sneaky needs that we can't see coming right now due to the fact the vets on our line are playing so unexpectedly well.

[Skinsinparadise]

7 minutes ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

I was struck by how good the Ravens OL looked last night, and it got me thinking about if we are overrating the talent level of our OL.  Are they massively overachieving?  Could we realistically run a vertical passing offense against a good defense with a pocket-bound QB?

 

We seem to have done well with run-blocking, but would we still if we increased the frequency of runs due to actually having some leads and wanting to strangle some clock?  Could we actually run the ball against a front playing up?

 

This might be one of those sneaky needs that we can't see coming right now due to the fact the vets on our line are playing so unexpectedly well.

 

Like you I am one of the bigger Scherff guys.  But I am uncertain about giving him big money considering his age and injury history.  Seems like Rivera wants him back.  That should be interesting if so.  Scherff's agent seems to think they can get a big score in FA but I wonder if they can get what they want considering Schreff will be 30 with a record of missing games just about every year.  But if he does come back, I think the tandem on the right side with Cosmi could be elite as run blockers.

 

Speaking of PFF, here's a little deeper dive according to their perspective

 

 

Edited October 12, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

I got to get to watching him

 

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

LINEBACKER

POWER FIVE: NAKOBE DEAN, GEORGIA BULLDOGS | 89.3

He’s finally here. Dean is arguably the best linebacker in the country, and his grade now matches his play. Bo Nix and Auburn tried him three times in the passing game, but that resulted in no catches and a Dean interception. Dean also has a quiet nine quarterback pressures on the season.

 

https://www.pff.com/news/college-football-highest-graded-power-5-group-of-5-every-position-college-football-week-6-2021

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

8 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I got to get to watching him

 

 

 

 

Haven't seen him yet, but based on the article that's another QB option to develop for the future.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Wyvern]

SIP, Thanks for the notice about Kenny Pickett.  I liked much of what I saw of him

[BC-Redskins]

A bit random question here but does anyone have any idea or insight to the type of QB Ron wants ?

We have had 2 drafts since he came in and passed on 

Tua

Herbert 

 

due to Chase Young which I get whether right or not !!!!

 

then this year 

 

could we have gotten Fields or Mac who are both different style of QB’s by moving up 

 

Not a qb guru but are we waiting on someone falling into our laps !!!

 

Hopefully we go get our guy this year ??

[Skinsinparadise]

9 hours ago, Wyvern said:

SIP, Thanks for the notice about Kenny Pickett.  I liked much of what I saw of him

 

I am going to try to watch him this Saturday for the first time, I've just watched bits and pieces thus far. 

8 hours ago, BC-Redskins said:

A bit random question here but does anyone have any idea or insight to the type of QB Ron wants ?

We have had 2 drafts since he came in and passed on 

Tua

Herbert 

 

 

Confirmed they chased Stafford.  Multiple reporters said they were pretty sure they liked Fields but were only willing to chase him if he dropped closer to their pick.  One reporter say they heard they liked Jones too but wouldn't trade up for him but would take him at 19.

 

If so it seems like they don't have a type.  Though I see Mac Jones is mischaracerized as a stationary QB, he has sneaky mobility albeit he's not fast.  

Edited October 13, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[bowhunter]

On 10/12/2021 at 10:13 AM, Koolblue13 said:

MLB&FS 1&2. Double down on a strength. Safeties usually go early in the second, because it's a devalued position. MLBs don't enter FA. It's a low price position and makes more sense to overpay your own, then let them go.

 

Double dip QB after that, but finish this defense off. Our offense isn't that far off. 

I agree. This year is a perfect year to consider the trade back option, we aren't (or shouldn't be) chasing the shiny hyped toy at a premium position. If we're at #13, It's a great time to drop into the late first and early second. Pick up a high caliber FS and true MLB. I think Our offense has enough spunk to maintain its top 12 ranking, while our D is ranked #31 for a reason. No new QB is going to be able to overcome such an atrocious defense, and we don't have the draft capital to acquire that caliber of a QB even if such a player existed.

[Koolblue13]

41 minutes ago, bowhunter said:

I agree. This year is a perfect year to consider the trade back option, we aren't (or shouldn't be) chasing the shiny hyped toy at a premium position. If we're at #13, It's a great time to drop into the late first and early second. Pick up a high caliber FS and true MLB. I think Our offense has enough spunk to maintain its top 12 ranking, while our D is ranked #31 for a reason. No new QB is going to be able to overcome such an atrocious defense, and we don't have the draft capital to acquire that caliber of a QB even if such a player existed.

I don't know about trading back yet obviously, but around 13 is where you can get the Kuelchy, Ware, Willis, Mosley, Von Miller types.

 

Although, the second round does seem to be the meat and potatoes of LBers, but I'd rather get a stud than a project. 13 you could be getting the best MLB in the draft and it looks like 3 that will be in that range.

[Skinsinparadise]

The Koramoah hype is driving me crazy.    That was my guy at 19.  Painful.  I don't dislike Jamin, I pushed for him in a trade down but man did I want Koramoah. 😧  I know some others did here, too

 

 

 

1 minute ago, Koolblue13 said:

I don't know about trading back yet obviously, but around 13 is where you can get the Kuelchy, Ware, Willis, Mosley, Von Miller types.

 

Although, the second round does seem to be the meat and potatoes of LBers, but I'd rather get a stud than a project. 13 you could be getting the best MLB in the draft and it looks like 3 that will be in that range.

 

If they have a losing season, which I think they will I'd be stunned if that first rounder isn't going to a QB.    But maybe as a darkhorse idea, Matt Ryan perhaps wouldn't warrant a first and a 2nd and change lands him.

 

I don't know if I want Ryan,  I liked him in his younger years but not sure about now when he's pushing 40.   I think Wilson and Rodgers won't want to come here.  So whose left that you could trade for?

 

I really doubt going in year 3 for Rivera they try for a retread.   I think they end up more aggressive than that. 

Edited October 13, 2021 by Skinsinparadise

[Burgundy Yoda]

I'm not impressed by our 2021 draft class at all. Zero impact from everyone besides Cosmi, who just appears to be solid at his position. 

 

I always see the same problem with this team, players rarely put it together consistently from one year to the next. 

Edited October 13, 2021 by Burgundy Yoda

[Koolblue13]

7 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

The Koramoah hype is driving me crazy.    That was my guy at 19.  Painful.  I don't dislike Jamin, I pushed for him in a trade down but man did I want Koramoah. 😧  I know some others did here, too

 

 

 

 

If they have a losing season, which I think they will I'd be stunned if that first rounder isn't going to a QB.    But maybe as a darkhorse idea, Matt Ryan perhaps wouldn't warrant a first and a 2nd and change lands him.

 

I don't know if I want Ryan,  I liked him in his younger years but not sure about now when he's pushing 40.   I think Wilson and Rodgers won't want to come here.  So whose left that you could trade for?

 

I really doubt going in year 3 for Rivera they try for a retread.   I think they end up more aggressive than that. 

Maybe, but he's been pretty cheap and doesn't get his player, and I don't see that changing. 

 

It's also proven that he will reach in the draft for need, instead of BPA, so he probably will go QB in the draft in round 1, but a boy can dream

 

You know me, I only want to draft defense, unless it's a TE.

[Skinsinparadise]

1 minute ago, Koolblue13 said:

Maybe, but he's been pretty cheap and doesn't get his player, and I don't see that changing. 

 

It's also proven that he will reach in the draft for need, instead of BPA, so he probably will go QB in the draft in round 1, but a boy can dream

 

You know me, I only want to draft defense, unless it's a TE.

 

I am actually more optimistic than most about where they are headed.  They are strong in the trenches on both sides.  They failed it seems to fix the secondary and LB this off season.  But Rivera has a defensive pedigree.  He had good defenses in SD and Carolina.  I actually think its good that those spots have been exposed in a big way.  It adds to a Code Red sentiment to fixing those spots and I think they will do so.  They got enough picks and cap room to do it.

 

For example, I've been rooting from the start of the season for Daniel Jones to do just enough to confuse the Giants brass about whether they need to make a move in the off season at that spot or not.  I purposely didn't want him to crash.   Why?  When you crash, the idea that it needs to be fixed becomes obvious.  I wanted the Giants stuck in purgatory and stuck on maybe.  And its easy to fall into that mindset because you don't have unlimited resources and opportunity at every spot so on some spots almost every team bets on some maybes.  

 

So for us, in one sense, I think there is a strange upside that it crashed at those spots with no ambiguity.  I didn't see this season as likely a big season anyway.  Holes still exist and the schedule is killer hard.  Next year I'd bet this team has less holes and the schedule right now looms to be much easier.  And we got ample cap room and picks to fix it.

 

The reason why I pimp John Keim a lot is because following different reporters for years, no one has nailed more right then him.    People give him a hard time for not nailing things 100% but who does?   And his narrative in the off season was they'd go for a QB in the draft (hinted it was Fields) but only if they could get him on the cheap.  And he didn't think that would happen.   Oherwise they wanted this off season to continue to build the roster but he got a sense from whomever he talked to at that FO that they'd chase a QB hard next off season and they were very very very aware they need to find that elusive franchise QB.  I guess will see. 

[Skinsinparadise]

 

 

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

4 hours ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

I'm not impressed by our 2021 draft class at all. Zero impact from everyone besides Cosmi, who just appears to be solid at his position. 

 

I always see the same problem with this team, players rarely put it together consistently from one year to the next. 

 

You don't see Juice flash positives?